The New Covenant

[Icyspark]

Let's take a look at the new covenant.

The promise of a new covenant is made in Jeremiah 31:31-34. Before the author of Hebrews quotes Jeremiah, he first details why there was a need for a new covenant in the first place (see vs 6-8):

Hebrews 8:6-13
6 But in fact the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which he is mediator is superior to the old one, since the new covenant is established on better promises.

7 For if there had been nothing wrong with that first covenant, no place would have been sought for another. 8 But God found fault with the people and said:
“The days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and with the people of Judah.

9 It will not be like the covenant I made with their ancestors when I took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt, because they did not remain faithful to my covenant, and I turned away from them, declares the Lord.

10 This is the covenant I will establish with the people of Israel after that time, declares the Lord. I will put my laws in their minds and write them on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.

11 No longer will they teach their neighbor, or say to one another, ‘Know the Lord,’ because they will all know me, from the least of them to the greatest.

12 For I will forgive their wickedness and will remember their sins no more.”

13 By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear.In the above passage I've highlighted (and color coded) some of the aspects of this prophecy which are relevant to drawing a correct conclusion about the new covenant. Let's go through the prophecy one verse at a time.​

Verse 6
The author notes that the new covenant is superior to the old one. Why does he tell us this? Because he says that this new covenant is "established on better promises."

Ok, stop. Now, ask yourself a couple things. Does the God of the Bible ever make anything less than perfect promises? Can a perfect God make anything less than a perfect promise?

Verse 7
This verse also notes the fact that there was something "wrong with that first covenant," such that there was a need to establish a new one.

Verse 8
After taking into account what verse 6 said about "better promises," it is pretty easy to understand what verse 8 is saying. It tells us where the imperfect promises came from: "God found fault with the people."

What do you suppose these faulty promises were?

Exodus 19:8
The people all responded together, “We will do everything the Lord has said.” So Moses brought their answer back to the Lord.

Exodus 24:3
When Moses went and told the people all the Lord’s words and laws, they responded with one voice, “Everything the Lord has said we will do.”​

You may be wondering, "Are the people's promises to obey really the faulty promises to which the author of Hebrews was speaking? Let's just bypass the rest of verse 8 for a moment and look at verse 9. The LORD says the people "did not remain faithful to my covenant." Basically, the LORD provided a perfect set of laws for His chosen people. The people responded together, saying, "We will do everything the LORD has said." And later, in Exodus 24, "Everything the LORD has said we will do." But they didn't do what they promised to do. Thus, God found fault with them.

Please note, the LORD did not find fault with His perfect laws which were the foundation of the agreement between Himself and the people. The text is clear: "God found fault with the people."

Let's look at another aspect of what verse 8 tells us. It records the LORD as stating who the new covenant is for. "I will make a new covenant with the people of ISRAEL and with the people of JUDAH." This new covenant is ONLY with Israel and Judah. Gentiles are not mentioned as part of this covenant.

Verse 9 says this covenant will be different from the one the LORD made with those He lead out of Egypt. Why? Again, "because they did not remain faithful to my covenant."

Verse 10
This verse echoes verse 8 in saying that the new covenant will be "with the people of Israel." No Gentiles mentioned here either. But then we come to an interesting point about this new covenant. The LORD says He is going to put His laws in the minds of His people and write them on their hearts. Consider again that the LORD is perfect and the laws He gave to the Israelites were likewise perfect. So why would you suppose that His perfect laws could get any more perfect than what they were to begin with? Why would the LORD need to compose a new set of laws to write on the hearts of His people?

The new covenant, I believe, is merely taking the faulty promises of the people out of the equation. It is no longer having laws written on stone tablets and having the people promise to keep them. Instead the LORD promises to write His laws on the fleshy tablets of human hearts. It is no longer "we will do." Now it is allowing the Spirit to live within us to do the law which He has written on our hearts. The law is internalized for those who truly love the LORD.

Romans 8:13
For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live.​

I pray this helps.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

 

[Guojing]

Let's take a look at the new covenant.

The promise of a new covenant is made in Jeremiah 31:31-34. Before the author of Hebrews quotes Jeremiah, he first details why there was a need for a new covenant in the first place (see vs 6-8):

Hebrews 8:6-13
6 But in fact the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which he is mediator is superior to the old one, since the new covenant is established on better promises.

7 For if there had been nothing wrong with that first covenant, no place would have been sought for another. 8 But God found fault with the people and said:
“The days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and with the people of Judah.

9 It will not be like the covenant I made with their ancestors when I took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt, because they did not remain faithful to my covenant, and I turned away from them, declares the Lord.

10 This is the covenant I will establish with the people of Israel after that time, declares the Lord. I will put my laws in their minds and write them on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.

11 No longer will they teach their neighbor, or say to one another, ‘Know the Lord,’ because they will all know me, from the least of them to the greatest.

12 For I will forgive their wickedness and will remember their sins no more.”

13 By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear.In the above passage I've highlighted (and color coded) some of the aspects of this prophecy which are relevant to drawing a correct conclusion about the new covenant. Let's go through the prophecy one verse at a time.​

Verse 6
The author notes that the new covenant is superior to the old one. Why does he tell us this? Because he says that this new covenant is "established on better promises."

Ok, stop. Now, ask yourself a couple things. Does the God of the Bible ever make anything less than perfect promises? Can a perfect God make anything less than a perfect promise?

Verse 7
This verse also notes the fact that there was something "wrong with that first covenant," such that there was a need to establish a new one.

Verse 8
After taking into account what verse 6 said about "better promises," it is pretty easy to understand what verse 8 is saying. It tells us where the imperfect promises came from: "God found fault with the people."

What do you suppose these faulty promises were?

Exodus 19:8
The people all responded together, “We will do everything the Lord has said.” So Moses brought their answer back to the Lord.

Exodus 24:3
When Moses went and told the people all the Lord’s words and laws, they responded with one voice, “Everything the Lord has said we will do.”​

You may be wondering, "Are the people's promises to obey really the faulty promises to which the author of Hebrews was speaking? Let's just bypass the rest of verse 8 for a moment and look at verse 9. The LORD says the people "did not remain faithful to my covenant." Basically, the LORD provided a perfect set of laws for His chosen people. The people responded together, saying, "We will do everything the LORD has said." And later, in Exodus 24, "Everything the LORD has said we will do." But they didn't do what they promised to do. Thus, God found fault with them.

Please note, the LORD did not find fault with His perfect laws which were the foundation of the agreement between Himself and the people. The text is clear: "God found fault with the people."

Let's look at another aspect of what verse 8 tells us. It records the LORD as stating who the new covenant is for. "I will make a new covenant with the people of ISRAEL and with the people of JUDAH." This new covenant is ONLY with Israel and Judah. Gentiles are not mentioned as part of this covenant.

Verse 9 says this covenant will be different from the one the LORD made with those He lead out of Egypt. Why? Again, "because they did not remain faithful to my covenant."

Verse 10
This verse echoes verse 8 in saying that the new covenant will be "with the people of Israel." No Gentiles mentioned here either. But then we come to an interesting point about this new covenant. The LORD says He is going to put His laws in the minds of His people and write them on their hearts. Consider again that the LORD is perfect and the laws He gave to the Israelites were likewise perfect. So why would you suppose that His perfect laws could get any more perfect than what they were to begin with? Why would the LORD need to compose a new set of laws to write on the hearts of His people?

The new covenant, I believe, is merely taking the faulty promises of the people out of the equation. It is no longer having laws written on stone tablets and having the people promise to keep them. Instead the LORD promises to write His laws on the fleshy tablets of human hearts. It is no longer "we will do." Now it is allowing the Spirit to live within us to do the law which He has written on our hearts. The law is internalized for those who truly love the LORD.

Romans 8:13
For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live.​

I pray this helps.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

Interesting that you took care to note, twice, that the New Covenant was only meant for Israel and not us gentiles.

So the question people will ask is, are we gentiles in the Body of Christ under the New Covenant too? Why and why not?

 

[ewq1938]

Verse 6
The author notes that the new covenant is superior to the old one. Why does he tell us this? Because he says that this new covenant is "established on better promises."

Ok, stop. Now, ask yourself a couple things. Does the God of the Bible ever make anything less than perfect promises? Can a perfect God make anything less than a perfect promise?

Obviously, yes. A perfect God can create imperfect things such as a covenant and human beings which are very imperfect. Even an arch angel fell away from God and God made him also.

 

[Icyspark]

Interesting that you took care to note, twice, that the New Covenant was only meant for Israel and not us gentiles.

So the question people will ask is, are we gentiles in the Body of Christ under the New Covenant too? Why and why not?

Hi Guojing,

That's a great question and I was hoping someone would ask it Let's look at what Paul says about ingrafted branches:

Romans 11:11-24
11 Again I ask: Did [Israel] stumble so as to fall beyond recovery? Not at all! Rather, because of their transgression, salvation has come to the Gentiles to make Israel envious. 12 But if their transgression means riches for the world, and their loss means riches for the Gentiles, how much greater riches will their full inclusion bring!

13 I am talking to you Gentiles. Inasmuch as I am the apostle to the Gentiles, I take pride in my ministry 14 in the hope that I may somehow arouse my own people to envy and save some of them. 15 For if their rejection brought reconciliation to the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead? 16 If the part of the dough offered as firstfruits is holy, then the whole batch is holy; if the root is holy, so are the branches.

17 If some of the branches have been broken off, and you, though a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others and now share in the nourishing sap from the olive root, 18 do not consider yourself to be superior to those other branches. If you do, consider this: You do not support the root, but the root supports you. 19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I could be grafted in.” 20 Granted. But they were broken off because of unbelief, and you stand by faith. Do not be arrogant, but tremble. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, he will not spare you either.

22 Consider therefore the kindness and sternness of God: sternness to those who fell, but kindness to you, provided that you continue in his kindness. Otherwise, you also will be cut off. 23 And if they do not persist in unbelief, they will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again. 24 After all, if you were cut out of an olive tree that is wild by nature, and contrary to nature were grafted into a cultivated olive tree, how much more readily will these, the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree!​

Gentiles become part of Israel's "olive tree" by being grafted in. According to verse 24 the tree belongs to Israel. Gentiles become part of Israel's "olive tree" by being grafted in. Once grafted into Israel's tree they become partakers of the new covenant.

I pray this helps.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

 

[Icyspark]

Obviously, yes. A perfect God can create imperfect things such as a covenant and human beings which are very imperfect. Even an arch angel fell away from God and God made him also.

Hi ewq1938,

I respectfully disagree. God didn't create anything less than perfect. Adam and Eve were perfect until they put their free will to use in choosing to transgress God's command that they not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. God didn't do that. He allowed them freedom of choice.

This is the same thing that happened with Lucifer. God created nothing but a perfect being. Speaking of Lucifer, Ezekiel writes, "You were the anointed cherub who covers; I established you; You were on the holy mountain of God; You walked back and forth in the midst of fiery stones. You were perfect in your ways from the day you were created, till iniquity was found in you."

If you read the opening post you'd also realize that embedded in the Hebrews 8 discussion of the new covenant is the acknowledgment that the fault was with the people (as in "God found fault with the people), so why would you seek to reframe this sin-ario to place any fault on God?

I pray this helps.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

 

[ewq1938]

Hi ewq1938,

I respectfully disagree. God didn't create anything less than perfect.

I believe the examples I gave show that the creations were not fully perfect else they wouldn't have rebelled against God. If the first covenant was perfect, it wouldn't have to be replaced with one built upon better promises.

"You were perfect in your ways from the day you were created, till iniquity was found in you."

This does not say Lucifer was created perfect but he was perfect in his ways or behavior until a certain time.

 

[Guojing]

Hi Guojing,

That's a great question and I was hoping someone would ask it Let's look at what Paul says about ingrafted branches:

Romans 11:11-24
11 Again I ask: Did [Israel] stumble so as to fall beyond recovery? Not at all! Rather, because of their transgression, salvation has come to the Gentiles to make Israel envious. 12 But if their transgression means riches for the world, and their loss means riches for the Gentiles, how much greater riches will their full inclusion bring!

13 I am talking to you Gentiles. Inasmuch as I am the apostle to the Gentiles, I take pride in my ministry 14 in the hope that I may somehow arouse my own people to envy and save some of them. 15 For if their rejection brought reconciliation to the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead? 16 If the part of the dough offered as firstfruits is holy, then the whole batch is holy; if the root is holy, so are the branches.

17 If some of the branches have been broken off, and you, though a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others and now share in the nourishing sap from the olive root, 18 do not consider yourself to be superior to those other branches. If you do, consider this: You do not support the root, but the root supports you. 19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I could be grafted in.” 20 Granted. But they were broken off because of unbelief, and you stand by faith. Do not be arrogant, but tremble. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, he will not spare you either.

22 Consider therefore the kindness and sternness of God: sternness to those who fell, but kindness to you, provided that you continue in his kindness. Otherwise, you also will be cut off. 23 And if they do not persist in unbelief, they will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again. 24 After all, if you were cut out of an olive tree that is wild by nature, and contrary to nature were grafted into a cultivated olive tree, how much more readily will these, the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree!​

Gentiles become part of Israel's "olive tree" by being grafted in. According to verse 24 the tree belongs to Israel. Gentiles become part of Israel's "olive tree" by being grafted in. Once grafted into Israel's tree they become partakers of the new covenant.

I pray this helps.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

I see, so you follow the Covenant Theology doctrine of "Fulfillment Theology".

What are some misconceptions about covenant theology? | Reformed Theological Seminary

Thanks for sharing.

 

[Icyspark]

I believe the examples I gave show that the creations were not fully perfect else they wouldn't have rebelled against God. If the first covenant was perfect, it wouldn't have to be replaced with one built upon better promises.

"You were perfect in your ways from the day you were created, till iniquity was found in you."

This does not say Lucifer was created perfect but he was perfect in his ways or behavior until a certain time.

Hi ewq1938,

At this point I suppose we need to discuss your view of God since our views are apparently at odds. Let me just ask some clarifying questions:

1. Do you believe in the God of the Bible?
2. Do you believe that the God of the Bible is omniscient; omnipresent; omnipotent?
3. Do you believe that the God of the Bible is infallible?
4. Do you believe that the Bible is the word of God?
5. Do you believe that the Bible is the infallible word of God?
6. Do you agree with David that the law of God makes mistakes?
7. Do you believe that God is ultimately responsible for creating evil?

God bless.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

 

[Icyspark]

I see, so you follow the Covenant Theology doctrine of "Fulfillment Theology".

What are some misconceptions about covenant theology? | Reformed Theological Seminary

Thanks for sharing.

Hi Guojing,

If by "Covenant Theology" you mean the belief that the Church has replaced Israel in terms of God's calling? From the text I just supplied I don't know that I'd read that into what Paul had to say about Gentiles being grafted into Israel's tree. The tree still belongs to Israel and not all the natural branches are "broken off" and replaced by Gentile branches. Those Jews who believe in Jesus remain attached to "their own olive tree."

Why do you think there was a need for a new covenant? What does the Bible say?

God bless.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

 

[BobRyan]

Interesting that you took care to note, twice, that the New Covenant was only meant for Israel and not us gentiles.

So the question people will ask is, are we gentiles in the Body of Christ under the New Covenant too? Why and why not?

Some people do not claim to be New Covenant Christians - but most of us do claim that we are New Covenant Christians.

As you note God says in Heb 8 and in Jer 31 it is for the House of Israel".

Rom 2 says this -
26 So if the uncircumcised man keeps the requirements of the Law, will his uncircumcision not be regarded as circumcision? 27 And he who is physically uncircumcised, if he keeps the Law, will he not judge you who though having the letter of the Law and circumcision are a violator of the Law? 28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh. 29 But he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter; and his praise is not from people, but from God.

Rom 9 says this -
6 But it is not as though the word of God has failed. For they are not all Israel who are descended from Israel; 7 nor are they all children because they are Abraham’s descendants, but: “through Isaac your descendants shall be named.” 8 That is, it is not the children of the flesh who are children of God, but the children of the promise are regarded as descendants.

1 Peter 2 says this -
7 This precious value, then, is for you who believe; but for unbelievers,
“A stone which the builders rejected,
This became the chief cornerstone,”
8 and,
“A stone of stumbling and a rock of offense”;

for they stumble because they are disobedient to the word, and to this they were also appointed.
9 But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for God’s own possession, so that you may proclaim the excellencies of Him who has called you out of darkness into His marvelous light; 10 for you once were not a people, but now you are the people of God; you had not received mercy, but now you have received mercy.

 

[Guojing]

Hi Guojing,

If by "Covenant Theology" you mean the belief that the Church has replaced Israel in terms of God's calling? From the text I just supplied I don't know that I'd read that into what Paul had to say about Gentiles being grafted into Israel's tree. The tree still belongs to Israel and not all the natural branches are "broken off" and replaced by Gentile branches. Those Jews who believe in Jesus remain attached to "their own olive tree."

Why do you think there was a need for a new covenant? What does the Bible say?

God bless.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

Notice I used the term fulfillment, rather than replacement?

I even provided an explanation link

 

[Icyspark]

Notice I used the term fulfillment, rather than replacement?

I even provided an explanation link

Hi Guojing,

Yes, icy that you did.

This from the link you provided:

Oftentimes you’ll hear people say, “Covenant theology is replacement theology because it says that Israel was replaced by the church.” Well, that’s not an accurate depiction of covenant theology. Covenant theology isn’t replacement theology, it’s fulfillment theology. There’s promise and fulfillment. The promises of God to Israel are fulfilled in both the Jews and the Gentiles being part of the one people of God in the purposes of God’s redemption.​

I may be wrong, but this sounds like it encapsulates what I said in my previous post. My caveat would be that the Gentiles have to be added in to Israel's tree.

God bless.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

 

[Guojing]

Hi Guojing,

Yes, icy that you did.

This from the link you provided:

Oftentimes you’ll hear people say, “Covenant theology is replacement theology because it says that Israel was replaced by the church.” Well, that’s not an accurate depiction of covenant theology. Covenant theology isn’t replacement theology, it’s fulfillment theology. There’s promise and fulfillment. The promises of God to Israel are fulfilled in both the Jews and the Gentiles being part of the one people of God in the purposes of God’s redemption.​

I may be wrong, but this sounds like it encapsulates what I said in my previous post. My caveat would be that the Gentiles have to be added in to Israel's tree.

God bless.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

I understand that the term "replacement theology" tend to be a non-PC term, so the covenant theologians that I have encountered in this forum prefer to use the term "fulfillment theology" instead.

For me, I distinguish between the Body of Christ, and the nation Israel, but I certainly can understand where you guys are coming from.

 

[Soyeong]

Let's take a look at the new covenant.

The promise of a new covenant is made in Jeremiah 31:31-34. Before the author of Hebrews quotes Jeremiah, he first details why there was a need for a new covenant in the first place (see vs 6-8):

Hebrews 8:6-13
6 But in fact the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which he is mediator is superior to the old one, since the new covenant is established on better promises.

7 For if there had been nothing wrong with that first covenant, no place would have been sought for another. 8 But God found fault with the people and said:
“The days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and with the people of Judah.

9 It will not be like the covenant I made with their ancestors when I took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt, because they did not remain faithful to my covenant, and I turned away from them, declares the Lord.

10 This is the covenant I will establish with the people of Israel after that time, declares the Lord. I will put my laws in their minds and write them on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.

11 No longer will they teach their neighbor, or say to one another, ‘Know the Lord,’ because they will all know me, from the least of them to the greatest.

12 For I will forgive their wickedness and will remember their sins no more.”

13 By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear.In the above passage I've highlighted (and color coded) some of the aspects of this prophecy which are relevant to drawing a correct conclusion about the new covenant. Let's go through the prophecy one verse at a time.​

Verse 6
The author notes that the new covenant is superior to the old one. Why does he tell us this? Because he says that this new covenant is "established on better promises."

Ok, stop. Now, ask yourself a couple things. Does the God of the Bible ever make anything less than perfect promises? Can a perfect God make anything less than a perfect promise?

Verse 7
This verse also notes the fact that there was something "wrong with that first covenant," such that there was a need to establish a new one.

Verse 8
After taking into account what verse 6 said about "better promises," it is pretty easy to understand what verse 8 is saying. It tells us where the imperfect promises came from: "God found fault with the people."

What do you suppose these faulty promises were?

Exodus 19:8
The people all responded together, “We will do everything the Lord has said.” So Moses brought their answer back to the Lord.

Exodus 24:3
When Moses went and told the people all the Lord’s words and laws, they responded with one voice, “Everything the Lord has said we will do.”​

You may be wondering, "Are the people's promises to obey really the faulty promises to which the author of Hebrews was speaking? Let's just bypass the rest of verse 8 for a moment and look at verse 9. The LORD says the people "did not remain faithful to my covenant." Basically, the LORD provided a perfect set of laws for His chosen people. The people responded together, saying, "We will do everything the LORD has said." And later, in Exodus 24, "Everything the LORD has said we will do." But they didn't do what they promised to do. Thus, God found fault with them.

Please note, the LORD did not find fault with His perfect laws which were the foundation of the agreement between Himself and the people. The text is clear: "God found fault with the people."

Let's look at another aspect of what verse 8 tells us. It records the LORD as stating who the new covenant is for. "I will make a new covenant with the people of ISRAEL and with the people of JUDAH." This new covenant is ONLY with Israel and Judah. Gentiles are not mentioned as part of this covenant.

Verse 9 says this covenant will be different from the one the LORD made with those He lead out of Egypt. Why? Again, "because they did not remain faithful to my covenant."

Verse 10
This verse echoes verse 8 in saying that the new covenant will be "with the people of Israel." No Gentiles mentioned here either. But then we come to an interesting point about this new covenant. The LORD says He is going to put His laws in the minds of His people and write them on their hearts. Consider again that the LORD is perfect and the laws He gave to the Israelites were likewise perfect. So why would you suppose that His perfect laws could get any more perfect than what they were to begin with? Why would the LORD need to compose a new set of laws to write on the hearts of His people?

The new covenant, I believe, is merely taking the faulty promises of the people out of the equation. It is no longer having laws written on stone tablets and having the people promise to keep them. Instead the LORD promises to write His laws on the fleshy tablets of human hearts. It is no longer "we will do." Now it is allowing the Spirit to live within us to do the law which He has written on our hearts. The law is internalized for those who truly love the LORD.

Romans 8:13
For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live.​

I pray this helps.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

God putting His Torah in our minds and writing it our our hearts is an example of a better promise, but that in no way diminishes our agreement to obey the Torah that He is putting in our minds and writing on our hearts when we become partakers of the New Covenant. Likewise, God promising that Israel would never cease to be a nation before Him is another example of a better promise (Jeremiah 31:35-37). In Deuteronomy 30, it is prophesied that Israel would return from exile and return to obedience to the Torah and that God would circumcise their hearts, which is a difference from instructing us to circumcise our hearts in Deuteronomy 10:12-16. So this was alluding to the New Covenant and in accordance with what Ezekiel and Jeremiah prophesied about the return from exile, such as in Ezekiel 36:26-27, where God would take away our hearts of stone, give us hearts of flesh, and send His Spirit to lead us in obedience to the Torah, so the New Covenant has always been about returning to the Torah, not about following a different set of laws. In Ephesians 2:19, through faith in Christ, Gentiles are no longer aliens or strangers to the covenant, but are now fellow citizens of Israel along with the saints in the household of God, so Gentiles are able to become partakers of the New Covenant through faith in Christ, who is the living embodiment of the Torah/the word of God made flesh.

 

[Albion]

God putting His Torah in our minds and writing it our our hearts is an example of a better promise, but that in no way diminishes our agreement to obey the Torah that He is putting in our minds and writing on our hearts when we become partakers of the New Covenant.

You're forgetting that the purpose for the argument about believers remaining under the Law is to facilitate a minimizing of the New Covenant, much as we saw earlier with the trivializing of the books of the New Testament. All of that is necessarily if the claims of Sabbatarianism are to be upheld.

 

[Soyeong]

You're forgetting that the purpose for the argument about believers remaining under the Law is to facilitate a minimizing of the New Covenant, much as we saw earlier with the trivializing of the books of the New Testament. All of that is necessarily if the claims of Sabbatarianism are to be upheld.

I have said nothing to facilitate minimizing of the New Covenant or trivializing of the books of the NT. In Jeremiah 31:33, the New Covenant involves following the Torah, and one of the commands of the Torah is to keep the Sabbath holy. In Matthew 4:15-23, Jesus began his ministry the Gospel message to repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand, which was a light to Gentiles, and the Torah was how his audience knew what sin is, which again includes the command to keep the Sabbath holy. Further, Jesus set a sinless example of how to walk in obedience to the Torah, including keeping the Sabbath holy, and as his followers we are told to follow his example (1 Peter 2:21-22) and that those who are in Christ are obligated to walk in the same way he walked (1 John 2:4).

In addition, in Titus 2:11-14, our salvation is described as being trained by grace to do what is godly, righteous, and good, and to renounce doing what is ungodly, which is what the Torah was given to instruct how to do, so God graciously teaching us to obey the Torah, including keeping the Sabbath holy is part of the content of our salvation. In Titus 2:14, Jesus gave himself to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good works, so becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to the Torah, including keeping the Sabbath holy, is what it means to believe in what Jesus accomplished through the cross. So on the contrary, someone would need to facilitate minimizing of the New Covenant and trivializing of what Jesus accomplished through his ministry and the cross in order to spurn God's precious gift of the Sabbath.

 

[Albion]

I have said nothing to facilitate minimizing of the New Covenant or trivializing of the books of the NT.

I wasn't speaking of your own beliefs in that post.

 

[Soyeong]

I wasn't speaking of your own beliefs in that post.

I believe that we are under God's law, which includes being obligated to keep that Sabbath holy, and you said that I was forgetting something, so from what I can tell your post is directed at me, yet neither I nor other Christian Sabbatarians seek to minimize or trivialize anything in the NT. The law that Paul was referring to us not being under was the law of sin so that we could be free to obey the Law of God, not the other way around.

 

[Albion]

I believe that we are under God's law, which includes being obligated to keep that Sabbath holy, and you said that I was forgetting something, so from what I can tell your post is directed at me.

I was addressing you but not criticizing you, which must be what you mistakenly thought.

At this point, let's just forget about it.

 

[boughtwithaprice]

The Old Covenant was a covenant of flesh, in that God gave the commands and ordinances and humans were expected to follow them. We were born in original sin, and this results in a condition known as concupiscence. We have a innate desire for sin, which can only be cleansed by grace. Mortal sin is cleansed by blood, concupiscence is cleansed by grace.
But for the grace of God, we would remain in our sins, but by His grace we are saved.
The old covenant was given to men that were not born of spirit, but of flesh. The promises were perfect and not made more perfect by the New Covenant, but man cannot fulfill the law of God in his flesh. Unless we are born of water and the spirit, we cannot see the kingdom of God.
The New covenant was prophesied in Ezekiel

[26] And I will give you a new heart, and put a new spirit within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and will give you a heart of flesh. [27] And I will put my spirit in the midst of you: and I will cause you to walk in my commandments, and to keep my judgments, and do them.

As Christians, the law was not done away with, and we do not ignore its precepts. We are empowered to obey the law by the sacrifice of Christ on the Cross.
It is not some future date where we will be cleansed of sin. Now is the time today is the day of salvation.
We do not preach sinless perfectionism here, but there is no excuse for a person that claims to be a Christian to remain in a state of mortal sin, or as John puts it a sin unto death. We preach repentance. Jesus said if you love Me keep My commandments
If we do practice mortal sin, the we need to cry out to God for deliverance. He will hear and cleanse you from that sin. You just have to ask, ask again and keep on asking.
As a Catholic, I eat the flesh and blood, soul and divinity of Christ in the sacrifice of the Mass. This cleanses of venial sin and decreases concupiscence or desire for sin.
If I fall into mortal sin, there is the sacrament of Penance to restore my soul to sanctifying grace

The Old Covenant merely proclaimed the law, the New Covenant actually empowers souls to obey it, as the prophesy of Ezekiel states