Under the New Covenant, where is the Biblical text for Worshipping on a particular day (ie Sunday)

guevaraj

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Obviously you're rejecting what Paul is teaching.
It's factual that before Jesus appeared to Paul, the gospel was preached primarily to Jews. Peter was the first to baptize a Gentile (Cornelius). You have no scripture to prove that Gentiles were a part of Israel. Jesus chose Paul to preach the Gospel to the Gentiles. The scriptures you highlight does not help your comments at all.
Brother, you are not hearing the message of God through Paul. I am going to capitalize the part that you did not realize includes all the Gentiles who "come in", where the "full number" of the Gentiles "come in" to "all Israel". There are no Gentiles who "come in" who are not part of "all Israel". A part of Israel is still hardened today, Judaism did not accept Jesus and they will remain hardened until the "full number" of Gentiles have "come in" to "all Israel". Gentiles "come in" to "all Israel" until saved is "all Israel", including the hardened part. The "full number" of the Gentiles is not realized until there is no more Judaism.

Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the FULL NUMBER of the Gentiles has come in, and in this way all Israel will be saved. As it is written: “The deliverer will come from Zion; he will turn godlessness away from Jacob. And this is my covenant with them when I take away their sins.” As far as the gospel is concerned, they are enemies for your sake; but as far as election is concerned, they are loved on account of the patriarchs, for God’s gifts and his call are irrevocable. (Romans 11:25b-29 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Cribstyl

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Brother, you are not hearing the message of God through Paul. I am going to capitalize the part that you did not realize includes all the Gentiles who "come in", where the "full number" of the Gentiles "come in" to "all Israel". There are no Gentiles who "come in" who are not part of "all Israel". A part of Israel is still hardened today, Judaism did not accept Jesus and they will remain hardened until the "full number" of Gentiles have "come in" to "all Israel". Gentiles "come in" to "all Israel" until saved is "all Israel", including the hardened part. The "full number" of the Gentiles is not realized until there is no more Judaism.

Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the FULL NUMBER of the Gentiles has come in, and in this way all Israel will be saved. As it is written: “The deliverer will come from Zion; he will turn godlessness away from Jacob. And this is my covenant with them when I take away their sins.” As far as the gospel is concerned, they are enemies for your sake; but as far as election is concerned, they are loved on account of the patriarchs, for God’s gifts and his call are irrevocable. (Romans 11:25b-29 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
Jorge, you're misleading the scriptures to say "come into Israel," but the scripture is talking about "coming into Christ through believing the Gospel.

You're correct to say that when the Gospel was first preached some of Israel believed, but most rejected the Gospel. The hardening were of the Jews who rejected the Gospel. (True or False?)
So God used the opportunity for the FULL NUMBER OF THE GENTILES to hear the Gospel and come in to Christianity, not come in to Judaism. (True or False?)
 
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guevaraj

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Jorge, you're misleading the scriptures to say "come into Israel," but the scripture is talking about "coming into Christ through believing the Gospel.
Brother, happy Sabbath! That we are not part of "all Israel" is a made up tradition contrary to what God is saying through Paul in this passage. Like all other made up traditions, the Bible opposes that teaching when you use all the Scriptures and not just your favorite part taken out of context to contradict the rest of the Scriptures. Taken out of context is that Paul speaks of us as Gentiles based on our origin and not that we stay Gentiles when we "come in" to "all Israel".
You're correct to say that when the Gospel was first preached some of Israel believed, but most rejected the Gospel. The hardening were of the Jews who rejected the Gospel. (True or False?)
Judaism is the "part" that did not accept Jesus. The "part" that follows Jesus to this day left Israel before the Romans destroyed Jerusalem in 70 AD.

“When you see Jerusalem being surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near. Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those in the city get out, and let those in the country not enter the city. For this is the time of punishment in fulfillment of all that has been written. How dreadful it will be in those days for pregnant women and nursing mothers! There will be great distress in the land and wrath against this people. They will fall by the sword and will be taken as prisoners to all the nations. Jerusalem will be trampled on by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled. (Luke 21:20-24 NIV)​

In 70 AD, when Rome destroyed Jerusalem, all of Jesus' followers had left the city in haste because they believed Jesus' warning above to leave when they saw armies surround the city. They all lived because they believed the message of Jesus and went to a safe place away from the city before Rome entered the city.
So God used the opportunity for the FULL NUMBER OF THE GENTILES to hear the Gospel and come in to Christianity, not come in to Judaism. (True or False?)
The "full number" does not "hear" as you say it, but rather "come in" when saved is Judaism. Judaism is still hardened today and will remain so until the "full number" of Gentiles "come in" to "all Israel". God sees two parts of "all Israel" and will save Judaism also in the future when the "full number" of Gentiles "come in" to "all Israel":
  1. Judaism is one "part" of "all Israel".
  2. Christianity is the other "part" of "all Israel".
United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Cribstyl

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Brother, happy Sabbath! That we are not part of "all Israel" is a made up tradition contrary to what God is saying through Paul in this passage. Like all other made up traditions, the Bible opposes that teaching when you use all the Scriptures and not just your favorite part taken out of context to contradict the rest of the Scriptures. Taken out of context is that Paul speaks of us as Gentiles based on our origin and not that we stay Gentiles when we "come in" to "all Israel".

Judaism is the "part" that did not accept Jesus. The "part" that follows Jesus to this day left Israel before the Romans destroyed Jerusalem in 70 AD.

“When you see Jerusalem being surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near. Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those in the city get out, and let those in the country not enter the city. For this is the time of punishment in fulfillment of all that has been written. How dreadful it will be in those days for pregnant women and nursing mothers! There will be great distress in the land and wrath against this people. They will fall by the sword and will be taken as prisoners to all the nations. Jerusalem will be trampled on by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled. (Luke 21:20-24 NIV)​

In 70 AD, when Rome destroyed Jerusalem, all of Jesus' followers had left the city in haste because they believed Jesus' warning above to leave when they saw armies surround the city. They all lived because they believed the message of Jesus and went to a safe place away from the city before Rome entered the city.

The "full number" does not "hear" as you say it, but rather "come in" when saved is Judaism. Judaism is still hardened today and will remain so until the "full number" of Gentiles "come in" to "all Israel". God sees two parts of "all Israel" and will save Judaism also in the future when the "full number" of Gentiles "come in" to "all Israel":
  1. Judaism is one "part" of "all Israel".
  2. Christianity is the other "part" of "all Israel".
United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
Jorge we'll just have to disagree. No need to continue this dialog. Thanks for the chat, God bless
 
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BobRyan

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In Acts 18:4 we find that they gathered "every Sabbath" for Gospel preaching to both gentiles and Jews.

Does Acts 20:7 say "they gathered every week day 1 for gospel preaching/services"??

Does Acts 20:7 say "we no longer call week-day-1 by that name ... for us it is the Lord's Day"??

The apostles met in the synagogues on the sabbath because that's when the Jews were assembled. They preached to them then.

1. Its the believing "GENTILES" in Acts 13 that ask for "more gospel" preaching on "The next Sabbath" at which point almost the entire gentile town turns out.

2. It is believing gentiles and Jews in Acts 18:4 that keep coming back "every Sabbath" for more gospel preaching.

These are "Bible details" - even if they do not fit someone's preference

It does not concern me what the SDA church thinks about it.

Well you have free will - there no Bible detail you "must" pay attention to no matter you preference on the matter.
 
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BobRyan

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Mark 2:27 speaks in the singular to teach that a man's need (for food) trumps the ceremonial observation, .

No the text is about 'mankind' - The Sabbath was made for mankind not mankind made for the Sabbath. Mark 2:27 speaks of the "making of both" mankind and the Sabbath - which we see in Gen 2:1-3 and Ex 20:11 in creation week.

And we see a similar use in Matt 4 "MAN shall not live by bread alone" -- it is not about "just men" it is not about "just one man" it is not about "just Jews" -- it is about mankind.
 
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Cribstyl

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No the text is about 'mankind' - The Sabbath was made for mankind not mankind made for the Sabbath. Mark 2:27 speaks of the "making of both" mankind and the Sabbath
False, Post any bible that agrees with your commentary in red.
As usual, partial quotes tend to hide truth.
According to the scripture Jesus said;
Mar 2:27 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:
Mar 2:28 Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.
When you quote at least the whole sentence that Christ made, you can understand that He's establishing mercy over the ceremonial because He has the authority to do it.
Again, Christ is saying a man's urgent needs should override the ceremonial and The Lord of the Sabbath) has the authority to establish that.
Thank God that Matthew and Luke's gospel covers the same exact event and they tells us what Jesus said and meant. Mat 12:1–8; Luk 6:1–5  I wonder why are you saying something else?
Mat 12:6
But I say unto you, That in this place is one greater than the temple.
Mat 12:7
But if ye had known what this meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice, ye would not have condemned the guiltless.

Luk 6:5

And he said unto them, That the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.


We can read 3 consistent views of the same issue.
Jesus is not teaching that Sabbath was made for all humanity. You're using a partial quote and playing a dangerous game with God's word.


- which we see in Gen 2:1-3 and Ex 20:11 in creation week.

And we see a similar use in Matt 4 "MAN shall not live by bread alone" -- it is not about "just men" it is not about "just one man" it is not about "just Jews" -- it is about mankind.
Your commentary intentional uses partail quotes to make your false arguments.
At least you're consistent.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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False, Post any bible that agrees with your commentary in red.
As usual, partial quotes tend to hide truth.
According to the scripture Jesus said;
Mar 2:27 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:
Mar 2:28 Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.
When you quote at least the whole sentence that Christ made, you can understand that He's establishing mercy over the ceremonial because He has the authority to do it.
Again, Christ is saying a man's urgent needs should override the ceremonial and The Lord of the Sabbath) has the authority to establish that.
Thank God that Matthew and Luke's gospel covers the same exact event and they tells us what Jesus said and meant. Mat 12:1–8; Luk 6:1–5  I wonder why are you saying something else?
Mat 12:6
But I say unto you, That in this place is one greater than the temple.
Mat 12:7
But if ye had known what this meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice, ye would not have condemned the guiltless.

Luk 6:5

And he said unto them, That the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.


We can read 3 consistent views of the same issue.
Jesus is not teaching that Sabbath was made for all humanity. You're using a partial quote and playing a dangerous game with God's word.


Your commentary intentional uses partail quotes to make your false arguments.
At least you're consistent.



God said this:

Exodus 20:10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath to the Lord your God.

It cannot get any clear than this verse that God not only spoke He wrote. God’s day is the seventh day, according to God.

This is pretty much the same thing Jesus said:
Mar 2:28 Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.

This is God’s authority! The only day in the entire bible that God sanctified, blessed, told us to not profane His holy day and commanded us to Remember the Sabbath day and to keep it holy. Exodus 20:8

You are welcome to believe whatever you want, but you should consider that you really are speaking against God’s authority and He is our Creator and Savior.

God’s Sabbath is eternal Isaiah 66:23 just like He promised Exodus 31:16
 
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BobRyan

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BobRyan said:
No the text Mark 2:27 is about 'mankind' - "The Sabbath was made for mankind not mankind made for the Sabbath. Mark 2:27 speaks of the "making of both" mankind and the Sabbath


True. Both mankind and the Sabbath were MADE in the same 7 day week in Gen 1:2-2:3. A Bible fact that Ex 20:11 points to - the Sabbath was made in Gen 2:1-3.

Post any bible that agrees with your commentary

All Bible's do.

And the major confessions of Faith such as the Baptist Confession of Faith (section 19), and the Westminster Confession of Faith (sectn 19) - and D.L. Moody's sermon on the TEN commandments, and C.H. Spurgeon and R.C. Sproul and ...

Matthew Henry on Mark 2:27 -
"Man was not made for the Sabbath, for he was made a day before the Sabbath was instituted. Man was made for God"

Consider reading the details.


Jesus is not teaching that Sabbath was made for all humanity.
.

Your preference "noted"
 
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BABerean2

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And the major confessions of Faith such as the Baptist Confession of Faith (section 19), and the Westminster Confession of Faith (sectn 19) - and D.L. Moody's sermon on the TEN commandments, and C.H. Spurgeon and R.C. Sproul and ...

(BobRyan, Christian Forums - Error
This member limits who may view their full profile.)

And none of the above, nor you, have never explained how Adam could commit adultery, or how Adam could honor his mother.



Early Church Fathers who lived before the Council of Nicaea comment on the Sabbath:


Ignatius of Antioch

If, therefore, those who were brought up in the ancient order of things have come to the possession of a new hope, no longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord’s Day, on which also our life has sprung up again by Him and by His death—whom some deny, by which mystery we have obtained faith, and therefore endure, that we may be found the disciples of Jesus Christ, our only Master(Letter to the Magnesians(shorter) Chapter IX.—Let us live with Christ [A.D. 110]).

During the Sabbath He continued under the earth in the tomb in which Joseph of Arimathæa had laid Him. At the dawning of the Lord’s day He arose from the dead, according to what was spoken by Himself, “As Jonah was three days and three nights in the whale’s belly, so shall the Son of man also be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.” The day of the preparation, then, comprises the passion; the Sabbath embraces the burial; the Lord’s Day contains the resurrection(The Epistle of Ignatius to the Trallians Longer Versions. Chapter IX.—Reference to the history of Christ.)

Justin Martyr

The Lawgiver is present, yet you do not see Him; to the poor the Gospel is preached, the blind see, yet you do not understand. You have now need of a second circumcision, though you glory greatly in the flesh. The new law requires you to keep perpetual sabbath, and you, because you are idle for one day, suppose you are pious, not discerning why this has been commanded you: and if you eat unleavened bread, you say the will of God has been fulfilled. The Lord our God does not take pleasure in such observances: if there is any perjured person or a thief among you, let him cease to be so; if any adulterer, let him repent; then he has kept the sweet and true sabbaths of God. If any one has impure hands, let him wash and be pure.(Dialogue with Trypho the Jew Chapter XII.—The Jews violate the eternal law, and interpret ill that of Moses.)

For we too would observe the fleshly circumcision, and the Sabbaths, and in short all the feasts, if we did not know for what reason they were enjoined you,—namely, on account of your transgressions and the hardness of your hearts. For if we patiently endure all things contrived against us by wicked men and demons, so that even amid cruelties unutterable, death and torments, we pray for mercy to those who inflict such things upon us, and do not wish to give the least retort to any one, even as the new Lawgiver commanded us: how is it, Trypho, that we would not observe those rites which do not harm us, —I speak of fleshly circumcision, and Sabbaths, and feasts?(Dialogue with Trypho the Jew Chapter XVIII.—Christians would observe the law, if they did not know why it was instituted. [A.D. 155]).

And we afterwards continually remind each other of these things. And the wealthy among us help the needy; and we always keep together; and for all things wherewith we are supplied, we bless the Maker of all through His Son Jesus Christ, and through the Holy Ghost. And on the day called Sunday,1 all who live in cities or in the country gather together to one place, and the memoirs of the apostles or the writings of the prophets are read, as long as time permits; then, when the reader has ceased, the president verbally instructs, and exhorts to the imitation of these good things. Then we all rise together and pray, and, as we before said, when our prayer is ended, bread and wine and water are brought, and the president in like manner offers prayers and thanksgivings, according to his ability, and the people assent, saying Amen; and there is a distribution to each, and a participation of that over which thanks have been given, and to those who are absent a portion is sent by the deacons. And they who are well to do, and willing, give what each thinks fit; and what is collected is deposited with the president, who succours the orphans and widows and those who, through sickness or any other cause, are in want, and those who are in bonds and the strangers sojourning among us, and in a word takes care of all who are in need. But Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly, because it is the first day on which God, having wrought a change in the darkness and matter, made the world; and Jesus Christ our Saviour on the same day rose from the dead. For He was crucified on the day before that of Saturn (Saturday); and on the day after that of Saturn, which is the day of the Sun, having appeared to His apostles and disciples, He taught them these things, which we have submitted to you also for your consideration.(First Apology Chapter LXVII.—Weekly worship of the Christians. [A.D. 155]).

“Wherefore, Trypho, I will proclaim to you, and to those who wish to become proselytes, the divine message which I heard from that man. Do you see that the elements are not idle, and keep no Sabbaths? Remain as you were born. For if there was no need of circumcision before Abraham, or of the observance of Sabbaths, of feasts and sacrifices, before Moses; no more need is there of them now, after that, according to the will of God, Jesus Christ the Son of God has been born without sin, of a virgin sprung from the stock of Abraham. For when Abraham himself was in uncircumcision, he was justified and blessed by reason of the faith which he reposed in God, as the Scripture tells. Moreover, the Scriptures and the facts themselves compel us to admit that He received circumcision for a sign, and not for righteousness.(The Second Apology of Justin for the Christians Addressed to the Roman Senate. Chapter XXIII.—The opinion of the Jews regarding the law does an injury to God.)

“As, then, circumcision began with Abraham, and the Sabbath and sacrifices and offerings and feasts with Moses, and it has been proved they were enjoined on account of the hardness of your people’s heart, so it was necessary, in accordance with the Father’s will, that they should have an end in Him who was born of a virgin, of the family of Abraham and tribe of Judah, and of David; in Christ the Son of God, who was proclaimed as about to come to all the world, to be the everlasting law and the everlasting covenant, even as the forementioned prophecies show.(The Second Apology of Justin for the Christians Addressed to the Roman Senate. Chapter XLIII.—He concludes that the law had an end in Christ, who was born of the Virgin.)

Tertullian

“[L]et him who contends that the Sabbath is still to be observed as a balm of salvation, and circumcision on the eighth day . . . teach us that, for the time past, righteous men kept the Sabbath or practiced circumcision, and were thus rendered ‘friends of God.’ For if circumcision purges a man, since God made Adam uncircumcised, why did he not circumcise him, even after his sinning, if circumcision purges? . . . Therefore, since God originated Adam uncircumcised and unobservant of the Sabbath, consequently his offspring also, Abel, offering him sacrifices, uncircumcised and unobservant of the Sabbath, was by him [God] commended [Gen. 4:1–7, Heb. 11:4]. . . . Noah also, uncircumcised—yes, and unobservant of the Sabbath—God freed from the deluge. For Enoch too, most righteous man, uncircumcised and unobservant of the Sabbath, he translated from this world, who did not first taste death in order that, being a candidate for eternal life, he might show us that we also may, without the burden of the law of Moses, please God”(An Answer to the Jews Chapter II.—The Law Anterior to Moses. [A.D. 203]).

It follows, accordingly, that, in so far as the abolition of carnal circumcision and of the old law is demonstrated as having been consummated at its specific times, so also the observance of the Sabbath is demonstrated to have been temporary.For the Jews say, that from the beginning God sanctified the seventh day, by resting on it from all His works which He made; and that thence it was, likewise, that Moses said to the People: “Remember the day of the sabbaths, to sanctify it: every servile work ye shall not do therein, except what pertaineth unto life.” Whence we (Christians) understand that we still more ought to observe a sabbath from all “servile work” always, and not only every seventh day, but through all time. And through this arises the question for us, what sabbath God willed us to keep? For the Scriptures point to a sabbath eternal and a sabbath temporal. For Isaiah the prophet says, “Your sabbaths my soul hateth;” and in another place he says, “My sabbaths ye have profaned.”9 Whence we discern that the temporal sabbath is human, and the eternal sabbath is accounted divine; concerning which He predicts through Isaiah: “And there shall be,” He says, “month after month, and day after day, and sabbath after sabbath; and all flesh shall come to adore in Jerusalem, saith the Lord;” which we understand to have been fulfilled in the times of Christ, when “all flesh”—that is, every nation—“came to adore in Jerusalem” God the Father, through Jesus Christ His Son, as was predicted through the prophet: “Behold, proselytes through me shall go unto Thee.” Thus, therefore, before this temporal sabbath, there was withal an eternal sabbath foreshown and foretold; just as before the carnal circumcision there was withal a spiritual circumcision foreshown. In short, let them teach us, as we have already premised, that Adam observed the sabbath; or that Abel, when offering to God a holy victim, pleased Him by a religious reverence for the sabbath; or that Enoch, when translated, had been a keeper of the sabbath; or that Noah the ark-builder observed, on account of the deluge, an immense sabbath; or that Abraham, in observance of the sabbath, offered Isaac his son; or that Melchizedek in his priesthood received the law of the sabbath

But the Jews are sure to say, that ever since this precept was given through Moses, the observance has been binding. Manifest accordingly it is, that the precept was not eternal nor spiritual, but temporary, which would one day cease. In short, so true is it that it is not in the exemption from work of the sabbath—that is, of the seventh day—that the celebration of this solemnity is to consist, that Joshua the son of Nun, at the time that he was reducing the city Jericho by war, stated that he had received from God a precept to order the People that priests should carry the ark of the testament of God seven days, making the circuit of the city; and thus, when the seventh day’s circuit had been performed, the walls of the city would spontaneously fall. Which was so done; and when the space of the seventh day was finished, just as was predicted, down fell the walls of the city. Whence it is manifestly shown, that in the number of the seven days there intervened a sabbath-day. For seven days, whencesoever they may have commenced, must necessarily include within them a sabbath-day; on which day not only must the priests have worked, but the city must have been made a prey by the edge of the sword by all the people of Israel. Nor is it doubtful that they “wrought servile work,” when, in obedience to God’s precept, they drave the preys of war. For in the times of the Maccabees, too, they did bravely in fighting on the sabbaths, and routed their foreign foes, and recalled the law of their fathers to the primitive style of life by fighting on the sabbaths. Nor should I think it was any other law which they thus vindicated, than the one in which they remembered the existence of the prescript touching “the day of the sabbaths.” Whence it is manifest that the force of such precepts was temporary, and respected the necessity of present circumstances; and that it was not with a view to its observance in perpetuity that God formerly gave them such a law.(An Answer to the Jews Chapter IV.—Of the Observance of the Sabbath.)

Therefore, since it is manifest that a sabbath temporal was shown, and a sabbath eternal foretold; a circumcision carnal foretold, and a circumcision spiritual pre-indicated; a law temporal and a law eternal formally declared; sacrifices carnal and sacrifices spiritual foreshown; it follows that, after all these precepts had been given carnally, in time preceding, to the people Israel, there was to supervene a time whereat the precepts of the ancient Law and of the old ceremonies would cease, and the promise3 of the new law, and the recognition of spiritual sacrifices, and the promise of the New Testament, supervene;4 while the light from on high would beam upon us who were sitting in darkness, and were being detained in the shadow of death.5 And so there is incumbent on us a necessity6 binding us, since we have premised that a new law was predicted by the prophets, and that not such as had been already given to their fathers at the time when He led them forth from the land of Egypt,7 to show and prove, on the one hand, that that old Law has ceased, and on the other, that the promised new law is now in operation.

And, indeed, first we must inquire whether there be expected a giver of the new law, and an heir of the new testament, and a priest of the new sacrifices, and a purger of the new circumcision, and an observer of the eternal sabbath, to suppress the old law, and institute the new testament, and offer the new sacrifices, and repress the ancient ceremonies, and suppress8 the old circumcision together with its own sabbath, and announce the new kingdom which is not corruptible. Inquire, I say, we must, whether this giver of the new law, observer of the spiritual sabbath, priest of the eternal sacrifices, eternal ruler of the eternal kingdom, be come or no: that, if he is already come, service may have to be rendered him; if he is not yet come, he may have to be awaited, until by his advent it be manifest that the old Law’s precepts are suppressed, and that the beginnings of the new law ought to arise. And, primarily, we must lay it down that the ancient Law and the prophets could not have ceased, unless He were come who was constantly announced, through the same Law and through the same prophets, as to come.(An Answer to the Jews Chapter VI.—Of the Abolition and the Abolisher of the Old Law. [A.D. 203]).

But you, many of you, also under pretence sometimes of worshipping the heavenly bodies, move your lips in the direction of the sunrise. In the same way, if we devote Sun-day to rejoicing, from a far different reason than Sun-worship, we have some resemblance to those of you who devote the day of Saturn to ease and luxury, though they too go far away from Jewish ways, of which indeed they are ignorant.(Apology Chapter XVI.)


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If we are under the new covenant
1. Love the lord thy God
2. Love thy neighbour as thyself

where is the command to worship our creator on a particular day?
Do we even need therefore to worship at all in church and celebrate creation and the creator?
What is the point of Sunday worship at all?
Did Jesus ask us to worship his resurrection anywhere in the Bible?

I put this question out there because a number of non trinitarians for example
- "show me a bible text that says "trinity"
- show me an text that commands "worship on sabbath" prior to exodus 20,
- show me a text that says the apostles and Gentiles were commanded to "keep the Seventh Day Sabbath"

So i turn that same literal reasoning back onto Sunday worshipers...Can you show me texts in the Bible where it specifically says "worship my resurrection on the first day of the week"?

Finally, if you use the argument "I worship God on every day", and you then go to Church services on Sunday because you were commanded somewhere in the covenant to do so (ie worship Jesus your messiah), then based on the model/standard God gave to Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden that they worship him in a special time on the Seventh day may i ask, are you breaking the law by working on all days you worship the creator? for the commandment says "on it thou shalt not do any work, neither yourself nor your servant...etc?
@AdamjEdgar
In short The Lords Day which is mentioned in the Bible in Revelation is the day Jesus rose from the dead which is the first day of the week, Sunday. Ever since Jesus's resurrection people have been worshipping on Sunday The Lord's day instead of Saturday the Old Testament Sabbath.

Despite this I do believe that if you are honest with Jesus as to why you choose Saturday or Sunday it is accepted by Jesus whichever day you choose to honor God. I like honoring Sundays by not working and resting and focusing on God in different ways. The personal relationship with Jesus is most important, ask and you shall receive an answer from Jesus.

As far as more info on The Lords Day here's something straight from Wikepedia as to why Christians worship on Sunday:
Lord's Day - Wikipedia
 
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Adventist Heretic

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Here is a post from another thread that I think applies here it is a respone to a summary of the options about the 10 commandmeant and the different views, but there is a problem with assumption. I examine them below. "This is a great summary of the conclusions people come to but it still show a lack of understanding of the Assumptions that are being made. let me list the 3 different views. All views are different method of interpretation of the Scripture. Each in contrast with the other.

Method 1
Covenant Theology View: is a framework for biblical interpretations of the bible, and a conceptual overview and interpretive framework for understanding the overall structure of the Bible. It uses the theological concept of a covenant as an organizing principle for Christian theology. In this view Covenants once established are continual and not replaced by any covenants that come after it. In fact if you are in a later covenant you are automatically in a prior covenant. the later covenant automatically incorporates the prior covenant. For example the Abraham was automatically part of the Creation Covenant, Adam's Covenant and Noah's Covenant when he received his Covenant. David was part of Moses Covenant, Abraham Covenant, Noah's Covenant, Adam's Covenant & the Creation Covenant when he received his covenant , When believers are born again they are born in the new covenants which included ALL the prior Covenants. This is the oldest view on covenants. SDA's, Roman Catholic, Orthodox and Reformers use this method.

Method 2
New Covenant Theology: Is a Theological frame work for interpreting the Bible, Which put Christ at the center the redemption and views Christ as the fulfillment of All prior covenants. All Prior Covenant end at Him, with that all laws end and all ending and a new law being established with its own requirements. the youngest of the view, most fundamental use this view.

Method 3
Dispensational Theology : is a framework for interpretations of the bible,The bible is divided up into dispensations or era's, each one different from the previous era. Each having different stewards, laws and requirements. Developed in the 1800 the author John Darby among the Plymouth Breathen it is responsible for influencing the Scofield bible, DL moody, the Niagara Conference & Dallas Theological Seminary
 
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BobRyan

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And none of the above, nor you, have never explained how Adam could commit adultery, or how Adam could honor his mother.

You are posting as if you suppose that God would need to "Change His law" in Eden as soon as Adam and Eve had a baby - if they had never sinned.

That is a form of speculation that is not based in a Bible statement affirming it so you are free to go down that road if you wish.
 
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BobRyan

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@AdamjEdgar
In short The Lords Day which is mentioned in the Bible in Revelation is the day Jesus rose from the dead which is the first day of the week, Sunday. Ever since Jesus's resurrection people have been worshipping on Sunday The Lord's day instead of Saturday the Old Testament Sabbath.

So we agree Jesus was resurrected early Sunday morning - but the rest of your statement above needs an actual Bible text saying it, specifically

"Ever since Jesus's resurrection people have been worshipping on Sunday The Lord's day instead of Saturday"

Why people believe that must have to do with some statement in the NT that says it.
 
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SeventhFisherofMen

You cannot fool Jesus
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So we agree Jesus was resurrected early Sunday morning - but the rest of your statement above needs an actual Bible text saying it, specifically

"Ever since Jesus's resurrection people have been worshipping on Sunday The Lord's day instead of Saturday"

Why people believe that must have to do with some statement in the NT that says it.
John is spoken of being in the spirit on The Lord's day in Revelation 1:10

Paul is spoken of as breaking bread and giving a talk on the first day of the week in
Acts 20:7

Those two verses alone should be enough to reach the conclusion that if there was a day mentioned in the Bible as being The Lord's day, a day specifically dedicated to The Lord, and another verse where it specifically mentions that Paul met on the first day of the week to break bread and give a talk, that since we are worshipping to this very day on Sunday it only makes sense that Christians unanimously came to the conclusion that they should worship God on Sunday. And since Jesus does not speak against this practice in The Bible it's fair to say He accepted worship of Himself on Sunday.

To be honest though if you're looking for word for word commands like there were in the old testament where God said "you must worship on this day" but in the new testament you're not going to find it. If it's not enough and you want to worship on Saturday in keeping with old testament practices Im sure you could do it and God would accept your doing so, but if you read the link to Wikepedia it mentions the practice of worshiping on Sunday as being the norm for Christians since the first century.

Let me know if that's enough to answer your question I'm all for talking more about it if you'd like.
 
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klutedavid

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Here is a post from another thread that I think applies here it is a respone to a summary of the options about the 10 commandmeant and the different views, but there is a problem with assumption. I examine them below. "This is a great summary of the conclusions people come to but it still show a lack of understanding of the Assumptions that are being made. let me list the 3 different views. All views are different method of interpretation of the Scripture. Each in contrast with the other.

Method 1
Covenant Theology View: is a framework for biblical interpretations of the bible, and a conceptual overview and interpretive framework for understanding the overall structure of the Bible. It uses the theological concept of a covenant as an organizing principle for Christian theology. In this view Covenants once established are continual and not replaced by any covenants that come after it. In fact if you are in a later covenant you are automatically in a prior covenant. the later covenant automatically incorporates the prior covenant. For example the Abraham was automatically part of the Creation Covenant, Adam's Covenant and Noah's Covenant when he received his Covenant. David was part of Moses Covenant, Abraham Covenant, Noah's Covenant, Adam's Covenant & the Creation Covenant when he received his covenant , When believers are born again they are born in the new covenants which included ALL the prior Covenants. This is the oldest view on covenants. SDA's, Roman Catholic, Orthodox and Reformers use this method.
Well that method of interpretation is clearly wrong.

Hebrews 8:13
13 When He said, “A new covenant,” He has made the first obsolete. But whatever is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to disappear.

The first covenant at Mt Sinai was terminated, it was made obsolete by the new covenant.

Your obviously following a corrupt interpretation of the scripture.
 
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klutedavid

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So we agree Jesus was resurrected early Sunday morning - but the rest of your statement above needs an actual Bible text saying it, specifically

"Ever since Jesus's resurrection people have been worshipping on Sunday The Lord's day instead of Saturday"

Why people believe that must have to do with some statement in the NT that says it.
Church history affirms that Sunday was the day when Christ rose. Church history states that Sunday was the day when Christians gathered.

Scripture calls Sunday the Lord's day and John did not rename the sabbath day.

Gentiles are not under the law, nor any part of the written law and that includes the sabbath.

Romans 6:14
For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.
 
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BobRyan

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Church history affirms that Sunday was the day when Christ rose.

Turns out -- the Bible also points that out.

I will take the Bible as a factual account of first century history. No problems with that for me.

Church history states that Sunday was the day when Christians gathered.

The Bible points out that they met every day in Acts 2 - to break bread.
And not one NT text saying that there was a weekly - week-day-1 worship meeting or gospel-preaching meeting.

Acts 18:4 "every Sabbath" there was gospel preaching for both gentiles and Jews.

I will take the Bible as a factual account of first century history. No problems with that for me.

Scripture calls Sunday the Lord's day

I see in Is 58:13 where scripture calls the Sabbath "The Holy Day of the Lord".

So what text do you have saying that "week day 1 is the Lord's day"??

Gentiles are not under the law, nor any part of the written law and that includes the sabbath.

No text says that the Law is not written on the heart and mind under the New Covenant - if one is a gentile.

On the contrary - gentiles are specifically singled out for Sabbath keeping in Is 56:6



Romans 6:14
For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

And 1 John 3:4 "SIN IS transgression of the LAW"

Where in that unit of TEN "honor your father and mother is the first commandment with a promise" Eph 6:2
 
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Well that method of interpretation is clearly wrong.

Hebrews 8:13
13 When He said, “A new covenant,” He has made the first obsolete. But whatever is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to disappear.

The first covenant at Mt Sinai was terminated, it was made obsolete by the new covenant.

Your obviously following a corrupt interpretation of the scripture.
Galatians 4:25, NIV: "Now Hagar stands for Mount Sinai in Arabia and corresponds to the present city of Jerusalem, because she is in slavery with her children.".

Apparently he has more to say on this topic than you'd like to admit. The reason why you can't say that it's been fulfilled and has to mean something else try try checking the Greek. Because in Hebrews it tells us that the rest stands for the time when all things will be brought under his feet.

It is very obvious that Adam's covenant is not fulfilled because the serpent's head is not been crushed.

It's obvious Moses coming and hasn't been completed because Jerusalem is not restored back to its rightful place.

Christ dwelling place is not yet with man.

The covenant of heaven and Earth has not been made new.

David's heir it's not ruling and regining in Jerusalem.
The shadows of things that linger in Colossians 2 have not been filled.

So that would lead me to believe that your conclusion is not correct
 
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