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wannagohome said:This book is alot about the end times and prophecy, one thing catches my attention greatly though. Chapter 13, verse 20: "Nevertheless, it is better to pass through these dangers and reach the end than to disappear like a cloud from this world and never see what takes place in the last days."
Seems pretty much like its saying the rapture is a no go.
Any thoughts? Jen
Not necessarily.wannagohome said:This book is alot about the end times and prophecy, one thing catches my attention greatly though. Chapter 13, verse 20: "Nevertheless, it is better to pass through these dangers and reach the end than to disappear like a cloud from this world and never see what takes place in the last days."
Seems pretty much like its saying the rapture is a no go.
Any thoughts? Jen
Notice, nothing states that there will be no Rapture. Esdras is only stating that there will be persecution. Still no mention of Tribulation. The Bible talks of there being persecution before the Rapture and Tribulation. Persecution does not automatically = Tribulation. Sorry, try again.Yet is it easier for him that is in danger to come into these things, than to pass away as a cloud out of the world, and not to see the things that happen in the last days. (2 Esdras 13:20)
You will have to use a Bible with the Septuagint (complete OT)...Brain Damage said:lol...Well i looked into my bible but i think someone has ripped out the book of Esdras coz i can't find it ...
I read the Concordant Literal New Testament Bible and the Living Bible.Orthodoxyusa said:You will have to use a Bible with the Septuagint (complete OT)...
http://www.christianforums.com/t727770
Forgive me....
I believe that I am wrong about II Esdras being in the Septuagint.. the book "II Esdras" being quoted fom here is not included... also known as "IV Esdras" not "II Esdras"...Orthodoxyusa said:You will have to use a Bible with the Septuagint (complete OT)...
http://www.christianforums.com/t727770
Forgive me....
Did you find chapter and verse?97trsgl said:It is in the Catholic Bible. Not generally a part of Protestant Bibles
Starstreak M86 said:Not necessarily.
Notice, nothing states that there will be no Rapture. Esdras is only stating that there will be persecution. Still no mention of Tribulation. The Bible talks of there being persecution before the Rapture and Tribulation. Persecution does not automatically = Tribulation. Sorry, try again.
Read 1 Thessalonians again with me, there is still no valid argument against the Rapture.
This book is between those two, are you refering to the stripped down version known as the King James Bible from 1622?Big Mouth Nana said:The way I see it, if it isn't Genesis through Revelation, it has no bearing on my life whatsoever. Why add confusion to something simple? Might as well add the book of Mormon, the Watchtower, the Quatrains of Nostradamus, etc., and make the circle complete
I don't know. In my KJ bible, it says the text originally taken from the 1611 version, and translated into English.Orthodoxyusa said:This book is between those two, are you refering to the stripped down version known as the King James Bible from 1622?
I'm sure your correct, I alway get that date wrong.Big Mouth Nana said:I don't know. In my KJ bible, it says the text originally taken from the 1611 version, and translated into English.
The times of the events before the Tribulation, like:wannagohome said:It specifically says "last days", in fact the entire book of 2 Esdras is basically visions of the end times. Not random persecutions. Jen
Starstreak M86 said:The times of the events before the Tribulation, like:
The Great Apostasy
The One World Government
The Great Lie
The Rise of Mystery Babylon
Are called "the last days" and "the Endtimes" in the epistles in the New Testament. The Endtimes does not automatically = the Tribulation. The Tribulation and more specifically the "Great Tribulation" is referred to by name.
Mostly because there is persecution before the Tribulation. However, it is not as severe as the Great Tribulation, so the Persecution before the Great Tribulation is called "the Endtimes" because it is close to the Last Week (Great Tribulation) in Daniel. 2 Esdras would have called it something other than the "last days" if it was the Tribulation, Endtimes are the last part of the Church Age.
That's why Pre-Tribs (me included) sometimes say things like, "Are we living in the Endtimes now?". Since Pre-Tribs believe that the Rapture is before the Tribulation, we would not call an era of persecution "the Endtimes" if it was the Tribulation, since we believe that the Tribulation does not happen until the Man of Sin (Antichrist) appears after the Restrainer (Holy Spirit and/or Church) is removed from the world.
Big Mouth Nana said:The way I see it, if it isn't Genesis through Revelation, it has no bearing on my life whatsoever. Why add confusion to something simple? Might as well add the book of Mormon, the Watchtower, the Quatrains of Nostradamus, etc., and make the circle complete
Wannagohome,wannagohome said:Just a couple questions then... if they introduce a chip that you can use in your body to purchase and sell items will you take it?
If some "guy" shows up and proclaims he's God and every one is gaga for him will you agree?
Just because it couldn't be 'the mark' or 'the antichrist' because you are still around? Jen
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