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The Modern Era Scientist don't help me, but I still have my faith in God

Discussion in 'Physical & Life Sciences' started by JohnB445, May 1, 2022.

  1. SelfSim

    SelfSim A non "-ist"

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    Interestingly, (with respect to the more detailed mutation mechanism), there's recent evidence that quantum tunnelling is involved at the cellular DNA level .. an idea that has been shelved for some 50 years, due to a likely flawed assumption about the feasibility of that happening at bodily temperatures and greater system complexities:
     
  2. FrumiousBandersnatch

    FrumiousBandersnatch Well-Known Member

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    Sagan was just summarising probabilistic Bayesian reasoning, where you update your initial credence according to new evidence. If your inital credence is low, it takes more convincing evidence to achieve the same level of credence than if your initial credence is high. I don't think it was intended to be a statement of scientific methodology.
     
  3. Mountainmike

    Mountainmike Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I am not sure what you are trying to convey. Are you trying to claim that the normal uncertainty in exact locations in ancient archeology, buried beneath remodelled cities , invalidates the history entirely?

    The assumed location of golgotha is entirely reasonable given the layout of jerusalem at the time.
    Indeed the excavation by mitsopolous found rock and features consistent with that location, including a stone ring, which appears to be the support for a cross upright. As with all things, it makes fascinating reading. Try hessemans book as a start point.

    There is indeed a gate - gennath gate now found which is the probable actual route of the via dolorosa ( hadrian destroyed the original, and reused stone from buildings to construct his new city) , the location of gennath is consistent with josephus descriptions of the walls of the time, the existence of tombs show it was outside the wall consistent with Quintilian statement that they did public execution on busy highways.

    Unlike other sites, jerusalem was subject to deliberate destruction, first Roman against the Jewish population generally , but also Jewish and Islamic antipathy towards the Christian cause. The flattened jerusalem was rebuilt by Hadrian on a different plan incuding deliberate insults with pagan temples. It is not therefore suprising some uncertainties remain.

    Many of the locations of the Jesus' life are indeed exactly locatable, the location of the "thou art peter" speech in what was caesarea phillipi, modern day banyas. Even some in Jerusalem, take the pool of siloam.

    The development of christianity over the next few hundred years is of course fascinating, not least because it was underground and in many ways illegal. Also it was an acorn that grew into an oak. Same species, different morphology.

    Are you trying to say that the lack of exact certainty over thelocation of Golgotha somehow invalidates doctrine? That is A total non sequitur.

    The letter of ignatius to smyrneans confirms for example the real presence of the eucharist valid only if presided by a bishop in succession. Since ignatius/polycarp were disciples of John the apostle, nothing has therefore changed in Millenia!


     
    Last edited: May 12, 2022
  4. Estrid

    Estrid Well-Known Member

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    A few observations
    - its not " negative view of bible"
    but pointing out that of the many interpretations, ones
    contrary to all data and lgic are highly problematic.

    -You are doing equivocation with the word " creation".
    See if you can figure out how. Assuming a conclusion is
    part of it.

    -The OT makes it very clear that the earth is no older
    than the oldest human.

    -What is or is not absurd is made evident by education
    and thought. Your ideas about random chance etc
    are highly simplistic and totally inadequate.
    Of course they sound absurd.

    -"Proof" does not exist in science. Speaking of it as if it does reveals
    a serious lack of scientific literacy, and need for study.

    -Scientists nor anyone else can help you if you
    wont help yourself.

    -If your wish is to believe what is true, great.
    But theres no easy- peasy way. Hardcwork,
    study and thought is the price.

    As for those of IQ and education observing that there is
    gross absurdity in beliefs you may hold causing you
    some discomfort- well it should. Taking such as the
    flood story, for example, as literal is wildly at variance with reality.
     
  5. AV1611VET

    AV1611VET IN GOD WE TRUST Supporter

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    So what?

    Taking Pluto as a dwarf planet in 2000 would have been "wildly at variance with reality" as well.

    So would saying there are 118 elements.
     
  6. Bungle_Bear

    Bungle_Bear Whoot!

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    Please start following normal process and leave the quoted reply at the top. It makes following a thread so much easier.
     
  7. Bungle_Bear

    Bungle_Bear Whoot!

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    What about claiming all lands came to Egypt to buy corn? Genesis 41:57 Would that be "wildly at variance with reality"?
     
  8. Estrid

    Estrid Well-Known Member

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    .
     
  9. AV1611VET

    AV1611VET IN GOD WE TRUST Supporter

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    What about it?
    No.
     
  10. Bungle_Bear

    Bungle_Bear Whoot!

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    Do tell how the aboriginals came from Australia to buy corn.
     
  11. AV1611VET

    AV1611VET IN GOD WE TRUST Supporter

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    I don't know. I wasn't there.
     
  12. Bradskii

    Bradskii Well-Known Member

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    Well you are here now. So how would they do it now?
     
  13. AV1611VET

    AV1611VET IN GOD WE TRUST Supporter

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    From Amazon?
     
  14. Mountainmike

    Mountainmike Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Yes miss. Following the “ thread” here is never easy! Too many tangents and non sequiturs. It is part of what makes it interesting.

    I notice you quote Voltaire in your bio.
    What few realise is Voltaire himself thought the cult of celebrity and quoting celebrities was utterly ridiculous, but for as long as his readers lapped it up, he would oblige whilst quietly ridiculing his readers!

    So I prefer his quote… “Les imbéciles ont l'habitude de croire que tout ce qui est écrit par un auteur célèbre est admirable”
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2022
  15. BNR32FAN

    BNR32FAN He’s a Way of life Supporter

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    The Bible is a spiritual supernatural book full of miracles that are not supposed to be explainable thru science. If these events were explainable by science they would cease to be miracles and would fail to have the intended effect which was to show God’s might and glory and to bring unbelievers to repentance. If we can’t believe that miracles defy the laws of science then how can we believe in Jesus’ incarnation and His resurrection or the hundred other miracles that took place throughout the scriptures? Jesus said it is easier for a camel to pass thru the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of Heaven. I think the same could be said for many scientists.
     
  16. Estrid

    Estrid Well-Known Member

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    .
     
  17. Bradskii

    Bradskii Well-Known Member

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    Seriously. How would they do it?
     
  18. AV1611VET

    AV1611VET IN GOD WE TRUST Supporter

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    They used the Southern Dispersal Route?
     
  19. Bradskii

    Bradskii Well-Known Member

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    It's a serious question. I'd appreciate a serious answer.
     
  20. AV1611VET

    AV1611VET IN GOD WE TRUST Supporter

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    I ... don't ... know.

    Should I?
     
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