Those who believe the perfect in 1 Cor 13:10 refers to the 2nd coming...

[Guojing]

Trying to make my words out into something else is quite unfair there.

I have been quoting what you said Those who believe the perfect in 1 Cor 13:10 refers to the 2nd coming...

You did say this correct? Love is the only remaining factor according to scripture

I am saying there is no scripture in 1 Cor 13 and 14 that says that or meant that

 

[ARBITER01]

I have been quoting what you said Those who believe the perfect in 1 Cor 13:10 refers to the 2nd coming...

You did say this correct? Love is the only remaining factor according to scripture

I am saying there is no scripture in 1 Cor 13 and 14 that says that or meant that

Does not scripture say that Love never fails? Yes it does.

Does not scripture say to follow after love? Yes it does.

Scripture ties following after love with desiring earnestly the spiritual gifts.

Unless you have something of real evidence to the contrary in scripture (which you won't have), I've got other things to do. Good day.

 

[Guojing]

Does not scripture say that Love never fails? Yes it does.

Does not scripture say to follow after love? Yes it does.

Scripture ties following after love with desiring earnestly the spiritual gifts.

Unless you have something of real evidence to the contrary in scripture (which you won't have), I've got other things to do. Good day.

I agree with all your points there.

We are discussing 1 Corinthians 13:13

I am just saying there is no scripture that says or meant Love is the only remaining factor out of these 3, faith, hope and love.

Why do you now "make my words out into something else", when you earlier claim it is quite unfair?

 

[ARBITER01]

I agree with all your points there.

We are discussing 1 Corinthians 13:13

I am just saying there is no scripture that says or meant Love is the only remaining factor out of these 3, faith, hope and love.

Why do you now "make my words out into something else", when you earlier claim it is quite unfair?

Did I?

I said that love will be the only remaining factor,....

"No it says that Love will be the remaining factor at some point,...

1Co 13:4 Love suffereth long, and is kind; love envieth not; love vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
1Co 13:5 doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not its own, is not provoked, taketh not account of evil;
1Co 13:6 rejoiceth not in unrighteousness, but rejoiceth with the truth;
1Co 13:7 beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
1Co 13:8 Love never faileth

Love believes all things, Love hopes for all things. It is Love that shall remain."

I was speaking predictively, and scripture does affirm this. You changed my words into saying that it was a current event. I said that love "WILL BE" the only remaining factor.

 

[Guojing]

Did I?

I said that love will be the only remaining factor,....

"No it says that Love will be the remaining factor at some point,...

1Co 13:4 Love suffereth long, and is kind; love envieth not; love vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
1Co 13:5 doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not its own, is not provoked, taketh not account of evil;
1Co 13:6 rejoiceth not in unrighteousness, but rejoiceth with the truth;
1Co 13:7 beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
1Co 13:8 Love never faileth

Love believes all things, Love hopes for all things. It is Love that shall remain."

I was speaking predictively, and scripture does affirm this. You changed my words into saying that it was a current event. I said that love "WILL BE" the only remaining factor.

Those who believe the perfect in 1 Cor 13:10 refers to the 2nd coming...

Don’t twist my words you know what I said. What part of “ surely you do not want to compare to that “ do you not understand? So I am telling you, I am fine being compared to that. =)

www.christianforums.com

We have been discussing 1 Corinthians 13:8-13 in the above.

Compared to tongues, prophecy, and word of knowledge, I certainly agree with you that charity is only one among them that will remain.

But compared to faith and hope, there is no verse that says only charity will remain but faith and hope will also fade/fail/vanish.

Now, if you were to say you believe the greatest out of those 3, faith hope and charity, is charity, then I will certainly agree with you.

 

[ARBITER01]

Those who believe the perfect in 1 Cor 13:10 refers to the 2nd coming...

Don’t twist my words you know what I said. What part of “ surely you do not want to compare to that “ do you not understand? So I am telling you, I am fine being compared to that. =)

www.christianforums.com

Compared to tongues, prophecy, and word of knowledge, I certainly agree with you that charity is only one among them that will remain.

Lol,... is that what I said?

You have a desire to mix people's words up a lot when you disagree with them.

Love shall be what remains since it encapsulates everything, but until that point arrives, we are to pursue love and desire earnestly the gifts. They are together, not separate.

This subject is becoming repetitive and monotonous with you. Our conversation is done. Good Day.

 

[pasifika]

10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.

13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.
====

One question I would like to ask and discuss with those who believes the "perfect" in this passage refers to the 2nd coming of Christ.

Why would Paul write we still need to have "hope" after Christ comes back and we are with him in heaven?

The Bible definition of hope is "a confident expectation and desire for something good in the future."

Why should hope still remain when we can see Christ face to face, and we have our redeemed body? Do we still need to have hope then and why?

Hi, "perfect" in this passage is referring to "Love" the ultimate goal of a Christian faith journey. In other words "Christ in You"..

 

[Guojing]

Lol,... is that what I said?

That is what verse 1 Corinthians 13:8-13 is saying.

 

[ARBITER01]

That is what verse 1 Corinthians 13:8-13 is saying.

As for love encapsulating everything, including faith and hope, again, there is no scripture verse that actually states that.

Our conversation is done. We are to pursue love and desire earnestly the spiritual gifts. There are other people to argue with since you love doing that so much. Bye.

 

[Guojing]

Hi, "perfect" in this passage is referring to "Love" the ultimate goal of a Christian faith journey. In other words "Christ in You"..

Thanks, why do you think 1 Corinthians 13:13 is saying that we still need faith and hope, when Christ is in us?

 

[Guojing]

Our conversation is done. We are to pursue love and desire earnestly the spiritual gifts. There are other people to argue with since you love doing that so much. Bye.

So what exactly is 1 Corinthians 13:13 actually saying? Why do you keep avoiding that?

 

[pasifika]

Thanks, why do you think 1 Corinthians 13:13 is saying that we still need faith and hope, when Christ is in us?

Hi, Paul here use faith and hope to get to Love (ultimate stage of Christian believers), it's like growth from young Christians to a mature Christians. the same way of Christ ( the Spirit ) growth until Christ ( is fully formed) within believers.

 

[Guojing]

Hi, Paul here use faith and hope to get to Love (ultimate stage of Christian believers), it's like growth from young Christians to a mature Christians. the same way of Christ ( the Spirit ) growth until Christ ( is fully formed) within believers.

If charity includes faith and hope,

out of curiosity, you cannot imagine that there can be someone who is full of charity, but may be lacking hope and faith?

Is that a logical impossibility to you?

 

[Postvieww]

Why would Paul write we still need to have "hope" after Christ comes back and we are with him in heaven?

Can you show a scripture that says when Christ come we are back in heaven with him? I know this leads to another topic but it is relevant to the argument you are trying to make.

Paul didn't say we would need hope when Christ return he said NOW abideth.

 

[Butch5]

You're coming at this from a point of inexperience, attempting to appear knowledgeable.
That's like reading a book on rocket science and then trying to teach it.

The operation of the gifts in the corporate assembly are always subject to the individual, and that is because GOD never possesses a person, He prompts us for usage through us and we allow it. GOD utilizes the gift inside us for His purpose.

Well, it's funny that everything I've said is right out of Scripture. Most of what I've heard here has been opinion. I'll take Scripture over opinion any day.

 

[ARBITER01]

Well, it's funny that everything I've said is right out of Scripture. Most of what I've heard here has been opinion. I'll take Scripture over opinion any day.

Book knowledge was never good enough with GOD. He teaches by experience, it's the only way you mature.

You have a lot to learn.

 

[ARBITER01]

I gonna repost this just so people can overlook the arguments and actually read something of worth,....



This thread is all over the place, let's see if we can steer it back on course somewhat,....

Scripture must be taken as a whole. It's easy to cherry pick a section at times, but scripture, because it is written by The Holy Spirit, finds agreement with itself in different subjects amongst all the different books.

For instance,....

Eph 4:11 And he gave some to be apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 for the perfecting of the saints, unto the work of ministering, unto the building up of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 till we all attain unto the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a fullgrown man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
Eph 4:14 that we may be no longer children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, in craftiness, after the wiles of error;
Eph 4:15 but speaking truth in love, may grow up in all things into him, which is the head, even Christ;
Eph 4:16 from whom all the body fitly framed and knit together through that which every joint supplieth, according to the working in due measure of each several part, maketh the increase of the body unto the building up of itself in love.

Have we as the body of Christ reached this point yet in our walk with GOD???

I say no, and we will never reach it in our current state of non-glorification. It's going to take Jesus and His glorification of our bodies before we will have no need of those gifts/offices that we have currently from Him.

The arguments by some people can go on forever (and they seemingly do), but for us to truly see clearly and face to face, and to know not just in part but to know even as we are already known, we are going to need Jesus to glorify our bodies so we can move past what we currently are,..... a regenerated human spirit by the sacrifice and blood of Jesus with an implanted portion of The Holy Spirit of GOD within us,........bound by a body of sin from this world.

Without a glorified body from Jesus, we are not perfected yet.

 

[pasifika]

If charity includes faith and hope,

out of curiosity, you cannot imagine that there can be someone who is full of charity, but may be lacking hope and faith?

Is that a logical impossibility to you?

Hi, some people who do charity outside of the faith because they haven't heard the Gospel of Jesus Christ, shown that God already put His Spirit within their hearts to do good works ie charity.
Romans 2 :14-15 comes to mind in which Gentiles who do not have the law yet by "nature" do the requirement necessary for the law, which shows that law is written within their heart.

 

[Aussie Pete]

10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.

13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.
====

One question I would like to ask and discuss with those who believes the "perfect" in this passage refers to the 2nd coming of Christ.

Why would Paul write we still need to have "hope" after Christ comes back and we are with him in heaven?

The Bible definition of hope is "a confident expectation and desire for something good in the future."

Why should hope still remain when we can see Christ face to face, and we have our redeemed body? Do we still need to have hope then and why?

Hope gives substance to faith. It's not given enough emphasis in my view. "Have faith, brother!" Sure, but in what? Hope is the "what".

1 John 3

…2Beloved, we are now children of God, and what we will be has not yet been revealed. We know that when Christ appears, we will be like Him, for we will see Him as He is. 3And everyone who has this hope in Him purifies himself, just as Christ is pure.

Colossians 1:5

"the faith and love proceeding from the hope stored up for you in heaven, of which you have already heard in the word of truth, the gospel"

I don't believe that we have but a vague understanding of what it will be like in the new heavens and new earth. I don't believe that it will be static. That's why faith arising from hope will be as eternal as love.

 

[Guojing]

I don't believe that we have but a vague understanding of what it will be like in the new heavens and new earth. I don't believe that it will be static. That's why faith arising from hope will be as eternal as love.

To confirm, you are one of those who believe that faith and hope are necessary even after we see Christ face to face?