The Saints as Inspirational People

[Unofficial Reverand Alex]

For the purpose of the post, I'm not worried about prayers to the saints, or anything about canonization. I want to take a step back from debates on the saints in heaven, and just look at the saints as people who lived inspirational lives.

We are called to live like Jesus. Unfortunately, we don't get to see Jesus in person anymore, and what's recorded about His life is relatively limited. While the Gospels give us quite a bit to work with, it's still helpful to see other people as role models, never forgetting that the pinnacle is Jesus.

Ideally, all of our pastors are this way. When we come to church, we should see a relatively holy person, helping us to do the same.

Many of us were blessed with good parents; I know I've been led closer to Christ by trying to live as my dad does.

I could honestly say, "Father Bob is a pretty cool guy. He's humble, regularly admitting his faults during his sermons; he's intelligent, very well-studied on the Church Fathers; he's friendly, always a joy to talk to. I want to be more like him." I don't think anyone would chastise me for saying this; what's wrong with wanting to be more like someone who lives his life better than I do?

So why don't we act the same regarding the saints?

All too often, Protestants outright reject many good things from the Catholic church, not because they're bad, but because they're Catholic. We see this trend in politics as well; Democrats will reject some good policies not because they're bad, but because they're Republican (and visa-versa).

Some Protestant churches accept the saints as I've portrayed them in this post; not as people to pray to, but as good role models. And why not? I've included a few links to saint stories at the bottom of this post to show holiness lived out in ways we might not have thought of before. "He that walketh with wise men shall be wise: but a companion of fools shall be destroyed." (Proverbs 13:20) "Remember your leaders who taught you the word of God. Think of all the good that has come from their lives, and follow the example of their faith." (Hebrews 13:7)

The saints have some of the quirkiest, coolest, and most amazing stories in human history, and they are the most diverse group of people. You already know about Saint Paul, St. Peter, St. Michael the Archangel, and others from the Bible; Saint John Chrysostom was incredibly influential in the early Church; Saint Cyril and Saint Methodius evangelized Eastern Europe, and the Cyrillic alphabet owes it's name to the saint who helped make it. The saints are constant proof that, rich or poor, American or Asian, martyr or convert, anywhere God puts you, you can find great holiness.

Also included is a link to Saint of the Day; it's a great thing to set your web browser to automatically open to.

Merciful Like the Father: St. Vitalis of Gaza - Held By His Pierced Hands
Saint Teresa of Avila
St. Catherine of Siena - Saints & Angels - Catholic Online
Saint of the Day

 

[bcbsr]

All too often, Protestants outright reject many good things from the Catholic church, not because they're bad, but because they're Catholic. We see this trend in politics as well; Democrats will reject some good policies not because they're bad, but because they're Republican (and visa-versa).

Actually most Protestants reject Catholicism because Catholicism is not in line with scripture on many points.

And for your information. all believers are saints. That's how the Bible speaks of saints. Even, for example the Corinthians.

"If any of you has a dispute with another, dare he take it before the ungodly for judgment instead of before the saints? Do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if you are to judge the world, are you not competent to judge trivial cases?" 1Cor 6:1,2

The word "saints" is used 45 times in the NT and if you study those cases you find it's not referring to an elite subset of Christians, but rather to all believers. And that's one example showing that Catholics just don't study the Bible.

I happen to be a saint myself. So follow my example.
[/QUOTE]

 

[TuxAme]

Actually most Protestants reject Catholicism because Catholicism is not in line with scripture on many points.

Or, more accurately, protestants reject Catholicism because you all have your own interpretations (not to mention canons) of Scripture.

 

[Albion]

Or, more accurately, protestants reject Catholicism because you all have your own interpretations (not to mention canons) of Scripture.

Now, that really is not fair. The members of a given Protestant church are not likely to be more diverse in their beliefs and interpretations than the members of the Roman Catholic Church.

But it is true that if you compare the members of one church, the Roman Catholic Church, against ALL the Protestant churches simultaneously, it will appear as though the Catholics are more in agreement than, say, the Baptists, Pentecostals, Lutherans, Presbyterians, etc. are with each other.

And why wouldn't the latter hold different beliefs, considering that they are different churches with different origins?

 

[Unofficial Reverand Alex]

Actually most Protestants reject Catholicism because Catholicism is not in line with scripture on many points.

And for your information. all believers are saints. That's how the Bible speaks of saints. Even, for example the Corinthians.

"If any of you has a dispute with another, dare he take it before the ungodly for judgment instead of before the saints? Do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if you are to judge the world, are you not competent to judge trivial cases?" 1Cor 6:1,2

The word "saints" is used 45 times in the NT and if you study those cases you find it's not referring to an elite subset of Christians, but rather to all believers. And that's one example showing that Catholics just don't study the Bible.

I happen to be a saint myself. So follow my example.

With all due respect, this post is missing the point of the OP. I'm not doing any apologetics for Catholicism, and I designed it so that it wouldn't become a debate between denominations.

What I'm trying to do with this post is encourage people to study the lives of holier people throughout history. Studying the lives of the saints shows the vast amount of ways that God can work in all of our lives. Surely you aren't opposed to listening to people's testimonies, or Christian speakers giving stories of how they developed their faith? Take John Pridmore, for example. He's a former member of the London underground mafia, who gradually became aware of how empty his life of hatred & earthly possessions was, and ended up making a conversion to Christianity. His story of finding love & forgiveness & treasures in heaven, when he had more treasure than we could imagine on Earth, is incredible! Why wouldn't we want to find the people through history that have done incredible things through the darkest circumstances, and be amazed by their stories?

(More from Pridmore: john pridmore - YouTube)

I respect your passion for Protestantism, but please keep this thread on the intended topic.

God be with you.

 

[Albion]

With all due respect, this post is missing the point of the OP. I'm not doing any apologetics for Catholicism, and I designed it so that it wouldn't become a debate between denominations..

I saw that you did. However, it could be that this was the line from the OP that undermined that intention.

All too often, Protestants outright reject many good things from the Catholic church, not because they're bad, but because they're Catholic.

 

[Phil 1:21]

I want to take a step back from debates on the saints in heaven, and just look at the saints as people who lived inspirational lives.

Some did, some didn't. I don't find anything particularly inspiration about how Pope JP2 allowed rampant sex abuse to permeate throughout the Catholic Church.

 

[Albion]

I agree, Phil. Some saints from the past are inspirational. But the questionable way that saints are created in some denominations tends to tarnish the idea of singling out some inspirational Christians from the past.

There are people on the lists who were simply political people now being commemorated for their politics; others were just spooky people who were taken for being spiritual on that basis; and others have been chosen mainly because the people liked them. Even the concept of canonizing a saint is suspect since no one can really know if the most holy-seeming person was truly moral in all aspects of his or her life and so is in heaven now.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

I agree, Phil. Some saints from the past are inspirational. But the questionable way that saints are created in some denominations tends to tarnish the idea of singling out some inspirational Christians from the past.

There are people on the lists who were simply political people now being commemorated for their politics; others were just spooky people who were taken for being spiritual on that basis; and others have been chosen mainly because the people liked them. Even the concept of canonizing a saint is suspect since no one can really know if the most holy-seeming person was truly moral in all aspects of his or her life and so is in heaven now.

This line of logic, taken too far, means we ought not look up to anyone. This would include even Biblical figures and few of us would object to using the Apostles as role-models or inspirational people. Protestants might go even further than Catholics and Orthodox in their particular veneration of biblical figures since we don't just honour biblical figures but men and women throughout all ages of the Church's history since we believe God has not deprived any generation of Godly people completely.

We are told that the city on the hill cannot be hid and if we believe Christ surely there ought to be some who fit that model despite whatever personal sins they committed and struggled against. Absolute perfection doesn't seem possible but some people are closer to God than others in their actions and way of life. Even the biblical figures we all honour had their sins and struggles and weren't absolutely perfect, yet few of us would suggest Paul is not deserving of some sort of recognition for the tremendous trials he went through.

The OP is fully correct in pointing out that there are figures beyond the bible whom we can look up to. Specific Saints who can be honored for the part they played in the Church. If we are going to dismiss the idea entirely because of the potential hidden sinful life, should we not do the same for biblical figures as well?

 

[Albion]

This line of logic, taken too far, means we ought not look up to anyone. This would include even Biblical figures and few of us would object to using the Apostles as role-models or inspirational people.

If someone should take it too far, you may have against an issue with what they say. That has nothing to do with what I wrote, however.