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The Turkey factor.

Discussion in 'News & Current Events (Articles Required)' started by Evangelion, Feb 20, 2003.

  1. Evangelion

    Evangelion <b><font size="2">δυνατός</b></font>

    +0
    What do people think of Turkey's response to the latest offer from America?

    Just so we all know what we're talking about, here's what the Beeb had to say:

    • The head of Turkey's ruling party has said that US forces will not be permitted to launch an attack on Iraq from his country unless written guarantees of financial aid are provided.

      Recep Tayyip Erdogan told a Turkish newspaper that Ankara was also seeking clarification from Washington on Turkey's role in any war.

      Use of Turkish military bases would allow the United States to open a northern front in any attack on Iraq, to coincide with operations in the south.

      But although Turkey is a key Muslim ally of the US and a fellow member of Nato, its leaders are deeply concerned about the impact of war on the already fragile Turkish economy.

      A parliamentary vote that would allow American troops to deploy on Turkish soil, due earlier this week, has been delayed while officials from the two countries try to hammer out a deal.


      Grants and loans

      Washington has reportedly offered Ankara grants of $6bn and loans of up to $20bn in exchange for its support, and has expressed frustration over Turkey's failure to accept the deal.

      US Secretary of State Colin Powell told reporters in Washington that he expected to hear back from Turkey by the end of Thursday.

      "Our position is firm," he said.

      But Mr Erdogan insists that Turkey should receive formal assurances that the US Congress will act quickly to release financial aid.


      Economy Minister Ali Babacan was even more downbeat.

      "We have found the figures insufficient and we are not looking favourably at the offer," he told the Cumhuriyet newspaper.

      And he added: "The US says the (Iraq) operation will be short. On the other hand, it says the congressional process affecting all matters, including the grants, will take between six and eight weeks.

      "What if the operation is over before the completion of the congressional process and Congress tells us 'Sorry'? That is why a written deal is a must."


      UN resolution

      Turkey argues that its economy suffered a loss of tens of billions of dollars as a result of the 1991 Gulf War, and that it had little input in subsequent decisions affecting the area, particularly northern Iraq.

      The situation is further complicated by calls from many within the Turkish leadership for a second United Nations Security Council resolution on Iraq, authorising the use of force, to be adopted before the Americans are allowed in.


      In other developments in the Iraq crisis:

      [*]The US is to submit a new resolution to the Security Council next week, a senior Bush administration official says

      [*]Russia expresses concern about "strong pressure" on UN weapons inspectors to produce assessments that could be used as a pretext for war

      [*]Inspectors visit Iraqi sites involved in producing al-Samoud missiles - chief inspector Hans Blix is to demand that Iraq destroy them

      [*]African leaders meeting in Paris endorse France's position on Iraq

      [*]The leaders of the UK's Catholic and Anglican churches call for inspections to be given more time
    Your thoughts? :cool:
     
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  2. Morat

    Morat Untitled One

    +2
    Atheist
    Wow. Looks like the Turks have paid more attention to Bush's record than American's. It's very common for him to promise some cash, but when it comes time to pay up...it's not there.

    His education bill being the most obvious example, but the way his budget short-changes first responders after all that talk about making sure firefighters and cops had the money and tools they needed...

    Must be that liberal media covering for him again. :)
     
  3. Evangelion

    Evangelion <b><font size="2">δυνατός</b></font>

    +0
    *bump*

    :)
     
  4. datan

    datan Well-Known Member

    +96
    Protestant
    sounds like a straightforward bribe to me...nothing more, nothing less..
     
  5. Morat

    Morat Untitled One

    +2
    Atheist
    You do realize that pretty much everyone, save Britain and Spain, that are part of our coalition (either supporting war, or allowing us use of bases or airspace) are all being bribed?

    Our coalition of the bought off, as I believe it's being called.
     
  6. Evangelion

    Evangelion <b><font size="2">δυνατός</b></font>

    +0
    Ooops, double post. :p
     
  7. Evangelion

    Evangelion <b><font size="2">δυνατός</b></font>

    +0
    Australia's being bribed too. John Howard has been offered a free trade agreement with the US. That's why he's supporting the war.

    There's nothing noble about this ugly little offensive. Everyone who's in it is in it for what they can get out of it. :cool:
     
  8. TheBear

    TheBear NON-WOKED

    +1,771
    United States
    Atheist
    Private
  9. Red Panda

    Red Panda Member

    127
    +0

    I work with a fellow from Turkey. He told me that during the first Gulf war, Turkey had to swallow some $31B dollars to absorb the refugees that were caused by that war.&nbsp; Many of them were Kurds, which only created more sentiment for Kurdish autonomy in areas of Turkey.&nbsp; (Note - the Turkish govt doesn't recognize Kurds; they call them 'mountain Turks').&nbsp; So I guess because of the 1st Gulf War and our record so far in Afghanistan,Turkey is understandably skeptical about the US govt's commitment to follow through.&nbsp; "Get it in writing"&nbsp; - always good advice. :D
     
  10. Blindfaith

    Blindfaith God's Tornado

    +76
    Non-Denom
    Thank you for bringing that up Panda. :)

    My knee-jerk response was "blackmail" type of mentality, but after thinking about it I changed my mind somewhat.&nbsp; The cost of war is always high, and not only in lives lost.&nbsp; The physical damages incurred, plus the refugee cost has got to increase rapidly, so I can't say that I blame Turkey for wanting some guarantees up front.

    But on the other hand ~ wouldn't they benefit from Saddam from being ousted?&nbsp; Therefore, they'd be willing to help absorb some of the cost?

    There's always two sides to the philosophy. :)

    Have an awesome day tomorrow everyone!

    BF
     
  11. Caffeine Socialism

    Caffeine Socialism Imagine all the people.

    380
    +0
    Actually, they might pay if (when, that is) Saddam is ousted. The Kurds will finally have an opportunity to make their own country, and the Turkish government doesn't even recognize the Kurds as a group. Turkey is scared of losing control of them, so that's one reason they might oppose the war.
     
  12. Red Panda

    Red Panda Member

    127
    +0
    Indeed. Turkey wants assurances that the US will support its effort to quell Kurdish rebellion as "anti-terrorism", similar to Russia smashing Chechen rebels as a form of "anti-terrorism".

    The Kurds are in for a rude surprise. They think the US is on their side but in reality, we will sell them up the river in order to keep Turkey as an ally.
     
  13. mala

    mala fluffy lion

    +2,270
    Muslim
    Single

    i'd advise you to do a search for information about the PKK organization

    it's not so-called terrorism but real terrorism
     
  14. Lacmeh

    Lacmeh Active Member

    711
    +1
    The PKK might be a terroristic organisation, but Turkey is guilty of government founded terrorism against the Kurdish minority, too.
    Besides, the fact, that PKK is a terroristic organisation is no grounds to discount the rights of the Kurdish minority in Turkey. Just because there is the ETA doesn´t make all Basques terrorists and rightless.
     
  15. Evangelion

    Evangelion <b><font size="2">δυνατός</b></font>

    +0
    Amen, Lacmeh. :cool:
     
  16. Red Panda

    Red Panda Member

    127
    +0
    I already know about them.&nbsp; What you should research is the history of Kurdish struggle, and their several attempts to establish their own homeland.&nbsp; I'd also advise that you look at an ethnic distribution map of the Kurds, to see why Turkey fears this Iraq situation (and potential independent Kurdish state) so badly.&nbsp;

    It was a mistake during the post WW1 division of the Ottoman Empire that created Turkey, to include with Turkey those areas with Kurdish majorities. That is how we got the Yugoslavia mess:&nbsp; force people who have nothing in common to form a country together, but give one group control of the govt, so they can rule over all the others.&nbsp; Recipe for disaster. :cry:
     
  17. Red Panda

    Red Panda Member

    127
    +0
    And right on cue, folks.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/2791723.stm
    Iraqi Kurds warn Turkey

    The Kurds of northern Iraq have warned that there will be clashes if troops from neighbouring Turkey cross the border.

    Ankara is demanding that Turkish forces should enter the north of the country to secure Turkey's interests if the US and Britain go ahead with an attack on Iraq.

    Kurdish spokesmen have said that their guerrillas who control the north will oppose any Turkish intervention.
     
  18. Evangelion

    Evangelion <b><font size="2">δυνατός</b></font>

    +0
    Exceptional. Thanks for the link, Panda. :wave: (And from the Beeb, no less! My default news source.)

    As you say - right on cue. :cool:
     
  19. mala

    mala fluffy lion

    +2,270
    Muslim
    Single

    mistake or not it happened

    and now people have to deal with it and stop insisting on grabbing pieces of other countries to form their own homeland

    what if the native americans demanded all their old homes back

    would you give it to them?

    as far as splitting up iraq into smaller pieces, that wont be happening since it is not in the best interests of that region.
     
  20. Lacmeh

    Lacmeh Active Member

    711
    +1
    Mala, right now the Kurds aren´t recognised as a minority by Turkey. That´ that´s like denying the fact, that that there are Native Americans in the US.
     
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