Trump falsely claims NATO countries owe United States money for defense spending

tulc

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President Trump got his 187th false today (the 73rd of his administration)
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...falsely-claims-nato-countries-owe-united-sta/
Trump said that "many countries owe us a tremendous amount of money for many years back."

NATO members agreed to contribute at least 2 percent of their country’s GDP toward defense by 2024, but that defense spending does not take the form of payments to the United States or the alliance as a whole.

We rate this statement False.
tulc(that's 2 this week...and it's just Wednesday) :sorry:
 

faroukfarouk

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tulc

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The fact that many countries have depended on the US for defence - especially in Europe during the Cold War - cannot be seriously challenged, whether you like it or not.
...was that what the article talked about? because I was under the impression it was dealing with a specific thing President Trump said and that thing was judged to be false. If you'd like to discuss the United States and the cold war you should start a thread where it can be discussed. This isn't that thread. :wave:
tulc(will look forward to faroukfarouk's thread) :)
 
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faroukfarouk

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...was that what the article talked about? because I was under the impression it was dealing with a specific thing President Trump said and that thing was judged to be false. If you'd like to discuss the United States and the cold war you should start a thread where it can be discussed. This isn't that thread. :wave:
tulc(will look forward to faroukfarouk's thread) :)
President Trump said: "Many countries are not paying what they should", as the article quotes.

If one reads what President Nixon said about European NATO governments nearly 50 years ago - as I have, incidentally - he said much the same thing then.

It's a refrain that's nothing new.
 
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tulc

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I don't think counting a man's sins is respecting the fear of God or revering the grace of God.
I don't think lying is a good thing either and is even worse when it's done on a regular basis by the leader of a nation. :wave:
tulc(thinks as such it's good to point it out when it happens) :)
 
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Hank77

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tulc

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For the first time I disagree with politifact. He clarified that it was his opinion that they owe it to the US. I watched a video of this meeting and what was said. The statement is being taken out of context.
Link? :wave:
tulc(is always ready to look at a link) ;)
 
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faroukfarouk

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...nor is it true as the OP explained. :wave:
tulc(a repeated falsehood is no less false just because it's been said often) :sorry:
While I could repeat until blue in the face the fact that President Nixon said much as President Trump has done about other countries paying more for their own defence, yet you probably won't believe it and so what purpose is there for me to contribute further to this thread?
 
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Albion

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President Trump got his 187th false today (the 73rd of his administration)
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...falsely-claims-nato-countries-owe-united-sta/

tulc(that's 2 this week...and it's just Wednesday) :sorry:
Oh, that's from Politifact which is often incorrect because it makes assumptions that are added to what was actually said or, as was already mentioned, takes statements out of context. It is common knowledge nowadays that this is the way Politifact operates and has long done so.

A number of European nations do owe the USA back money, just as the president said.
 
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tulc

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While I could repeat until blue in the face the fact that President Nixon said much as President Trump has done about other countries paying more for their own defence, yet you probably won't believe it and so what purpose is there for me to contribute further to this thread?
I was under the impression you were ignoring things that were explained in the OP as if they weren't and then you seemed to want to discuss the Cold War. Which wasn't what the OP was about. I simply pointed out if you wanted to discuss the NATO and the Cold War you should start a thread about that. because that wasn't what this thread was about. It's not about "what I believe or don't believe" either. Know why? That's right it's because the thread isn't about me either. :wave:
tulc(hopes this clears up what the thread is about) :)
 
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tulc

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I already started a thread on this. So yours doesn't count, you're still at 186.
no YOU'RE at 186, I'm in the future and MY count is at 187! (cue evil laughter!)
:ahah:
tulc(doesn't actually have an evil laugh, it's more of a guffaw with an snort at the end...no evil in it) :sigh:
 
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drjean

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Since NATO was created so the USA would protect the European countries against the (Soviet Union) Russians, and they are now in deals with Russia, spending money and giving monies to Putin's Russia and not paying even the 2% to NATO, there is no reason for the US to continue to carry them, and pay for their protection. (I'm all for cancelling the Treaty altogether at this rate. They have made their beds with Russia...)

Secretary General Annual Report NATO

See charts also pp 33, 34

The ability of the Alliance to fulfil all its tasks depends on it having the right tools and
capabilities. That, in turn, means appropriate investment in defence, with all 29 Allies
contributing their fair share.
NATO Allies need to invest in developing, acquiring
and maintaining the right capabilities for the Alliance
to be able to fulfil its core purpose of defending nearly
one billion citizens in Europe and North America.
The Alliance attaches great importance to its
ongoing efforts to ensure a better balance and fairer
burden-sharing across three specified elements:
defence expenditure; investments in capabilities;
and contributions to NATO’s operations, missions
and activities.
At the 2014 Summit in Wales, NATO Heads of State
and Government signed up to a Defence Investment
Pledge. The pledge called for all Allies that do
not already meet the
NATO-agreed guideline
of spending 2% of Gross Domestic Product
(GDP) on defence
to stop cuts to defence budgets,
gradually increase spending, and aim to move
towards spending 2% of GDP on defence within a
decade.
They also agreed to move towards
spending
at least 20% of annual defence expenditure on
major new equipment
, including related research
and development, in the same timeframe.
Since then, Allies have made significant progress in
meeting these goals. After years of defence cuts,
the trend over the last three years has been one of
increased defence spending.


For all the graphs in this chapter of the report, it should be noted that Iceland
has no armed forces.
Note: The figures presented at aggregate level may differ from the sum of their
component due to rounding.
In 2017, the trend continued, with European Allies
and Canada increasing their defence expenditure
by almost 5%. Many Allies have put in place national
plans to reach 2% by 2024 and are making progress
towards that goal. In real terms, defence spending
among European Allies and Canada increased
by 4.87% from 2016 to 2017, with an additional
cumulative spending increase of USD 46 billion for
the period from 2015 to 2017, above the 2014 level.
In 2017, the United States accounted for 51.1% of
the Allies’ combined GDP and 71.7% of combined
defence expenditure.
At the same time, European
Allies and Canada increased their spending, helping
to redress the balance.
Progress was also made on the commitment to
invest 20% or more of defence expenditure in major
new capabilities. In 2017,
26 Allies spent more
in real terms
on major equipment than they did
in 2016. The number of Allies meeting the NATO-
agreed 20% guidelines rose to 12 in 2017.
 
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drjean

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NATO_common_funded_budgets-2018-19.jpg
 
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tulc

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..and the fact that President Trump businesses and personally is supported by millins of dollars from Russia and Russian interests is beside the point?
https://www.usnews.com/opinion/thom...nald-trumps-money-in-the-russia-investigation
or this:
https://www.nj.com/opinion/index.ssf/2018/02/why_jared_kushners_gargantuan_debt_matters_in_trum.html
When I look at those articles (and a myriad of others like them) the fight with Germany and other countries stops being about trade and more about a guy getting jealous that his "special Russian friend" is seeing other people more then him. :sorry:
tulc(just a thought) :wave:
 
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