This bugs me...the chosen people

Angel4Truth

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Deuteronomy 7: 6. "For you are a holy people to the Lord your God; the Lord your God has chosen you to be a people for Himself, a special treasure above all the peoples on the face of the earth.
7. "The Lord did not set His love on you nor choose you because you were more in number than any other people, for you were the least of all peoples;
8. "but because the Lord loves you, and because He would keep the oath which He swore to your fathers, the Lord has brought you out with a mighty hand, and redeemed you from the house of bondage, from the hand of Pharaoh king of Egypt.
 
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TexasSky

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God didn't turn His back on man and reject man.

Man turned his back on God and rejected God.

Originally, God cared for and loved Adam and Eve and all their children. Adam and Eve rejected God when they chose to listen to Satan's lies instead of God's wisdom.

They were not so much "tossed out of Eden" as they "marched out."

The first sin in Eden was not about "fruit" it was about, bascially, calling God a liar. It was about trusting the rebel who had already tried to wage war in heaven. It was about betrayal, not by God, but first by the "fairest of the heavens" and then by man.

When Cain murdered Abel, God did not strike him dead. Instead God showed him mercy.

As time went by, men continued to rejecte God's wisdom and love more and more and more.

Then Abraham came along.

The first man in a long, long time who actually listened to and obeyed God. At that point, God stepped back in and said that Abraham's family, since they alone were following God, would be watched over by God.

It was about God choosing to let the one's who rejected Him go. It was about God choosing to aide the one's who WANTED His aide.

And it really is still about that isn't it?

Christ offers love, forgiveness and salvation to everyone.
He does not, though, force Himself upon anyone.

He has told you the consequences of rejection of God.
Just as God told Adam and Eve the consequences of disobeying Him in Eden.

He has offered forgiveness and mercy.

If you accept that, you will be saved.
If you reject that, He will let you go.

Its as simple as that.
 
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orthros

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Peace.....the word "chosen" is not in reference to being "special", but that this is who and where God decided to start the Ministry and Mission for Jesus. Ex: God "chose" to start with the Jewish people and continue from that point in time and history. God Bless! "orthros":crosseo:
 
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cfmember

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Response to the first post about 'why' God has a chosen people:

You should ask: "What" were the Israelites 'chosen for'? A lot of people think that to be "chosen" means to be "saved" but that is not so. You can find help in Romans 9:4. God chose to bring the Savior thru the Jews (a Gentile can't claim to be Christ), and he chose to bring the Old Testament thru them as well, and the New Testament too (although some debate whether Luke was a Jew)

Some think Jacob was saved and Esau condemned because God said he "chose the elder to serve the younger", but clearly the verse has nothing to do with salvation or condemnation, but with service. Jesus had 12 "chosen" men but one betrayed him.

I've wondered the same thing, 'why' God had a chosen people (Israel), but I think God had a chosen people for some very good reasons, shown in the Bible, not to mention it pinpoints his Son so false Christs cannot do identity theft.

I have a relative that dislikes the Jews because they are called God's "chosen people" and the Gentiles are not. He didn't understand that "chosen" doesn't mean saved, but chosen 'for a specific purpose' (to bless the obedient or punish/correct the disobedient), which God makes clear in his Word.

Claiming to be "chosen" for some means they were saved (in like Flynn) before they were born. But that's not possible, because Jesus judges as he hears (John 5:30), and unless God knew they would 'believe God' like Abraham did (and his belief "was counted unto him for righteousness"). Men can't be judged before they're born, because they had yet to be given the truth and the opportunity to believe it or not, and to be judged by Jesus for that. (Those who believe otherwise must believe in magic too :)
 
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kj7gs

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It is like a teacher asking for volunteers and seeing whose hand rises. They are then chosen.
Like a teacher asking for volunteers!? What if no one volunteers? The first one in that class volunteered for a little while, but then decided to quit. And passed that non-volunteerism to everyone following him. That's about as far as I'll go with this anthropomorphism, because salvation as a matter of the heart rather than works.
 
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visionary

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Like a teacher asking for volunteers!? What if no one volunteers? The first one in that class volunteered for a little while, but then decided to quit. And passed that non-volunteerism to everyone following him. That's about as far as I'll go with this anthropomorphism, because salvation as a matter of the heart rather than works.
the heart of the student is to please the teacher, that is why the eagerness of the heart to volunteer in the first place.
 
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Bick

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MY answer:

Because God wanted to. As for converting people, God could send angels to everyone, and if their glory was not turned down, to scare the pants off everyone. But everyone would no doubt believe.

But God has chosen the simple things, the ordinary limited humans to bring the message of hope to the world. Why? Because God can show his great love and rescue the fallen human race; for in our weakness is His strength.
 
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visionary

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Ex 34:5 And the LORD descended in the cloud, and stood with him there, and proclaimed the name of the LORD. 6 And the LORD passed by before him, and proclaimed, The LORD, The LORD God, merciful and gracious, longsuffering, and abundant in goodness and truth, 7 Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear the guilty; visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children, unto the third and to the fourth generation. 8 And Moses made haste, and bowed his head toward the earth, and worshipped. 9 And he said, If now I have found grace in thy sight, O Lord, let my Lord, I pray thee, go among us; for it is a stiffnecked people; and pardon our iniquity and our sin, and take us for thine inheritance.

10 And he said, Behold, I make a covenant: before all thy people I will do marvels, such as have not been done in all the earth, nor in any nation: and all the people among which thou art shall see the work of the LORD: for it is a terrible thing that I will do with thee.
We have watched and read the consequences and blessings and curses of being the bearer of the covenant of the Lord. Being chosen does carry with it grave consequences that is not an easy burden. In those written pages of the Bible you read the trials and errors of a people who were not perfectly obedient to the voice of God and the tragedy of their mistakes. We should not think that it is a cruise ride of glory but should look to our own life not to make the same mistakes as they and look to ride the cruise of grace and glory with equal foolishness of mind.
 
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Bible2

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visionary said in post #853:
We have watched and read the consequences and
blessings and curses of being the bearer of the
covenant of the Lord. Being chosen does carry with
it grave consequences that is not an easy burden. In
those written pages of the Bible you read the trials
and errors of a people who were not perfectly
obedient to the voice of God and the tragedy of their
mistakes. We should not think that it is a cruise
ride of glory but should look to our own life not to
make the same mistakes as they and look to ride the
cruise of grace and glory with equal foolishness of
mind.

That's right: "brethren, I would not that ye should
be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the
cloud, and all passed through the sea; And were all
baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea; And
did all eat the same spiritual meat; And did all
drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of
that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock
was Christ.
|
But with many of them God was not well pleased: for
they were overthrown in the wilderness. Now these
things were our examples, to the intent we should not
lust after evil things, as they also lusted. Neither
be ye idolaters, as were some of them; as it is
written, The people sat down to eat and drink, and
rose up to play. Neither let us commit fornication,
as some of them committed, and fell in one day three
and twenty thousand. Neither let us tempt Christ, as
some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of
serpents. Neither murmur ye, as some of them also
murmured, and were destroyed of the destroyer.
|
Now all these things happened unto them for
ensamples: and they are written for our admonition,
upon whom the ends of the world are come. Wherefore
let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he
fall" (1 Corinthians 10:1-12).

"For if we sin wilfully after that we have received
the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more
sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for
of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour
the adversaries. He that despised Moses' law died
without mercy under two or three witnesses: Of how
much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be
thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son
of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant,
wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and
hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?"
(Hebrews 10:26-29).
 
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lmorovan

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The topic actually has to do with what many people ask "why God did this or didn't do that?". Well, the simple answer is: God is God, and He does what is always the best (He is incapable to do anything other than perfect). Fortunately, He doesn't have to give account for His actions to anyone other than Himself, lest we would be in a much bigger trouble than we are.
 
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Bible2

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lmorovan said in post #857:
God is God, and He does what is always the best

And the best is what pleases Him: "Thou art worthy,
O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for
thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure
they are and were created" (Revelation 4:11). "The
LORD hath made all things for himself: yea, even
the wicked for the day of evil" (Proverbs 16:4).

As Creator, God can do with His creatures whatever He
wants: "God hath from the beginning chosen you to
salvation" (2 Thessalonians 2:13); "... many are
called, but few are chosen" (Matthew 22:14); "strait
is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth
unto life, and few there be that find it" (Matthew
7:14).

"Not as though the word of God hath taken none
effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of
Israel: Neither, because they are the seed of
Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall
thy seed be called. That is, They which are the
children of the flesh, these are not the children of
God: but the children of the promise are counted for
the seed. For this is the word of promise, At this
time will I come, and Sara shall have a son. And not
only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by
one, even by our father Isaac; (For the children
being not yet born, neither having done any good or
evil, that the purpose of God according to election
might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth)
It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the
younger.
|
As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have
I hated. What shall we say then? Is there
unrighteousness with God? God forbid. For he saith to
Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy,
and I will have compassion on whom I will have
compassion. So then it is not of him that willeth,
nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth
mercy. For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for
this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might
shew my power in thee, and that my name might be
declared throughout all the earth. Therefore hath he
mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he
hardeneth.
|
Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find
fault? For who hath resisted his will? Nay but, O
man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall
the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast
thou made me thus? Hath not the potter power over the
clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto
honour, and another unto dishonour? What if God,
willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power
known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of
wrath fitted to destruction: And that he might make
known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy,
which he had afore prepared unto glory, Even us, whom
he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the
Gentiles?
|
As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people,
which were not my people; and her beloved, which was
not beloved. And it shall come to pass, that in the
place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my
people; there shall they be called the children of
the living God. Esaias also crieth concerning Israel,
Though the number of the children of Israel be as the
sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved: For he
will finish the work, and cut it short in
righteousness: because a short work will the Lord
make upon the earth. And as Esaias said before,
Except the Lord of Sabaoth had left us a seed, we had
been as Sodoma, and been made like unto Gomorrha"
(Romans 9:6-29).
 
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clmanning

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...i don't know if its actually true...but i heard somewhere that jews can't go to heaven until the RApture...i didn't want to beleive that but it ended up bugging me...could someone pleaze tell me if its true?
Scripturally speaking, no one is in Heaven as of now. If the dead immediately went to Heaven, there would be no need for a resurrection.

Scripture teaches that when we die we remain in the grave until the resurrection, either the resurrection unto life or the resurrection unto damnation.

When we die, we go to sleep and wait until the coming of our Lord.
 
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clmanning

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God chose the jewish people to work out his salvation through them. Why would God need to chose "A" people. Isn't our God big enough to chose all people? And wouldnt' that make more sense:sigh:
Put very simply, God chose Abram as the predecessor of Christ. Through Abram and his decendents, God would bring salvation to the world through Christ.

Secondly, God chose Abram's decendents as examples for us, to reveal His power and His grace.
 
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clmanning

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"The great dragon was hurled down--that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray." Revelation 12:9a niv

Its the Devil's world. He leads the whole world astray (and into an ash tray).

God chose the small nation of Israel to set up a contrast between his system for life, and that of the proud Devil's. God can choose a people, because God can control who, when, and where, each one of us is to be born.

" From one man he made every nation of men, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he determined the times set for them and the exact places where they should live." Acts 17:26 niv

God has chosen Israel for a special function in Eternity, as well. After all, Jerusalem is chosen for the capitol of the world. The throne Jesus will sit on will be stationed in the New Jerusalem! Israel has been chosen for the future, as well as the past for a special place in God's order of importance amongst the nations.

" This is what the LORD Almighty says: "In those days ten men from all languages and nations will take firm hold of one Jew by the hem of his robe and say, 'Let us go with you, because we have heard that God is with you.' " Zechariah 8:33 niv

That will take place during the Millenium..... God is not done with the Jews yet. They have been chosen for a purpose. Just as we, the Church, has been chosen with a purpose. Ours is to become the helpmate for Christ. Those who are now faithful to grow in grace and truth, and overcome (in their thinking) the evil they find in their world, will be allowed to rule with Christ. Those who seek after false understanding will be still saved, but not granted authority to reign with Christ over the nations.

"To him who overcomes and does my will to the end, I will give authority over the nations-- " Revelation 2:26 niv

That rulership will be a close intimate sharing of Christ of his life with those who wanted to know the truth while living on this earth. All the so called faithful "religious" types will not be granted such authority. They will be happy in their resurrection life, but disallowed certain privileges only granted to those who kept growing in grace and truth all of their lives. That is why I dislike denominations so much. Denominations put up walls of dogma and man made tradition, that keep one a prisoner of not being able to discover the vast frontier of the entire Bible and what it has to teach us. Faithful to denominational creeds and traditions... but fearful of taking up one's cross and leaving the security of confomity of "safety in numbers" into the transforming spiritual life of growing in an accurate understanding of God's Holy Word. The Word that was with God in the beginning. The Word that would tear down one's denominational blockades if it were to be accepted with open eyes of one's heart.

Yes... The Jews will have special function in Eternity. Abraham was promised a land grant that he never received in his lifetime. It was about the size of the United States. Not the little nation of Israel we see today. That has yet to be. The seed of Abraham (which are OT and Tribulational saints) will inherit that earthly kingdom. We, the Church, have been chosen for a home in Heaven. Our mansions will be in Heaven, but we will serve with Christ on the New Earth.

Each group chosen by God for his purpose and delight. :)

Grace and peace, GeneZ
Sorry, but our rooms will be in the city of God, the New Jerusalem, on the New Earth, and the Father and the Son will be here. What reason would there be to be in Heaven when God will be on the New Earth?
 
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