The Thing Most Sabbath Keepers Do not Talk About.

[Studyman]

"Were" being the keyword. The Jews considered Jesus to be a blasphemer and had him crucified. Those who accepted Jesus as the Messiah, were no longer Jews, they became Christians.

Paul said a Jew was one inwardly, and Jesus said Salvation was of the Jews. Paul also said a Christian is a man who Yields Himself to God and becomes "a servant of God's Righteousness".

Isn’t a true Christian, a Jew inwardly who does the Works of Abraham, who are Doers of the Christ's sayings, not hearers only.

 

[Servus]

I don't know the meaning of all your worldly religious terms.

Body of Christ: Romans 7:4, 1 Corinthians 10:16, 1 Corinthians 11:29, 1 Corinthians 12:27, Ephesians 4:12.

I get the impression you think anything outside of what you've come up with, on your own, is worldly religion. The lone Christian with extra special discernment most every Christian has lacked in the last 2000 years.

 

[Servus]

Paul said a Jew was one inwardly, and Jesus said Salvation was of the Jews.

Isn’t a true Christian, a Jew inwardly who does the Works of Abraham, who are Doers of the Christ's sayings, not hearers only.

Okay. I'm not going to debate someone's own personal homespun theology.

 

[Jerry N.]

Body of Christ: Romans 7:4, 1 Corinthians 10:16, 1 Corinthians 11:29, 1 Corinthians 12:27, Ephesians 4:12.

I get the impression you think anything outside of what you've come up with, on your own, is worldly religion. The lone Christian with extra special discernment most every Christian has lacked in the last 2000 years.

Paul says, "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved." He says, "If you confess with your lips that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead you will be saved." (Romans 10:9). This includes both Christians and Jews who keep the Sabbath and those who don’t. These are the Body of Christ.

 

[Servus]

They kept the Sabbath and still do. By the way Paul was very much a Jew and wrote about it often.

When he was a Jew, he was participating in Christians being put to death. Do you think the Sanhedrin accepted him as one of their own after he became an apostle? But I see you're Messianic, which basically means being completely Jewish, but also believing is Christ. Some folks for whatever reason will go some other route to avoid being an orthodox Christian. I don't get it, but to each their own. Say hi to Martin Chernoff for me.

 

[Servus]

Paul says, "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved." He says, "If you confess with your lips that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead you will be saved." (Romans 10:9). This includes both Christians and Jews who keep the Sabbath and those who don’t. These are the Body of Christ.

It was Gentiles and Jews, who became Christians. Messianic Judaism goes back to the 19th century, with the biggest influx coming about in the 1960s. It is not a thing of the 1st century Christian church.

 

[Jerry N.]

It was Gentiles and Jews, who became Christians. Messianic Judaism goes back to the 19th century, with the biggest influx coming about in the 1960s. It is not a thing of the 1st century Christian church.

Who was Peter talking to at Pentecost? I don't know where you got the idea that it started in the 19th century. Messianic Jews have been around since Pentecost. Most of the Christians in the first century were Jews. Please take a closer look at Messianic Judaism history. The fact that there has been an increase in the last 200 years, doesn't mean it has not existed from the beginning.

 

[Studyman]

Okay. I'm not going to debate someone's own personal homespun theology.

"debate"= a formal discussion on a particular matter in a public meeting, in which opposing arguments are put forward.

In this case, you are promoting that the "Bible", Specifically the Church of God under His New High Priest, rejected God's Commandments. In this case, the 4th Commandment.

I have presented evidence, not founded in religious traditions that are popular in this world God placed me in, rather, posting for your review and discussion, what is actually written in Scriptures. For a debate to happen, we must both engage in acknowledging Scriptures, then discussing what they mean concerning the topic at hand, and perhaps asking and answering each others questions in search of biblical Truth..

I am trying to engage in debate for the purpose of understanding what the Scriptures posted means, by asking questions and sharing my understanding of them. You are not engaging at all in a debate. You have a religious philosophy, and are not answering questions or even acknowledging what is actually written in your quest to preserve your own philosophy, and have now judged me of promoting my own personal homespun theology, just as you are doing.

This is not unusual in the history of the Bible. In John 7, Jesus was quoting what was actually written in Scriptures.

John 7: 37 In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.

38 He that believeth on me, "as the scripture hath said", out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water. (Is. 58)

11 And the LORD shall guide thee continually, and satisfy thy soul in drought, and make fat thy bones: and thou shalt be like a watered garden, and like a spring of water, whose waters fail not.

12 And they that shall be of thee shall build the old waste places: thou shalt raise up the foundations of many generations; and thou shalt be called, The repairer of the breach, The restorer of paths to dwell in. 13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words: 14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

But the mainstream preachers of Jesus Time, just as their fathers did for over 2000 years, rejected the Scriptures and the God who inspired them, and the Sabbaths HE created for them. And because Jesus was exposing their religion as not wrought in God, but in man, they sent men to shut Him up. Hear what transpired.

John 7: 45 Then came the officers to the chief priests and Pharisees; and they said unto them, Why have ye not brought him?

46 The officers answered, Never man spake like this man. 47 Then answered them the Pharisees, "Are ye also deceived?"

48 Have any of "the rulers or of the Pharisees" "believed on him?" And truly for over 2000 years, although they professed to know God, and to be Preachers of God's Word, they rejected His Commandments and polluted His Sabbaths, so that they might live by their own traditions.

In other words, they refused to debate Jesus or even acknowledge Isaiah's Words Jesus quoted, accusing Him instead of promoting HIS "own personal homespun theology".

I'm done here, I mean no ill towards you at all. And I still hope that maybe, in the confines of your own home, when no one is looking, you might consider some of these things.

Thanks for the discussion, such as it was.

 

[HIM]

Yep. Exactly what I do on the Lord’s day.

Which is Friday sundown to Saturday sundown

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Which is Friday sundown to Saturday sundown

Yes, the only holy day God claimed for Himself in the entire Bible.

Isa58:13“If you turn away your foot from the Sabbath,
From doing your pleasure on My holy day,
And call the Sabbath a delight,
The holy day of the Lord honorable,
And shall honor Him, not doing your own ways,
Nor finding your own pleasure,
Nor speaking your own words,

Happy Sabbath!

 

[Hentenza]

Which is Friday sundown to Saturday sundown

Nah. It’s the first day of the week celebrating Jesus resurrection which marks the beginning of the new covenant that does not include the requirement for Christians to keep the 4th commandment.

Of course, you could always post a post resurrection verse that requires the Christian to keep the 4th commandment.

 

[Hentenza]

Yes, the only holy day God claimed for Himself in the entire Bible.

Isa58:13“If you turn away your foot from the Sabbath,
From doing your pleasure on My holy day,
And call the Sabbath a delight,
The holy day of the Lord honorable,
And shall honor Him, not doing your own ways,
Nor finding your own pleasure,
Nor speaking your own words,

Happy Sabbath!

I’m still waiting for a post resurrection verse that requires the Christian to keep the 4th commandment.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I’m still waiting for a post resurrection verse that requires the Christian to keep the 4th commandment.

I have showed you, sadly you just dismiss any Scripture that doesn't fit your doctrine.

This still doesn't change the fact that the God of the Bible only identified one day as His holy day, He in His own words said it is THE holy day Isa 58:13, meaning there is no other, just a counterfeit.

God doesn't change, I do not need to try to disprove God, if you wish to, that can be between you and He.

 

[Freth]

Nah. It’s the first day of the week celebrating Jesus resurrection which marks the beginning of the new covenant that does not include the requirement for Christians to keep the 4th commandment.

Of course, you could always post a post resurrection verse that requires the Christian to keep the 4th commandment.

Hebrews 4:4,9-10 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works...There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

 

[Hentenza]

I have showed you, sadly you just dismiss any Scripture that doesn't fit your doctrine.

Really? None of the verses that you have posted are post resurrection verses that requires the Christian to keep the 4th commandment so why don’t you post it again please.

This still doesn't change the fact that the God of the Bible only identified one day as His holy day, He in His own words said it is THE holy day Isa 58:13, meaning there is no other, just a counterfeit.

It’s now Jesus rest and it was never added to the new covenant. Maybe you can also post a verse that shows where the 4th commandment was summarized along with the other 9 commandments into Jesus two love commandments.

God doesn't change,

God brought us a much better new covenant. He did not change because He sent Hs son to die on the cross to fulfill (complete) the old covenant.

I do not need to try to disprove God,

No but you need to believe Him. God is much bigger than your belief.

 

[Hentenza]

Hebrews 4:4,9-10 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works...There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

Which talks about and proofs Jesus rest not the Jewish sabbath. Try again. It’s pretty bad that you only posted the verses that you thought helped your case. How come you didn’t post the verses in between. Let’s look.

“and again in this passage, “They certainly shall not enter My rest.” Therefore, since it remains for some to enter it, and those who previously had good news preached to them failed to enter because of disobedience, He again sets a certain day, “Today,” saying through David after so long a time just as has been said before, “Today if you hear His voice, Do not harden your hearts.””
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4‬:‭5‬-‭7‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

Hebrews 4:6-7 Therefore, since it remains for some to enter it, and those who previously had good news preached to them failed to enter because of disobedience, He again sets a certain day, “Today,” saying through | New American Standard Bible - NAS

Therefore, since it remains for some to enter it, and those who previously had good news preached to them failed to enter because of disobedience, He again sets a certain day, “Today,” saying through

bible.com

The new day IS today not just one day of the week. We are to worship God daily.

Also, please post a verse that shows the 4th commandment being summarized into Jesus two love commandments like the 9 other commandments have been. Thanks.

 

[Freth]

Which talks about and proofs Jesus rest not the Jewish sabbath. Try again. It’s pretty bad that you only posted the verses that you thought helped your case. How come you didn’t post the verses in between. Let’s look.

“and again in this passage, “They certainly shall not enter My rest.” Therefore, since it remains for some to enter it, and those who previously had good news preached to them failed to enter because of disobedience, He again sets a certain day, “Today,” saying through David after so long a time just as has been said before, “Today if you hear His voice, Do not harden your hearts.””
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4‬:‭5‬-‭7‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

Hebrews 4:6-7 Therefore, since it remains for some to enter it, and those who previously had good news preached to them failed to enter because of disobedience, He again sets a certain day, “Today,” saying through | New American Standard Bible - NAS

Therefore, since it remains for some to enter it, and those who previously had good news preached to them failed to enter because of disobedience, He again sets a certain day, “Today,” saying through

bible.com

The new day IS today not just one day of the week. We are to worship God daily.

Also, please post a verse that shows the 4th commandment being summarized into Jesus two love commandments like the 9 other commandments have been. Thanks.

1. It literally says the seventh day specifically.
2. It also says, "as God did from His." The Sabbath day specifically.

 

[Hentenza]

1. It literally says the seventh day specifically.

Being used as a shadow of it not literally it. Again, the day has been changed. You guys need to start reading at the bottom part of chapter 3 to get the context of chapter 4 which begins with “therefore” which denotes a conclusion from what was being said in chapter 3.

2. It also says, "as God did from His." The Sabbath day specifically.

Correct but here Jesus rest is being contrasted and equaled to God’s rest after the creation. The person that enters His (Christ) rest is the same as resting as God did after creation. In other words Christ rest is now the same as God’s rest after creation. The Jewish sabbath is no longer necessary.

“For the one who has entered His rest has himself also rested from his works, as God did from His.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4‬:‭10‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

Hebrews 4:10 For the one who has entered His rest has himself also rested from his works, as God did from His. | New American Standard Bible - NASB (NASB2020) | Download The Bible App Now

For the one who has entered His rest has himself also rested from his works, as God did from His.

bible.com

 

[SabbathBlessings]

1. It literally says the seventh day specifically.
2. It also says, "as God did from His." The Sabbath day specifically.

Heb 4:10 For he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His. (on the seventh day Heb4:4) God said the seven day is the Sabbath Exo20:10 why the seventh day was spoken of in this way. - Spoken by Whom- God of the Universe. Exo 20:1 Exo 20:8-11
11 Let us therefore be diligent to enter that rest, lest anyone fall according to the same example of disobedience. That sounds like a commandment to me.

Why the literal translation in v9 says there remains a Sabbath-rest (keeping of the Sabbath) for the people of God. Heb4:9

Plus we are literally told, the tablets of stone (only the Ten Commandments Deut4:13 Exo31:18) went from being written on stone to being written on the heart, what the New Covenant is about Heb8:10 God laws, written on the heart. Who defines what God laws are, man or God? Deut4:13 Exo20:6 Exo31;18, its sad this even has to be a question or a debate.

2 Co3:3 clearly you are an epistle of Christ, ministered by us, written not with ink but by the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of flesh, that is, of the heart.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

“For the one who has entered His rest has himself also rested from his works, as God did from His.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4‬:‭10‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

God rested on the seventh day
Heb 4:4 For He has spoken in a certain place of the seventh day in this way: Quoting Exo 20:1 Exo20:8-11
“And God rested on the seventh day from all His works”;

If one can't see this plain Scripture, its because they don't want to. But it doesn't change God's Biblical Truth that harmonizes with His own Testimony that said He would not alter the words of His covenant Psa89:34 the Ten Commandments sits under His mercy seat, where justice and mercy will come together soon. I personally would not want to remove a jot or tittle of what God covers with His mercy and therefore a record is left of our sins.


Pro 28:13 He who covers his sins will not prosper,
But whoever confesses and forsakes them will have mercy.