Trump's Line in the Sand -- Poll

[doubtingmerle]

I'm not aware of any current threat beyond bracketing Guam with four blank ICBMs. He may well have made similar threats in 2013 - I don't remember - but if he did, they would not have been achievable at that time.
OB

This:

North Korea has responded to the sanctions with characteristically strong rhetoric.

"We will balance the U.S.'s felonious crime against our country and our people with something thousands of times worse, and if the U.S. does not retract its attempts to crush us to death and behave prudently, we will be ready and not hesitate to take ultimate measures," the government said in a statement published by the state-run KCNA news agency. Source
​

Trump's "line in the sand" appears to be that if they make threats, he will retaliate. That is scary stuff. We have always said we will retaliate against unprovoked attacks. That is different from saying we will retaliate against threats.

If Trump interprets statements like the above as threats; if NK continues to make such statements; and if the promise is that such threats will be met with more fire and fury than happened at Hiroshima, that does not lead to a good outcome. Somebody needs to back down. But when there are two crazy men yelling at each other, each with a loaded gun, that is not an easy situation to defuse. The situation requires a calm leader to tone things down. Unfortunately, Trump is not that man.

 

[Mountainmanbob]

The situation requires a calm leader to tone things down. Unfortunately, Trump is not that man.

Actually, many experts in the field say that we need someone just like Trump so as to deal with N Korea.
M-Bob

 

[Occams Barber]

OK, the line in the sand I heard is that North Korea will not threaten anybody, and if they do, we will reign fire and fury on them. They are still threatening us. Are you saying Trump now should attack NK? How would he attack? Total devastation, surgical strike, or assassination? I don't see how any of those will prevent a counterattack, and don't see how the result of any of those is good.

This:

North Korea has responded to the sanctions with characteristically strong rhetoric.

"We will balance the U.S.'s felonious crime against our country and our people with something thousands of times worse, and if the U.S. does not retract its attempts to crush us to death and behave prudently, we will be ready and not hesitate to take ultimate measures," the government said in a statement published by the state-run KCNA news agency. Source
​

Trump's "line in the sand" appears to be that if they make threats, he will retaliate. That is scary stuff. We have always said we will retaliate against unprovoked attacks. That is different from saying we will retaliate against threats.

If Trump interprets statements like the above as threats; if NK continues to make such statement; and if the promise is that such threats will be met with more fire and fury than Hiroshima, that does not lead to a good outcome. Somebody needs to back down. But when there are two crazy men yelling at each other, each with a loaded gun, that is not an easy situation to defuse. The situation requires a calm leader to tone things down. Unfortunately, Trump is not that man.

I agree.
With unbelievable stupidity and ineptitude Trump has managed to paint himself into a corner while, at the same time, pushing Kim towards an aggressive response.

Trump is severely lacking in both the wit and the strategic sense to handle this situation. This would be fine if only Trump had to bear the consequences but his actions also put the rest of us, beyond Korea, beyond Guam, and beyond America, at risk.
OB

 

[doubtingmerle]

Actually, many experts in the field say that we need someone just like Trump so as to deal with N Korea.
M-Bob

Ah, what experts are saying that the proper way to deal with a hostage situation is to yell at the hostage taker and tell him that if he does not back down you will reign fire on him? That goes against everything I know about hostage negotiation.

Because right now Kim Jong-On basically has Seoul as a hostage.

Does your strategy in any way protect Seoul, Guam and Tokyo from attack? If so, what do you think Trump should do next that would protect them?

 

[Jenny_8675309]

Actually, many experts in the field

... who?

 

[doubtingmerle]

Actually, many experts in the field say that we need someone just like Trump so as to deal with N Korea.
M-Bob

Here is what the experts say about hostage negotiation: 6 hostage negotiation techniques that will get you what you want .

On a scale of 0 to 10, with 10 representing exactly what this says, what score do you give Trump on his hostage negotiation skills?

If you think there is a better way to deal with a hostage taker than what it says here, please state how you would do it.

 

[Mountainmanbob]

Oh how they would be better informed if they would stay away from the Fake News channels. It's probably the better air up top the mountain that helps with seeing the Light.
M-Bob

 

[Mountainmanbob]

Here is what the experts say about hostage negotiation: 6 hostage negotiation techniques that will get you what you want .

On a scale of 0 to 10, with 10 representing exactly what this says, what score do you give Trump on his hostage negotiation skills?

If you think there is a better way to deal with a hostage taker than what it says here, please state how you would do it.

Who told you that this was a hostage negotiation? That is not what is happening jeepers change your news channel quick.

Please help us they are being blinded and cannot see.

Truth is looking to be false and false is looking to be truth.

M-Bob

 

[Occams Barber]

Oh how they would be better informed if they would stay away from the Fake News channels.
M-Bob

This is a ridiculous statement.

I see Trump's words live on TV coming from his own mouth. Kim's words are directly broadcast by the state run North Korean TV channel. My news comes via Australian TV.

Are you suggesting that your ridiculous conspiracy theory extends out to the entire world?
OB

 

[doubtingmerle]

This is a ridiculous statement.

I see Trump's words live on TV coming from his own mouth. Kim's words are directly broadcast by the state run North Korean TV channel. My news comes from both sources via Australian TV.

Are you suggesting that your ridiculous conspiracy theory extends out to the entire world?
OB

Unfortunately, that seems to be what many otherwise rational people believe: that there is a global media conspiracy corrupting all news outlets so that nobody can believe a thing on the news (unless it matches the "preferred" ideology.) Sad, that.

 

[doubtingmerle]

Who told you that this was a hostage negotiation? That is not what is happening jeepers change your news channel quick.

Please help us they are being blinded and cannot see.

Truth is looking to be false and false is looking to be truth.

M-Bob

Jong-On is threatening to attack Seoul, Tokyo, and Guam unless America does what he wants. We are trying to talk him out of it. That is about as close to hostage negotiation as it gets. And we have the wrong hostage negotiator, in my opinion.

 

[Mountainmanbob]

Kim realizes that Trump is not going to be pushed around as leaders in the past.

It appears behind the scenes talks between the two countries have been going on for a while. Months I hear??

Let's see if negotiations were opened what can both sides get out of this?
Trump wrote the book.
He will not pull an Obama deal.

Relax, we always have Dennis Rodman to send over there. He is a fine representative for the other side the far out there other side.

M-Bob

 

[doubtingmerle]

Oh how they would be better informed if they would stay away from the Fake News channels. It's probably the better air up top the mountain that helps with seeing the Light.
M-Bob

OK, down here in the valley, I am hearing the following:

1. America is doing things that North Korea does not like.
2. Kim Jong-On has threatened that, if America does not stop doing these things, he will attack.
3. Trump has said that if Jong-On does not stop making such threats, he will attack.

What are you hearing different up there in the mountain? Please edit the 3 statement above to match what you are hearing up in the mountain air.

 

[Nithavela]

Trump wrote the book.

Which book?

 

[doubtingmerle]

Kim realizes that Trump is not going to be pushed around as leaders in the past.

It appears behind the scenes talks between the two countries have been going on for a while. Months I hear??

Let's see if negotiations were opened what can both sides get out of this?
Trump wrote the book.
He will not pull an Obama deal.

M-Bob

Ah, sanctions and negotiations? So now we are back to sanctions and negotiations as the correct strategy, rather than a preemptive attack?

Good, because that is what seems like the best solution to me down here in the valley. So sanctions and negotiations look good from up there in the mountain, too?

And I hate to break the news to you, but Trump did not write "The Art of the Deal". Tony Schwartz did. See Donald Trump’s Ghostwriter Tells All .

 

[Mountainmanbob]

Bottom line we are not going to let Kim get a nuclear bomb delivery system so he can put one on our doorstep. It's not going to happen with this president. If Kim shoots off a rocket and it gets too close to Guam sparks will fly. If Kim happens to drop a missile on any of our allies he will be turned into dust quickly. And still everyday Kim states he is ready to take on the United States in a war. Everyone including him knows that would be suicide for North Korea. China has warned the United States not to take action first but, if Kim acts up first we have permission to put him out of his misery.

As seen from up top the mountain.
Greetings to the valley people.

M-Bob

 

[Jenny_8675309]

Bottom line we are not going to let Kim get a nuclear bomb delivery system so he can put one on our doorstep. It's not going to happen with this president. If Kim shoots off a rocket and it gets too close to Guam sparks will fly. If Kim happens to drop a missile on any of our allies he will be turned into dust quickly. And still everyday Kim states he is ready to take on United States in a war. Everyone including him knows that would be suicide for North Korea. China has warned the United States not to take action first but, if Kim acts up first we have permission to put him out of his misery.

As seen from up top the mountain.
Greetings to the valley people.

M-Bob

Explain to me why a country with a massive nuclear stockpile gets the moral authority to stop other countries from developing their own nuclear weapons?

I'm sincerely curious to know how that may be rationalised?

 

[Mountainmanbob]

Explain to me why a country with a massive nuclear stockpile gets the moral authority to stop other countries from developing their own nuclear weapons?

I'm sincerely curious to know how that may be rationalised?

Make an appointment and ask the United Nations they are also in agreement.

M-Bob

 

[doubtingmerle]

He will not pull an Obama deal.

Will Trump be able to pull any deal? Because so far, I have not seen Trump do a single deal in Washington of any significance.

Obama was able to pull off a healthcare deal in a divided Washington. Trump could not.

Obama was able to cooperate in a global climate deal. All Trump could do was destroy it.

Obama was able to negotiate a deal to keep nukes out of Iran. Trump has not come up with an alternate deal.

Trump has not been able to negotiate agreement on a wall, on tax reform, on a budget, or any other of his campaign promises.

So after 6 months, if he is such a good deal maker, can you point to one good deal that Trump negotiated in Washington?

 

[doubtingmerle]

Make an appointment and ask the United Nations they are also in agreement.

M-Bob

Ah so news about the United Nations reached the mountain? Good to hear that. Because I hear about the United Nations all the time down here in the "fake news" down here in the valley. I am never quite certain what you get in your news.

What do they say about the United Nations up in the mountain? Do they say it is a good idea for nations to get together and cooperate?