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Trump says, Go Back To Church -- POLL

Discussion in 'General Politics' started by Mountainmanbob, May 23, 2020 at 4:02 AM.

  1. yes

    6 vote(s)
    24.0%
  2. No

    11 vote(s)
    44.0%
  3. Each Church should be able to decide on their own

    8 vote(s)
    32.0%
  1. Mountainmanbob

    Mountainmanbob Goat Whisperer Supporter

    +10,043
    United States
    Calvinist
    Married
    US-Republican
    Trump deems churches, places of worship 'essential' in COVID reopening

    WASHINGTON – President Donald Trump on Friday called on local officials to reopen churches and other places of worship beginning this weekend, but aides offered conflicting messages about how far the administration will go to ensure parishioners are allowed back in the pews.

    &&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&

    Note -- voting in this poll should be only for the ones who do attend Church regularly.
    M
     
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  2. Paidiske

    Paidiske Clara bonam audax Supporter

    +13,985
    Australia
    Anglican
    Married
    Being "ready" is an interesting question. When we do start to gather again, we will need to take measures/precautions that will mean church is still not going to be as "normal." I voted no in the poll because my church is not, at this point, prepared to be flexible to take those measures and precautions.
     
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  3. Richard T

    Richard T Well-Known Member

    761
    +454
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Single
    My pastor can open church but everyone would be required to wear masks. He is waiting for this restriction to be lifted before services are opened up. Singing in particular will bring out virus particles, if one has an active case. Many are asymptomatic, so it seems unlikely that services will be fully normal until there is a vaccine. Sorry, but I will only attend online. I suppose if i were a pastor, I would limit attendance at this time to 1/10th of normal. Have 3 services a week rotating your congregation and you would have everyone in church about every 3 weeks. I might consider too having singing outside if weather permits, unmasked, and then coming in the church for the sermon/communion/giving.
     
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  4. Jonathan Walkerin

    Jonathan Walkerin Well-Known Member

    +1,471
    Sweden
    Catholic
    Married
    So the usual Trump cheerleading and others have to figure out how to make his fantasies happen or at least how to make those fantasies look like they are happening.

    I really don’t envy those people.
     
  5. Richard T

    Richard T Well-Known Member

    761
    +454
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Single
    Trump and America seemed doomed for failure because too many worship money. I hope i am wrong but we already lead the world with cases and we are just getting started.
     
  6. seeking.IAM

    seeking.IAM Episcopalian Supporter

    +2,367
    Anglican
    Married
    Now that POTUS has said you may, churches have to decide if you should. And then parishioners get to decide if we will.

    Episcopal Church Dioceses of my state have established their own plan for returning to church based upon reaching virus-related metrics, not .gov rhetoric (or upon science not politics). I suspect their metrics are going to pretty tough to achieve. Once they do re-open, I am going to wait and see what happens to all the early adopters first. I miss church terribly, but am being fed and staying connected by my Church's virtual offerings.

    On one had there are those who say God will protect us (and some have paid a price for it). I, on the other hand, rather like a quote I read from columnist Connie Shultz, wife of a U.S. Senator. She wrote her mother used to tell her, "If you want to die stupid, God’ll let you."
     
  7. Hazelelponi

    Hazelelponi Well-Known Member Supporter

    +4,355
    United States
    Baptist
    Married
    I voted it should be up to each individual church.
     
  8. The Barbarian

    The Barbarian Crabby Old White Guy

    +6,071
    United States
    Catholic
    Married
    US-Libertarian
    The point is, it's out of Trump's hands. While he dithered and called the pandemic a "hoax", the states were picking up where he failed, and put their own plans in place. Trump has no business getting involved with it; the Tenth Amendment gives the power to decide this issue to the states.

    He might have had some moral authority to lead if he had chosen to do so, but his failure to act put him on the sidelines.
     
  9. Mountainmanbob

    Mountainmanbob Goat Whisperer Supporter

    +10,043
    United States
    Calvinist
    Married
    US-Republican
    We know how to keep a safe distance.
    Been doing it everyday while in public.
    Our Church will probably be much safer
    than a trip to Walmart.
    M
     
  10. Mountainmanbob

    Mountainmanbob Goat Whisperer Supporter

    +10,043
    United States
    Calvinist
    Married
    US-Republican
    Last edited: May 23, 2020 at 11:16 AM
  11. seeking.IAM

    seeking.IAM Episcopalian Supporter

    +2,367
    Anglican
    Married
    Let's be fair. You are unlikely to find 200 people milling about the gas station or liquor store. The law of probability is in play.
     
  12. The Barbarian

    The Barbarian Crabby Old White Guy

    +6,071
    United States
    Catholic
    Married
    US-Libertarian
    You're resorting to facts, again. Confusing everyone.
     
  13. Mountainmanbob

    Mountainmanbob Goat Whisperer Supporter

    +10,043
    United States
    Calvinist
    Married
    US-Republican
  14. Sophrosyne

    Sophrosyne Let Your Light Shine.. Matt 5:16

    +40,853
    Christian
    My church had outdoor services like a drive in theater that the city allowed. I think many churches won't want to have "normal" services as they have to adhere to the policies of state and local governments just like other businesses do. Here I think they are calculating the square footage of a business and dividing it by 36 and using that number for occupancy or taking the fire marshals max occupancy figure and using a percentage of that for the figure. They have someone that keeps track of in/out so they have a running figure of how many people are inside and some have distancing marks for those outside waiting too.
    I think that if distancing rules are required of churches still then they may decide not to have services at all due to the limited amount of people that can attend would cause a possible mess either they would need to have a lot more smaller services perhaps shorter in length so everyone that wants to attend can or postpone it or maybe even set up appointments so people don't get locked out when they hit their Covid occupancy limits.
    I considered this and I see no reason for keeping churches closed if they are given the same rules to abide by that other businesses that are allowed to be open have.
    In a church that has let's say 1000 people in a normal service are required by the rules set to only allow 150 to 200 people in for a service that leaves 800 or more that could be stuck waiting outside which would be a nightmare for managing in traffic in/out and standing in lines. It would take 4-5 times as many services if people all wanted to go but I figure that would probably not be quite back to normal even 2-3 times the limits may not be manageable.

    For smaller churches the fear of getting the virus along with people that are good with watching it online for the time being may allow them to follow the local protocols as good as other places allowed to be open. I think the bigger issue would be profitability, that is if a service has too few people in it would the cost of having a service vs the donations that are picked up during the service don't balance out a more poor church may not be able to afford to have churches that severely limit participants due to distancing guidelines vs size of building.
    One could parallel this thinking to having a store that is profitable with having an average of 100 people in the store average at a time during the day now being told they can only have 20 people in it at a time is no longer able to afford to make a profit and concludes that they cannot open. Churches that have 1000 seats if required to distance people even with masks or whatever you may lose 2/3 of your seats and have to figure out how to mark off seats to help enforce distancing guidelines which also can be an expense and big hassle.
    Now if there is no distancing issues only masking issues then perhaps a max occupancy rating would allow many businesses and churches to operate at levels that at least break even on the expenses they have but I don't think there is anywhere that is not requiring distancing still in the US.

    There is one thing that could work that is to used closed stadiums and other sports venue areas for church services they could address distancing rules that would limit capacity to even 10% on the majority of church services easily.
     
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  15. tulc

    tulc loves "SO'S YER MOM!! posts!

    +15,523
    Christian
    Married
    uhmmm...doesn't that mean that President Trump wouldn't be able to vote in your poll? :scratch:
    tulc(is just curious) :wave:
     
  16. Mountainmanbob

    Mountainmanbob Goat Whisperer Supporter

    +10,043
    United States
    Calvinist
    Married
    US-Republican
    Derailing my thread again.
    Nothing New Under The Sun

    Since you brought it up
    Biden couldn't find a church
    if he was standing across the street from one.

    Actually, with his stance on abortion
    would a Church even let him in?

    M
     
  17. seeking.IAM

    seeking.IAM Episcopalian Supporter

    +2,367
    Anglican
    Married
    Since you derailed your own thread...Biden is Catholic. Has actually worshipped. And has actually been denied communion once in SC. Google is your friend.
     
  18. Sistrin

    Sistrin We are such stuff as dreams are made on... Supporter

    +3,164
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    It is called the First Amendment. Which, in case you are unfamiliar, guarantees the free practice of religion. If the membership wishes to return to church they are intelligent enough to institute an appropriate system without the state dictating when and how that will happen.
     
  19. Mountainmanbob

    Mountainmanbob Goat Whisperer Supporter

    +10,043
    United States
    Calvinist
    Married
    US-Republican
    A church with some backbone.
    God hates abortion.

    And we should pitty those supporters of abortion.

    M
     
  20. tulc

    tulc loves "SO'S YER MOM!! posts!

    +15,523
    Christian
    Married
    uhmmm, not really derailing, if you didn't want people talking about President Trump, churches opening and people who go to church, why start a thread about, you know, President Trump and churches reopening and people who go to church? My comment covered two of the three things this thread is about. It's not like I brought up Mr Biden in a thread where he's not mentioned in the OP.

    If you wanted to talk about Mr Biden shouldn't you start a thread about him somewhere else? I don't think the poster who started the thread would like people bringing up things not talked about in the OP. :sorry:

    tulc(hopes M-Bob doesn't mind tulc trying to keep this thread on track for only things brought up in the OP) :wave:
     
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