Tollhouses!

[Not David]

Saw them and they look sugary!

 

[WanderedHome]

Saw them and they look sugary!
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if only the idea of spiritual toll houses sounded as fun as eating chocolate chip cookies.

 

[AMM]

One of my favorite snacks!

(Unfortunately at my house, the last time we stocked up the stores were OUT of Nestle brand. So we got the Costco Kirkland brand instead. Tragically, they're not as good... buyers be warned)

 

[ArmyMatt]

boo! get them scratch made.

 

[AMM]

boo! get them scratch made.

do you make yours from scratch or do you get them from a local chocolatier who makes them?

 

[ArmyMatt]

do you make yours from scratch or do you get them from a local chocolatier who makes them?

my wife insists on scratch made. I happily oblige.

 

[AMM]

my wife insists on scratch made. I happily oblige.

nice, I'll have to look into that. I don't ever buy cookies anymore - they're always homemade. But my chocolate chips are still storebought... for now!

 

[ArmyMatt]

nice, I'll have to look into that. I don't ever buy cookies anymore - they're always homemade. But my chocolate chips are still storebought... for now!

there was a local place when I was in Seminary that made candy and chocolate and such. needless to say, we made use of that store.

 

[Lyrasong]

Hello - I have been away from the Church for many years, but am praying about returning. The belief in ‘celestial toll houses’ (by many) remains troubling. Support for this belief appears to be lacking in Scripture, no matter how far back it can be traced in Orthodox tradition. Furthermore, why would the judgement of demons be placed before that of Christ? Thank you for any thoughts and direction.

 

[Jude1:3Contendforthefaith]

Hello - I have been away from the Church for many years, but am praying about returning. The belief in ‘celestial toll houses’ (by many) remains troubling. Support for this belief appears to be lacking in Scripture, no matter how far back it can be traced in Orthodox tradition. Furthermore, why would the judgement of demons be placed before that of Christ? Thank you for any thoughts and direction.

Check out this thread :

Your View on The Aerial Toll Houses (Orthodox Only Please)


.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Hello - I have been away from the Church for many years, but am praying about returning. The belief in ‘celestial toll houses’ (by many) remains troubling. Support for this belief appears to be lacking in Scripture, no matter how far back it can be traced in Orthodox tradition. Furthermore, why would the judgement of demons be placed before that of Christ? Thank you for any thoughts and direction.

the demons don't judge anyone. they accuse, flatter, deceive, and like us to think that they can judge, but they can't.

it's in Scripture (the parable of the rich young fool, Lazarus and the rich man, etc.).

 

[Not David]

What's so scary about the Tollhouses that everyone tries to say it doesn't exist, it's pagan, etc?

 

[ArmyMatt]

personally, I think it's because it clashes with our American love of ease.

 

[AMM]

What's so scary about the Tollhouses that everyone tries to say it doesn't exist, it's pagan, etc?

I mean, I cant deny that I’m more than a little scared of the idea. Demons accusing me? Their accusations are true. Flattering me? I would fall into pride so easily. Deceiving me? I’m not that wise to think I’ll be able to resist their deceptions. Tempting me? Considering that they tempt me successfully now, I don’t know how things would be any different if I departed this life and had to face their temptations right now

 

[ArmyMatt]

I mean, I cant deny that I’m more than a little scared of the idea. Demons accusing me? Their accusations are true. Flattering me? I would fall into pride so easily. Deceiving me? I’m not that wise to think I’ll be able to resist their deceptions. Tempting me? Considering that they tempt me successfully now, I don’t know how things would be any different if I departed this life and had to face their temptations right now

so, just think about it. it's really no different then the spiritual warfare we undergo now, only that we're more aware.

so if we spend our life repenting and clinging to Christ, our first instinct when we depart and see the demons is to cling to Christ.

and when we do that, we see how powerless they are.

 

[AMM]

so, just think about it. it's really no different then the spiritual warfare we undergo now, only that we're more aware.

so if we spend our life repenting and clinging to Christ, our first instinct when we depart and see the demons is to cling to Christ.

and when we do that, we see how powerless they are.

That makes sense, and I’m not saying I feel hopeless despair about it. But I think my fear rises from the fact that right now, if I fall into sin, I can repent. After death, if I succumb to the demons, there is no chance to repent. (Unless I’m mistaken on my understanding, whichcould very well be true)

 

[ArmyMatt]

That makes sense, and I’m not saying I feel hopeless despair about it. But I think my fear rises from the fact that right now, if I fall into sin, I can repent. After death, if I succumb to the demons, there is no chance to repent. (Unless I’m mistaken on my understanding, whichcould very well be true)

that's why we need to be vigilant.

 

[Lyrasong]

Check out this thread :

Your View on The Aerial Toll Houses (Orthodox Only Please)


.

Thank you ... will check it out.

 

[AMM]

that's why we need to be vigilant.

How would you say that vigilance differs from fear or caution?

 

[Lyrasong]

the demons don't judge anyone. they accuse, flatter, deceive, and like us to think that they can judge, but they can't.

it's in Scripture (the parable of the rich young fool, Lazarus and the rich man, etc.).

Thank you, but I just do not see this doctrine in Scripture. Saint Paul tells us that to be absent from the body, is to be present with the Lord. Our Lord, Himself, assured the Good Thief from the Cross ... that that very day, he would be with Him in Paradise.

A real problem with the belief in aerial Toll Houses is that it removes the Lord’s saving death as the means for our justification, and places it right back on our own worthiness (or, lack thereof). It causes us to be self-centered, rather than to place our trust and hope in Jesus Christ. It makes us fearful, when we have been told that God’s perfect love casts out fear.

I have read Fr Seraphim Rose’s book, btw, though it was some years ago.