The ten horns of Daniel...

[Douggg]

fair enough - the Prince of princes is Jesus or Michael? This part of chapter 11 might be an insight into an antichrist:

The Prince of princes is Jesus. At the end of the 7 years, the little horn person - the beast at that time - will convince the kings of the earth to assemble their armies at Armageddon to try and make war on Jesus to keep him from executing judgement of them - as insane as that might seem to think they can ever hope to be successful.

What you are talking about Michael is a little different. Just past the middle part of the 7 years, there is a war in heaven (the second heaven) which Michael the angel and the good angels will war against Satan and his evil angels - to cast them down to earth in Revelation 12.

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In Daniel 11:36, it has switched to the end times. And the king in verse 36 is the person after he has become the beast because he is claiming to be God, greater than any other god - apparently he will claim different levels of gods.

When he is attacked by the kings of the south, north, and east - it is near the end of the seven years. The beast is the king of the west, and his kingdom is the EU. The United States and Canada will likely be aligned with the EU.
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His career in the bible runs like this....


He first becomes the little horn, 7th julio claudian king of the Roman Empire, the EU in the end times.

He next becomes the King of Israel messiah, following the Gog/Magog event, as the Antichrist.

He next becomes magnified in his heart that he has attained God-hood. Commits the transgression of desolation. The Jews reject him from continuing as their king - ending his stint as the Antichrist.

God has him killed and brought back to life as the beast, 8th julio-claudian king of the Roman Empire, the EU in the end times - as the ten EU leaders hand over their kingdom to him.

He then rules for 42 months. Abomination of desolation, 666, mark of the beast during that time.

Near the end of the 7 years, he is attacked from the south, north, and east in Daniel 11:40-44.

Jesus appears unexpected in heaven, all of the kings of the earth with their armies in the middle east, are terrorized and unite under the beast. They meet their end when Jesus destroys them in Revelation 19:19-21.

 

[gomerian]

Not a lot there that the Reformers would agree with.

Whom ever the Reformers are said to be... may I just say, Whew!

You have to be different to be better. Viva la difference!

 

[Douggg]

Until you can think your way out of the Roman box, Revelation will never make any sense to you. And isn't that why Jesus had John write the Revelation? to open all of the Books of the Prophets.

Just the opposite. Until a person can put together the Roman Empire connection as one track for the person. And the King of Israel messiah Antichrist the other track for the person. They can never get the end times right.

Islam ends as a global religion when Gog/Magog takes place. The 7 years of Daniel 9:27 follow the destruction of Gog's army. This 100% verifiable by the two feasts in Ezekiel 39:4 and Ezekiel 39:17-20.

Ezekiel 39:17-20 is the Armageddon feast, 7 years after Gog/Magog. Jesus is the one speaking in Ezekiel 39:21.

 

[gomerian]

The Prince of princes is Jesus.

Lucifer was father of the prince of Tyre, in Ezekiel 28... wherein the prince of Tyre seems to be an awful lot like Solomon, what with his wisdom and his world-trading tendencies. And in Ezekiel 28:16, the two are seen to be of one single nature. God tells us that in the end, there will be no more merchants in Canaan. God also tells us that the kings of the earth are nothing but merchants.

You're surely not saying that Jesus was fond of glass beads, are you?

 

[gomerian]

The 7 years of Daniel 9:27 follow the destruction of Gog's army.

Gog Magog only happens once. Ezekiel shows you that there is some surprise connected with the identification. Which cannot be the case, if Gog Magog were a not-so-old foe. Nor can modern-day Israel be called a place of unwalled towns.

Although it is true that Esau will claim to be the reclaimer of waste places.

 

[gomerian]

the Prince of princes is Jesus or Michael?

These princes are archangels. Michael is the answer.
Not to be confused with the princes of the earth,
or the king of Tyre, the former covering cherub of the family of the angels.

When Satan falls from heaven, he brings with him 1/3 of the angels.
When the star falls from heaven, he brings with him 1/3 of the stars.

It's not a simple as it looks. When Satan is kicked out for good, he leaves room for the multitude.

 

[Douggg]

Lucifer was father of the prince of Tyre, in Ezekiel 28... wherein the prince of Tyre seems to be an awful lot like Solomon, what with his wisdom and his world-trading tendencies. And in Ezekiel 28:16, the two are seen to be of one single nature. God tells us that in the end, there will be no more merchants in Canaan. God also tells us that the kings of the earth are nothing but merchants.

You're surely not saying that Jesus was fond of glass beads, are you?

Ezekiel 28:1-10 is about the person after he reveals himself to be the man of sin.

Ezekiel 28:11-19 is about Satan.

 

[Douggg]

Nor can modern-day Israel be called a place of unwalled towns.

Yes, it can. They don't open city gates to enter cities.

 

[gomerian]

God has him killed and brought back to life as the beast, 8th julio-claudian king of the Roman Empire, the EU in the end times - as the ten EU leaders hand over their kingdom to him.

God doesn't have him killed. The death by sword isn't a godly adventure. Men are the warriors, which is why God will be said to be doing His un-natural act... if God's was the warrior's hand, the act would hardly be outside of the norm.

 

[Hiscosmicgoldfish3]

These princes are archangels. Michael is the answer.
Not to be confused with the princes of the earth,
or the king of Tyre, the former covering cherub of the family of the angels.

When Satan falls from heaven, he brings with him 1/3 of the angels.
When the star falls from heaven, he brings with him 1/3 of the stars.

It's not a simple as it looks. When Satan is kicked out for good, he leaves room for the multitude.

When the star falls from heaven, he brings with him 1/3 of the stars: Why? I don't understand what you mean - he leaves room for the multitude? The King of Tyre was Lucifer - a description of the cherub worked into the surrounding prophesy. So the prince of Persia is an archangel? (fallen presumably).
Do you go along with the orthodox view that the principalities and archons are derived from Nephalim? It is a mystery to me - where the archons originate. There would not be enough Nephalim to account for the number of them. Do you have any ideas on the origin of the archons?

 

[gomerian]

Ezekiel 28:1-10 is about the person after he reveals himself to be the man of sin.

Ezekiel 28:11-19 is about Satan.

Isn't that what I said? I sure meant to... although I don't think revealing himself is what happens. He's been hiding in plain sight for a very long time, hasn't he? And the same may be said for his prophet... although people are a bit backward in that particular revelation.

 

[Douggg]

Isn't that what I said? I sure meant to... although I don't think revealing himself is what happens.

revealing himself to be the man of sin - is when he commits the act in 2Thessalonians2:3-4.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

Up to that point, about 3 years 3 months into the 7 years, the Jews and the world will be thinking he is the messiah, and they are living in the messianic age of peace and safety (1Thessalonians5).

 

[jgr]

Whom ever the Reformers are said to be... may I just say, Whew!

You have to be different to be better. Viva la difference!

Thankfully, their diagnoses were accurate. Accuracy is better.

 

[gomerian]

When the star falls from heaven, he brings with him 1/3 of the stars: Why? I don't understand what you mean - he leaves room for the multitude? The King of Tyre was Lucifer - a description of the cherub worked into the surrounding prophesy. So the prince of Persia is an archangel? (fallen presumably).
Do you go along with the orthodox view that the principalities and archons are derived from Nephalim? It is a mystery to me - where the archons originate. There would not be enough Nephalim to account for the number of them. Do you have any ideas on the origin of the archons?

The star from heaven is Abaddon... not hardly the prince of Persia, right? Lucifer loses his place as the covering cherub to become the angel of the pit. And hell followed with him. Hell was created for Satan... and because of Satan. The people who keep his commandments will keep him company.

But... is the Nephilomania considered orthodoxy these days? Wow. Glad I missed that, otherwise I might be thinking shape-shifting lizzards, rather than demons and scorpions and locusts. While the kids may be calling it magic, they used to call it shamanism, but its nothing more than fire worship... which is where Persia fits in.

 

[jgr]

revealing himself to be the man of sin - is when he commits the act in 2Thessalonians2:3-4.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

Up to that point, about 3 years 3 months into the 7 years, the Jews and the world will be thinking he is the messiah, and they are living in the messianic age of peace and safety (1Thessalonians5).

Paul's "temple" in all of his epistles refers to the spiritual temple of the believer, collectively the Church.

 

[gomerian]

the Jews and the world will be thinking he is the messiah, and they are living in the messianic age of peace and safety (1Thessalonians5).

yeah... but that's not what really happens. He actually looks like and does what Ezekiel 28 says that he does. Trading what God gave him for what God gave other people. In other words, covet thy neighbor's... pretty much everything. And kill and steal and lie and drugs are the daughters of that thinking.

The Jews of the world have made a covenant with Abaddon, in Isaiah 28:18, so that the overflowing scourge (Jihad?) will not happen to them. The locusts of Joel and Daniel's flood are the men of the overflowing scourge. What is the mark of Islam?

 

[RACarvalho]

Daniel and the ten horns/little horn..
I don't agree with the SDA's interpretation of the ten horns being ten kingdoms, as the horns are said to be kings, in Daniel.

First, it is an error to consider that Historicism is a "SDA" interpretation, for it's not.
Way before SDA existed the Reformers were already preaching, teaching and demonstrating that the papacy is the Antichrist foretold in the bible.
As for the King reference, you can get back to Daniel, when He interprets Nabucodonosor dream and says that Nabucodonosor was the Head of the statue but after Him it would come another "king" , etc...
Well, after Nabucodonosor died, his son reigned in his place and his grandson in place of his son and this one was the one that was overtaken but the Medes/Persians.
So the reference to "King" is not to a person, but to a system/Dynasty that is replaced by the next system/Dynasty.

 

[gomerian]

the spiritual temple

John 2:19 Jesus answered and said unto them, "Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up." 21 But He spake of the temple of His body.

John 20:27 Then saith He to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold My hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust [it] into My side: and be not faithless, but believing.

Zechariah 13:6 And [one] shall say unto Him, What [are] these wounds in Thine hands? Then He shall answer, [Those] with which I was wounded [in] the house of My friends.

Psalm 45 shows the garments of Jesus, and the garments of the bride. "... upon Thy right hand did stand the queen..." The wise virgins of Jesus' parable are the companions of the queen/bride... and this is why the mother of James and John was wrong, btw.

 

[RACarvalho]

The 70 weeks are determined upon Daniel's people and Jerusalem. That's what is in the text. The 70 weeks are not over until Matthew 23:39 is fulfilled. Which will be at Jesus's Return.

Matthew 23:39 is included in the 70 weeks but the 70 weeks finished when Jesus drove the Roman army to destroy Jerusalem and burn the temple in the year 70dc.
Josephus makes a description that matches what Jesus said about the Jews and the end of the Jew age, which was the question posted by the disciples.
Albert Barns in his commentary of Mathew 24 makes a magnificent back to back comparison of Mathew 24 and History in Josephus words....

 

[Douggg]

Paul's "temple" in all of his epistles refers to the spiritual temple of the believer, collectively the Church.

These verses, not 2Thessalonians2:4. (all caps, not my doing. everybody gets treated nice. That's my intent).

BIBLE VERSES ABOUT BODY IS A TEMPLE