Tolerant leftists clash with pro-free speech supporters...

[Servant68]

Looking forward to the rationalization of violence by those who support these views...


5 arrested as Trump supporters, counterprotesters rally in Seattle

By
Jessica Lee, Dahlia Bazzaz
and
Christine Willmsen
Seattle Times staff reporters

Five people were arrested, American flags burned and police officers used bicycle barricades and pepper spray to separate demonstrators at the University of Washington’s Red Square on Saturday during a much-anticipated rally called by supporters of President Donald Trump and others who said they aimed to promote free speech.

The rally — led by leaders of the College Republicans and their guests, the right-leaning Patriot Prayer, based in Vancouver, Washington — was peaceful early on. The chaos came roughly 75 minutes in, despite officers’ efforts to keep at a distance a couple of hundred protesters who far outnumbered the pro-Trump crowd. Those protesters came to denounce the president and promote a variety of anti-capitalist or pro-civil-rights themes.

People supporting the Patriot Prayer gathering broke out in chants of “USA! USA! USA!” with signs including, “We died for liberty not socialism.” A few held yellow “Don’t Tread on Me” flags. At least one person wore a Proud BoysT-shirt in support of the far-right men’s group.

Wearing a Make America Great Again hat, College Republicans President Chevy Swanson said the goal Saturday was to create a space for campus conservatives to share their values and promote their free-speech rights.

 

[High Fidelity]

Morons will be morons.

Why either side felt the need to waste precious time in their finite lives on such nonsense is beyond me.

 

[SilverBear]

From what can be pieced together the violence began when a group of Proud Boys crossed police barricades and dove into counter protesters. The intent, according to Proud Boys twitter feed, was to take the flag carried by an AntiFa counter-protester. Apparently they accomplished that.

The Washington police were asked why they permitted the barricade crossing but they declined to answer.

 

[SolomonVII]

I support the views that Americans have the right to freely associate, and that other Americans have the same right to rally in opposition. I support the obligation for police to respond to violence through arrests, and also believe that the punishment should fit the crime, with those resorting to violence in these clashes ought to spend some real jail time until they grow up and can be trusted to not repeat in their ways.
I also believe in the idea of discernment, and that charges of riotous behavior discern that we all have the right to self-defense, and to defend ourselves against others spitting on us and causing us bodily harm. Video evidence is a useful tool in making those discernments and thus ought to be gathered at these kinds of clashes in order that the penalties against the violent be seen as fair.

 

[Rion]

From what can be pieced together the violence began when a group of Proud Boys crossed police barricades and dove into counter protesters. The intent, according to Proud Boys twitter feed, was to take the flag carried by an AntiFa counter-protester. Apparently they accomplished that.

The Washington police were asked why they permitted the barricade crossing but they declined to answer.

No idea where you heard that, as video shows Antifa starting the fight and then proceeding to get their butts kicked before crying out that they're being victimized.

 

[redleghunter]

From what can be pieced together the violence began when a group of Proud Boys crossed police barricades and dove into counter protesters.

If so then obviously into their loving arms for a big hug no doubt.

 

[SilverBear]

No idea where you heard that, as video shows Antifa starting the fight and then proceeding to get their butts kicked before crying out that they're being victimized.

The Proud Boys were proud to say that they crossed the police barricade with the intent to take an Antifa flag and (obviously) to start a fight.

 

[SilverBear]

If so then obviously into their loving arms for a big hug no doubt.

No doubt the Proud Boys intention in crossing the police barrier was to give out some loving hugs.

 

[Ringo84]

"Pro free speech supporters"

So is that the spin now - white supremacists "are simply pro-free speech" while people who (for obvious reasons) dislike them are labeled as "intolerant"?

You don't necessarily have to march around a town with a little tiki torch in order to be a collaborator with these Nazis...
Ringo

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

The Washington police were asked why they permitted the barricade crossing but they declined to answer.

The antifa were massed on Red Square, while the rally was up the stairs by the entrance to Odegaard Library, surrounded by a barrier. Entry into and exit from the rally site was from the rear, i.e. the side opposite to that facing the square. Rally attendees, including the Proud Boys, could exit the rally site out the back and walk around Kane hall into Red Square, which was open to the public.

Another thing to note is that the University tried to bill the UW College Republicans for security.

 

[pat34lee]

"Pro free speech supporters"
So is that the spin now - white supremacists "are simply pro-free speech" while people who (for obvious reasons) dislike them are labeled as "intolerant"?
You don't necessarily have to march around a town with a little tiki torch in order to be a collaborator with these Nazis...
Ringo

I guess they have to add "Pro Free Speech Supporters" to the list.

 

[SolomonVII]

I guess they have to add "Pro Free Speech Supporters" to the list.

The problem with the left today is not that they are the left. There will always be fundamental differences in people in a society, some tasked with organizing the society towards efficiency, some towards creativity in preparation for all the possibilities of tomorrow. Some will focus on preserving the fabric of society, and some will be pushing the envelop, seeking changes and improvements. Some will focus on pursuit of excellence of the individual, and some to develop structures in the social fabric that mitigates in the disparity caused by the fact that people will be left behind in any system, no less a system in which merit and ability are rewarded. And of course, a meritocracy is the best system there can be.
A good system is one which contains checks and balances, in which the proclivities of one type of person are balanced by the opposite proclivities of another type of person, is a system where left and right are both present, and actually talk to each other, and but heads with passionate arguments.

So the problem with the left today is not that they are the left. The problem with the left today is that they have been absconded by bureacrats only interested in creating authoritarian structures that serve themselves and their kind into perpetuity. It has been absconded by the totalitarian mindset, typical of Marxists and neo-Marxists, which has no interest in dialogue, and a deep resentment of any aspects of society that has more wealth and power and especially freedom that is outside of the grasp of their control.

Left and right check and balance each other by reasoned debate and listening to each other. The pattern here is that the illiberal 'liberals' described by the actions listed above have no use for reason, and a contempt for debate. These are the actions of a mindset that only wants to shut down debate, by shrill diatribes and virtue signalling that defines the limits of acceptable, politically correct discourse.

 

[Radagast]

So is that the spin now - white supremacists "are simply pro-free speech" while people who (for obvious reasons) dislike them are labeled as "intolerant"?

The "Patriot Prayer" group are neither "white supremacist" (the founder is Asian) nor "Nazi."

If they really want to chant “USA! USA! USA!,” I'm pretty sure the US Constitution gives them the right to do that. And wearing silly red hats isn't illegal either.

 

[Rion]

"Pro free speech supporters"

So is that the spin now - white supremacists "are simply pro-free speech" while people who (for obvious reasons) dislike them are labeled as "intolerant"?

You don't necessarily have to march around a town with a little tiki torch in order to be a collaborator with these Nazis...
Ringo

Aren't you the guy who thinks that the BLM and anti-GMO people at the Boston free speech event were white supremacists?

 

[Ringo84]

The "Patriot Prayer" group are neither "white supremacist" (the founder is Asian) nor "Nazi."

If they really want to chant “USA! USA! USA!,” I'm pretty sure the US Constitution gives them the right to do that. And wearing silly red hats isn't illegal either.

Perhaps you missed the part about many of them being Proud Boys.

Do you know what/who "Proud Boys" are? That's a serious question; many people don't.
Ringo

 

[Rion]

Perhaps you missed the part about many of them being Proud Boys.

Do you know what/who "Proud Boys" are? That's a serious question; many people don't.
Ringo

I know who they are. I'm assuming you think they're alt-right because they will punch back at Antifa?

 

[Yarddog]

No idea where you heard that, as video shows Antifa starting the fight and then proceeding to get their butts kicked before crying out that they're being victimized.

According to news reports and some Patriot Prayer members, they came out of the meeting space to confront the protesters.

 

[Yarddog]

The "Patriot Prayer" group are neither "white supremacist" (the founder is Asian) nor "Nazi."

If they really want to chant “USA! USA! USA!,” I'm pretty sure the US Constitution gives them the right to do that. And wearing silly red hats isn't illegal either.

Both sides of this coin have the second exact rights to exercise their freedom of speech. Neither has the right to attack the other. Neither is more patriotic than the other. But, they look at these issues through opposing views.

 

[Radagast]

Both sides of this coin have the second exact rights to exercise their freedom of speech.

Indeed, but Antifa isn't interested in "speech," as far as I can tell; their modus operandi is violence. To quote Antifa organizer Scott Crow, "we go to cause conflict."

 

[Ringo84]

Indeed, but Antifa isn't interested in "speech," as far as I can tell; their modus operandi is violence. To quote Antifa organizer Scott Crow, "we go to cause conflict."

Yep...it was definitely antifa who was causing all the violence in Charlottesville this past summer. Yesiree.
Ringo