The Son is God in the OT, too.

Peter J Barban

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While studying John 5, I came to a startling conclusion: every interaction with God in the Bible, including the OT, reveals the Son. It is the Son, executing the Father's will, who speaks from the Burning Bush to Moses, that eats with Abraham, that Isaiah sees in heaven, that speaks to the prophets, etc.

And the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me. You have never heard his voice nor seen his form, nor does his word dwell in you, for you do not believe the one he sent. You study the Scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. These are the very Scriptures that testify about me, yet you refuse to come to me to have life.
John 5:37-40

Here are the basic scriptures for support:


1. We can't see God the Father, but we can see God the Son.

No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known. John 1:18

The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. Colossians 1:5

The Son is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. Hebrews 1:3a.


2. God, the Son, is the executor of God, the Father's will

yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live. 1 Corinthians 8:6

For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him, 20 and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross. Colossians 1:19-20

Moreover, the Father judges no one, but has entrusted all judgment to the Son John 5:22


3. The Son is the “I Am”, the God of Israel

If you believed Moses, you would believe me, for he wrote about me. John 5:46

For this reason they could not believe, because, as Isaiah says elsewhere:
He has blinded their eyes
and hardened their hearts,
so they can neither see with their eyes,
nor understand with their hearts,
nor turn—and I would heal them.”
[Isaiah 6: 10]
Isaiah said this because he saw Jesus’ glory and spoke about him. John 12:39-41

Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!” At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds. John 8: 58-59

Discussion to follow.
 

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While studying John 5, I came to a startling conclusion: every interaction with God in the Bible, including the OT, reveals the Son. It is the Son, executing the Father's will, who speaks from the Burning Bush to Moses, that eats with Abraham, that Isaiah sees in heaven, that speaks to the prophets, etc.

And the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me. You have never heard his voice nor seen his form, nor does his word dwell in you, for you do not believe the one he sent. You study the Scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. These are the very Scriptures that testify about me, yet you refuse to come to me to have life.
John 5:37-40

Here are the basic scriptures for support:


1. We can't see God the Father, but we can see God the Son.

No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known. John 1:18

The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. Colossians 1:5

The Son is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. Hebrews 1:3a.


2. God, the Son, is the executor of God, the Father's will

yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live. 1 Corinthians 8:6

For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him, 20 and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross. Colossians 1:19-20

Moreover, the Father judges no one, but has entrusted all judgment to the Son John 5:22


3. The Son is the “I Am”, the God of Israel

If you believed Moses, you would believe me, for he wrote about me. John 5:46

For this reason they could not believe, because, as Isaiah says elsewhere:
He has blinded their eyes
and hardened their hearts,
so they can neither see with their eyes,
nor understand with their hearts,
nor turn—and I would heal them.”
[Isaiah 6: 10]
Isaiah said this because he saw Jesus’ glory and spoke about him. John 12:39-41

Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!” At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds. John 8: 58-59

Discussion to follow.

The Church Fathers wrote of this
 
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eleos1954

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While studying John 5, I came to a startling conclusion: every interaction with God in the Bible, including the OT, reveals the Son. It is the Son, executing the Father's will, who speaks from the Burning Bush to Moses, that eats with Abraham, that Isaiah sees in heaven, that speaks to the prophets, etc.

And the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me. You have never heard his voice nor seen his form, nor does his word dwell in you, for you do not believe the one he sent. You study the Scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. These are the very Scriptures that testify about me, yet you refuse to come to me to have life.
John 5:37-40

Here are the basic scriptures for support:


1. We can't see God the Father, but we can see God the Son.

No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known. John 1:18

The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. Colossians 1:5

The Son is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. Hebrews 1:3a.


2. God, the Son, is the executor of God, the Father's will

yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live. 1 Corinthians 8:6

For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him, 20 and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross. Colossians 1:19-20

Moreover, the Father judges no one, but has entrusted all judgment to the Son John 5:22


3. The Son is the “I Am”, the God of Israel

If you believed Moses, you would believe me, for he wrote about me. John 5:46

For this reason they could not believe, because, as Isaiah says elsewhere:
He has blinded their eyes
and hardened their hearts,
so they can neither see with their eyes,
nor understand with their hearts,
nor turn—and I would heal them.”
[Isaiah 6: 10]
Isaiah said this because he saw Jesus’ glory and spoke about him. John 12:39-41

Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!” At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds. John 8: 58-59

Discussion to follow.

God throughout the entire bible is Jesus ... He does the Father's work.

John 5:37
And the Father Himself, who sent Me, has testified of Me. You have neither heard His voice at any time (throughout history), nor seen His form.
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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God throughout the entire bible is Jesus ... He does the Father's work.
Who does the Father's work TODAY? Truthfully, visibly, in reality, as the Father testifies or instructs all the time ? In total harmony with all His Word.
 
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Ken Rank

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While studying John 5, I came to a startling conclusion: every interaction with God in the Bible, including the OT, reveals the Son. It is the Son, executing the Father's will, who speaks from the Burning Bush to Moses, that eats with Abraham, that Isaiah sees in heaven, that speaks to the prophets, etc.

And the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me. You have never heard his voice nor seen his form, nor does his word dwell in you, for you do not believe the one he sent. You study the Scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. These are the very Scriptures that testify about me, yet you refuse to come to me to have life.
John 5:37-40

Here are the basic scriptures for support:


1. We can't see God the Father, but we can see God the Son.

No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known. John 1:18

The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. Colossians 1:5

The Son is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. Hebrews 1:3a.


2. God, the Son, is the executor of God, the Father's will

yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live. 1 Corinthians 8:6

For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him, 20 and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross. Colossians 1:19-20

Moreover, the Father judges no one, but has entrusted all judgment to the Son John 5:22


3. The Son is the “I Am”, the God of Israel

If you believed Moses, you would believe me, for he wrote about me. John 5:46

For this reason they could not believe, because, as Isaiah says elsewhere:
He has blinded their eyes
and hardened their hearts,
so they can neither see with their eyes,
nor understand with their hearts,
nor turn—and I would heal them.”
[Isaiah 6: 10]
Isaiah said this because he saw Jesus’ glory and spoke about him. John 12:39-41

Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!” At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds. John 8: 58-59

Discussion to follow.
Hi Peter. So just a question... where do you think is the first mention of or reference to... the son of God in the OT?

Anyone can answer.
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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Hi Peter. So just a question... where do you think is the first mention of or reference to... the son of God in the OT?

Anyone can answer.

Adam HaRishon was Ben Elohim :)
He walked with God in Gan Eden...who did he walk with?
 
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Peter J Barban

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The Church Fathers wrote of this
Good. I often find that my new ideas have been discussed by God's people before. It's extremely unlikely that we can discover anything that is both novel and true at this late date.
 
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Peter J Barban

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Hi Peter. So just a question... where do you think is the first mention of or reference to... the son of God in the OT?

Anyone can answer.
They say that word for "God" in Genesis 1 is a plural noun, so technically that would be the first, via inclusion.

The second, I note is in Gen 3:15
And I will put enmity
between you and the woman,
and between your offspring a and hers;
he will crush b your head,
and you will strike his heel.”

The offspring of the woman refers to Jesus ths son.

I don't know the first mention specifically of God's son in the OT.
 
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Ken Rank

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They say that word for "God" in Genesis 1 is a plural noun, so technically that would be the first, via inclusion.

The second, I note is in Gen 3:15
And I will put enmity
between you and the woman,
and between your offspring a and hers;
he will crush b your head,
and you will strike his heel.”

The offspring of the woman refers to Jesus ths son.

I don't know the first mention specifically of God's son in the OT.
Elohim (God) is always plural... it probably doesn't denote more than one being because that goes against the idea that "God is one" and is referred to in the singular throughout Scripture (with the exception of a few verses like Genesis 1:26. Hebrew lacks the ability to say, "good, better, best." So some believe, and I kind of lean here, that Elohim means God of gods.

As far as the first reference, I believe it is in Genesis 1:14...

"And God said, “Let there be lights in the expanse of the heavens to separate the day from the night. And let them be for signs and for seasons, and for days and years."

The word for seasons is moedim... which means "appointments" but we translate it as feasts. Since the feasts (i.e. Passover/Unleavened Bread, Pentecost, Atonement, etc.) all point to various aspects of Messiah's work.... then Genesis 1:14 not only lets us know that God knew we were going to fall... but it also teaches us that He made a ways for us to get back to Him and this through the son. So Genesis 1:14, as far as I can tell, is the first true reference of the son and his work.
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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Elohim (God) is always plural... it probably doesn't denote more than one being because that goes against the idea that "God is one" and is referred to in the singular throughout Scripture (with the exception of a few verses like Genesis 1:26. Hebrew lacks the ability to say, "good, better, best." So some believe, and I kind of lean here, that Elohim means God of gods.

As far as the first reference, I believe it is in Genesis 1:14...

"And God said, “Let there be lights in the expanse of the heavens to separate the day from the night. And let them be for signs and for seasons, and for days and years."

The word for seasons is moedim... which means "appointments" but we translate it as feasts. Since the feasts (i.e. Passover/Unleavened Bread, Pentecost, Atonement, etc.) all point to various aspects of Messiah's work.... then Genesis 1:14 not only lets us know that God knew we were going to fall... but it also teaches us that He made a ways for us to get back to Him and this through the son. So Genesis 1:14, as far as I can tell, is the first true reference of the son and his work.

Slain from the foundation of the world
 
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Ken Rank

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Slain from the foundation of the world
Yes, that goes hand in hand with my thoughts. From the very beginning, the role he played was laid out.... even before man was created, let alone fell away. Our God is an awesome God!
 
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