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Featured Universalism Was Condemned and Defeated In 553 A.D. At The The Fifth Ecumenical Council

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by Jude1:3Contendforthefaith, Aug 13, 2019.

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  1. Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

    Jude1:3Contendforthefaith Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The Anathemas of the Emperor Justinian Against Origen
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    "If Anyone says or thinks that the punishment of demons and of impious men is only temporary, and will one day have an end, and that a restoration will take place of demons and of impious men, Let Him Be Anathema.

    Anathema to Origen and to that Adamantius, who set forth these opinions together with his Nefarious and Execrable and Wicked Doctrine and and to whomsoever there is who thinks thus, Or Defends These Opinions, or in any way hereafter at any time shall presume to protect them.


    • Second Council of Constantinople (553 A.D.)


    CHURCH FATHERS: Second Council of Constantinople (A.D. 553)

    Second Council of Constantinople - Wikipedia





    It's done, finished, Over etc. The issue has already been resolved. There's nothing left to debate.


    [​IMG]


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  2. CharismaticLady

    CharismaticLady Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Good! What exactly did Origen believe? Do you have a quote? I didn't look at what you linked, as I don't have time for a whole article.
     
  3. Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

    Jude1:3Contendforthefaith Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Basically That demons / The Devil / Evil People will all be saved in the end and that the punishment of Hell was only temporary.


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  4. CharismaticLady

    CharismaticLady Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I wonder how he came to such a conclusion. I remember decades ago, I totally disagreed with something he believed, but haven't looked at anything else of his. Right now I like Augustine.
     
  5. Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

    Jude1:3Contendforthefaith Well-Known Member Supporter

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    A lot of his opinions and writings were good, but the Universalism was bad.


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  6. mkgal1

    mkgal1 His perfect way sets me free. 2 Samuel 22:33 Supporter

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    I don't believe it was Origen's belief of universalism that was attacked, but instead his beliefs about salvation and the Trinity:

    Quoting linked article: Now let the reader recapitulate: (1) Origen during his life-time was never opposed for his Universalism; (2) after his death Methodius, about A.D. 300, attacked his views of the resurrection, creation and pre-existence, but said not a word against his Universalism; (3) ten years later Pamphilus and Eusebius (A.D. 310) defended him against nine
    charges that had been brought against his views, but his Universalism was not among them; (4) in 330 Marcellus of Ancyra, a Universalist, opposed him for his views of the Trinity, and (5) Eustathius for his teachings concerning the Witch of Endor, but limited their arraignment to those items; (6) in 376 Epiphanius assailed his heresies, but he did not name Universalism as among them, and in 394 he condemned Origen's doctrine of the salvation of the Devil, but not of all mankind; (7) in 399 and 401, his views of Christ's death to save the Devil were attacked by Epiphanius, Jerome and Theophilus, and his advocacy of the subordination of Christ to God was condemned, but not his teachings of man's universal salvation; and (8) it was not till 544 and again in 553 that his enemies formulated attacks on that doctrine, and made a cat's-paw of a half-heathen Emperor, and even then, though the latter framed a canon for the synod, it was never adopted, and the council adjourned--owing, it must have been, to the Universalistic sentiment in it--without a word of condemnation of Origen's Universalism. ~ Chapter 21 - Unsuccessful Attempts to Suppress Universalism
     
  7. Stabat Mater

    Stabat Mater Jesus Christ conquers! Supporter

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    It's often considered to be that of his disciples or the school of Origen. Scholars seems to agree that universialism though endorsed in a more moderate form by Origen himself, mainly stemmed from the works of others writing in his name post mortem.
     
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  8. Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

    Jude1:3Contendforthefaith Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Interesting. Thanks for that information.


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  9. Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

    Jude1:3Contendforthefaith Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The Canons and Decrees of The Ecumenical Councils are Infallible.


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  10. FineLinen

    FineLinen Senior Veteran Supporter

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    Dear Mkgal; it is always a joy seeing you in cyber land. Of course you are right again.

    The First 500 Years

    The Beautiful Heresy- Christian Universalism: The Early Church
     
  11. TheLostCoin

    TheLostCoin A Lonesome Coin Supporter

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    Many Church Fathers were influenced by the ancient intellectuals and philosophers of ages past, including such figures as Plato, Aristotle, Ptomely, etc.

    Based on what I've been told by people, Plato posited this kind of cyclical logic, that all of our reality came from one principle, and our reality will ultimately return to this one principle, in a certain circle of life.

    The Gnostics applied this logic specifically to the idea of material reality; that material came from the immaterial, and the end is the ultimate return to the immaterial; that anything that is material is from the devil (who is immaterial) and that anything immaterial is from God, and that God desires the return to the immaterial, as it once was. You can see how the Gnostics took this logic of reality coming from one principle and returning to this principle, and tried to apply it to Christianity.

    Origen tried applying this logic in a different sense; that the principle, rather than being immateriality, is actually God, and that the ends are a reconciliation with God, where all of existence was once with God, was broken by Original Sin, and that all of existence will return with God as it was before through Christ.
    The idea of an eternal hell, for the disciples of Origen, violated the principle of returning to what reality once was, so the Origenists came to the conclusion that Hell must have had an end.
     
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  12. TheLostCoin

    TheLostCoin A Lonesome Coin Supporter

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    Not really, because many of those sympathetic to Origen don't deny that hell has an end; they rather place extreme hope in the idea that hell is actually empty, which hasn't been condemned by an Ecumenical Council.
     
  13. Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

    Jude1:3Contendforthefaith Well-Known Member Supporter

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    • Jesus left A Church On Earth.

    • He said that the gates of Hell would Not prevail against it.

    • His Church had Councils.

    • The Lord Jesus Christ Is The Head Of The Church and The Head Of The Councils.

    • The Holy Spirit worked through these Bishops at these Councils

    • Universalism was Defeated and Condemned at The Fifth Ecumenical Council / Thread



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  14. mkgal1

    mkgal1 His perfect way sets me free. 2 Samuel 22:33 Supporter

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    Nothing I posted conflicts with that.
     
  15. Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

    Jude1:3Contendforthefaith Well-Known Member Supporter

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    [​IMG]
     
  16. Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

    Jude1:3Contendforthefaith Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The Council Condemned The Heresy of Universalism.


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  17. mkgal1

    mkgal1 His perfect way sets me free. 2 Samuel 22:33 Supporter

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    No, it condemned Origenism - as your link describes more completely than I can fit here. Universalism was not a topic of debate at that council.

    From link provided in OP:
    Topics

    Nestorianism

    Origenism
     
  18. David Cabrera

    David Cabrera Catechumen

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    :amen:
     
  19. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    That seems kind of late to form an opinion.
    Or if you don't like that argument, a couple
    scholars have been born since then who are sharp.
    Or if you don't like that argument, we don't know if
    the council was unbiased.
    Or if you don't like that argument, the debate continues
    in the real world.
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2019
  20. DamianWarS

    DamianWarS Follower of Isa Al Masih Supporter

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    apparently, it's not over.
     
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