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Under the Law?

Discussion in 'Non-denominational' started by TheBear, Feb 2, 2002.

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  1. TheBear

    TheBear Free Agent

    +1,694
    Atheist
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    A scenareo pertaining to the law.

    A Christian gets into an argument with someone. The argument escallates in to a physical fight. There is a lot of jelousy, anger, hate, rage and vengence going on, inside the Christian. Finaly, the Christian picks up a brick and smashes it over the head of the other combatant, killing him.

    O.K. So this is an extreme example. Please bear with me.

    Beyond the man made laws, the Christian also answers to God by asking forgiveness for killing the guy. He truely is repentative for taking a life. He is very remorseful for his actions.

    But, he is so pre-occupied by the physical act of his sin, he completely overlooks and forgets his sins of jelousy, anger, hate, rage and vengence. He doesn't even think to ask forgiveness for those sins.

    He eventualy dies.


    How will he be judged?

    John
     
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  2. solo66 man

    solo66 man Well-Known Member

    +2
    Good question.

    If we ask forgiveness for a sin we have commited and had commited other sins in the process, and did not realize it,
    how could God judge us. No, he does not judge us according to
    sins we are not aware of.
     
  3. Christopher

    Christopher Junior Member

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    Married
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    the act was the result of what he allowed in his heart... at the moment he truly repented, in his heart he forsook all of those feelings, and the guilt from embracing them, and the act he committed for them...so when he repented of his act, he in effect repented of his spiritual filth as well...

    hope that makes sense.

    Christopher
     
  4. TheBear

    TheBear Free Agent

    +1,694
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    Let's just add, for the sake of this discussion, that on his way over to the victims house, the Christian saw a beautiful woman crossing the street, and he became lustfull, and that he eventualy became so overwhelmed after he killed the guy, he completely overlooked and forgot that sinnful act, as well.

    John
     
  5. Apologist

    Apologist 2 Tim. 2:24-26

    +11
    Christian
    That is what the cross was for. Christs's death atoned for all our sins and imputed Christs's righteousness to our account so that we will stand before God clothed in His righteousness and not our 'filthy rags' as Isaiah said.

    God Bless
     
  6. Hervey

    Hervey Member

    481
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    I John 3:15 - "and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him"

    There is a sin unto death - I John 5:16 -- "Murder"

    Love IN Christ - Hervey
     
  7. TheBear

    TheBear Free Agent

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    Does anyone see the deeper questions to the scenareo?

    John
     
  8. Apologist

    Apologist 2 Tim. 2:24-26

    +11
    Christian
    Yes. How could a Christain allow himself to get to the point of murdering someone if the Spirit is within him?

    God Bless
     
  9. TheBear

    TheBear Free Agent

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    No, that's not it, Apologist. But that is a good point.

    John
     
  10. rkbo

    rkbo Member

    272
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    King David was a murderer and he repented. We all sin and repent to keep our fellowship with God a close one. Our salvation has been paid for a couple of thousand years ago. When Jesus died for your sins they were all in the future compared to him. When he said "it is finished" he meant the sacrafice for your sins to purchase salvation for you. When you recieve this fact in your heart, you become an adopted child of God. The Holy Spirit will convict you of your sin and lead you towards Godliness for the rest of your life. If you resist the Holy Spirit he does not leave you. He will work in your life to bring you back to a fuller fellowship with God.
    Rom 3:22-24
    22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
    23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
    24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
    (KJV)

    Rom 5:2
    2 By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.
    (KJV)

    Eph 1:5-7
    5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
    6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.
    7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
    (KJV)

    Eph 3:16-19
    16 That he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man;
    17 That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,
    18 May be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;
    19 And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God.
    (KJV)

    Phil 2:13
    13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.
    (KJV)

    Titus 3:7
    7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
    (KJV)

    Grace is just that, grace. We are justified by no works of our own we are keept saved by no works of our own and we will be saved by no works of our own. It is Jesus that bought us the Holy Spirit that keeps us and the Father that adopted us.
     
  11. Hervey

    Hervey Member

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    King David was "not" a murderer ! !

    In the OT , everything was an eye for an eye, according to the Law, that God established with Israel. God himself would not break the Law he established with Israel.

    What was the punishment unto King David for his act , pertaining to Uriah ?

    Love IN Christ - Hervey
     
  12. rkbo

    rkbo Member

    272
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    Nathan thought David to be a murderer.
    2 Sam 12:9
    9 Wherefore hast thou despised the commandment of the LORD, to do evil in his sight? thou hast killed Uriah the Hittite with the sword, and hast taken his wife to be thy wife, and hast slain him with the sword of the children of Ammon.
    (KJV)
     
  13. Hervey

    Hervey Member

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    Try and understand, that Uriah died in battle, and these words are figurative !

    Look at the punishment from God himself, which explains the wrong. The punishment equals the wrong.

    God would not punish less or more than the Law required ! For God is no respector of persons.

    Love IN Christ - Hervey
     
  14. Apologist

    Apologist 2 Tim. 2:24-26

    +11
    Christian
    Every time someone explains what scripture says you come back with your off the wall arguments. Quit trying to tell the scriptures what to say and let them speak for themselves.
     
  15. rkbo

    rkbo Member

    272
    +0
    Hervey are you for real? I am serious. Take a look
    2 Sam 11:15-17
    15 And he wrote in the letter, saying, Set ye Uriah in the forefront of the hottest battle, and retire ye from him, that he may be smitten, and die.
    16 And it came to pass, when Joab observed the city, that he assigned Uriah unto a place where he knew that valiant men were.
    17 And the men of the city went out, and fought with Joab: and there fell some of the people of the servants of David; and Uriah the Hittite died also.
    (KJV)

    This was a planned murder on Davids part. David even had some unintended victims in this devious plan. Don't forget about Gods mercy when you talk judgment. Without it we are all in trouble.
     
  16. Louisa

    Louisa New Member

    16
    +1
    I probably shouldn't comment when I've only just read the passage but I thought I'd add my two cents (or whatever they're worth!)

    I think David was a murder, or at least he was an adulterer. No sin is worse than other - it is all sin in God's eyes.

    I think it shows us two important things:

    1) That God can forgive these grevious sins when we repent

    2) That He can use us poor sinners to such great lengths. David was a king! And he was sinner! Doesn't that show the grace of God!!

    His punishment - not sure, but wasn't alot of things taken away - mostly his pride and godliness?

    Well, I'm probably way off the eight ball but there you go.
     
  17. Hishandmaiden

    Hishandmaiden The Humble Servant Supporter

    +218
    Christian
    Private
    WEll, all of us sin, hence if we are not forgiven, won't we all be in deep troubles?
     
  18. Redeemed1

    Redeemed1 Passionate Worshiper

    711
    +1
    Very thought provoking. I've recently done a small study on the work of the Cross, and was overwhelmed with how little we apply all that was accomplished for us into our daily lives. (That was just a sidebar). My comment on the hypothetical question is this: Oh what deep trouble we are in if we will be judged according to every sin we are remiss in confessing...for I know I have plenty. Thank You God, for the blood that covers me! Thank You God, for rescuing me from the penalty for my sins! And thank You God, for imparting to me Your righteousness, for the death of Your Son which justifies me freely.
     
  19. Redeemed1

    Redeemed1 Passionate Worshiper

    711
    +1
    I'm not trying to be antaginistic, I just have a curious question:

    Did God give the law "an eye for an eye" for Himself to follow...or for man to follow? Is God bound by the law...or by His character? While the law for man at that time was to take an eye for an eye, are we to say that God is then prohibited to show mercy?

    Blessings.
     
  20. Hervey

    Hervey Member

    481
    +0
    King Saul and King David were just as much under the Law as anyone else, and they were under the watchful eye of God , being King over Israel ! God punished Solomon for not obeying him as well ! Do any of you know what the wrong was, and what the punishment was for Solomon, who also was King over Israel ? ?

    That is why David would not go against Saul when he was King over Israel, because it was God's responsibility to correct or reprove any of the Kings that were over Israel.

    King David was reproved by God through Nathan, and his punishment fit the wrong that was done by King David ! !

    Not one of you have answered my question !

    What was the punishment that God impossed upon King David for his unrighteous act ? ?

    The punishment fit the wrong, and I will quarantee you, that he was not seen in God's eyes as a murderer !!

    This is your private interpretation of what you are reading into what is being said in the scriptures, pertaining to this record ! !

    God is no respector of persons, and King David was punished for that which fit the crime ! !

    If you can honestly answer this question, then you will be able to see what God saw by way of the punishment ! !

    Do I have to type the record out for you ? ? Or can you all find what the punishment was ? ?

    The Law of Moses was - an eye for an eye ! !

    Love IN Christ - Hervey
     
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