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to get healed it seems easy here

Discussion in 'Christian Philosophy & Ethics' started by lambofgod43985889, May 25, 2019.

  1. lambofgod43985889

    lambofgod43985889 Member Supporter

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    Is anyone among you sick? Let them call the elders of the church to pray over them and anoint them with oil in the name of the Lord. 15 And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well; the Lord will raise them up. If they have sinned, they will be forgiven. 16 Therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person is powerful and effective.

    somebody had tried to call the elders? who are the elders of the church?
    did this ritual? it worked?
     
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  2. Gordon Wright

    Gordon Wright Newbie

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    I'm pretty sure that only worked in the Apostolic age.

    The Apostles could pass on something - it's a bit vague what, something in connection with the Holy Spirit - by the laying on of hands. That may well have included healing powers.
     
  3. lambofgod43985889

    lambofgod43985889 Member Supporter

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    it's kinda sad that the bible says something of other time, we use to think the bible is transversal in the time,the eras
     
  4. Gordon Wright

    Gordon Wright Newbie

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    The Bible is all about time. It tells of lots of different eras. When it talks about the eternal, it's not talking about this world.

    This is one of many reasons it's a mistake to ignore context when interpreting Scripture.
     
  5. lambofgod43985889

    lambofgod43985889 Member Supporter

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    i resist this idea, because bible endures forever
     
  6. asking_about_healing

    asking_about_healing New Member

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    Paul's words in 2 Corinthians 13 make it clear that he considered gifts of healings (along with prophecy, tongues, interpretation of tongues, and other gifts) necessary for healthy church life. Why would we expect that to be different now? It's also noteworthy that James tells his readers to go to the elders of the church, not to the apostles. If he makes no connection to the apostles, why would we conclude they are prerequisite?

    Our problem is typically not with Scripture. It's with experience. We have experienced healing not coming, so we build theologies to explain that. However, Paul tells us to earnestly desire the spiritual gifts, and there are many examples of people who kept praying for the sick despite failure, and then things changed and people started getting healed. Here are two examples:


    (I apologize for the nature of the TV show this account is in)
     
  7. asking_about_healing

    asking_about_healing New Member

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    I think this might indicate one of the requirements for being an elder that we typically don't look for. In the churches where I live, elders are most commonly picked because they are successful businessmen. I don't understand that. I know it says they should be respected in the community, but I think that should speak to their character, not their business acumen.

    I sympathize with you, however. Since my wife was diagnosed with medically incurable cancer, I have done a lot of research into Christian healing. I went to a local church this morning and asked for prayer for healing of my wife. They prayed with me, and then I asked them a second time to pray for healing. They had prayed for everything from wisdom for the doctors to strength for me in the trial. But they had not prayed for healing. I've also found it very hard to find anyone who'll pray for my wife without either saying "if it be thy will" or telling my wife that she needs to have faith. Jesus healed everyone who came to him. Why do we think healing might not be God's will? That was clearly not a question for Jesus. Did he only do what he saw the Father doing? Yes, but apparently that meant he saw the Father healing everyone who asked to be healed. He also never told anyone they did not have enough faith to be healed. In fact, the only people he said anything like that to were his disciples. So faith is needed in the healer but not in the sick person.

    Acts 2:22 tells us the Jesus was a man accredited by God by miracles, signs and wonders that God did through him. We are just people, but God can work through us too. That isn't going to happen though if we don't start laying hands on the sick.
     
  8. Gordon Wright

    Gordon Wright Newbie

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    I lean strongly toward empirical cessationism, largely because I'm an empirical guy.

    The Apostles laid their hands upon men who became elders. The Apostles all died. Those elders then died. After that, the more impressive miracles - such as healings - kind of dried up.

    I saw a site that blames this on heresies creeping into the Church in the 3rd century. I look at that and see a correlation-causation fallacy. It seems more likely to me from a Granger causality point of view that the heresies crept in because the power that had kept them out was no longer active.

    God can work through us, but whether - and when - He does so or not is His decision, not ours. Too much of what is called faith is an attempt to dictate terms to God.
     
  9. asking_about_healing

    asking_about_healing New Member

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    It is definitely good to go where the facts lead you. With that in mind, here is some data to consider:
     
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