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Trump's got the Pro-Life vote

Discussion in 'General Politics' started by Mountainmanbob, Feb 2, 2020.

  1. Mountainmanbob

    Mountainmanbob Goat Whisperer Supporter

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    Marjorie Dannenfelser: Trump the most pro-life president in history – these policies a game-changer

    Ahead of this year’s State of the Union address, the state of the pro-life movement is the most hopeful yet since Roe v. Wade. President Trump’s leadership as the most effective pro-life president in American history has been a game-changer. As evidenced in his historic address at this year’s March for Life, he has truly embraced our movement and delivered on his promise to be a pro-life president; now we will deliver for him at the ballot box.

    Today the contrast between President Trump and the Democrats is even starker. A new poll shows 88 percent of Republicans, 62 percent of Independents, and 44 percent of rank-and-file Democrats prefer to vote for a candidate who wants significant limits on abortion – yet all of the president’s opponents have doubled down on expanding abortion on demand through the moment of birth, no limits whatsoever paid for by taxpayers. They refuse to condemn infanticide, while Democrats in Congress led by Speaker Nancy Pelosi block popular legislation to protect babies who survive abortions.
     
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  2. Halbhh

    Halbhh Everything You say is Life to me Supporter

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    What's reality though?

    Abortions fell and fell lower and lower under Obama:

    [​IMG]

    Reality: people don't choose to get abortions because a President says this or that. They do it depending on personal choices, and it's 100% only a personal morality choice question, just like promiscuity or drinking alcohol.

    The political noise is just a show.

    Really want to make a difference? Then help young people make better choices, and put your money $$$ into helping young unwed mothers.
     
  3. Mountainmanbob

    Mountainmanbob Goat Whisperer Supporter

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    "Stop these abortions.”

    "Look, I got two daughters — 9 years old and 6 years old," he said. "I am going to teach them first about values and morals, but if they make a mistake, I don't want them punished with a baby. I don't want them punished with an STD at age 16, so it doesn't make sense to not give them information."
     
  4. Brightmoon

    Brightmoon Apes and humans are all in family Hominidae.

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    I wouldn’t call health issues, mental illness caused by pregnancy, poverty issues, a toxic pregnancy or a dead fetus a morality choice . A Pro lifer misnamed “convenience” issue doesn’t adequately describe what women who’ve had abortions go through . Why don’t you ask them instead of misjudging? Some women just don’t want to die like my paternal grandmother did giving birth to her 3rd child . Or have 15 children during 15 pregnancies like my maternal great grandmother did.
    Honestly if I had the choice between pregnancy induced psychosis ( or other serious health problem) or having the abortion , I’d get the abortion . I’d support any other women who did too.
     
  5. Mountainmanbob

    Mountainmanbob Goat Whisperer Supporter

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    I've been to Christian Abortion Recovery Classes.
    Abortions bring pain to most
    for their entire lives.
    What does God say?
    M-Bob
     
  6. Brightmoon

    Brightmoon Apes and humans are all in family Hominidae.

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    . Most invasive surgical procedures cause can emotional trauma . Abortion is a painful invasion of the body and it can cause trauma . Most women DONT go through this after an abortion . I do understand that pro lifers like to exaggerate the numbers of women that feel trauma but It could be due to the pain experienced or people gaslighting them into feeling guilty
     
  7. section9+1

    section9+1 Well-Known Member

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    Proverbs 13:15
    The way of the transgressor is hard.
     
  8. Brightmoon

    Brightmoon Apes and humans are all in family Hominidae.

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    Lying about this isn’t ethical. babies who survive abortions have to taken care of . Thats the law. Pelosi probably blocked because the new law as written wasn’t necessary ( and it looked like republicans were just pandering instead of writing a real law)
     
  9. Brightmoon

    Brightmoon Apes and humans are all in family Hominidae.

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    02D6FC67-A0B9-47A9-856C-716232F0CCDF.jpeg

    These single parent numbers are just going to go up . So I agree with a previous poster about helping single parents ( who might not be unwed or female )
     
  10. Brightmoon

    Brightmoon Apes and humans are all in family Hominidae.

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    Well I didn’t look at the Democrats vs Republican numbers but this is what I got from Pew . The survey was done in August 2019 7E1B208F-C776-4682-8F86-16F4190B5844.jpeg
     
  11. GACfan

    GACfan Well-Known Member Staff Member Trainee Supporter

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    Don't be fooled by any of this "Trump is pro-life" rhetoric because he isn't genuinely pro-life. In fact, he supports abortion in cases of rape, incest, and when the pregnancy threatens the mother's life.

    Trump... "Every life brings love into this world. Every child brings joy to a family."

    Also Trump... "The other thing with the terrorists is you have to take out their families, when you get these terrorists, you have to take out their families. They care about their lives, don't kid yourself. When they say they don't care about their lives, you have to take out their families" (source).

    Can't you see how pro-life he is by suggesting to take out the families of terrorists? I guess his "Every life brings love into this world. Every child brings joy to a family" doesn't apply to any foreign children who are related to terrorists. I don't see how "take out the families of terrorists" is pro-life, do you?
     
  12. GACfan

    GACfan Well-Known Member Staff Member Trainee Supporter

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    We honestly shouldn't take any of the pro-life rhetoric seriously from either Trump or from his voting base. The conservative pro-life movement has its fair share of hypocrisy and political flip-flopping.

    Trump has personally flip-flopped on the abortion issue several times since he was elected.

    Donald Trump's 3 positions on abortion in 3 hours

    Donald Trump took 5 different positions on abortion in 3 days

    Donald Trump retracts call for women who have abortions to be 'punished'

    Trump shifted from pro-choice to pro-life only as he planned a presidential run

    It wouldn't be morally consistent of Trump's voting base to point a judgmental finger at Democrats for supporting abortion without pointing that same finger at the Republicans who weren't exactly morally consistent remaining faithful to the Republican Party's political platform on the abortion issue.

    Tenn. GOP congressman's ex-wife had 2 abortions

    A Republican theme on abortions: 'It's OK for me, evil for thee'

    Do As I Say Not As I Do: The Truth About the Anti-Abortion Crowd

    Conservative Pennsylvania Congressman Resigns Amid Abortion Scandal

    Republicans Are Against Abortions For Women Who Aren’t Their Mistresses
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2020
  13. dzheremi

    dzheremi Coptic Orthodox non-Egyptian

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    I am pro-life and Trump most definitely does not have my vote. He is obviously opportunistic in this and talks out of both sides of his mouth on life issues, as has been shown in this very thread.

    Furthermore, I think a great deal more could be done for the pro-life cause by actually treating women who have had abortions like people who have made choices that are against the ethic of Christianity (assuming you're dealing with Christian women, that is; probably a non-Christian would not respond to or understand this sort of thing), rather than like cold-blooded killers who revel in baby murder. The women I know who have had abortions have told me that they regret it deeply, but that ought not be a talking point in a political argument, but instead an opportunity to help them heal and reach a place of forgiveness and healing from a tragic circumstance.

    In the very long ago, the ecclesiastical penalty for purposely aborting a baby was excommunication for life (as the Church has always considered deliberate/non-natural abortion to be murder), but sometime around the time of St. Basil the Great (4th century), that penalty was greatly loosened to something like 10 years. (It has been a long time since I read the relevant portions of the canons of St. Basil that deal with this, but I know it was in his time that the penalty was changed.)

    No doubt the modern person would look at that and still say that ten years of banishment from the chalice is still incredibly harsh, but my point is that if the Church itself could decide to greatly alter the penalty for abortion 1,600 years ago, then what business do a bunch of modern people have reinstating a kind of 'all-or-nothing' idea, where the brokenness of the mother is ignored in favor of focusing on the hideousness of the crime? I don't doubt that the majority of people here probably find abortion to be a terrible thing (as I do), but we either believe in the redemption of people who have done horrible things (via the same path of repentance that we all must walk for our own sins) or we do not.

    I do, and I'm not going to sell that view out in order to signal my true allegiance to political tribalism when in fact that's not where my heart and mind are at concerning this issue. I don't know that overturning Roe v. Wade is that politically viable (and is it really a good idea to effectively reintroduce illegal abortion into the scheme of things?), but even if it were I would imagine more could be done by supporting women who are pregnant in less than ideal circumstances than is ever done by aggressively parading around with this or that political banner.
     
  14. Mountainmanbob

    Mountainmanbob Goat Whisperer Supporter

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    Actually, they feel guilt long before attending Recovery Classes.

    Once one truly sees what God thinks about abortion how could one not feel guilty?
    Unless they have no contact with God
    or his Word.

    What the Bible Says About the Beginning of Life - Focus on the Family

    Why Should We Value Life?

    “Know that the LORD Himself is God; it is He who has made us, and not we ourselves; we are His people and the sheep of His pasture” (Psalm 100:3, NASV).

    “Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, and the One who formed you from the womb, ‘I, the LORD, am the maker of all things, stretching out the heavens by Myself, and spreading out the earth all alone . . .'” (Isaiah 44:24, NASV).

    “But now, O LORD, Thou art our Father, we are the clay, and Thou our potter; and all of us are the work of Thy hand” (Isaiah 64:8, NASV).

    &&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&
    So some support destroying
    the work of His hand?
    Don't wish to be there when that's brought up.
    M-Bob
     
  15. Mountainmanbob

    Mountainmanbob Goat Whisperer Supporter

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    John 10:10-29 King James Version (KJV)
    10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

    11 I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.

    &&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&
    He (He) doesn't want his sheep killed
    especially by their own parents.
    M-Bob
     
  16. GACfan

    GACfan Well-Known Member Staff Member Trainee Supporter

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    If supporting the devil has nothing to do with this thread, then why did you bring it up before me? As everyone knows, Donald Trump is only "pro-life" if an abortion isn't the result of a rape or incest or if a pregnancy doesn't risk the mother's life. Is it really pro-life to want to kill the families of terrorists?
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2020
  17. Yarddog

    Yarddog Senior Contributor Supporter

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    Well, he's got the anti-abortionists vote which is not entirely Pro-life.
     
  18. BNR32FAN

    BNR32FAN He’s a Way of life Supporter

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    As Christians our duty is to spread God’s word. We don’t make the rules we just help others know and understand them. If the person has done something against God then their guilt is on their own shoulders. There’s not a single Christian on this planet that hasn’t offended God and has no guilt of doing so. So the guilt that some who’ve had abortions may experience is not the result of Christians “gaslighting” them into it but the result of their own transgressions against God.
     
  19. Yarddog

    Yarddog Senior Contributor Supporter

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    If abortion is Satanic worship so is turning away immigrants fleeing from dictatorships. So is flaunting one's money or power. Making fun of those who have disabilities and I could go on and on about this administration.

    I am Pro-life, which goes further than being anti-abortion. Supporting the death penalty when it is not necessary for protection is not pro-life. Neglecting the women who choose abortion because they cannot afford to raise their children is not pro-life or neglecting the children born to poor families is not pro-life.

    The Republican Party has failed to do their duty to try and stop abortion at the national level for almost 50 years and we have abortion, not because of legislation but because of a SCOTUS ruling filled with Conservative judges.

    Abortion is inexcusable but so are so many other issues embraced by the Right.
     
  20. Brightmoon

    Brightmoon Apes and humans are all in family Hominidae.

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    We have legal abortions because women asked for it back in the 70s . Women ! The ones who get pregnant. Coat hanger abortions were killing and maiming too many of us. I don’t want to see those days return. Abortion is, for ANY woman who has one, a lesser of 2 evils choice. Companies or politicians that won’t support birth control or adequate sex Ed just add to the problem. Religion induced guilt doesn’t solve the problem it just adds to it.
     
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