• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  2. The forums in the Christian Congregations category are now open only to Christian members. Please review our current Faith Groups list for information on which faith groups are considered to be Christian faiths. Christian members please remember to read the Statement of Purpose threads for each forum within Christian Congregations before posting in the forum.
  3. Please note there is a new rule regarding the posting of videos. It reads, "Post a summary of the videos you post . An exception can be made for music videos.". Unless you are simply sharing music, please post a summary, or the gist, of the video you wish to share.
  4. There have been some changes in the Life Stages section involving the following forums: Roaring 20s, Terrific Thirties, Fabulous Forties, and Golden Eagles. They are changed to Gen Z, Millennials, Gen X, and Golden Eagles will have a slight change.
  5. CF Staff, Angels and Ambassadors; ask that you join us in praying for the world in this difficult time, asking our Holy Father to stop the spread of the virus, and for healing of all affected.

Time and evolution

Discussion in 'Creation & Evolution' started by JohnR7, Feb 25, 2007.

  1. JohnR7

    JohnR7 Well-Known Member

    +191
    Pentecostal
    Married
    What was here before time began, or what was here before evolution began?
    Evolutionist always say you have to have something to evolved, so where did that something come from?
     
    We teamed up with Faith Counseling. Can they help you today?
  2. lemmings

    lemmings Veteran

    +125
    Atheist
    Private
    What is “North of the North Pole”? This has been one of science's’ greatest mystery since we discovered the Big Bang.

    Evolution began when the first imperfect replicators, AKA cells, where created. Thus there where no imperfect replicators prior to evolution.

    The Big Bang? We don’t know. The Earth? We do know.

    The Earth came from the collisions between countless asteroids in the early solar system. The material that made these asteroids came from supernova explosions where the extreme pressure and heat fused lighter atoms together to form those that we see today.
     
  3. ranmaonehalf

    ranmaonehalf Senior Member

    +50
    Atheist
    um ..
    God Did it..

    ...:thumbsup:
     
  4. aerophagicbricolage

    aerophagicbricolage New Member

    74
    +5
    Atheist
    Single
    US-Libertarian
    This question is meaningless.
     
  5. CACTUSJACKmankin

    CACTUSJACKmankin Scientist

    +124
    Judaism
    Private
    US-Democrat
    Once again you demonstrate that you know nothing of evolution despite all of the attempts on this board of people to educate you.
    Those are two totally different questions. Evolution starts with the arrival of the first replicators, the universe was in existance long before then.
    What was there before the big bang? Who knows? I don't and neither do scientists. It is something that all the evidence for it is long gone, so we don't know.

    The first replicators came from some chemical process, there are several models as to what form those processes took. The simplest replicators we see today are in several ways more similar to macromolecules than the simplest cellular life.
    Again your question is flawed because it is really asking two questions, origin of life and origin of universe. Where the big bang came from, who knows? The big bang theory does explain lots of phenomena such as background microwave radiation and the expansion of the universe.
     
  6. FoeHammer

    FoeHammer Veteran

    916
    +15
    Baptist
    Married
    Hmmm interesting choice of word ''created'' care to elaborate?
    Pure speculation.

    FoeHammer.
     
  7. FoeHammer

    FoeHammer Veteran

    916
    +15
    Baptist
    Married
    Why?

    FoeHammer.
     
  8. Danhalen

    Danhalen Healing

    +437
    Atheist
    Married
    US-Others
    There is no such thing as "before time."
     
  9. FoeHammer

    FoeHammer Veteran

    916
    +15
    Baptist
    Married
    So where did time come from?

    FoeHammer.
     
  10. FishFace

    FishFace Senior Veteran

    +164
    Atheist
    What is left of the leftmost point you can ever get to?
    Where was space created?
    Time cannot begin, because to begin implies that there was a time prior and a time after the beginning. Without time, that can't be.

    Stuff. Planets, stars, rocks. Atoms, molecules. Specifically, organic molecules.

    It doesn't really matter to evolution, but modern biology has a few hypotheses regarding abiogenesis - how what we'd describe as living might come from simple organic molecules.
     
  11. Sleeker

    Sleeker DON'T PANIC

    +45
    Agnostic
    Single
    US-Republican
    Liar.

    [​IMG]

    Time doesn't have location, therefore, there is no "where." Time has a "when." "When" did time start is easy: at the beginning.
     
  12. TeddyKGB

    TeddyKGB A dude playin' a dude disgused as another dude

    +425
    Atheist
    Single
    US-Others
    It doesn't matter. "Before" implicitly denotes time.

    In any case, time is a fundamental part of the universe. It began "when" the universe began.
     
  13. FishFace

    FishFace Senior Veteran

    +164
    Atheist
    When is left?
    How many blue?
    Who is Tuesday?
    Why is six?
    What is not?
    Where did time come from?

    You should be sensing a theme. In case you aren't, it's that they're all nonsense.
     
  14. humbledbyhim

    humbledbyhim Senior Member

    594
    +35
    Christian
    That would be assuming that you agree with uniformitarianism, the underlying assumption of physics and geology.
     
  15. us38

    us38 im in ur mind, disturben ur sanities

    661
    +35
    Atheist
    Single
    US-Democrat
    Along with everyday living. Can't forget that one.
     
  16. TeddyKGB

    TeddyKGB A dude playin' a dude disgused as another dude

    +425
    Atheist
    Single
    US-Others
    And we all know how badly that has turned out for technology and our overall body of knowledge.
     
  17. humbledbyhim

    humbledbyhim Senior Member

    594
    +35
    Christian
    Uniformitarianisn:

    "Uniformitarianism is one of the most basic principles of modern geology, the observation that fundamentally the same geological processes that operate today also operated in the distant past. It exists in contrast with catastrophism, which states that Earth surface features originated suddenly in the past, by geological processes radically different to those currently occurring. Note, however, that many "catastrophic" events are perfectly compatible with uniformitarianism. For example, Charles Lyell thought that ordinary geological processes would cause Niagara Falls to move upstream to Lake Erie within 10000 years, leading to catastrophic flooding of a large part of North America.
    Uniformitarianism is a generalisation of the principle of actualism, which states that present day-processes (astronomical, geological, paleontological,...) can be used to interpret past patterns. It is also known as "the present is the key to the past". The principle of actualism is the cornerstone of paleoecology."
    Show me some observations taken and examined billiions of years ago that verify this. In other words, since no one was there to observe past universal laws, uniformitarianism will continue to be an assumption. Of course the lives and dignity of millions of people rest on this assumption, so I don't suspect any prominent secular authority to seriously challenge it.
     
  18. humbledbyhim

    humbledbyhim Senior Member

    594
    +35
    Christian
    Just because a model fits the facts and allows for further development, it doesn't mean that the the model is true. Many people, including myself seek truth, and scientifically defined fact, especially when based on assumptions that I don't agree with, are not sufficient for me.
     
  19. Wiccan_Child

    Wiccan_Child Contributor

    +602
    Atheist
    In Relationship
    UK-Liberal-Democrats

    Indeed. No-one has ever claimed it was anything other than an assumption. However, it is by a long shot the most probable assumption we can make. Since all recorded and verifiable observations ever made conform to the principle, and none has ever demonstrated a unique area of spacetime where the physical laws are different, then we can be fairly (i.e., beyond a shadow of a doubt) sure that the principle is sound.

    You understand, of course, that if we reject the principle, then empiricism collapses and we fall into an intellectual stupour? Axioms and fundamentals exist so that we can progress beyond them.

    I don't suppose you can give us a pragmatic reason to reject the assumption? The last appeal of the literalist and the religious fundamentalist is the rejection of reality.

    Or perhaps you advocate we go all the way? As individuals with private thoughts, we only know, truely know, three things: the laws of logic, the fact that we recieve sensory input, and the fact that we exist. I do not know my computer exists, for it is remotely possible that my senses are manipulated.

    However, it is absurd (not to mention useless) to reject the assumption that the sensory input I recieve is at least a semi-accurate portrayal of the 'real' reality.

    Likewise, we assume the physical laws are not arbitrarily and unpredictably tampered with by an external entity or force.

    Finally, there is also the question of: if the principle is false, then why do palaeontological predictions bear out? Indeed, why do all dating methods correlate? Surely the past, if it is indeed subject to different laws as today, would yield incomprehensible abominations that would defy explanation?

    Yea, I'm not sure how well that flows, it's late. But it's right.

    On the contrary, the nature of reality and the laws inherent therein are richly debated by philosophers and scientists alike (me and you being but one pair).
     
  20. JohnR7

    JohnR7 Well-Known Member

    +191
    Pentecostal
    Married
    Created? So evolution begins after creation?
     
Loading...