True free will, actions and reactions, chemical reactions in the body and brain, emotions/feelings..

[Neogaia777]

Most of us are just acting and reacting in response to chemical reactions in our body and our brains, entirely predictable behavior, following our feelings and emotions, acting reacting on instincts, and not by "thinking" first...

We do not really have free will when were doing this, in my opinion... I do not think most children actually have "free will" because of this, and very few adults, that I've met and seen do, in reality... We only have free will when we "think" hard first before acting or reacting... And not just "shooting from the emotional hip" with words and actions, I call it...

And this is very and entirely predicable, and subjects you to being manipulated in my opinion... I do not want to be predicable in that way... I want to have a free will, and the only way to do that, is to stop thoughts coming from feelings alone, and rethink another way of handling or acting/reacting in any given situation...

I want to be unpredictable, not predictable, even by the powers that be... I do not want angels or spirits to be able to predict my actions and reactions... To do this, I have to stop myself, when I am feeling a thing, and think hard first... This is the only way to take back control of not only our actions/reactions, but also our own course in life and our destiny... The only way to blaze our own path and take the path less traveled...

I want to surprise the powers that be (the angels at least, fallen or otherwise) and take them off guard and do something that they totally could not predict and were not expecting...

We are just like the animals and are acting carnally and are no better or any different from animals when we just "shoot from the hip" based on a feeling without using our minds to stop it/them and "think" first...

I think true free will is something we learn or attain to, by thinking carefully and deeply before acting/reacting based on feelings... In those cases, we are only acting due to chemical reactions in body and brain, and the spirits or angels know them all, and know how to manipulate and control us through it/them... I want to be able to do things or react or act in such a way, that they might not know, or be able to predict, or for the fallen angels most especially, be able to take advantage of, and control or manipulate us with...

The world says, "follow your heart" "do what you feel"... Yet the Bible says, that "the heart (or feelings or chemical reactions in you) is desperately wicked and deceitful above all things, and who can know it or get mastery over it" (by thinking and doing something different from what your heart feels)... And that, "The things that come out of the mouth come from the heart" and "Whomever gets mastery over their tongue is a perfect person" and getting mastery over your mouth and the things that come out of it, is, or comes by this stopping and thinking hard and deep first, and is also mastery over your feelings or your heart...

Now, there is not always ample time to think about something first, before responding, in those moments... At those times, I feel like the Holy Spirit helps me, to not act/react totally based on the chemical reactions going on in my body and brain, but to do something totally different and in some cases even entirely opposite of that...

When you feel a thing and are tempted to react out of it, try hard to stop it and think first, for this is the only way to be unpredictable and truly have a free will of your own...

Oh, I don't want to wage war on or against feelings and emotions, but...? Well...?

Comments...?

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

Try to keep emotion out of it when responding or acting/reacting... Think first...

 

[Neogaia777]

When i see or meet or are around people laughing in one moment, crying the next, then getting angry and very intense, when i am around someone going through the flux of these emotions constantly and all the time, i get afraid, a wall goes up and all i can think is "get me the blankity-blank and the hell out here/this now please"

God bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

In my opinion these people need to seek professional help and get on some psych/behavioral meds. Up and down, up and down, i can't do it anymore. Used to be able to, i use to be very good at it and it was even part of my profession for many years, not now though, now things are different...

It triggers me now and puts me in flight or fight mode. I ask God to just send me someone stable for Christ's sake, someone who has some measure of self-control is all i ask.

God Bless!

 

[tdidymas]

Most of us are just acting and reacting in response to chemical reactions in our body and our brains, entirely predictable behavior, following our feelings and emotions, acting reacting on instincts, and not by "thinking" first...

We do not really have free will when were doing this, in my opinion... I do not think most children actually have "free will" because of this, and very few adults, that I've met and seen do, in reality... We only have free will when we "think" hard first before acting or reacting... And not just "shooting from the emotional hip" with words and actions, I call it...

And this is very and entirely predicable, and subjects you to being manipulated in my opinion... I do not want to be predicable in that way... I want to have a free will, and the only way to do that, is to stop thoughts coming from feelings alone, and rethink another way of handling or acting/reacting in any given situation...

I want to be unpredictable, not predictable, even by the powers that be... I do not want angels or spirits to be able to predict my actions and reactions... To do this, I have to stop myself, when I am feeling a thing, and think hard first... This is the only way to take back control of not only our actions/reactions, but also our own course in life and our destiny... The only way to blaze our own path and take the path less traveled...

I want to surprise the powers that be (the angels at least, fallen or otherwise) and take them off guard and do something that they totally could not predict and were not expecting...

We are just like the animals and are acting carnally and are no better or any different from animals when we just "shoot from the hip" based on a feeling without using our minds to stop it/them and "think" first...

I think true free will is something we learn or attain to, by thinking carefully and deeply before acting/reacting based on feelings... In those cases, we are only acting due to chemical reactions in body and brain, and the spirits or angels know them all, and know how to manipulate and control us through it/them... I want to be able to do things or react or act in such a way, that they might not know, or be able to predict, or for the fallen angels most especially, be able to take advantage of, and control or manipulate us with...

The world says, "follow your heart" "do what you feel"... Yet the Bible says, that "the heart (or feelings or chemical reactions in you) is desperately wicked and deceitful above all things, and who can know it or get mastery over it" (by thinking and doing something different from what your heart feels)... And that, "The things that come out of the mouth come from the heart" and "Whomever gets mastery over their tongue is a perfect person" and getting mastery over your mouth and the things that come out of it, is, or comes by this stopping and thinking hard and deep first, and is also mastery over your feelings or your heart...

Now, there is not always ample time to think about something first, before responding, in those moments... At those times, I feel like the Holy Spirit helps me, to not act/react totally based on the chemical reactions going on in my body and brain, but to do something totally different and in some cases even entirely opposite of that...

When you feel a thing and are tempted to react out of it, try hard to stop it and think first, for this is the only way to be unpredictable and truly have a free will of your own...

Oh, I don't want to wage war on or against feelings and emotions, but...? Well...?

Comments...?

God Bless!

The WILL of a person resides in the heart, that is, the unconscious part of a person in which motive or intention drives the decision-making process. Augustine wrote that desire, not intellect, drives a person's will. I also believe that desire is the strongest influencer of decision making. This is what makes temptation, and especially addictions, so strong to influence a person's decisions. Our desire to please God must be stronger than desire for self-centered pleasures, if we are to live as Christ commands.

There are various sources of influence on a person's will. Past experiences, memories, habits, culture, peer pressure, laws, voices of the Holy Spirit and of demons, media, education, logic and reasoning, persuasions, food chemistry, family and religious traditions, diseases, psychological and physical wounds, pain, pleasure, etc. etc. ad infinitum. This is what makes God's word, and the memorization of it, so important to Christian living.

Much of what you say above is true, but I would like to point out one fallacy:

I think true free will is something we learn or attain to, by thinking carefully and deeply before acting/reacting based on feelings

This is a completely unreasonable goal, as "true free will" is an elusive myth. Why do you think that Jesus requires us to "take up our cross DAILY" and follow Him (daily)? People who think that "free will" (in the same sense that God has free will) is the solution to a stable character are deluded. The only stability we will ever attain to is in the habit of practicing the Christian disciplines, the first and foremost being faithfulness in following the lifestyle of Christ. This is the only "WAY" to developing a desire to please God that is stronger than the evil desires that reside in our flesh. It is in the faith-walk of living as Jesus commanded (the practice of faith in Christ).

The Christian life is a journey, a walk, "The Way" of life. No one ever attains to a free will. There will always be a trying circumstance in which a Christian cannot choose good, because goodness is not sourced by us. The victorious Christian life is lived by faith in Christ, not by trying to establish a truly free will. Read Romans chapter 7 and 8 many times, and I think you will not come to a different idea. The will of a man is not "fixed" (becomes truly free) by becoming a Christian. The only way the will of a person is "fixed" (able to obey God in every situation) is by an ongoing moment by moment trust in Him. It is a matter of not only the intellect, but also of the heart, and faith is certainly a matter of the heart (Rom. 10).

1 Jn. 5:4 "For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith."
TD

 

[Neogaia777]

The WILL of a person resides in the heart, that is, the unconscious part of a person in which motive or intention drives the decision-making process. Augustine wrote that desire, not intellect, drives a person's will. I also believe that desire is the strongest influencer of decision making. This is what makes temptation, and especially addictions, so strong to influence a person's decisions. Our desire to please God must be stronger than desire for self-centered pleasures, if we are to live as Christ commands.

There are various sources of influence on a person's will. Past experiences, memories, habits, culture, peer pressure, laws, voices of the Holy Spirit and of demons, media, education, logic and reasoning, persuasions, food chemistry, family and religious traditions, diseases, psychological and physical wounds, pain, pleasure, etc. etc. ad infinitum. This is what makes God's word, and the memorization of it, so important to Christian living.

Much of what you say above is true, but I would like to point out one fallacy:

This is a completely unreasonable goal, as "true free will" is an elusive myth. Why do you think that Jesus requires us to "take up our cross DAILY" and follow Him (daily)? People who think that "free will" (in the same sense that God has free will) is the solution to a stable character are deluded. The only stability we will ever attain to is in the habit of practicing the Christian disciplines, the first and foremost being faithfulness in following the lifestyle of Christ. This is the only "WAY" to developing a desire to please God that is stronger than the evil desires that reside in our flesh. It is in the faith-walk of living as Jesus commanded (the practice of faith in Christ).

The Christian life is a journey, a walk, "The Way" of life. No one ever attains to a free will. There will always be a trying circumstance in which a Christian cannot choose good, because goodness is not sourced by us. The victorious Christian life is lived by faith in Christ, not by trying to establish a truly free will. Read Romans chapter 7 and 8 many times, and I think you will not come to a different idea. The will of a man is not "fixed" (becomes truly free) by becoming a Christian. The only way the will of a person is "fixed" (able to obey God in every situation) is by an ongoing moment by moment trust in Him. It is a matter of not only the intellect, but also of the heart, and faith is certainly a matter of the heart (Rom. 10).

1 Jn. 5:4 "For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith."
TD

Do you believe in free will...?

Thanks for your reply,

God Bless!

 

[DreamerOfTheHeart]

Most of us are just acting and reacting in response to chemical reactions in our body and our brains, entirely predictable behavior, following our feelings and emotions, acting reacting on instincts, and not by "thinking" first...

We do not really have free will when were doing this, in my opinion... I do not think most children actually have "free will" because of this, and very few adults, that I've met and seen do, in reality... We only have free will when we "think" hard first before acting or reacting... And not just "shooting from the emotional hip" with words and actions, I call it...

And this is very and entirely predicable, and subjects you to being manipulated in my opinion... I do not want to be predicable in that way... I want to have a free will, and the only way to do that, is to stop thoughts coming from feelings alone, and rethink another way of handling or acting/reacting in any given situation...

I want to be unpredictable, not predictable, even by the powers that be... I do not want angels or spirits to be able to predict my actions and reactions... To do this, I have to stop myself, when I am feeling a thing, and think hard first... This is the only way to take back control of not only our actions/reactions, but also our own course in life and our destiny... The only way to blaze our own path and take the path less traveled...

I want to surprise the powers that be (the angels at least, fallen or otherwise) and take them off guard and do something that they totally could not predict and were not expecting...

We are just like the animals and are acting carnally and are no better or any different from animals when we just "shoot from the hip" based on a feeling without using our minds to stop it/them and "think" first...

I think true free will is something we learn or attain to, by thinking carefully and deeply before acting/reacting based on feelings... In those cases, we are only acting due to chemical reactions in body and brain, and the spirits or angels know them all, and know how to manipulate and control us through it/them... I want to be able to do things or react or act in such a way, that they might not know, or be able to predict, or for the fallen angels most especially, be able to take advantage of, and control or manipulate us with...

The world says, "follow your heart" "do what you feel"... Yet the Bible says, that "the heart (or feelings or chemical reactions in you) is desperately wicked and deceitful above all things, and who can know it or get mastery over it" (by thinking and doing something different from what your heart feels)... And that, "The things that come out of the mouth come from the heart" and "Whomever gets mastery over their tongue is a perfect person" and getting mastery over your mouth and the things that come out of it, is, or comes by this stopping and thinking hard and deep first, and is also mastery over your feelings or your heart...

Now, there is not always ample time to think about something first, before responding, in those moments... At those times, I feel like the Holy Spirit helps me, to not act/react totally based on the chemical reactions going on in my body and brain, but to do something totally different and in some cases even entirely opposite of that...

When you feel a thing and are tempted to react out of it, try hard to stop it and think first, for this is the only way to be unpredictable and truly have a free will of your own...

Oh, I don't want to wage war on or against feelings and emotions, but...? Well...?

Comments...?

God Bless!

Angels are very smart, so it is hard to surprise them.

I think you are thinking some original stuff, which is good and important.

So often these days folks tend to just take what others tell them.


On microscopes and telescopes, I would suggest taking all of that with a dash of caution. We are more then the sum of our parts, and there is so much more then what we see. We are slices of infinity. The slice we see is such a small part. And this is true with what we see "out there", too.


Angels and spiritual Christians are free and have dynamic, strong personalities. I think that is a trademark. They are the very thesis of unexpected, where unexpected is good. But, where they need to be consistent, they are that, too.


I pride myself on being easy for God to manipulate, I dare say. I know God manipulates me. I rely and ask for God to manipulate me into good and away from evil.

 

[Neogaia777]

Angels are very smart, so it is hard to surprise them.

I think you are thinking some original stuff, which is good and important.

So often these days folks tend to just take what others tell them.


On microscopes and telescopes, I would suggest taking all of that with a dash of caution. We are more then the sum of our parts, and there is so much more then what we see. We are slices of infinity. The slice we see is such a small part. And this is true with what we see "out there", too.


Angels and spiritual Christians are free and have dynamic, strong personalities. I think that is a trademark. They are the very thesis of unexpected, where unexpected is good. But, where they need to be consistent, they are that, too.


I pride myself on being easy for God to manipulate, I dare say. I know God manipulates me. I rely and ask for God to manipulate me into good and away from evil.

God may use me, heck, even my enemies may use me, but, not "abuse" me, that, I will not tolerate...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

We have to get our will back from the manipulations of the enemy, and the flesh, and then, once acquired, fully submitted and submitting it to God's will... Then it can be God's will in you after that...

It's like an offering to the Lord...

 

[DreamerOfTheHeart]

God may use me, heck, even my enemies may use me, but, not "abuse" me, that, I will not tolerate...

God Bless!

I did not say I pride myself on allowing God to abuse me.... why did you turn it into that?

I said God manipulates me.

So, use, yes, not abuse.

Do you see how you changed the meaning of what I wrote? I understand, for some, the word "manipulation" has a very narrow definition. But, you must remember, this is common in language, with words, and try and understand the word from the context of what the person is saying.

 

[Neogaia777]

I did not say I pride myself on allowing God to abuse me.... why did you turn it into that?

I said God manipulates me.

So, use, yes, not abuse.

Do you see how you changed the meaning of what I wrote? I understand, for some, the word "manipulation" has a very narrow definition. But, you must remember, this is common in language, with words, and try and understand the word from the context of what the person is saying.

The potter manipulates, which can be a way of shaping and molding the clay... When you wield a sword, you are manipulating the blade...

The word "Manipulation" has kinda got a bad rap nowdays...

God Bless!

 

[DreamerOfTheHeart]

The potter manipulates, which can be a way of shaping and molding the clay... When you wield a sword, you are manipulating the blade...

The word "Manipulation" has kinda got a bad rap nowdays...

God Bless!

Yes, it does, and it has for the past few decades. So, I am aware I use it in this way, across the grain. Of course, we are limited by our language. Perhaps, in German, or Japanese, it is more clear?

And, you are correct, I do throw that out there as a sort of thing to get people to stop and think about how God manipulates us, and to be okay with that.

Frankly, this tactic works for me, so I use it for others, too.

Sorry for the confusion.

 

[Neogaia777]

Yes, it does, and it has for the past few decades. So, I am aware I use it in this way, across the grain. Of course, we are limited by our language. Perhaps, in German, or Japanese, it is more clear?

And, you are correct, I do throw that out there as a sort of thing to get people to stop and think about how God manipulates us, and to be okay with that.

Frankly, this tactic works for me, so I use it for others, too.

Sorry for the confusion.

No problem,

God Bless!

 

[tdidymas]

Do you believe in free will...?

Thanks for your reply,

God Bless!

It depends on what you mean by "believe in" and your def. of "free will." In the context of relationships between humans, our wills are independent from each other. In that sense, we have "free wills" toward other humans. The Biblical use of the term "free will" means a voluntary action. If a person is threatened, coerced, or in some manner put into distress, then a resulting action is not considered a "free will" action (i.e. a voluntary action).

In regard to relationship with God, man does not naturally have a "free will" in the sense of voluntary action to obey the law of God. This Biblical doctrine is called "Original Sin" or "Total Depravity." This doctrine is clearly expressed by the apostle Paul's writings in Romans 3, 1 Corinthians 2, Ephesians 2, and elsewhere. In fact, we are naturally haters of God because in our natural state we loathe to do God's will. Even after becoming a Christian, we still have trouble always obeying God's law, as testified in Romans 7. So then, prior to our conversion, we were slaves to sin (John 8:34), held captive by the devil to do his will (2 Tim. 2:26), dull of hearing (2 Cor. 4:4), etc. But after God divinely imposed our spiritual enlightenment (our conversion), our will was (to some degree) freed from being captive by the devil, and made (to some degree) a slave to Jesus Christ. The degree to which we are free from sin and slaves to Christ is that degree we are sanctified by the Holy Spirit. We were transferred from the kingdom of darkness to the kingdom of light (Col. 1:13).

Therefore, anyone who is well-familiar with what the Bible teaches about this can't claim that man has (or can have) a completely free will (in the same sense that God has free will), and still be consistent with Biblical teaching. The idea that man has "free will" is humanistic (and atheistic) in origin. We Christians live by faith, which means we acknowledge that God is in control of our lives, including our wills, as it is written "For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure." (Phil. 2:13) Notice it says "to will" which means that the Holy Spirit is a powerful influence in us to cause, motivate, push, etc. (IOW to force) us toward God's will. This is a major issue of our faith. We pray that God's will be done on earth (i.e. in us).

We must acknowledge that sin remains in us, since the scripture is clear on this matter "if we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us" (1 Jn. 1:8). So then, the corruption of sin remains in us even though we are converted. It means we have entered a warfare against our own sinful nature (by being converted). It is also an ongoing matter. There is no such thing as sinless perfection while we live in these bodies of death (Rom. 7:24). Many have taught this false idea, but not one person (save Jesus Himself) ever proved it true.

Therefore, I must object to your statement in another post:

We have to get our will back from the manipulations of the enemy, and the flesh, and then, once acquired, fully submitted and submitting it to God's will... Then it can be God's will in you after that...

It's like an offering to the Lord...

Your idea about "getting our will back" from the devil is a false idea, and a delusion. As human beings, and Christians, we will never have complete control of our will. The moment we think we have it, we will surely fall. This is because we are designed for God to have control of our will. There are various terms the Bible uses for God having control of our will, such as "filled with the Spirit," "led by the Spirit," "he who loves lives in God and God in him," and such as these. It takes continuous faith in Christ and the work of God to "abide" or live in this kind of relationship with God. Therefore there is no "taking back" our will, but rather yielding to God by faith. This kind of surrender to God has to be done immediately with no delay. The reason is that God must take the sin out of us, we cannot take it out of ourselves (by "taking back" our will). So then, your idea here is not Biblical. God calls us to come to the cross at once. No one ever came to the cross after getting his own will in line. It is like saying you can clean up your own act before you present yourself to God - this will never happen, and is the idea of world religions, not of the Christian faith.

In conclusion, I believe in a great God who works His will in people.
TD