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Featured Three questions about unbelievers

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by ClementofA, Oct 22, 2017.

  1. ClementofA

    ClementofA Well-Known Member Supporter

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    1. Do any unbelievers love other people?

    2. Do any unbelievers love with God's kind of love?

    3. Do unbelievers have the Spirit of God in them?

    1Jn.2:15 Do not love the world or anything in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
     
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  2. PloverWing

    PloverWing Episcopalian

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    1. Yes.
    2. I don't think any human is capable of loving the way God loves.
    Our love is a shadow of God's love.
    3. Maybe. God is able to reach into our lives with love and divine
    grace before we are aware of God's existence or love for us.
     
  3. gordonhooker

    gordonhooker Franciscan tssf Supporter

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    1. Yes.
    2. I believe only God loves like God, although it is possible for a person to have unconditional love I know my wife and I love each other that way.
    3. Given we were created in Gods image of course all have the Spirit of God in them. The question is whether any of us acknowledge that Spirit or not.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2017
  4. sparow

    sparow Well-Known Member Supporter

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    For some "believer" and "unbeliever" are jargon that means something to them; to me they are verbs used as nouns or at least used without a subject.

    An abstract could be: Do any who believe God, keep his commandments.

    More detailed: Do any who believe God did not give Israel a religion but a system of government as a type for the covenant where God promises a king, a kingdom and eternal life and a Law and mankind's part is to enter into the covenant.

    I am not good at grammar and I most probably have not expressed your meaning.
     
  5. Tolworth John

    Tolworth John Well-Known Member Supporter

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  6. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    Yes to all three. Most unbelievers are saved by their obiedience
    to God's Holy Spirit, even if they don't profess allegiance.
    There are some that reject the value of God's Holy Spirit.
    They are not saved.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2017
  7. Shempster

    Shempster ImJustMe Supporter

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    1. Some do, some don't. Same goes with believers.
    2. Some do and some don't. Many believers love those who love them but despise their "enemies".
    3. I think that the living spirit of God is in every living being to some degree.
     
  8. tdidymas

    tdidymas Newbie

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    Don't be deceived by anyone's opinion that conflicts with what the Bible teaches. In order to emphasize this, I'll answer the 3 questions in reverse order:
    3. No, they don't! Anyone who does not believe in Christ does not have His Spirit, according to 1 John, Romans 8, and many other passages of scripture. "If anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him" implies that a person must be a believer in the gospel (which is the context of Rom. 8) to belong to Christ. In 1 John it says "Who is the liar but the one who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, the one who denies the Father and the Son." He also calls them the "spirit of the antichrist" which implies that they have a spirit opposing God's Spirit.
    2. No, 1 John testifies that love comes from God (that is, God's kind of love), and that only those born of God can do this. They might act like they can, but when their ability is tested, they always show they cannot do it.
    1. Yes, they can, but not with God's kind of love. They only love others when it is convenient for them, and when their own desire is being met. Jesus said, "if you love those who love you back, what good is that to you? Even pagans do that." God's kind of love does the ultimate good for others, whether they can reciprocate or not.

    Expression of God's kind of love is shown best in times of trials and tribulations. Jesus said "Pray for those who persecute you, and love those who despitefully use you. So shall you be sons of your Father in heaven." (Mat. 5). It means that it is in the worst circumstances that we prove to be children of God, by the fact that we can love our neighbor beyond natural ability.
    TD:)
     
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  9. SPF

    SPF Well-Known Member

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    1. Yes

    2. I think we have to define our terms to properly answer that. My guy reaction is no. But then what of the non-believing mother who pushes her child out of the way of a moving car and dies herself. I don't know of much more selfless love than that.

    3. Absolutely not. But again, this may require defining terms. Everyone born has a soul, but only Believers are sealed with the promised Holy Spirit.
     
  10. Adstar

    Adstar Well-Known Member

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    Yes..

    2. Do any unbelievers love with God's kind of love?

    Nope.. Only God loves with that level of purity..


    3. Do unbelievers have the Spirit of God in them?

    No..
     
  11. Hearingheart

    Hearingheart Well-Known Member

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    Define unbeliever and believer. There are many people who claim to be believers yet evidence would say otherwise.
     
  12. SPF

    SPF Well-Known Member

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    I would assume it's referring to someone who is an actual Christian, meaning someone who has been forgiven, given a new heart with a bend towards Christ as opposed to an unbeliever who has not actually been forgiven and is still driven primarily by their flesh.
     
  13. 1213

    1213 Disciple of Jesus

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    Bible says:

    But I tell you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who mistreat you and persecute you, that you may be children of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the just and the unjust. For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Don't even the tax collectors do the same? If you only greet your friends, what more do you do than others? Don't even the tax collectors do the same? Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.
    Matt. 5:44-48

    Apparently, it is possible that even tax collector loves the ones who love him. :)

    But only few seem to love those that are not useful for them, or are their enemies. I don’t know any unbeliever who does that. And I don’t see how it would be possible that unbeliever would have Spirit of God in him.
     
  14. gordonhooker

    gordonhooker Franciscan tssf Supporter

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    believer - someone who believes

    unbeliever - someone who does not believe

    :)
     
  15. Everybodyknows

    Everybodyknows The good guys lost

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    So one can be saved by obedience without faith? Interesting.
     
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  16. SBC

    SBC Well-Known Member

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    1) Sure. Unbelievers, and believers alike, have a range of feelings they call love.

    Love;
    their mommy, their daddy, a particular job, a particular color, particular foods, particular clothing, particular jewelry, particular art, friends, enemies, and on and on and on.

    However; a human's love, is always dependent upon something.
    Meaning; a human's love depends upon the particular's.
    Meaning; a human can love something/someone, WHILE also "hating" (which means a strong DIS-like), of something about the thing they claim to love.

    In other words, a human, "qualifies" their love.

    The Lord, who IS perfect, loves all of His creations with a perfect love, despite, the corruption.

    This is the Love, a perfect love, the Lord desires from a man.

    Believers, with the Lords power, can accomplish such a love toward the Lord.

    2) No. Unbelievers, without the Lords power, can not accomplish such a love toward the Lord.

    3) No.

    God Bless,
    SBC
     
  17. SBC

    SBC Well-Known Member

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    What sort of evidence?

    God Bless,
    SBC
     
  18. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    Those without faith are not held to account for their sins.
     
  19. SBC

    SBC Well-Known Member

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    Saved BY Faith ~

    Saving, or Having Faith ~ neither of those things are by the mans power.

    Man has the power to BELIEVE ~ the Saving, the Faith, are gifts from God.

    God Bless,
    SBC
     
  20. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    According to Paul, that would be all of us.
     
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