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Featured Two women in Revelation 17

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by Douggg, Aug 8, 2020.

  1. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    There are two women in Revelation 17, not one as is often thought.

    One is the great whore that gets destroyed by the ten kings in the end times.

    The other is the kingdom of Satan and his third of the angels, that is at the root of all false religions and abominations upon the earth.

    Here is my chart to aid in understanding the difference.

    upload_2020-8-8_18-43-5.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2020
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  2. TribulationSigns

    TribulationSigns Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I am going to have a little fun with your chart. I will respond based on your literal approach to Revelation:

    1.) You believe the Vatican is a Great Whore that sits upon many waters.

    Last I hear that the Vatican sits on Apostolic Palace in Vatican City somewhere in Rome, 31km from the nearest sea which is one water. Okay!

    2.) You said that there were no crowns upon the heads and horns during the first century with first 6 heads represented the six Roman leaders, yet when 7th head as "little horn" show up some 1,800 years later, ALL heads AND the horns suddenly have crowns despite the fact that the first 6 emperors had long died? Okay!

    3.) You said that Rome is (or sit upon) seven mountains? Ahem... do you know what is God's definition for the word, mountain, in Scripture? Do you realize that the beast has seven kingdoms? Not literal mountains?

    4.) You said that the ten horns will destroy the Whore with Fire? Hold on, do you realize there are something more to the judgement of the Whore? You need to read the Scripture:

    Revelation 17:16-17 KJV
    [16] And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.
    [17] For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.

    Now tell me. Exactly who are the Ten Horns? If you think she is Vatican City, then tell us how will the ten horns make her naked? desolate? Her flesh being eaten? And burn with fire? Take your time and explain these biblically!
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2020
  3. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    The Vatican has influence in all the nations. And many peoples.

    You have that mixed up. The 7 heads have their crowns (completion of the prophecy) in the end times, because the completion of the 7 kings prophecy is not until the little horn comes to power - right before the 7 years in Revelation 12 begin.

    The ten horns don't have their crowns until Revelation 13 (read the text in Revelation 13), because they rule with the beast.

    Differently you should note that the 7 heads no longer have crowns in Revelation 13 (42 months left in the seven years), because king 7 will have been killed ending the prophecy of the 7 kings. I am in progress on that Revelation chart.

    What it boils down to regarding the crowns/no crowns on the heads and horns -
    Revelation 17 - first century.
    Revelation 12 - the full 7 years left.
    Revelation 13 - only 42 months left.


    I know how many have twisted the text to make the heads into kingdoms and not kings.

    It doesn't take any time. I am very familiar with these topics. I don't know by actual name of the persons. But they will be ten leaders of the EU, under the little horn person, overall leader of the EU.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2020
  4. TribulationSigns

    TribulationSigns Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Vatican is widely popular believed by people like you to be Babylon the Great but you got her wrong.

    you missed the point of question I was asking. So the first 6 heads receive crowns just because the little horn comes to power but you were the one who has labeled the first 6 heads with 6 Romans Emporers in the first century. It does not make any sense. The heads have nothing to do with physical earthly kings but the rule of the beast itself.

    The ten horns don't have their crowns until Revelation 13 (read the text in Revelation), because they rule with the beast. The 7 heads no longer have crowns in Revelation 13, because king 7 will have been killed ending the prophecy of the 7 kings. I am in progress on that chart -

    The beasts of Revelation 13 is not the European Union or the Vatican. Like I said, you need to find God's definition of the beast in Scripture which you have refused so far.

    You need to find God's definitation for:

    1.) Beast =
    2.) Heads =
    3.) Horns =
    4.) Crowns =

    God did not give these to you to figure out with world history, map, political empires, powerful men, etc. Stick with Scripture and find God's interpretation alone!

    Of course, you do not know what the ten horns represent. Why must you want for "ten men"? No, you need to find God's definition for the horn in Scripture!

    And how can the ten horns make the Vatican City naked? Make her desolate? Was her flesh eaten? Being burned with fire? What do you think God is talking about here? Listen.. why would Vatican City be naked, eaten, burn if she was not the one who was faithful representative of God's kingdom to begin with, humm?
     
  5. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Where the big mistake is that many think that the woman riding the beast is the whore. Not realizing that there are two women in Revelation 17.

    I understand your point. But the description of the beast in Revelation 17 - there are no crowns on either the heads, nor the horns.

    The crowns are not there because
    1. The prophecy of the 7 kings is not complete until the end times.
    2. The prophecy of the ten horns is only for the times


    You have your own ideas - make some charts.


    I don't need to do any of that. Make your own charts, and prove your view.

    You are making your own definitions. Sounds like you are "pontificating". Do you think Satan has his own kingdom? If you don't, what kind of idealist interpreter are you?

    Vatican created some of it's own doctrine departing from sound doctrine.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2020
  6. TribulationSigns

    TribulationSigns Well-Known Member Supporter

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    False.

    Revelation 17:7 KJV
    [7] And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns.

    The angel told us about ONE woman. Selah. I will believe him instead of you.

    Nah, God's Word already testified against your idea. So no chart is needed. :)


    This only proves that you are too lazy to do the research by compare Scripture with Scripture. I would say that the Scripture has already proved you wrong. No chart needed. :)

    Not really. Here is God's definition in case you did not bother researched:

    Daniel 8:5-6 KJV
    [5] And as I was considering, behold, an he goat came from the west on the face of the whole earth, and touched not the ground: and the goat had a notable horn between his eyes.
    [6] And he came to the ram that had two horns, which I had seen standing before the river, and ran unto him in the fury of his power.

    Daniel 8:7 KJV
    [7] And I saw him come close unto the ram, and he was moved with choler against him, and smote the ram, and brake his two horns: and there was no power in the ram to stand before him, but he cast him down to the ground, and stamped upon him: and there was none that could deliver the ram out of his hand.

    Horn = power. No chart needed. :)

    LOL! The Roman Catholic Church is full of people who listen to MEN. It makes no sense unless we read scripture logically, circumspectly, and define scripture by comparing scripture with scripture. Not by the geographical hills and valleys of Italy, or the il feelings toward the Catholic Church of the day.
     
  7. Running2win

    Running2win Well-Known Member

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    Nice chart Douggg! Agree with a lot of it.:oldthumbsup: Think we will see things happening this decade.
     
  8. TribulationSigns

    TribulationSigns Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Figures. Blind leading the blind going on here.
     
  9. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Yes. Thanks for the question.
     
  10. Running2win

    Running2win Well-Known Member

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    I guess we will see who is blind to what is going on, probably very shortly. :)
     
  11. Running2win

    Running2win Well-Known Member

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    So, I do question who do you think will ascend out of the bottomless pit?
     
  12. TribulationSigns

    TribulationSigns Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Actually, you already are. It is happening and you don’t even see it. Spiritual discerned.
     
  13. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    The spirit of the literal beast called a serpent in Genesis, who apparently sold out to Satan, to get Adam and Eve to sin.

    btw, it was Adam who named all the animals. So it would have been Adam who named that particular beast - the serpent. Genesis 2:19-20.
     
  14. TribulationSigns

    TribulationSigns Well-Known Member Supporter

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    A spirit of a literal serpent sold out to Satan?

    LOL!!

    Look...please provide a scripture saying this. Not your silly speculations as you also done with your charts!
     
  15. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    according to your logic....

    Hair = power. re: Sampson.
     
  16. TribulationSigns

    TribulationSigns Well-Known Member Supporter

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    LOL. What. You do not make any sense, or you must have spelling issue.
     
  17. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    What did Satan try to offer Jesus to get Jesus to worship him?
     
  18. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Well Sampson lost his strength when his hair was cut. So according to your logic - power, strength is in a person's hair.
     
  19. TribulationSigns

    TribulationSigns Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Typical distraction tactic when asked for fact check.

    You are clearly avoiding to do what I asked to confirm your claim. Please provide a Scripture where the spirit of a physical serpent has sold out to Satan. If you can’t, admit your mistake. You can’t compare this with someone else in Bible!

    Come on man, a spirit of an ANIMAL sold out to Satan?! Where do you find that in Scripture?
     
  20. TribulationSigns

    TribulationSigns Well-Known Member Supporter

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    We are not talking about hair here. You are comparing Apples to oranges. Why did Sampson lost his supernatural strength when his hair was cut? No where in Scripture where God has defined hair as power or strength. It is about the OATH Samson need to keep with God.

    Beside what does this has to do with the horns anyway? Do you understand how to find God’s definition for the horn in Scripture? Horn = power of whatever is in view. Focus on this.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2020
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