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Featured The Post-Trib Rapture

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by SeraphimsCherub, Jan 2, 2017.

  1. SeraphimsCherub

    SeraphimsCherub New Member

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    We can see clearly from the Scriptures that the Rapture will occur simultaneously at

    the Resurrection when YashiYa-h our Messiah shall raise the dead bodies, His dead bodies

    of all of His children who have fallen asleep in Him from the beginning of this world unto

    the last day of "this" current world. And the very few that shall be blessed by God to be

    alive, and still remain on that last day. Where by they shall also be instantly changed,and translated into the visible presence of God.~In

    the twinkling of an eye simultaneously at the same time that all the spirit's

    (God Consiousness),and soul's (self consciousness) of all those who are coming back in

    YashiYa-h,and with YashiYa-h who are already in Heaven with Him. Both those who are

    alive, and remain, and all who are coming back in Him, and with Him from Heaven.

    Both shall receive their New spiritual bodies when they shall shall meet together in the air in Him, and so shall we ever be with the Lord

    ~ 1Co 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

    ~Col_1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

    ~Heb_11:5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.


    ~1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

    ~1Co 15:53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

    ~ 1Co 15:42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

    ~1Co
    15:43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:

    ~1Co
    15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

    ~1Co
    15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

    ~1Co
    15:46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

    ~1Co
    15:47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

    ~1Co
    15:48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

    ~1Co
    15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.


    That the 3 are absolutely divisible can be very clearly seen from these 2 Scriptures as well:
    ~ 1Th 5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

    ~Heb 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword,
    piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

    (For all the spirit's, and soul's who have been Quickend From Above,beings Made, and

    Created By The Eternal GodHead, to posses eternal everlasting Life)

    ~By The Eternal Everlasting Life oF The Spirit Who Proceeds Forth From Himself As He Is As our Eternal Abba Father YaHaWaH ~
    Through The Eternal Everlasting Life oF The Spirit Who Eternally Simultaneously Proceeds Forth From Himself As He Is As our Eternal Everlasting Ya(shi)(Ya-h) our Eternal Everlasting Messiah.

    For just as The Eternal Life oF The Spirit oF YashiYaH YaHaWaH Is Clothed With The Eternal Everlasting Immortal Spiritual Body oF YahsiYah When He Was Raised Bodily From The Dead By His Own Spirit~ By The Eternal Almighty Power oF His Very Own Spirit~ From The Eternal Almighty Power oF The Glory As He Is As our Eternal Abba Father.

    So must we also posses ,
    the eternal life of the spirit's, and souls all of His son's, and daughter's that He Has Created, Caused,and Made By Him to posses.

    ~We must also be clothed with a immortal spiritual body just like His.
    For God Is Himself A Eternal Everlasting Spirit Who Has A Eternal Everlasting Soul, Who Also Has A Eternal Everlasting Immortal Spiritual Body.

    ~Gen 6:3 And the LORD said,
    My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

    ~Lev_26:11 And I will set my tabernacle among you: and
    my soul shall not abhor you.

    ~Isa_1:14 Your new moons and your appointed feasts
    my soul hateth: they are a trouble unto me; I am weary to bear them.

    ~Isa_42:1 Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my
    soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.

    ~Jer_5:9 Shall I not visit for these things? saith the LORD: and shall not
    my soul be avenged on such a nation as this?

    ~Jer_5:29 Shall I not visit for these things? saith the LORD: shall not
    my soul be avenged on such a nation as this?

    ~Jer_6:8 Be thou instructed, O Jerusalem, lest
    my soul depart from thee; lest I make thee desolate, a land not inhabited.

    ~Jer_12:7 I have forsaken mine house, I have left mine heritage; I have given the dearly beloved of
    my soul into the hand of her enemies.

    ~Eze 18:4 Behold,
    all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.

    ~Isa_53:11 He shall see of the travail of
    his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities. Jer

    ~32:41 Yea, I will rejoice over them to do them good, and I will plant them in this land assuredly with my whole heart and with my whole soul.

    ~Zec_11:8 Three shepherds also I cut off in one month; and
    my soul lothed them, and their soul also abhorred me.

    ~Mat_12:18 Behold my servant, whom I have chosen; my beloved, in whom
    my soul is well pleased: I will put my spirit upon him, and he shall shew judgment to the Gentiles.

    ~Mat_26:38 Then saith he unto them,
    My soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death: tarry ye here, and watch with me. ~

    Joh_12:27 Now is
    my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour.

    ~Heb_10:38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back,
    my soul shall have no pleasure in him.

    ~ 1Co 15:42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

    ~1Co 15:43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:

    ~1Co
    15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

    ~1Co
    15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

    ~1Co
    15:46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

    ~1Co 15:47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

    ~1Co 15:48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

    ~1Co 15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

    ~ 1Th 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

    ~ 1Th
    4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

    ~ 1Th
    4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: (When Is The Resurrection? On The Last Day!)

    What Trumpet Blast Is It? The Last One!
    ~1Co_15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

    ~1Th
    4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. (The Rapture!)

    ~1Th 4:18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

    As YashiYa-h declares this 4 times that He shall raise the dead on/at the last day. To make it absolutely perfectly clear!

    ~Joh
    6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

    I feel really sorry for those who believe they can lose their Salvation. Be cause I am absolutely 100% certain IN my GOD, BY my GOD, THROUGH my GOD,FROM my GOD,WITH my GOD, BACK UNTO my GOD, that i can NEVER LOSE mine.

    Sorry about that, i know that this isn't a
    Soteriology But i couldn't refuse lol'

    ~ Joh
    6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

    ~Joh 6:41 The Jews then murmured at him, because he said, I am the bread which came down from heaven.
    (As so may Christians do today! Wow..There truly is nothing new under the sun)

    ~ Joh
    6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

    ~Joh
    6:54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.

    ~"From" The Power oF The Eternal AhaYah Asher AhaYah YaHaWah~
    "Through" The Eternal Power oF The Eternal YashiYah our Ha Mashiach The Messiah~

    And "By" The Eternal Power oF The Ruach Ha'Kodesh with the practically almost simultaneously, even most likely beyond that of what is Infinitely, and Eternally beyond that of what Simultaneous truly is "From" The Eternal Perspective oF The Eternal Most High YaHaWaH Elohim~ Who Is The Exact Same Self That He Himself Is~
    That He Is That He Is!~
    That He Himself Eternally Always Shall Be From Eternal Everlasting Unto Eternal Everlasting ~
    "Through" The Perspective oF The Eternal YashiYa-h Ha Mashiach our Messiah Who Is Also The Exact Same Self That He Himself Is That He Is~
    The Very Self Same He~ That He Himself Eternally Always Is~That He Eternally Always Has Been~
    That He Eternally Always Shall be From Eternal Everlasting Unto Eternal Everlasting ~ That He Is!
    "By" The Eternal Perspective oF The Ruach Ha'Kodesh
    Who Is Also The Exact Same Self That He Himself Is~ That He Is~
    The Very Self Same He~ That He Himself Eternally Always Is~That He Eternally Always Has Been~
    That He Eternally Always Shall be From Eternal Everlasting Unto Eternal Everlasting ~ That He Is!
    ~Deu 6:4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:

    ~The Eternal Perspective oF The Eternal GodHead, which we could never even come close to fathoming from our finite perspective here on earth!


    ~i pray AhaYah Asher AhaYah In The Bahasham oF YashiYa-h Ha'Mashiach i pray that You would truly richly Spiritually bless all those who take the time to read this By Ruach Ha'Kodesh In The Precious Bahasham oF YashiYah Through The Almighty Eternal Power oF His Precious Blood~ By The Almighty Eternal Power oF His Precious Ruach Ha'Kodesh i pray and ask these things. The HalleluYah Is Himself The Amen...Amen!
     
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2017
  2. ewq1938

    ewq1938 Won with the world is a loss. Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter

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    Not exactly simultaneously, Paul says the dead in Christ first, then the rapture occurs. It's almost simultaneous but technically is not. :)

     
  3. SeraphimsCherub

    SeraphimsCherub New Member

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    [QUOTE/] Not exactly simultaneously, Paul says the dead in Christ first, then the rapture occurs. It's almost simultaneous but technically is not. :) [QUOTE/]



    On the first quote I was trying to express simultaneous from God's Eternal Perspective vs. ours from our finite perspective. But I agree with you. I'm also sorry, because it probably very hard for people to follow how I write. I'm both ADD, and have tad bit of dyslexia as well lol. It's like I explain things logically from backward to forward. It's almost like I write in Hebrew in English lol.

    Blessings :)
     
  4. ewq1938

    ewq1938 Won with the world is a loss. Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter

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    No problem. It was a minor correction. I like to be as accurate as possible especially since many people actually don't know the rapture and the resurrection are two different events despite how close in time they occur within each other.
     
  5. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2017
  6. SeraphimsCherub

    SeraphimsCherub New Member

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    So do you agree with me? Not sure I follow you?
     
  7. SeraphimsCherub

    SeraphimsCherub New Member

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    So what is your personal take on when the Rapture will take place?
     
  8. ewq1938

    ewq1938 Won with the world is a loss. Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter

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    One of the biggest issues for pre-trib is they claim the rapture is first before the tribulation and second coming then after the trib the resurrection happens at the second coming but scripture says the resurrection happens before the rapture which therefore also means the second coming happens before both. All false doctrines violate the scriptures in one way or another which makes it easy to debunk:

    1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: (the second coming) and the dead in Christ shall rise first: (the resurrection of the dead in Christ)
    1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. (the rapture)

    A rapture before the second coming and before the resurrection is scripturally impossible and the second coming cannot happen until the tribulation has ended, Mat 24:29-30.

    Let's back up slightly to establish context:



    Paul is clear the rapture happens after the resurrection and the resurrection happens after the second coming. There is no pre-trib rapture in scripture.



    1Th 4:13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
    1Th 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

    Context is the second coming!

    1Th 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

    Context is the second coming!

    1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

    This is the second coming!


    1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.


    This is the rapture! The Greek word for rapture is harpazo and that's the term used by Paul!

    So, the proper order of events according to scripture:

    1. the second coming begins/Christ leaves heaven. (1Th 4:16) (this doesn't happen until the tribulation has ended, Mat_24:29)
    2. the resurrection. (dead saints resurrect bodily in heaven and follow Christ as he returns to the Earth-second coming) (1Th 4:14-16)
    3. the rapture. (living saints on Earth are gathered together from where ever they are on the Earth in order to meet Christ in the clouds when he arrives)(1Th 4:17)
    This proves the pre-trib (and mid-trib) rapture to be false because the second coming comes after the tribulation not before or during it, Mat 24:29-30


    A rapture before the tribulation is impossible according to Mat 24:29-30, and a rapture before the second coming is impossible according to 1Th 4:13-17.


    So, the proper order of events according to scripture including Mat_24:29:

    1. the great tribulation ends. (Mat_24:29)
    2. the second coming begins/Christ leaves heaven. (1Th 4:16, Mat_24:30)
    3. the resurrection. (dead saints resurrect bodily in heaven and follow Christ as he returns to the Earth-second coming) (1Th 4:14-16)
    4. the rapture. (living saints on Earth are gathered together from where ever they are on the Earth in order to meet Christ in the clouds when he arrives)(1Th 4:17)
     
  9. John Hyperspace

    John Hyperspace UnKnown ReMember

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    I believe it will occur on the last day: John 6:39-40, John 11:24. Now, that may at first seem very ambiguous, but I propose that it is not ambiguous at all; but is very specific, and only means one specific day. The words "the last day" are used 7 times in John, all describing the resurrection specifically. There is one use that gives the precise timing of the phrase: John 7:37

    When the scripture says "no man knows, but the Father" it means that "flesh and blood has not revealed this thing, but My Father": that the "natural man" cannot obtain this knowledge of himself, but that it must be revealed by the Father. The last day is a specific festival of the 7 moedim. It is the last day of the festivals, and that "Great Day": do you know when it is?

    Matthew 11:27 Do you see Jesus is saying "no man knows Who the Son is, but the Father"? Yet when Jesus asks Peter, "Who am I?" Peter replies: Matthew 16:16. Now, how did Peter know what "no man knows, but the Father"? Jesus says: Matthew 16:17. And so the apostle Paul, speaking of these things which "no man knows" writes: 1 Corinthians 2:11, 1 Corinthians 2:10
     
  10. wayfaring man

    wayfaring man Veteran

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    Been writing about this for quite a while now - A Post Trib Translation is the most clearly substantiated time frame in Scripture.

    Some of it is indeed mysterious, but the time frame is clearly indicated in relationship to the end / last day / Day of The Lord / dead in Christ rising.

    Perhaps what confuses the issue some - is the apparent provision for being hid / flown away pre-trib...but that is only for those who need not the fiery trial to yet purify their spirit and cleanse their soul. Those so blessed are still on earth and mortal, so not yet translated, as they will be if still alive on The Day of The Lord's Return.
     
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2017
  11. SeraphimsCherub

    SeraphimsCherub New Member

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    I believe that is will happen on the last day as well. But when that day shall be no man can really know that lol. If I knew that, I would probably lose my mind. Though I would hope to be of those few who are still alive and remain. None of us can even come close to fathoming the hell that they would have to go through to get to that day.

    Blessings :)
     
  12. John Hyperspace

    John Hyperspace UnKnown ReMember

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    It was the last day of the Festival of Tabernacles on which Jesus stood and cried. The "last day" also appear once in the OT: Nehemiah 8:17-18 which is always connected to the finishing of the temple as at the first: 2 Chronicles 7:8-10, 2 Chronicles 7:11

    I'm sure it will be as a furnace of sevenfold fire: Daniel 3:19. But the good news: Daniel 3:24-26
     
  13. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2017
  14. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
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  15. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
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  16. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2017
  17. ewq1938

    ewq1938 Won with the world is a loss. Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter

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    Not according to scripture. No angel is even given a trump until the 7th seal has been opened. How exactly can the 7th trump sound when the 7th angel has no trumpet?
     
  18. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm.
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2017
  19. Revealing Times

    Revealing Times Well-Known Member

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    Rapture............We MARRY Jesus in Heaven........We return with Jesus IMMEDIATELY AFTER the Tribulation.........That is the Second Coming.
     
  20. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2017