The Rapture - 2020?

[Marilyn C]

I believe that the `catching away, ` the rapture precedes the Tribulation. Although I do not see the exact timing of this in God`s word I believe that we will know close to the time & even the month & year. I will set out my thinking in stages so you can respond, if you desire to a particular point.

1. We are NOT in darkness. I believe we will know closer to the time.
   `...you yourselves know perfectly that the Day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night,.....but you, brethren are NOT in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief. You are sons of light...` (1 Thess. 5: 1 – 5)
   
   `...exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the Day approaching.` (Heb. 10: 25)
   
   
   
2. The Day of Atonement – 10th of Tishri.

This is Israel`s most important day of the year. Thus I believe it is when they will start their sacrifices.

....I..............X.............2,300 days.......................................I.....>

.................10th Tishri................................................................>


`“ How long will the vision be, concerning the daily sacrifices & the transgression of desolation, the giving of both the sanctuary & the host to be trampled underfoot?” And he said to me, “For 2300 days; then the sanctuary shall be cleansed.”` (Dan. 8: 13 & 14)

I see that the 2,300 days includes –

• the sacrifices starting – 10th Tishri.
  
  
• the host being trampled – midway through the Tribulation.
  
  
• the sanctuary cleansed – when the Lord comes to deliver Israel.

3. The Cleansing of the Land – 7 months.

....I....220days..........X.............2,300 days.......................................I.....>

.........................10th Tishri................................................................>

220 days = 7 months & 10 days.

`For seven months the house of Israel will be burying them, in order to cleanse the land.` (Ez. 39: 12)

After the Russian Federation is dealt with by God on the mountains of Israel, then Israel will cleanse the land of bodies etc. This will take seven months. Then, I believe, they will desire to start their sacrifices to God.

`Then they will know that I am the Lord.` (Ez. 38: 23)


4. The months for the beginning & end of the tribulation.


....I......220.......X.............2,300 days.......................................I...........>

....Adar....10th Tishri........................................................Shebat.........>


Now we can place the beginning & end months on the timeline – Adar to Shebat.

Then we need to work out the year. And this is possible because of a very interesting event that happens in Israel`s calendar nearly every three years.

5. The years – of the beginning & end of the tribulation.

....I......220.......X.............2,300 days................................I......30......I.....30....I...15th .........>

....Adar....10th Tishri..............................................Shebat.....Adar 1.....Adar 2...New Year.. >


The 30, 30 & 15, are related to the 1, 290 & 1,335 days of Daniel 12: 11 & 12. (15th is the Feast of Tabernacles.)

After the month of Shebat comes the month of Adar. And every three years or so Israel has a double Adar month to come in line with its feasts & the Solar calendar. Thus there are two months of Adar before the New Year. They are called Adar 1 & Adar 2. The second Adar, (Adar 2) is the recognised month for the time of rejoicing over deliverance from their enemies.

So, we ask ourselves which years, in the future do these double months of Adar occur? According to the Jewish calendar the double Adars are in

• 2016, 2019, 2022 – all these do not give time for a 7 year tribulation.
  
  
• 2024, 2027, 2030, 2033, (etc) – my choice is 2027 (& I have more details for this, (month & day)but that would require more steps. Thus I will leave that for another thread.)

So if the end of the tribulation is, as I think, 2027 then the beginning would be 2020.

Thus I believe, the `catching away,` the rapture will be either late 2019 or early 2020.

Obviously we haven`t long to wait & see.


What are your thoughts?



Note – Israel`s months.

1. Nisan (Mar/April) 2. Iyyar (April/May) 3. Sivan (May/June) 4. Tammuz (June/July)
   
   5.Ab (July/August) 6. Elul (Aug/Sept) 7. Tishri (Sept/Oct)
   
   8.Marchesvan (Oct/Nov) 9. Kislev (Nov/Dec) 10. Tebeth (Dec/Jan) 11. Shebat (Jan/Feb)
   
   12. Adar (Feb/March)

 

[LastSeven]

How long will the vision be, concerning the daily sacrifices & the transgression of desolation, the giving of both the sanctuary & the host to be trampled underfoot?” And he said to me, “For 2300 days; then the sanctuary shall be cleansed.”` (Dan. 8: 13 & 14)

So many issues with your post, but let's start with this one. Daniel 8 is in the past, not the future.

 

[Marilyn C]

So many issues with your post, but let's start with this one. Daniel 8 is in the past, not the future.

Hi LastSeven,

Thank you for your comment. So I see that you believe Dan. 8 is in the past. I believe that some of it is, but that is another topic altogether & would be good for its own thread.
So meanwhile, I`ll just wait to see if people will discuss the details as regards the `future` view of Dan.8:13 & the rapture.

regards, Marilyn.

 

[Douggg]

So, we ask ourselves which years, in the future do these double months of Adar occur? According to the Jewish calendar the double Adars are in

• 2016, 2019, 2022 – all these do not give time for a 7 year tribulation.
  
  
• 2024, 2027, 2030, 2033, (etc) – my choice is 2027 (& I have more details for this, (month & day)but that would require more steps. Thus I will leave that for another thread.)

So if the end of the tribulation is, as I think, 2027 then the beginning would be 2020.

Setting the issue of the Rapture aside, you are thinking that the beginning of the 7 years is hinged on the double Adar month (Adar 1 and Adar 2) ?

Focusing just on that could you explain again your rationale, working back from 2027?


2027 - end of the 70th week
Adar 2 - 30 days
?????
?????
?????

 

[Marilyn C]

Hi Doug,

Good questions, thank you. I will get to answering them.

Marilyn.

 

[Douggg]

Marilyn, if the Second coming is tied to the fall feasts - then Adar2 would be 6 months off... if the 70th week ends then.

 

[Douggg]

trying to get the system to work the way I want it to.... .....

 

[John Hyperspace]

We can probably see patterns allowing us to wonder 'could it be this certain year?' for every year to come. But all I can really say is:

1. Watch Tebet 10 like a hawk. Don't be ignorant of what happened on Tebet 10. This is the day that the king of Babylon came to encompass Jerusalem with his armies and begin the seige of the holy people. This is the one and only person in all of scripture whose coming is specifically recorded as a day and month timing in the scripture. The king of Babylon. Only person in all of scripture with a specific day and month recorded to provide the exact timing of his coming. Same king of Babylon who said "Is not this great Babylon that I have built?" Daniel 4:30

Same king of Babylon that overcame the holy people. Jeremiah 38:3, Revelation 13:7
Same king of Babylon that took into captivity Jeremiah 13:17, Revelation 13:10
Same king of Babylon that had all peoples, nations and languages given into his hand. Daniel 3:4, Revelation 13:7
Same king of Babylon that built a great image and forced worship or death. Daniel 3:5-6, Revelation 13:15
Same king of Babylon that all the world worshipped the image he set up Daniel 3:7, Revelation 13:8
2 Kings 25:1, Jeremiah 52:4, Ezekiel 24:1-2 <-This same day

So burn it into your mind. Whatever comes, no matter how pleasant to the eyes, no matter how grand, no matter if you see people and churches dancing in the streets crying "Hosanna in the Highest!" remember one thing: whatever happens on Tebet 10

2. I believe the 'catching up' occurs at the second coming. But if I'm wrong, please pray to the Lord that he leave me behind and not take me out of the great tribulation. This is because I thrive in extreme tribulation, and gain strength of faith, and extreme trial causes my faith and love of God to flourish like wildfire, and I would sure hate to miss the opportunity to increase the strength of my spirit by missing out on the greatest tribulation since the world began. I need my tribulation. I'm like a man in a gym when everyone else is too tired, too sore, and wanting to go home, I'm saying, just 100 more reps; no pain no gain; just 100 more reps, Lord; just 1000 more reps.

 

[Marilyn C]

Marilyn, if the Second coming is tied to the fall feasts - then Adar2 would be 6 months off... if the 70th week ends then.

Hi Doug,

Yes it would seem wrong, however.....the two New Years, (Religious & Political) will come together as Christ is the KingPriest upon His throne. (Zech. 6:13)

Glad you are bringing up things that look wrong. This is how we can work through this. I am still working on my answer to your other question.

Marilyn.

 

[Douggg]

Hi Doug,

Yes it would seem wrong, however.....the two New Years, (Religious & Political) will come together as Christ is the KingPriest upon His throne. (Zech. 6:13)

Glad you are bringing up things that look wrong. This is how we can work through this. I am still working on my answer to your other question.

Marilyn.

Marilyn, I think the spring new year has to with the agricultural season.

The fall new year, has to do with atonement. I could be wrong.

Personally, I think the Second Coming will coincide with the fall feasts.

The seven years, 70th week, in theory should start on the feast of tabernacles. Because that is when the confirmation of the covenant law that Moses made in Deuteronomy 31:9-13 is supposed to be done for the 7 year cycle.

 

[Marilyn C]

Hi Doug,

OK I`ll work back from 2027, actually the millennium first.

1. The Feast of Tabernacles – the Millennium. This is God`s special appointed time for when He will `dwell,` (tabernacle) with them.
   
   `…it shall come to pass that everyone who is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of host, & to keep the Feast of Tabernacles.`(Zech. 14: 16)
   
   It is associated with the agricultural cycle so as Israel would know when to celebrate it. Notice that it is the last Festival & after the Day of Atonement.
   
   It is the beginning of the Religious New Year in the month of Tishri. Now when Christ is king over the earth in the millennium, then the two New Years, - Political & Religious, come together, as Christ is the King Priest upon His throne.
   
   `He shall sit & rule on His throne; so he shall be a priest on His throne. `(Zech. 6: 13)
   
   Previously in Israel these two offies – king, & priest, were held separately & the New Years were separate, however Christ brings the two offices together & thus the two New Years. They all come together in Christ.
   
   
   
2. End of 70th week - 2027.

As I pointed out I believe Israel will start their sacrifices on the 10th of Tishri, the most holy day of the year, the Day of Atonement. This then makes the beginning (Adar) & the end, (Shebat). Thus I believe the Lord returns to deliver Israel & judge the nations at the end of Shebat.

Then we see that there are two months of Adar till the New Year, the Millennium. These are accounted for in Daniel 12 – 1,290 days & 1,335 days. The second part of the Tribulation is 1,260 days, so there are 30 & 30 & 15 days till 1,335 days.

3. The extra days – 30 & 30, Adar 1 & Adar 2.

Adar 1 -

When the Lord returns we know that He will go to the tents of Judah first, -

`The Lord will save the tents of Judah first, so that the glory of the house of David & the glory of the inhabitants of Jerusalem shall not be greater than that of Judah.`(Zech. 12: 7)

The Lord reveals Himself to the house of David & they will mourn for Him. (Zech. 12: 10)

Then we know that He will judge the nations. (Matt. 25: 31 & 31)

Adar 2 –

Then the Lord will set up His kingdom. He will appoint a regent king, - David (Jer. 30: 9) & also priests (Isa. 66: 21)

Then it is the Millennium, with the 15 days to go till the Feast of Tabernacles.

`Blessed is he who waits, & comes to the 1,335 days.`(Dan. 12: 12)

 

[rollinTHUNDER]

Marilyn, I think the spring new year has to with the agricultural season.

The fall new year, has to do with atonement. I could be wrong.

Personally, I think the Second Coming will coincide with the fall feasts.

The seven years, 70th week, in theory should start on the feast of tabernacles. Because that is when the confirmation of the covenant law that Moses made in Deuteronomy 31:9-13 is supposed to be done for the 7 year cycle.

I agree the second coming will occur during the fall feasts. Christ fulfilled the spring feasts during His first coming. The fall feasts have not yet been fulfilled, but will certainly be fulfilled upon His return.

I believe the 70th week will be confirmed and begin during the fall feasts, and it will end during the fall feasts as well. The covenant with many will be broken in the middle, during the spring feasts, bringing an end to the daily sacrifices, which will ignite the great tribulation (3.5 yrs., 42 months, & 1260 days).

 

[Marilyn C]

I agree the second coming will occur during the fall feasts. Christ fulfilled the spring feasts during His first coming. The fall feasts have not yet been fulfilled, but will certainly be fulfilled upon His return.

I believe the 70th week will be confirmed and begin during the fall feasts, and it will end during the fall feasts as well. The covenant with many will be broken in the middle, during the spring feasts, bringing an end to the daily sacrifices, which will ignite the great tribulation (3.5 yrs., 42 months, & 1260 days).

Hi rollinTHUNDER,

Great to see your smiling face here. So we think differently on this detail, but hey, we do see that the `fall feasts` are very important & play a major role in explaining what the Lord is doing.

God bless, Marilyn.

 

[Butch5]

I believe that the `catching away, ` the rapture precedes the Tribulation. Although I do not see the exact timing of this in God`s word I believe that we will know close to the time & even the month & year. I will set out my thinking in stages so you can respond, if you desire to a particular point.

1. We are NOT in darkness. I believe we will know closer to the time.
   `...you yourselves know perfectly that the Day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night,.....but you, brethren are NOT in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief. You are sons of light...` (1 Thess. 5: 1 – 5)
   
   `...exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the Day approaching.` (Heb. 10: 25)
   
   
   
2. The Day of Atonement – 10th of Tishri.

This is Israel`s most important day of the year. Thus I believe it is when they will start their sacrifices.

....I..............X.............2,300 days.......................................I.....>

.................10th Tishri................................................................>


`“ How long will the vision be, concerning the daily sacrifices & the transgression of desolation, the giving of both the sanctuary & the host to be trampled underfoot?” And he said to me, “For 2300 days; then the sanctuary shall be cleansed.”` (Dan. 8: 13 & 14)

I see that the 2,300 days includes –

• the sacrifices starting – 10th Tishri.
  
  
• the host being trampled – midway through the Tribulation.
  
  
• the sanctuary cleansed – when the Lord comes to deliver Israel.

3. The Cleansing of the Land – 7 months.

....I....220days..........X.............2,300 days.......................................I.....>

.........................10th Tishri................................................................>

220 days = 7 months & 10 days.

`For seven months the house of Israel will be burying them, in order to cleanse the land.` (Ez. 39: 12)

After the Russian Federation is dealt with by God on the mountains of Israel, then Israel will cleanse the land of bodies etc. This will take seven months. Then, I believe, they will desire to start their sacrifices to God.

`Then they will know that I am the Lord.` (Ez. 38: 23)


4. The months for the beginning & end of the tribulation.


....I......220.......X.............2,300 days.......................................I...........>

....Adar....10th Tishri........................................................Shebat.........>


Now we can place the beginning & end months on the timeline – Adar to Shebat.

Then we need to work out the year. And this is possible because of a very interesting event that happens in Israel`s calendar nearly every three years.

5. The years – of the beginning & end of the tribulation.

....I......220.......X.............2,300 days................................I......30......I.....30....I...15th .........>

....Adar....10th Tishri..............................................Shebat.....Adar 1.....Adar 2...New Year.. >


The 30, 30 & 15, are related to the 1, 290 & 1,335 days of Daniel 12: 11 & 12. (15th is the Feast of Tabernacles.)

After the month of Shebat comes the month of Adar. And every three years or so Israel has a double Adar month to come in line with its feasts & the Solar calendar. Thus there are two months of Adar before the New Year. They are called Adar 1 & Adar 2. The second Adar, (Adar 2) is the recognised month for the time of rejoicing over deliverance from their enemies.

So, we ask ourselves which years, in the future do these double months of Adar occur? According to the Jewish calendar the double Adars are in

• 2016, 2019, 2022 – all these do not give time for a 7 year tribulation.
  
  
• 2024, 2027, 2030, 2033, (etc) – my choice is 2027 (& I have more details for this, (month & day)but that would require more steps. Thus I will leave that for another thread.)

So if the end of the tribulation is, as I think, 2027 then the beginning would be 2020.

Thus I believe, the `catching away,` the rapture will be either late 2019 or early 2020.

Obviously we haven`t long to wait & see.


What are your thoughts?



Note – Israel`s months.

1. Nisan (Mar/April) 2. Iyyar (April/May) 3. Sivan (May/June) 4. Tammuz (June/July)
   
   5.Ab (July/August) 6. Elul (Aug/Sept) 7. Tishri (Sept/Oct)
   
   8.Marchesvan (Oct/Nov) 9. Kislev (Nov/Dec) 10. Tebeth (Dec/Jan) 11. Shebat (Jan/Feb)
   
   12. Adar (Feb/March)

Can you show that the rapture precedes that Tribulation? If not then it how could 2020 be the year? Also, what about the times of the Gentiles, they haven't been fulfilled yet.

 

[Marilyn C]

Can you show that the rapture precedes that Tribulation? If not then it how could 2020 be the year? Also, what about the times of the Gentiles, they haven't been fulfilled yet.

Hi Butch5,

Thank you for being in the discussion. Yes I can show that the rapture precedes the Tribulation. This would take my OP off into greater detail of God`s purposes & therefore would be best on another thread.

I was hoping that people would discuss the calculations here though.

regards, Marilyn.

 

[Butch5]

Hi Butch5,

Thank you for being in the discussion. Yes I can show that the rapture precedes the Tribulation. This would take my OP off into greater detail of God`s purposes & therefore would be best on another thread.

I was hoping that people would discuss the calculations here though.

regards, Marilyn.

Hi Marilyn,

The reason I asked is that if the rapture doesn't happen before the Tribulation then the calculations couldn't be right. You see, I don't believe that the rapture takes place until after the Tribulation so I would see your calculations as incorrect.

 

[Marilyn C]

Hi Marilyn,

The reason I asked is that if the rapture doesn't happen before the Tribulation then the calculations couldn't be right. You see, I don't believe that the rapture takes place until after the Tribulation so I would see your calculations as incorrect.

Hi Butch5,

Ok so that`s your view, however can you be more specific & show why some or all of the calculations are wrong? Note the calculations, I believe, are also for those who do not think there is a pre-trib rapture.

Marilyn.

 

[Butch5]

Hi Butch5,

Ok so that`s your view, however can you be more specific & show why some or all of the calculations are wrong? Note the calculations, I believe, are also for those who do not think there is a pre-trib rapture.

Marilyn.

Hi Marilyn,

I think you're about 16 years too soon. One reason is that the fullness of the Gentiles is not over yet. I believe Israel's second exile is 1960 years. That exile began when the Temple and Jerusalem were destroyed in 70 A.D. 1960 year from 70 A.D. is 2030, actually it comes out to about 2029 1/2. I believe this is when the Tribulation will start and God will confirm His covenant with Israel for one week (7 years). This also corresponds the 120 jubilee cycles or 6000 years.

 

[Marilyn C]

Hi Marilyn,

I think you're about 16 years too soon. One reason is that the fullness of the Gentiles is not over yet. I believe Israel's second exile is 1960 years. That exile began when the Temple and Jerusalem were destroyed in 70 A.D. 1960 year from 70 A.D. is 2030, actually it comes out to about 2029 1/2. I believe this is when the Tribulation will start and God will confirm His covenant with Israel for one week (7 years). This also corresponds the 120 jubilee cycles or 6000 years.

Hi Butch,

Thank you for your calculations. So I believe about 2020 is the start of the Trib, & you think about 2030, so we wont have long to wait to see if either are right.

regards, Marilyn.

 

[Straightshot]

[Acts 1:6-7]