• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  2. The forums in the Christian Congregations category are now open only to Christian members. Please review our current Faith Groups list for information on which faith groups are considered to be Christian faiths. Christian members please remember to read the Statement of Purpose threads for each forum within Christian Congregations before posting in the forum.
  3. Please note there is a new rule regarding the posting of videos. It reads, "Post a summary of the videos you post . An exception can be made for music videos.". Unless you are simply sharing music, please post a summary, or the gist, of the video you wish to share.
  4. There have been some changes in the Life Stages section involving the following forums: Roaring 20s, Terrific Thirties, Fabulous Forties, and Golden Eagles. They are changed to Gen Z, Millennials, Gen X, and Golden Eagles will have a slight change.
  5. CF Staff, Angels and Ambassadors; ask that you join us in praying for the world in this difficult time, asking our Holy Father to stop the spread of the virus, and for healing of all affected.

Featured Truth

Discussion in 'General Theology' started by Celticroots, Jul 21, 2017.

  1. Celticroots

    Celticroots Newbie

    975
    +707
    Christian
    Single
    I am not a new Christian but have some questions. The Gospel as I understand it is: God wants a relationship with us and for us to enter Heaven. But we are sinful and God does not let sin enter Heaven. Luckily God provides us a way out-His son Jesus. Jesus was God in flesh who took the penalty of our sin by his death/ resurrection.

    To be saved you must believe Jesus's sacrifice as the only payment for your sins; you can't save yourself. Obedience will not save but obedience naturally comes after being saved. After being regenerated we obey God's commands because we have been saved.

    Some believe you can lose your salvation. If that's the case then why did Christ endure one of the worst deaths imaginable? Or that we can stop sinning in this life. I believe we still sin but our attitude towards sin should change and we should start to sin less.

    On here I've seen arguments regarding salvation and other things go on for pages. Everyone sure their position is the correct one.



    Then how can anyone find out the truth? How can we find out through the word? As a Christian I want to know.
     
    • Like Like x 7
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • List
    We teamed up with Faith Counseling. Can they help you today?
  2. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

    +10,907
    Anabaptist
    Good direction. -- always to God's Word.

    In God's Word, He shows simply and clearly the things you mentioned, even things the people post differences (apparent differences anyway) for pages, not just a few pages but hundreds and thousands of pages: what is wrong is not erased but allowed to continue......

    How can anyone find out the truth then, since what is wrong is allowed to continue?

    The answer is in God's Word, again. Always. Not on the internet/ not guaranteed most places on earth,
    but always in God's Word, yes, for sure.
     
    • Like Like x 3
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
    • List
  3. Friend-of-Jesus

    Friend-of-Jesus Well-Known Member

    647
    +470
    Canada
    Christian
    Married
    God is so big. We are so small. We can't undo His salvation. Simply impossible
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
    • List
  4. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

    +10,907
    Anabaptist
    Almost truth. Yes. Close but no cigar.


    IF God, who is so big, TAKES AWAY OUR FREE WILL, then it is true that we could not lose our salvation after being saved on earth.

    There are so many warnings though,
    from God, who is so big,
    that multitudes who really really really believe they are saved forever, and their fellow deceived ones encourage this false belief,
    but who are told "bye bye"
    on Judgement Day....

    They should have listened to God's Word and to those who warned them ..... they might have made it then.... if they repented....
     
    • Winner Winner x 4
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
    • List
  5. CodyFaith

    CodyFaith Well-Known Member Supporter

    +5,051
    Canada
    Baptist
    Single
    Ephesians 4:30 - sealed by the Holy Spirit unto the day of redemption
    Ephesians 1:13 - sealed
    John 5:24 - has passed from death unto life and shall not come into condemnation, has eternal life
    1 John 5:13 - they you may know you have eternal life. You can't lose eternal life, you either have it or don't.
    Romans 10:9 - you will be saved, not you might, not you will if you continue, will.
    Ephesians 2:8 - saved. Saved means saved. It's simple, don't let people complicate it. If you could become "unsaved" then the word saved itself would not even make sense.

    Some of many verses.

    Don't let slick-worded people deceive you. This is one of the most primary doctrines and is essential to understand the gospel properly, so naturally it is one of the most vehemently attacked. Satan hates the gospel.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
    • Like Like x 1
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
    • List
  6. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

    +10,907
    Anabaptist
    Your own post meets your own criteria - slickly (you think) pulling out just those Scriptures that you think support your own idea,
    while ignoring the many Scriptures that show otherwise.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
    • List
  7. Celticroots

    Celticroots Newbie

    975
    +707
    Christian
    Single
    So Jesus did it all? Or, He did a good chunk of it but we have to throw in our works? Then at the end of life we get an a for effort then enter heaven?

    What is one supposed to believe?
     
  8. GandalfTheWise

    GandalfTheWise In search of lost causes and hopeless battles

    357
    +523
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    I find that Christians seem to have fairly general agreement on what God has done. They just have strong disagreements about explaining it and implementing it. :) "My" explanation and implementation is of course best because it's most scriptural and is the best way to be a Christian. "Other" explanations and implementations are potentially in error and spiritually damaging, because...., well they just are because they are wrong. And depending on how wrong they are, it might just be best to deny that they are Christians and encourage people to stay away from them.

    One of the cultural blindspots Christians have in western culture is the idol we have made of "Truth". We seem to view holding a complete proper and correct understanding of Christianity as more important than actually knowing God well and exhibiting the fruit of that relationship in our lives. We will question and deny the work of Jesus Christ in other believers lives because of our arguments about what is the "real truth". Given the choice, many believers would rather hang around with believers with the "correct" doctrinal views regardless of how much fruit is in their lives than hang around with believers with a lot of spiritual fruit who hold "incorrect" doctrinal views. But of course, those with "correct" doctrinal views always have more fruit than those without so we are justified in doing that. Good Christians with much fruit holding "incorrect" views are exceptions to the rule and imagine how much better they'd be if they'd just adopt our views.

    Many new believers have not learned to fully trust God with their salvation and worry about it. Many people attribute this to lack of "Truth" rather than lack of spiritual maturity. Those who've been taught "once saved always saved" worry about if they are "really" a Christian. Those who've been taught the opposite worry about if they've committed one too many sins. It's years of faithfully walking with God, seeing His hand on our lives, and developing a lasting trust in Him that drives doubts out of our hearts, not trying to convince ourselves intellectually of a particular doctrinal position. We often attempt to remedy every ill by administering "Truth" which usually looks like presenting a series of doctrinal facts rather than the life changing experience of God doing things in our hearts and lives over a long period of time.

    I think the primary goal of learning "Truth" should be to get to know God Himself better. Explaining Him and His works better with be a natural side effect of that. Get to know God's character by reading scripture and meditating on it. Read a variety of works by admired Christian authors over the centuries and learn how they got to know God better. Spend regular time in prayer. Spend time in fellowship with other believers. Learn about God through what He has done. Put "explanations" in second place, not first place. Don't confuse zeal and enthusiasm and a plethora of Bible quotations for deep spirituality. The point is getting to know God better, not figuring out which of His followers is more right than the other.

    I like the attitude expressed by the blind man who Jesus healed and was being grilled by the Pharisees about it in John 9. A second time they summoned the man who had been blind. “Give glory to God by telling the truth,” they said. “We know this man is a sinner.” He replied, “Whether he is a sinner or not, I don’t know. One thing I do know. I was blind but now I see!” In the living presence of God in our lives, bad doctrinal errors will be obvious for what they are.
     
    • Winner Winner x 3
    • Like Like x 1
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
    • List
  9. Friend-of-Jesus

    Friend-of-Jesus Well-Known Member

    647
    +470
    Canada
    Christian
    Married
    I don't smoke! :)
     
    • Prayers Prayers x 2
    • Funny Funny x 2
    • List
  10. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

    +10,907
    Anabaptist
    Don't believe anything contrary to Scripture.

    Ask the Father, continually, for understanding of Scripture, as you continue to read Scripture and seek His Kingdom in Jesus, by faith and grace ....

    Men often lie.

    God never lies.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Like Like x 1
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
    • List
  11. Fish Catcher Jim

    Fish Catcher Jim Radically Saved

    562
    +482
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    Explain Hebrews 6:4-6
    4For it isimpossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
    5 and have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
    6 if they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put himto an open shame.

    Blessings
    FCJ
     
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • List
  12. Celticroots

    Celticroots Newbie

    975
    +707
    Christian
    Single
    So if we are saved partly by our own effort, why did Jesus die? Kind of makes it seem like God sets us up to fail because all of us sin.
     
  13. Fish Catcher Jim

    Fish Catcher Jim Radically Saved

    562
    +482
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    You can not just lump Scriptures together to back any belief and IGNORE OTHERS that say different. All Scripture works together
    Explain Hebrews 6:4-6
    4For it isimpossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
    5 and have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
    6 if they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put himto an open shame.

    Blessings
    FCJ
     
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • List
  14. CodyFaith

    CodyFaith Well-Known Member Supporter

    +5,051
    Canada
    Baptist
    Single
    If I provide a reasonable explanation, would that be enough for you?

    Those verses aren't talking of believers, it's talking of people who saw the Holy Spirit's power and love, and rebelled against it. For example, when some of the Jews saw Jesus driving out demons they said it was by the power of Satan doing such things. They saw and partook of the heavenly gift, seeing works directly from God's hand, and called such things evil.

    It's about the choice we all make - either to repent and believe or to turn from Christ entirely, permanently in our hearts.
     
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • List
  15. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

    +10,907
    Anabaptist
    This is all clearly spelled out all through Scripture, (and distorted by men for thousands of years now),
    starting in Gesesis when YHWH told Adam and Havah(Eve) His Word , through all the way, every book, to Revelation and the end of the world....
     
  16. Fish Catcher Jim

    Fish Catcher Jim Radically Saved

    562
    +482
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    It's not committing sins that is in effect but rather slowly walking away.
    We have to Turn From, Walk Away, Give Up On, DENY HIS WAYS to the point the Holy Spirit Will Leave and once that happens the evil one has his place back.

    Our enemy the devil is ever working 24/7/365 to get this to happen in every believers life.

    For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds
    Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;

    Far too many Believers Don't fight, won't fight or think they don't have too.
    Far to many believers feel they are smarter then our enemy and he can pull one across them. They are already half way defeated.

    Our enemies deception dies not come smelling like sulfer but can come with scriptures, feelings and emotions.

    he is a master at what he does and his deception is so camouflaged that most never even grasp it was him.

    his deception is tailored to each individual and in most cases knows you better then you do.

    This once saved always saved nonsense comes from him just as so many other ignorant religious beliefs the church has accepted and taught for generations.

    Fact is this, many begin to think along the deception of the enemy in which all the while he is ever slowly pulling you out and away from the truth.
    This is no one's fault but your own.

    his plan is to get you out far enough with out you knowing and eventually you turn your back on God.
    That was a choice you made so you reap from the consequences of that choice.

    Then he follows through and takes you out.
    Your fate is set and it's not what you thought.

    There is scripture to back everything
    Blessings
    FCJ
     
  17. Fish Catcher Jim

    Fish Catcher Jim Radically Saved

    562
    +482
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    No because there is none.

    Again you lack understanding here.
    It is talking about spirit filled believers.

    Any way I am not going to get in some foolish argument with you.
    Blessings
    FCJ
     
  18. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

    +18,732
    United States
    Lutheran
    In Relationship
    US-Others
    Unfortunately that's frequently how the Gospel is preached, but that's not the Gospel.

    The Gospel is that God loves the world and intends to redeem and rescue it; He does this through Jesus Christ, His Son. By the death and resurrection of our Lord Jesus He has destroyed the power of sin and death which holds mankind and creation captive, and delivers us to God.

    The point isn't "Heaven", the point is the redemption and healing of creation, because God will one day make all things new. It's not "going to heaven when we die", it's God will raise us up from the dead on the last day. Sin and death are our fallen brokenness, by which we are captive to its tyranny; God loves us and wants to rescue us so that we might live, have life, and yes have life forever with Him. Salvation is not an escape clause, salvation is the divine rescue of the entire world. The Word became flesh, God became man; and in dying and rising God heals our human brokenness and restores us to communion with Him that we might share in His life forever in the future world when He makes all things new.

    This places the onus on us rather than on what Christ has done. To say we must do X is to say that we contribute to our salvation; instead Scripture teaches that we are saved by grace alone through faith (Ephesians 2:8-9). This faith isn't believing X, Y, and/or Z; it is the gift of God (see again Ephesians 2:8) which is given to us by God through the Gospel (Romans 10:17).

    We are saved not by what we think, do, say, or believe; we are saved by the gracious and kind God who condescends to meet us broken and fallen sinners in the Person of Jesus and rescue us and restore us to Himself.

    Yes, but; we are called to walk in the good works prepared before hand for us, as we were created in Christ for good works. This isn't to contribute to our own salvation or to climb up some ladder toward personal holiness. Instead it's because we are invited to serve God by serving our neighbor. This is why no one can say "I love God" and hate their fellow man; the Great Commandment is to love the Lord our God and love our neighbor--the two cannot be separated. If we love Him because He first loved us, then we are to be present in the world loving our neighbor through good works; not that we might boast in them as though they save us, but that our neighbor might benefit and God is glorified, "Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven." Not glorify you, because you receive no glory from your good works.

    Our salvation is found in Christ alone. If we abandon our salvation which is found alone in Christ, then we abandon our salvation.

    Read Romans 7. We are simultaneously saint and sinner; saint because we are born again of God in Jesus Christ by the Holy Spirit; sinner because the old man, our flesh, continues to cling to us. Which is why no one can be perfect in this life, it is why we continue to find that we do not do the things we ought to do and we do the things we ought not do--we should not lie, but yet we lie; we should not steal, but yet we steal; we should love, but we frequently do not love. Both intentionally and unintentionally we sin. Which is why we can never cling to our own efforts, strength, or will--but only to Jesus Christ and the hope we have in Him alone.

    -CryptoLutheran
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
    • List
  19. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

    +10,907
    Anabaptist
    Amein..... and until the day we die, we have free will, unless God takes our free will away from us.
     
  20. Celticroots

    Celticroots Newbie

    975
    +707
    Christian
    Single
    If we aren't saved by believing in Christ's work then what can we do? Why do people say believe? I am not getting this at all.

    I personally told God I believed that Jesus was the only way I could be saved that I put my trust in Him and that I firmly believe Him and only He saved me when He died and rose again.

    I take Him at his word, not because of any action I took.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
    • List
Loading...