The original Hebrews and even Jesus were dark skinned?

weariedsoul

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Actually, the racial divisions I gave are scientifically devised, and not based on scripture. Scripture does not mention races but rather ethnic groups based on linage. Hebrews, consisting of 12 tribes has a wide range of coloring, facial features etc and which doesn't follow along scientificied racial divides or the more grossly defined division by skin color which holds no scriptural or scientific backing. The division I gave is based on bone structure, as skin coloration as the division of races is not accurate but based more on human observation which misses more important factors. In otherwords, to define people by easily observed skin color just doesn't hold up and is based on more prejudices then anything else. There are tribes on multiple continents which are caucasoids with black skin color from pigmentation. Many Africans fall into two different bone structures which means two standard different races: Congoid and Capoid. Although some Africans groups are Caucasoid.

You're right that things like bone structure and hair can be indicators. And Skin color alone cannot determine race. I stand corrected on that particular thing. But skin color is important in determining race. Other factors must also be considered though.
 
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Gxg (G²)

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One more thing, i see that a few of these people you have posted above have very dark skin and appear to be from India possibly, but i can clearly see that they are not fully African, although its possible they may share some African descendants but not necessarily. How did my method work out? Are they from india? The hair was what i based my opinion on, not the clothing
They're from India, Bruh. Not remotely related to being "Possibly" for anyone who has either worked there or studied the issue. And scientists have already noted where dark skin there has nothing to do with being of African descent, just as getting darker/tanning for whites has nothing to do with being African. It's all a matter of climate.

You know the truth is found in what both of us say. What i say is not ignorance, its just logic and reasoning. Likewise what you say it also true and based on Logic and reasoning, but if you cannot admit that what im saying is true then political correctness has blinded your judgment, on this particular matter.
There's no truth in anything you've noted thus far at a host of points, science being one of the most basic. It's largely cultural stereotypes you've offered thus far and other scientists have long noted it. Thus, so long as you do so, it'll be noted for what it is...which is a lack of real/credible reasoning that no one in the world of science even agrees with. What you've been noting is also generally something that's seen in many that've often struggled with differing levels/forms of prejudice when it comes to having ideologies on skin color that have no basis in reality...and the scriptures have never supported that.

Again, it is what it is.
 
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weariedsoul

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Easy G (G²);61586397 said:
They're from India, Bruh. Not remotely related to being "Possibly" for anyone who has either worked there or studied the issue. And scientists have already noted where dark skin there has nothing to do with being of African descent, just as getting darker/tanning for whites has nothing to do with being African. It's all a matter of climate.

Yes, but we are getting away from my point here. And that is that is, most times you can look at a person and see who their descendants were.
 
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Gxg (G²)

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The five primary races are the Caucasoid, Mongoloid, Australoid, Congoid, and the Capoid.

The Causasoid has a wide range of skin color from very very light (white) to a very very dark pigmentation (black).
Thanks for pointing that out, sis...as that's a common fact that many people are often unware of when having their ideology based more so on cultural preference rather than objective fact. From what many whites have often said of those in their camp, a lot of people just don't want to admit that dark skin is not an African trait solely due to racial issues/prejudices----with the claim of "I'm not racist to say that whites can't have dark skin!!!!" being a smoke screen when it comes to ignoring the facts. Talked to one of my white peers not too long ago, as she grew up in the Deep South, and she noted how often there were battles for other whites to reconcile the fact that other whites had dark complexion---for in their mind, it was something they really didn't want to deal with and it was easier to think that they could label others based soley on their coloration rather than being challenged to study.

Had similar happen when it came to the church I grew up in. It was a multi-cultural church, where the goak was the goal was to have every tribe and tongue and nation all together worshipping the Lord---and reaching all groups around them if it's within their power...and I'm glad to have been apart of that growing up. At the church I grew up in, known as Liberty Church of Marietta, under Pastor John Ficthner, they literally had to FIGHT FOR BEING MULTI-CULTURAL (and this from a white pastor whose congregation was predominately white and HALF LEFT when he started preaching about practicing racial reconcilliation rather than merely theorizing/preaching about it). It was amazing when he, as a white man, discussed what many scientists noted in regards to pigmentation and suggesting that Adam was probably the darkest man on the planet since lighter colors come from darker ones getting lighter over time----and it was wild with him noting that all people are rooted in Africa originally.

It truly blessed my mother and I since we had never seen a church truly like that to that degree back in the late 90's.....and it's something that has always been dear to my heart. On the series my mother and I first heard from our pastor called "Racial Reconcilliation":



It's interesting to consider others who often stereotype based on looks alone since it does have a lot of impact abroad. I'm reminded of the issue of the presidency and how many continually sworn that the president really wasn't black because he didn't look "dark enough"--which was sheer foolishness, IMHO. I think I've mentioned it you before...but one of the Messianic Jewish groups I love listening to----called Hazakim--spoke in-depth on the issue regarding how they were mixed and felt that many of the terms for "black" and "white" were often pitted against one another in ways that seem arbitrary at times...and discussing the discussions within Judaism as it concerns ethnic identity and acknowledging things in one's genes regardless of where they come from. For more, one can go online to their blog and investigate the article entitled A Multi-Cultural Perspective About "Race" in America And The Presidential Race in America....and for more about them, one can go online/hear their story at their Record Label of "Lamp Mode", as seen in Lamp Mode Recordings » Hazakim Interview.

As they themselves come from a mixed background, I was glad Hazakim mentioned what they did when it came to debate about whether the President was "Black" or "White" and how that reflects battles others go through daily....and on the larger issue, I'm glad they noted the reality of how you cannot always tell what someone is or where they descend from based SOLELY on how they appear or how they look alone :)

One can see that plainly when seeing a lot of the battles others have because people rely solely on judging by looks rather than understanding diversity. Some say someone's Hispanic because they have light-skin...even though there are PLENTY of Hispanics who are Dark-Skinned. People don't know how cultures can intersect....and that goes for a myriad of things, such as being Afro-Hispanic orAfro-Latin American ....and being Afro-Latino myself, I've often had many battles in seeking to explain things to people who had no idea of the variations. The same as it concerns those who are black and yet they're Afro-Asians (i.e. Asian-African or Asian-African AMerican mix).

I've experienced it many times when other black associates would often ask me what my ethnic background was---and when I told them that my mother was Hispanic and I was mixed, they'd sometimes look at me and say "Stop denying that you're BLACK!!!!!". The reason they would do this is because in their minds, they only had ONE interpretation of what it meant to be Hispanic or "Spanish. ANd not surprisingly, they went SOLEY by looks alone. Those within my own family would always have to clarify to others where we stood when it came to having to make clear that "Spanish" didn't mean looking like others from the Spanish channels (i.e. having white/light skin and olive hair, etc). It would simply floor some of my associates that being dark-skinned could ever be apart of anything Spanish or Hispanic.

The same thing goes for other groups as well who don't fit the stereotype, like saying all Jamaicans are dark-skinned and yet ignoring the variety even present there :)

'I AM A JAMAICAN!!'

Forgotten Faces of Jamaica Trailer/ white Jamaicans Asian Jamaicans

For other places to consider, some good sources to go for more info would be sources such the PBS Series by Louis Gates entitled "Black in Latin America" and Review of Part 1 of PBS' “Black in Latin America” – Haiti
 
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weariedsoul

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Easy G (G²);61586414 said:
with the claim of "I'm not racist to say that whites can't have dark skin!!!!" being a smoke screen when it comes to ignoring the facts

Im not racist and i admitted that dark skin comes from other places than Africa, but not from the peoples who are called white. You are calling me a racist for that? If so then political correctness has clouded your judgment. And i use more than skin color to determine a persons race. And i realize that a person can have descendants from multiple races. You seem to be caught up on race more than I do bro, i dont care what color anyone is.
 
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Gxg (G²)

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.. the racial divisions I gave are scientifically devised, and not based on scripture. Scripture does not mention races but rather ethnic groups based on linage. Hebrews, consisting of 12 tribes has a wide range of coloring, facial features etc and which doesn't follow along scientificied racial divides or the more grossly defined division by skin color which holds no scriptural or scientific backing. The division I gave is based on bone structure, as skin coloration as the division of races is not accurate but based more on human observation which misses more important factors. In otherwords, to define people by easily observed skin color just doesn't hold up and is based on more prejudices then anything else. There are tribes on multiple continents which are caucasoids with black skin color from pigmentation. Many Africans fall into two different bone structures which means two standard different races: Congoid and Capoid. Although some Africans groups are Caucasoid.
Indeed. The same thing has occurred in many places where there were discussions on culture and many people had no idea that their definitions just didn't fit the real world. Many have noted it to be a lazy stance that others took when saying "Well, you can tell by the skin color that someone's white or black!!!" and yet not choosing to be aware of how many cultures have long had differing skin colors and cannot be categorized as if all blacks look the same or all whites look the same----or even think that those categories are uniform since there's more beyond that.


Technically, there's only ONE race...the Human race...but within that, there are many differing variations within ethnicity (ethnic groups). And the Jewish ethnic group has been mixed with so many others....and expressing so many differing cultural aspects. Even within this, having differing cultural expressions has caused battles amongst those doing outreach to Jewish camps/groups since there are many Jewish camps are vastly different.



On the subject of race, there were excellent documentaries on PBS that really spoke on the subject..
In scripture, God never mentioned race. He did recognize what I call ethnicity, or people descended from a common ancestor. And yet within that came all types of variations of skin coloration/facial features...and many of them shared across cultures, be it European cultures that have dark skin types or African cultures with light skin types and many others. The same as it concerns Jewish culture---and hence, as the OP focus on, there needs to be more cultural intelligence promoted when it comes to understanding the sheer level of diversity present in our world.:)

Obviously it doesn't matter what color the Lord was since what matters is that his blood is red and He died for ALL the world---and yet it isn't a small matter when it comes to giving inaccurate views/perspectives on what the ethnic picture of various groups looks like if we're to truly be honorable toward others. For we're called to be people of truth and we as believers must ensure that our definitions and portrayals of others are based on what is true rather than stereotypes that are not.

Thanks again for bringing clarity and truth to the situation:thumbsup::)
 
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weariedsoul

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I think this thread is edifying. It shows the differences in people, gaining understanding of how others think helps us. And i am aware that i dont know anyone here and so im not judging anyone, i think we all just struggle to get along in this world and to understand things. And we come from different backgrounds and experiences so its natural to have different perspectives.
 
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GuardianShua

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Well, I for one don't believe in interracial friendships, to be sure.
I mean, how could one ever have a conversation with a bear, or a pig? Seriously, though!
We should stick to our own race, THE HUMAN RACE.

Hmph.
:confused: Which race is the "Human Race?" We do not have any aliens here from another planet.
 
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yedida

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:confused: Which race is the "Human Race?" We do not have any aliens here from another planet.

That's what you think!!
(Somehow this got thru. At least the argument seems to be over. Maybe this thread can go somewhere now..??)
 
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Gxg (G²)

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We do not have any aliens here from another planet.
You never know...

Personally, of course, I'd think that people would even trip on that.

But in the event that they did exist and showed up, I don't think we'd be any different with them than we are with one another here on Earth. Other movies in Sci-Fi have sought to bring out the point, such as District 9 when it showed aliens landing in South Africa and being violently mistreated by people (akin to racism) even when they were peaceful/refugees.....or Avatar , where humans went to another planet and began to steal resources from the native population while calling the natives "blue monkeys/savages" due to their culture....and the main hero of the story actually fell in love with one. The "John Carter of Mars" novel series that precedded much of what's seen in Sci-Fi also spoke on the issue when the main hero (John Carter) fell in love with a beautiful Red-Skinned Martian.....something many often pondered on when it came to the concept of relationships :)

JohnCarter_LCollins_TKitsch.jpg


john-carter-1.jpg




If I ever met someone who was red-skinned like the girl from John Carter...or someone who had green skin, that'd be amazing. Green skin is really interesting to me and I've always found it attractive (even in humans who've also had the same in real life). And as crazy as it may sound, yes, there are really green-skinned people:


.%2Fphotos%2Funcategorized%2Fapril27_2003jhjh.jpg

For more:​

As one person said best:​

"I know this may be strange, but green skin is actually hereditary. I've had it my whole life. My heritage is half Ukrainian and thats where the green comes from. hundreds of years ago the ukrainians were thought to be a mix of the italians and russians. the white mixed with the tan green skin (olive) turned out to be a 'white' skin tone that displayed a hint of green in it. Most people don't know this becuase the Ukrainians arn't a manority group that can be studied. In fact there are hardly any Ukrainians in Ukraine. Sure there are those who claim to be Ukrainian, but they are just residents or Russians. I didnt even notice it until I looked at a picture with a group of my friends in it and saw I looked green next to their 'white' skin. It was even more amusing after realizing how strong the genetics where when saw that my new nephew, who was only a quarter Ukrainian, turned out to carry the green skin too next to his 'white' mother."

Some of the issue comes down to hereditary issues of dark skin discoloration. There are others with potential to turn to darker colors of green/blue depending on their exposure to certain elements. Its based on the condition known as argyria ..and when it came to medicines back in the day utilizing silver treatments, there were more common accounts of skin discoloration. In some communities, there were examinations of others who were of darker skin if they used home-remidies...

One man in real life ended up having Blue Skin..and CNN just had a video awhile ago on the man:


Interestingly enough, for many, seeing films within Sci-Fi where people are differing colors (primarily aliens or even alien hybrids, as often seen in Startrek) actually prepared them to not freak out at seeing people with the skin colors they had.....and demonize them because it looked different than the norm. :) One of the reasons Startrek became so successful was because it showed so many things could be possible than what others were used to (or ready to accept).....​
 
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xDenax

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however im not sure where Jamaica is, i think its an island somewhere and i know they too are very dark skinned.

Much of the Jamaican population is made up of the decedents of African slaves who were brought there in the 1600, 1700 and 1800's. A quick search would show you the location of this island.

I always find this topic strange. What difference does it make what color the skin of the Israelites 3000 years ago? Do we all look like our ancestors from 3000 years ago? I'd say no! Even today, within one family we can have various colors of skin. My own family ranges from super pale to as dark as a Middle Eastern. That's just a couple generations. Variation in skin tone for Jews should be expected. It doesn't make sense to insist we be any certain shade. Africans come in many shades. Indians come in many shades. Mexicans come in many shades. Italians come in many shades. Jews come in many shades. So on and so forth. Who cares? It's irrelevant. I wonder if people who start these posts have any basic understanding of genetics?
 
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yedida

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Much of the Jamaican population is made up of the decedents of African slaves who were brought there in the 1600, 1700 and 1800's. A quick search would show you the location of this island.

I always find this topic strange. What difference does it make what color the skin of the Israelites 3000 years ago? Do we all look like our ancestors from 3000 years ago? I'd say no! Even today, within one family we can have various colors of skin. My own family ranges from super pale to as dark as a Middle Eastern. That's just a couple generations. Variation in skin tone for Jews should be expected. It doesn't make sense to insist we be any certain shade. Africans come in many shades. Indians come in many shades. Mexicans come in many shades. Italians come in many shades. Jews come in many shades. So on and so forth. Who cares? It's irrelevant. I wonder if people who start these posts have any basic understanding of genetics?

I doubt this OP does. It seems he had an agenda which, hopefully, looks like it went nowhere. He seems to have moved on to somewhere else.
 
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sevengreenbeans

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Easy G (G²);61586414 said:
It was amazing when he, as a white man, discussed what many scientists noted in regards to pigmentation and suggesting that Adam was probably the darkest man on the planet since lighter colors come from darker ones getting lighter over time----and it was wild with him noting that all people are rooted in Africa originally.

Interesting thought... the more melanin a person has, the more protection from the sun.
 
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yedida

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Interesting thought... the more melanin a person has, the more protection from the sun.

It didn't seem to be that way with my daughter. I'm extremely light skinned, her father is a very dark man of color - she got the best of both worlds! but she would burn just as badly as me, she just didn't turn lobster red!! And her dad also burns out in the sun, but he doesn't get red either, just darker. But they both would go through the same discomfort as when I burn.....
 
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sevengreenbeans

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It didn't seem to be that way with my daughter. I'm extremely light skinned, her father is a very dark man of color - she got the best of both worlds! but she would burn just as badly as me, she just didn't turn lobster red!! And her dad also burns out in the sun, but he doesn't get red either, just darker. But they both would go through the same discomfort as when I burn.....


To clarify... I meant protection from the harmful effects of the sun...

(From wikipedia... "The photochemical properties of melanin make it an excellent photoprotectant. This is because it efficiently absorbs harmful UV-radiation (ultraviolet) and transforms the energy into harmless heat. This occurs by means of a process called "ultrafast internal conversion". This property enables melanin to dissipate more than 99.9% of the absorbed UV radiation as heat (see photoprotection). This prevents the indirect DNA damage that is responsible for the formation of malignant melanoma and other skin cancers.")
 
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