THE LOST SHEEP

[WailingWall]

DEUT.4 [27] And THE LORD SHALL SCATTER YOU AMONG THE NATIONS, AND YE SHALL BE LEFT FEW IN NUMBER AMONG THE HEATHEN, whither the LORD shall lead you.[28] And there ye shall serve gods, the work of men's hands, wood and stone, which neither see, nor hear, nor eat, nor smell.[29] BUT IF FROM THENCE THOU SHALT SEEK THE LORD THY GOD, THOU SHALT FIND HIM, if thou seek him with all thy heart and with all thy soul.[30] WHEN THOU ART IN TRIBULATION, AND ALL THESE THINGS ARE COME UPON THEE, EVEN IN THE LATTER DAYS, if thou turn to the LORD thy God, and shalt be obedient unto his voice;[31] (For the LORD thy God is a merciful God he will not forsake thee, neither destroy thee, nor forget the covenant of thy fathers which he sware unto them.

The Lord scatters the 10 {lost}tribes of the children of Israel amoung the gentiles for being disobedient. The lost sheep? Look what happens in the latter days.

MATT.15 [22] And, behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts, and cried unto him, saying, Have mercy on me, O Lord, thou Son of David; my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil.[23] But he answered her not a word. And his disciples came and besought him, saying, Send her away; for she crieth after us.[24] But he answered and said, I AM NOT SENT BUT UNTO THE LOST SHEEP of the house of Israel.

Jesus said "I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel". Do you believe Jesus?

JER.50 [4] In those days, and in that time, saith the LORD, the children of Israel shall come, they and the children of Judah together, going and weeping: they shall go, and seek the LORD their God.[5] They shall ask the way to Zion with their faces thitherward, saying, Come, and let us join ourselves to the LORD in A PERPETUAL COVENANT that shall not be forgotten.[6] MY PEOPLE HATH BEEN LOST SHEEP: their shepherds have caused them to go astray, they have turned them away on the mountains: they have gone from mountain to hill, THEY HAVE FORGOTTEN THEIR RESTINGPLACE.

My people hath been lost sheep

they have forgotten their restingplace (they sure have)

let us join ourselves to the LORD in a perpetual covenant that shall not be forgotten (remember the sabbath…)

Well, In Jeremiah we can find the sheep that Jesus came for. The remnant of the lost 10 tribes of the children of Israel, who believe they are nothing more than gentiles. Have the many been decieved, just as the new testament says. The sabbath rest has been forgotten, but as you can see, the lost sheep that Jesus came for will return to the “perpetual covenant” and keep Gods sabbath day. Do you believe these scriptures? If so, where do the gentiles fit in?

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Hello my good friend WW. Nicely written as usual from you with some very good points and scriptures.

links to.....

Exodus 31
16, Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a PERPETUAL <H5769 Eternity> COVENANT.

links to.....

Revelation 12
17, And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the REMNANT OF HER SEED which KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD, and HAVE THE TESTIMONY OF JESUS CHRIST.

links to.....

Revelations 19
10, And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: FOR THE TESTIMONY OF JESUS CHRIST IS THE SPIRIT OF PROPHECY.

There are no gentiles believers in the NEW Covenant. Gentiles are grafted into God's Israel who the Word of God says are those that BELIEVE the Word of God and FOLLOW what God says...

Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He says not, and to seeds, as of many; but as of one, AND TO YOUR SEED, WHICH IS CHRIST (Galatians 3:16)

Abraham’s seed is Israel.........

THERE IS NEITHER JEW NOR GREEK, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: FOR YOU ALL ALL ONE IN CHRIST JESUS AND IF YOU BE CHRISTS, THEN YOU ARE ABRAHAM'S SEED FOR YOU ARE ALL ONE IN CHRIST JESUS and IF YOU BE CHRISTS, THEN ARE YOU ABRAHAM'S SEED, AND HEIRS ACCORDING TO THE PROMISE (Galatians 3:28).

No explanation needed, believe God's Word, and again..........

FOR THEY ARE NOT ALL ISRAEL WHICH ARE OF ISRAEL,: NEITHER, BECAUSE THEY ARE THE SEED OF ABRAHAM, ARE THEY ALL CHILDREN: but in Isaac shall thy seed be called <Christ> That is, THEY WHICH ARE THE CHILDREN OF THE FLESH, THESE ARE NOT THE CHILDREN OF GOD: BUT THE CHILDREN OF THE PROMISE <those who believe> ARE COUNTED FOR THE SEED (Romans 9:6).

FOR HE IS NOT A JEW WHICH IS ONE OUTWARDLY; NEITHER IS THAT CIRCUMCISION, WHICH IS OUTWARDS IN THE FLESH: BUT HE IS A JEW WHICH IS ONE INWARDLY; and CIRCUMCISION IS OF THE HEART, IN THE SPIRIT, AND NOT IN THE LETTER; whose praise is not of men, but of God. (Romans 2:28-29)

God's Israel...............

Galatians 3:28-29,
THERE IS NEITHER JEW NOR GREEK, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Colossians 3:11,
WHERE THERE IS NEITHER JEW NOR GREEK circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.

Romans 10:11-13,
For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. FOR THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN JEW OR GREEK: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. FOR WHOSOEVER SHALL CALL UPON THE NAME OF THE LORD SHALL BE SAVED.

Romans 2:28-29,
FOR HE IS NOT A JEW WHICH IS ONE OUTWARDLY; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: BUT HE IS A JEW WHICH IS ONE INWARDLY ; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

The New Covenant is for God's Israel..........

Jeremiah 31:33-4,
BUT THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL; After those days, says the LORD, I WILL PUT MY LAW IN THEIR INWARD PARTS,AND WRITE IT IN THEIR HEARTS; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, says the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

Hebrews 8:10-12,
BUT THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL; After those days, says the LORD, I WILL PUT MY LAW IN THEIR INWARD PARTS, AND WRITE IT IN THEIR HEARTS; and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

Hebrews 10:14-17,
For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before, this is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says the Lord, I WILL PUT MY LAWS INTO THEIR HEARTS, AND INTO THEOR MINDS WILL I WRITE THEM; and their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.

Galatians 3:29,
AND IF YOU BE CHRISTS THEN YOU ARE ABRAHAMS SEED AND HEIRS ACCORDING TO THE PROMISE.

The New Covenant is for God's Israel which represent God’s followers the believers. If you are not part of God's Israel you are not part of the New Covenant (Hebrews 8:10-12).

God's Israel are those that believe the Word of God and follow it and is why Jesus says If you love me keep my commandments (John 14:15)

The Shepards of todays mainstream Christian Churces have indeed scattered the sheep and led them astray....

Jeremiah 50
4, In those days, and in that time, saith the LORD, the children of Israel shall come, they and the children of Judah together, going and weeping: they shall go, and seek the LORD their God.
5, They shall ask the way to Zion with their faces thitherward, saying, Come, and let us join ourselves to the LORD in A PERPETUAL COVENANT that shall not be forgotten.
6, MY PEOPLE HATH BEEN LOST SHEEP: their shepherds have caused them to go astray, they have turned them away on the mountains: they have gone from mountain to hill, THEY HAVE FORGOTTEN THEIR RESTINGPLACE.

They have changed times and laws and spoken against God..........

Daniel 7
25, And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

.................

There is not one scripture in all of God's Word that says that God's 4th Commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to KEEP Sunday as a Holy day.

God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has lead many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of men or the Word of God? Who should we believe the Words of men or the Word of God?

May God bless you as you seek him through His Word.

 

[Shimshon]

The perpetual covenant is not the Sinai covenant. It's the new covenant promised from the foundation of the world. The covenant NOT LIKE the one made with our ancestors at Sinai.

Jeremiah 3:16
16 In those days, when your numbers have increased greatly in the land,” declares the LORD, “people will no longer say, ‘The ark of the covenant of the LORD.’ It will never enter their minds or be remembered; it will not be missed, nor will another one be made.​

Contradiction #1. Jeremiah states the LORD declares the ark of the (old) covenant will never enter the minds of restored Israel, nor will it be remembered, nor another one made. Perpetual???

Jeremiah 11:10
10 They have returned to the sins of their ancestors, who refused to listen to my words. They have followed other gods to serve them. Both Israel and Judah have broken the covenant I made with their ancestors.
​

Contradiction #2. Jeremiah states the LORD told him to proclaim that the covenant made at Sinai was/is broken by Israel. Perpetual??

Jeremiah 31:31-33
31 “The days are coming,” declares the LORD, “when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and with the people of Judah. 32 It will not be like the covenant I made with their ancestors when I took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt, because they broke my covenant, though I was a husband to them, ” declares the LORD. 33 “This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel after that time,” declares the LORD. “I will put my law in their minds and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.
​

Contradiction #3. Jeremiah states the LORD declares a new covenant will be made with Israel that is not like the covenant made at Sinai. The law does not operate in this new covenant as it did in the old. It's not even written on the same medium. And is not operated with the same instructions. When the LORD states 'NOT LIKE the (Sinai) covenant, because they broke my covenant proves again the Sinai covenant is NOT being explained as perpetual...

Jeremiah 32:36-41
36 “You are saying about this city, ‘By the sword, famine and plague it will be given into the hands of the king of Babylon’; but this is what the LORD, the God of Israel, says: 37 I will surely gather them from all the lands where I banish them in my furious anger and great wrath; I will bring them back to this place and let them live in safety. 38 They will be my people, and I will be their God. 39 I will give them singleness of heart and action, so that they will always fear me and that all will then go well for them and for their children after them. 40 I will make an everlasting covenant with them: I will never stop doing good to them, and I will inspire them to fear me, so that they will never turn away from me. 41 I will rejoice in doing them good and will assuredly plant them in this land with all my heart and soul.
​

Notice this everlasting covenant descriptions are identical to Chapter 31's new covenant. God's laws are written on the hearts and minds. Inspiring us to fear him and never turn away from him.

Also notice it states God will put 'my law', it does not state 'the law', nor refer to the Sinai covenant. As the 'new' covenant which is perpetual will place 'God's law' within us.

A very common fallacy within the Torah movement is the equating of 'the law' or 'my word' with the Sinai covenant. The law spoken about in Jeremiah 31:33 refers to 'the words' (my words) as spoken through Yeshua. His word is living manna, the bread of life, speaking and thus bringing eternal (perpetual) life. To all who believe.

Did you ever wonder why Yeshua contrasted his food with the food given Moses? (John 6) If the Torah of Yeshua equates to the same instructions as the Torah given Moses, why did Yeshua contrast them here instead of correlate them? If the Spirit in Yeshua was teaching all to ‘follow him’ into the true observance of the Torah given Moses, why did he contrast his food with the food given Moses?

48I am the bread of life.49Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and they died.50This is the bread that comes down from heaven, so that one may eat of it and not die.51I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. And the bread that I will give for the life of the world is my flesh.”

53So Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you.54Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.55For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink.56Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him.57As the living Father sent me, and I live because of the Father, so whoever feeds on me, he also will live because of me.

58This is the bread that came down from heaven, not like the bread the fathers ate, and died. Whoever feeds on this bread will live forever.”

​

The Father draws all to the Messiah. Because it is Yeshua that gives life. Nowhere here do we find even the notion that Messiah’s Torah is to be returning us to the Torah given Moses.

This last statement here (V.58) is the real kicker. We know that the bread of life are the actions and words of Yeshua. Likewise, the bread our fathers ate is not merely manna, but the actions and words accomplished through Moses. When Yeshua offered the crowds bread that never rots and brings life eternal they wanted to correlate this teaching with that given in the Tanakh. But instead Yeshua contrasted his Torah with the Torah of the fathers.

The bread that comes down from heaven and gives eternal life to the world ‘is NOT’ like the bread the fathers ate, because they died.

But Yeshua brings life, perpetually, eternally.

John10
7 Yeshua therefore said to them again, "Most assuredly, I tell you, I am the sheep's door.
8 All who came before me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep didn't listen to them.
9 I am the door. If anyone enters in by me, he will be saved, and will go in and go out, and will find pasture.

10 The thief only comes to steal, kill, and destroy. I came that they may have life, and may have it abundantly.

11 I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep.
12 He who is a hired hand, and not a shepherd, who doesn't own the sheep, sees the wolf coming, leaves the sheep, and flees. The wolf snatches the sheep, and scatters them.
13 The hired hand flees because he is a hired hand, and doesn't care for the sheep.
14 I am the good shepherd. I know my own, and I'm known by my own;
15 even as the Father knows me, and I know the Father. I lay down my life for the sheep.​

Now, why would Yeshua lead us back into the ministry of the hired hands when he has come as the good shepherd? The good shepherd laid down his life for us so we could now walk as under the hired hands of old?

 

[LoveGodsWord]

The perpetual covenant is not the Sinai covenant. It's the new covenant promised from the foundation of the world. The covenant NOT LIKE the one made with our ancestors at Sinai.

Agreed this is partly true and partly false. It might help if you define what the Sinai Covenant means to you because this is the foundation and the premise of your whole argument.

So would you mind explaining what Sinai Covenant means to you?

Jeremiah 3:16
16 In those days, when your numbers have increased greatly in the land,” declares the LORD, “people will no longer say, ‘The ark of the covenant of the LORD.’ It will never enter their minds or be remembered; it will not be missed, nor will another one be made.

Contradiction #1. Jeremiah states the LORD declares the ark of the (old) covenant will never enter the minds of restored Israel, nor will it be remembered, nor another one made. Perpetual???

What is the contradiction here? There is no contradiction whatsoever the OLD has BECOME NEW and stone has turned to the fleshly tables of the heart (2 Cor 3:3). God's LAW (10 Commandments) is still perpetual but only fulfilled in LOVE and is why Jesus says; If you LOVE me keep my Commandments (John 14:15) and on these two commandments (LOVE to God and Man) hang ALL the LAW and the Prophets (Matthew 22:36-40)

This is further written about in the book of Jeremiah……..

Jeremiah 31
33, But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. (Hebrews 8:10-12; 10:15-18)

The NEW Covenant does not ABOLISH the 10 Commandment it fulfills the Shadows they were pointing to. God’s LAW (10 Commandments) are written in the HEART through LOVE in those who by FAITH, BELIEVE the Word of God. LOVE is the FULFILLING of God’s LAW in those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW GOD’s WORD buy walking in His Spirit (Romans 13:8-10; Romans 8:1-4; Romans 3:31; Matthew 22:36-40)

The NEW COVENANT does not ABOLISH the 10 Commandment it ESTABLISHES THEM.

Romans 3
31, Do we then make void the law through faith? GOD FORBIT; YEA WE ESTABLSIH THEM.

God’s Word says the 10 Commandments are forever and the standard in the OLD and NEW Covenants and the Judgement to come…..

The Law of God (10 commandments) which includes the 4th commandment is the work of God (Exodus 32:16) whatsoever God does is forever nothing can be added to it or taken away (Ecclesiastes 3:14). God's Law is perfect converting the soul (Psalms 19:7).
It is the very standard of the Old and New Covenants (Exodus 20:1:17, Hebrews 8:10-12).
God's Law was spoken by God himself to His people (Exodus 20:1-22). Jesus says Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away (Matthew 25:35). Gods Law is still in force today (Psalms 111:7-8, Revelation 12:17, 14:12, 22:14, 1 John 3:5-8, 1 John 2:3-4 etc.). The Law of God reveals sin to us so we can see ourselves as we truly are sinners in need of a Saviour (Romans 3:20; 1 John 3:4).It is the great standard of the judgement (Ecclesiastes 12:13-14, James 2:10-12, 1 John 3:4, Acts 17:31). God's Law is our teacher revealing sin and the character of God and brings us to Christ at the foot of the cross that we might be saved by faith by Him who loves us and washed us in His own blood (Galatians 3:24; Revelation 1:5). Jesus came not to abolish the law, but to fulfil it ( Matt 5:17-20 ). The law is the embodiment of truth that instructs ( Rom 2:18-19 ). It is "holy" and "spiritual, " making sin known to us by defining it; therefore, Paul delights in it ( Romans 7:7-14Romans 7:22). The law is good if used properly ( 1 Tim 1:8 ), and is not opposed to the promises of God ( Gal 3:21 ). Faith does not make the law void, but the Christian establishes the law ( Rom 3:31 ), fulfilling its requirements by walking according to the Spirit ( Rom 8:4 ) through love ( Rom 13:10 ).

How do you know what SIN is when the 10 Commandments are the KNOWLEDGE of SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS (Romans 7:7; Romans 3:20; 1 John 3:4; James 2:11)?

If you have NO LAW then you have NO KNOWLEDGE of SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS. If you have NO KNOWLEDGE of SIN you have NO NEED of a SAVIOR. If you have no need of a SAVIOR you have no SALVATION. IF you have no SALVATION you are LOST because you are still in your SINS and stand guilty before God in SIN.

Do we need more scripture?

This is why Jesus says;

They that be whole need not a physician, but they that are sick. But go ye and learn what that means, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance. (Matthew 9:12-13)

If you have lost your mirror how can you see yourself and find your way when the road is dark and narrow to him who loves you? If the blind lead the blind when their lamp has gone out they will both fall into a ditch. Do you know the scriptures?

Hope this helps

.................

There is not one scripture in all of God's Word that says that God's 4th Commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to KEEP Sunday as a Holy day.

God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has lead many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of men or the Word of God? Who should we believe the Words of men or the Word of God?

May God bless you as you seek him through His Word.

 

[WailingWall]

The perpetual covenant is not the Sinai covenant. It's the new covenant promised from the foundation of the world. The covenant NOT LIKE the one made with our ancestors at Sinai.

Opinion noted. But what does scripture say

EXODUS 31[15] Six days may work be done; but in THE SEVENTH IS THE SABBATH of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.[16] Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a PERPETUAL COVENANT.[17] It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.

If you have a KJV bible you will find the words “PERPETUAL COVENANT” only in these 2 scriptures. Jer. 50 and Exodus 31. Exodus 31 speaks of the sabbath as the “perpetual covenant” and Jer.50 speaks of that “perpetual covenant” being forgotten by His people. But...in verse 5 Gods people will return to that perpetual covenant {the sabbath} and it will not be forgotten

JER.50 [4] In those days, and in that time, saith the LORD, the children of Israel shall come, they and the children of Judah together, going and weeping: they shall go, and seek the LORD their God.[5] They shall ask the way to Zion with their faces thitherward, saying, Come, and let us join ourselves to the LORD in A PERPETUAL COVENANT that shall not be forgotten.[6] MY PEOPLE HATH BEEN LOST SHEEP: their shepherds have caused them to go astray, they have turned them away on the mountains: they have gone from mountain to hill, THEY HAVE FORGOTTEN THEIR RESTINGPLACE.

 

[WailingWall]

Just a little somethin to show how great the WORD is! There are only 2 places in the KJV where the words “moreover also” can be found

EZEK.20 [12] MOREOVER ALSO I gave them MY SABBATHS, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the LORD that sanctify them

ACTS 2 [26] Therefore did my heart rejoice, and my tongue was glad; MOREOVER ALSO MY FLESH SHALL REST in hope:

In ACTS 2 the WORD says “my flesh shall rest in hope”. Just as GODS 4th commandment tells us to do. Aint the WORD great!

 

[Shimshon]

But what does scripture say

You would simply have to actually read, and understand, the rest of what I posted..... Your dismissal or out right ignorance of the scriptures I posted is noted. You addressed none of them.

 

[WailingWall]

The perpetual covenant is not the Sinai covenant. It's the new covenant promised from the foundation of the world. The covenant NOT LIKE the one made with our ancestors at Sinai.

Jeremiah 31:31-33

31 “The days are coming,” declares the LORD, “when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and with the people of Judah. 32 It will not be like the covenant I made with their ancestors when I took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt, because they broke my covenant, though I was a husband to them, ” declares the LORD. 33 “This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel after that time,” declares the LORD. “I will put my law in their minds and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.
​

Contradiction #3. Jeremiah states the LORD declares a new covenant will be made with Israel that is not like the covenant made at Sinai.

OK. Your pointing to a covenant that has not yet taken place.

JEREMIAH 31 [31] BEHOLD, THE DAYS COME, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: [32] Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD: [33] But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; AFTER THOSE DAYS, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. [34] AND THEY SHALL TEACH NO MORE EVERY MAN HIS NEIGHBOUR, AND EVERY MAN HIS BROTHER, SAYING, KNOW THE LORD: FOR THEY SHALL ALL KNOW ME, FROM THE LEAST OF THEM UNTO THE GREATEST of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

HEBREWS 8 [8] For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah: [9] Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord. [10] For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I WILL PUT MY LAWS INTO THEIR MIND, AND WRITE THEM IN THEIR HEARTS: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: [11] And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. [12] For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more. [13] In that he saith, A NEW COVENANT, HE HATH MADE THE FIRST OLD. NOW THAT WHICH DECAYETH AND WAXETH OLD IS READY TO VANISH AWAY.

Jer.31 and Heb.8 are speaking of the same exact covenant. Although we are to try and walk as if Gods law was written in our heart, has the covenant of Jer.31 and Hebrews 8 already arrived?

Verse 8- I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah. Not a gentile mentioned anywhere. Every time i say we {gentiles} are to keep the 10 commandments, i hear that covenant wasnt given to the gentiles! It was given to Isreal only!

Verse 11- Tell me Shimshon, does EVERYONE know the Lord? Not even close. There will come a time.

Verse 13- Hebrews 8 was written AFTER the crucified Christ and the scripture clearly says that the old covenant (10 commandments) is WAXING OLD and GETTING READY to vanish. Aint vanished yet! Yes there are some books {not the bible} that claim the ten are obsolete. In them same books youll find in Hebrews 4 the name of Jesus being change to Joshua for the same reason. To hide the truth

Verse 10- When God writes His commandments in our heart you can bet the ranch we will be keeping them. Yes, even His sabbath. When will God write His laws in our hearts?

DEUT. 30 [4] If any of thine be driven out unto the outmost parts of heaven, from thence will THE LORD THY GOD GATHER THEE, and from thence will he fetch thee: [5] And the Lord THY GOD WILL BRING THEE INTO THE LAND WHICH THY FATHERS POSSESSED, and thou shalt possess it; and he will do thee good, and multiply thee above thy fathers. [6] And the Lord THY GOD WILL CIRCUMCISE THINE HEART, and the heart of thy seed, to love the Lord thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live. [7] And the Lord thy God will put all these curses upon thine enemies, and on them that hate thee, which persecuted thee. [8] And THOU SHALT RETURN AND OBEY THE VOICE OF THE LORD, AND DO ALL HIS COMMANDMENTS which I command thee this day.

After the gathering {in the twinkling of an eye} to the kingdom rest. Verse 8- Yes.... that would be the 10 commandments. Does that include the sabbath

ISAIAH 66 [22] For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain. [23] And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and FROM ONE SABBATH TO ANOTHER, SHALL ALL FLESH COME TO WORSHIP before me, saith the Lord.

Yup

 

[WailingWall]

Notice this everlasting covenant descriptions are identical to Chapter 31's new covenant. God's laws are written on the hearts and minds. Inspiring us to fear him and never turn away from him.

We agree on one thing. We must fear the Lord.

MATTHEW 15 [8] This people draweth nigh unto me with THEIR MOUTH, and honoureth me with THEIR LIPS; but THEIR HEART IS FAR FROM ME. [9] But in vain they do worship me, TEACHING FOR DOCTRINES THE COMMANDMENTS OF MEN.

Lets go to Isaiah 29 and learn more of these people who worship Jesus in vain

ISAIAH 29 [13] Wherefore the Lord said, Forasmuch as this people draw near me with their mouth, and with their lips do honour me, but HAVE REMOVED THEIR HEART FAR FROM ME, AND THEIR FEAR TOWARD ME IS TAUGHT BY THE PRECEPT OF MEN:

So who are these people who say they believe in the Lord and honor the Lord with their words but because they “fear not” the Lord, ........

LUKE 12 [4] And I say unto you my friends, Be not afraid of them that kill the body, and after that have no more that they can do. [5] But I will forewarn you whom ye shall fear: Fear him, which after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto you, FEAR HIM.

So what does it mean to fear the Lord

DEUT. 6 [1] Now THESE ARE THE COMMANDMENTS, the statutes, and the judgments, which the Lord your God commanded to teach you, that ye might do them in the land whither ye go to possess it: [2] THAT THOU MIGHTEST FEAR THE LORD THY GOD, to keep all his statutes and his commandments, which I command thee, thou, and thy son, and thy son's son, all the days of thy life; and that thy days may be prolonged.

PSALM 111 [10] The FEAR OF THE LORD is the beginning of wisdom: a good understanding HAVE ALL THEY THAT DO HIS COMMANDMENTS: his praise endureth for ever.

PROVERBS 1 [7] THE FEAR OF THE LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction. [8] My son, hear the instruction of thy father, and FORSAKE NOT THE LAW of thy mother:[9] For they shall be an ornament of GRACE unto thy head, and chains about thy neck.

Heres a great scripture. Forsake not the law. Fear the Lord, get wisdom and receive His grace.

DEUT. 4 [10] Specially the day that thou stoodest before the Lord thy God in Horeb, when the Lord said unto me, Gather me the people together, and I will make them hear my words, THAT THEY MAY LEARN TO FEAR ME all the days that they shall live upon the earth, and that they may teach their children. [11] And ye came near and stood under the mountain; and the mountain burned with fire unto the midst of heaven, with darkness, clouds, and thick darkness. [12] And the Lord spake unto you out of the midst of the fire: ye heard the voice of the words, but saw no similitude; only ye heard a voice. [13] And he declared unto you HIS COVENANT, which HE COMMANDED YOU TO PERFORM, EVEN TEN COMMANDMENTS; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.

PSALM 78 [35] And they remembered that God was their rock, and the high God their redeemer. [36] Nevertheless they did FLATTER HIM WITH THEIR MOUTH, and they LIED UNTO HIM WITH THEIR TONGUES. [37] For their heart was not right with him, NEITHER WERE THEY STEDFAST IN HIS COVENANT.

DEUT.4 [13] And he declared unto you HIS COVENANT, which he commanded you to perform, EVEN TEN COMMANDMENTS; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.

 

[Shimshon]

OK. Your pointing to a covenant that has not yet taken place.

JEREMIAH 31 [31] BEHOLD, THE DAYS COME, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: [32] Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD: [33] But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; AFTER THOSE DAYS, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. [34] AND THEY SHALL TEACH NO MORE EVERY MAN HIS NEIGHBOUR, AND EVERY MAN HIS BROTHER, SAYING, KNOW THE LORD: FOR THEY SHALL ALL KNOW ME, FROM THE LEAST OF THEM UNTO THE GREATEST of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

HEBREWS 8 [8] For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah: [9] Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord. [10] For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I WILL PUT MY LAWS INTO THEIR MIND, AND WRITE THEM IN THEIR HEARTS: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: [11] And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. [12] For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more. [13] In that he saith, A NEW COVENANT, HE HATH MADE THE FIRST OLD. NOW THAT WHICH DECAYETH AND WAXETH OLD IS READY TO VANISH AWAY.

Jer.31 and Heb.8 are speaking of the same exact covenant. Although we are to try and walk as if Gods law was written in our heart, has the covenant of Jer.31 and Hebrews 8 already arrived?

Yes, it has.

Matthew 26
26 As they were eating, Yeshua took bread, gave thanks for it, and broke it. He gave to the talmidim, and said, "Take, eat; this is my body."
27 He took the cup, gave thanks, and gave to them, saying, "Drink all of it,
28 for this is my blood of the new covenant, which is poured out for many for the remission of sins.​

He spoke in present tense. This IS my blood of the NEW covenant. Notice also the connection to John 6 where he said;

John 6
53 Yeshua therefore said to them, "Most assuredly I tell you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you don't have life in yourselves. 54 He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. 55 For my flesh is food indeed, and my blood is drink indeed. 56 He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood lives in me, and I in him.
57 As the living Father sent me, and I live because

58 This is the bread which came down out of heaven -- not as our fathers ate the manna, and died. He who eats this bread will live forever."
​

For the remission of sins. You actually believe forgiveness has not happened yet? Have you forgotten the whole gospel? That the Son of God came to offer his own life in our place for the sins we committed and will commit. And by faith in this one act of obedience to God's word the rest of us are accounted as righteous in God's eyes. Then God's holy spirit comes to live within our hearts. Keeping us and preserving us till the day of our redemption to eternal life. Have you ever believed this? The Messiah of Israel came and ratified the new covenant with his own blood. Poured it on the ground of Jerusalem and forgave us all! Now if we believe in the actions of the High Priest, and all they have accomplished we will be united as one with God through his spirit. NOW!

This is my covenant with them, I will take away their sins. Do you believe Yeshua took away your past and future sins? How on earth would they be handled any other way? The whole point of sending the Spirit of God do dwell within us is to keep us 'in him'. We don't live apart, not abiding in him then come to him sometimes. Or like the catholics coming to him only in confession. The whole reason we can have this 24/7 relationship with God is because of what Yeshua did in establishing the new covenant in us.

2 Corinthians 3
1 Are we beginning again to commend ourselves? Or do we need, as do some, letters of commendation to you or from you? 2 You are our letter, written in our hearts, known and read by all men; 3 being revealed that you are a letter of Messiah, ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tablets of stone, but in tablets that are hearts of flesh.
4 Such confidence we have through Messiah toward God; 5 not that we are sufficient of ourselves, to account anything as from ourselves; but our sufficiency is from God; 6 who also made us sufficient as servants of a new covenant; not of the letter, but of the Spirit. For the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

7 But if the service of death, written engraved on stones, came with glory, so that the children of Yisra'el could not look steadfastly on the face of Moshe for the glory of his face; which was passing away: 8 won't service of the Spirit be with much more glory? 9For if the service of condemnation has glory, the service of righteousness exceeds much more in glory. 10 For most assuredly that which has been made glorious has not been made glorious in this respect, by reason of the glory that surpasses. 11 For if that which passes away was with glory, much more that which remains is in glory.​

Hebrews 8
6 But now he has obtained a more excellent ministry, by so much as he is also the mediator of a better covenant, which has been enacted on better promises.
7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then no place would have been sought for a second.​

Something you seemingly left off from Heb 8 that completely renders useless the theory that Yeshua's ministry is based on teaching the old covenant, or that the old is still intact. A second was sought, and enacted by Yeshua with Israel, both houses.

You actually used Hebrews 8 to try and prove the old covenant is still intact? Which covenant is Yeshua mediating? Do you believe he is mediating a covenant, now?

 

[Shimshon]

Verse 8- I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah. Not a gentile mentioned anywhere. Every time i say we {gentiles} are to keep the 10 commandments, i hear that covenant wasnt given to the gentiles! It was given to Isreal only!

Yes, the covenants are made with and through Israel, but gentiles can participate in the covenants. In the old covenant a gentile could join the house of Israel, there was a process lined out in Torah for it. The Torah movement misuses and/or misunderstands the one law for all instructions. In the new covenant gentiles are called to join 'the body of Messiah', and there is a process lined out in the Torah of Messiah for it. But, it's 'not like' the process lined out in the Torah of Moses.

Verse 11- Tell me Shimshon, does EVERYONE know the Lord? Not even close. There will come a time.

Yes, it is Now as well. Again, have you not understood the gospel message of the reason the Holy Spirit is given and what it's 'work' is in your life/heart?

Luke 12
11 “When you are brought before synagogues, rulers and authorities, do not worry about how you will defend yourselves or what you will say,
12 for the Holy Spirit will teach you at that time what you should say.”​

We need not worry about how to defend ourselves or what we will say, because the Holy Spirit WILL teach us at any given time what we should say. Even better than a bible really. A more excellent ministry for sure!

John 14
25 “All this I have spoken while still with you.
26 But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.​

How incredible, no! We have an advocate against the accuser who lives within our beings and teaches us all things, reminding us of everything Yeshua spoke.

1 John 2
20 You have an anointing from the Holy One, and you know the truth. 21 I have not written to you because you don't know the truth, but because you know it, and because no lie is of the truth.

22 Who is the liar but he who denies that Yeshua is the Messiah? This is the Anti-messiah, he who denies the Father and the Son. 23 Whoever denies the Son, the same doesn't have the Father. He who confesses the Son has the Father also.

24 Therefore, as for you, let that remain in you which you heard from the beginning. If that which you heard from the beginning remains in you, you also will remain in the Son, and in the Father. 25 This is the promise which he promised us, the eternal life.

26 These things I have written to you concerning those who would lead you astray. 27 As for you, the anointing which you received from him remains in you, and you don't need for anyone to teach you. But as his anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is no lie, and even as it taught you, you will remain in him.
​

The Holy Spirit teaches us to remain in him.

John 14:15 “If you love me, you will keep my commandments. 16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Helper, to be with you forever, 17 even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him. You know him, for he dwells with you and will be in you. 18 “I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19 Yet a little while and the world will see me no more, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20 In that day you will know that I am in my Father, and you in me, and I in you. 21 Whoever has my commandments andkeeps them, he it is who loves me. And he who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I will love him and manifest myself to him.”

John 15:7 If you abide in me, and my words abide in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you. 8 By this my Father is glorified, that you bear much fruit and so prove to be my disciples. 9As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you. Abide in my love. 10 If you keep my commandments, you will abide in my love, just as I have kept my Father’s commandments and abide in his love. 11 These things I have spoken to you, that my joy may be in you, and that your joy may be full.

12 “This is my commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you. 13Greater love has no one than this, that someone lay down his life for his friends. 14 You are my friends if you do what I command you.​

The command is to abide the love of the vine. Yeshua is the vine, He commands us to be ‘in’ Him, and to Love. He states that if we are united with Yeshua through love, we are keeping the Fathers commandments that He spoke through Yeshua. In Messiah we live by love, as a commandment. It is His commandment to live united with Yeshua through love. Yeshua remained united with the Father through love, and commands us to remian united with Yeshua through love.

The Father is glorified when we are united with Yeshua in love. It proves we are His disciples. If we love him we keep Yeshua's commandments, his Torah. Messiah's Torah. Not according to the covenant he made with our fathers at Sinai. But according to the covenant he made with Israel at Mt. Zion.

Isaiah 42
6 I, the LORD, have called you in righteousness, and will hold your hand, and will keep you, and give you for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Goyim;​

 

[Shimshon]

Verse 10- When God writes His commandments in our heart you can bet the ranch we will be keeping them. Yes, even His sabbath. When will God write His laws in our hearts?

Yes, we are to be holy as he is holy. We are to die to ourselves and live for Messiah. Our bodies used for the kingdom, the Spirit of holiness dwelling in a person. We are called to holiness. Set apart for God. Paul called it being free.

Galatians 5:1 For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore, and do not submit again to a yoke of slavery. 2 Look: I, Paul, say to you that if you accept circumcision, Christ will be of no advantage to you. 3 I testify again to every man who accepts circumcision that he is obligated to keep the whole law. 4 You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace.

5 For through the Spirit, by faith, we ourselves eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness. 6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith working through love. 7 You were running well. Who hindered you from obeying the truth?

8 This persuasion is not from him who calls you. 9 A little leaven leavens the whole lump. 10 I have confidence in the Lord that you will take no other view than mine, and the one who is troubling you will bear the penalty, whoever he is.

11 But if I, brothers, still preach circumcision, why am I still being persecuted? In that case the offense of the cross has been removed. 12 I wish those who unsettle you would emasculate themselves!

13 For you were called to freedom, brothers. Only do not use your freedom as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another. 14 For the whole law is fulfilled in one word: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 15 But if you bite and devour one another, watch out that you are not consumed by one another.​

In Messiah neither following the law or not counts for anything, but only faith working through love. The one who calls us is not persuading us to account observance to the law to our faith. If Paul was still preaching the law why was he still being persecuted? Notice, the ministry of Messiah (the cross) was an offense to the law. Preaching Messiah's Torah was an offense to the Torah of Moses.

Midrash Qoheleth 71,8
"The Torah which man learns in this world is but vanity compared with the teaching of the Messiah."
Referring to Psalm 146:7 the corresponding Midrash says:

• 
  " 'The LORD sets prisoners free'... What does this 'setting free of prisoners' mean? There are those who say that in the future the Holy One will make all unclean animals fit for eating."

And finally, we have this prophesy.

Zechariah 9:9 Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion! Shout aloud, O daughter of Jerusalem! Behold, your king is coming to you; righteous and having salvation is he, humble and mounted on a donkey, on a colt, the foal of a donkey. 10 I will cut off the chariot from Ephraim and the war-horse from Jerusalem; and the battle bow shall be cut off, and he shall speak peace to the nations; his rule shall be from sea to sea, and from the River to the ends of the earth. 11 As for you also, because of the blood of my covenant with you, I will set your prisoners free from the waterless pit. 12 Return to your stronghold, O prisoners of hope; today I declare that I will restore to you double.​

Our king has come to us, righteous and having salvation. Humble and mounted on a donkey. God has cut off the ministry of death, the chariots of fire, the altar is removed, the walls torn down. Every stone removed from it's place. All ability to observe any part of the old covenant as given is 'cut off'. And shalom is NOW being preached to the nations. He is king of kings and lord of lords, Yeshua IS Lord over all the earth, his kingdom manifesting within the hearts of his followers. Israel's restoration is the final outpouring of the kingdom of God. But it began as promised when Yeshua came, the ministry has begun, the covenant has been ratified by blood, the signs have been witnessed. The indwelling of the Spirit has been testified to and seen throughout the body of Messiah.

 

[WailingWall]

WailingWall said: ↑
Verse 11- Tell me Shimshon, does EVERYONE know the Lord? Not even close. There will come a time.

Shimson said-Yes, it is Now as well.

Come on ole boy. Youve got to be kidding. Everyone does not know the Lord

 

[WailingWall]

WailingWall said: ↑
Verse 11- Tell me Shimshon, does EVERYONE know the Lord? Not even close. There will come a time.

Shimson said-Yes, it is Now as well.

Come on ole boy. Youve got to be kidding. Everyone does not know the Lord

Whats it mean to know the Lord according to scripture?

MATT.7 [22] Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?[23] And then will I profess unto them, I NEVER KNEW YOU: DEPART FROM ME, YE THAT WORK INIQUITY.

PSALMS 119 [113] I hate vain thoughts: but thy law do I love.[114] Thou art my hiding place and my shield: I hope in thy word.[115] DEPART FROM ME, YE EVILDOERS: for I WILL KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS OF MY GOD.[116] Uphold me according unto thy word, that I may live: and let me not be ashamed of my hope.

Depart from me! Aint it great how the new verifies the old. Seems there will be many people who will be saying “I believe” when Jesus returns. Who had talked of Jesus and spoke in his name. Some that even have cast out devils in the name of Jesus. But “in that day” Jesus will say to “the many”, depart from me...I never knew you.

1JOHN2 [3] AND HEREBY WE DO KNOW THAT WE KNOW HIM, IF WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS.[4] He that saith, i know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.[5] But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.

Theres the people who know God and will be saved. Once again, the new verifies the old. They that observe to keep Gods 10 commandments. Remember to read the 4th one.

TITUS 1 [13] This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith; [14] Not giving heed to Jewish fables, AND COMMANDMENTS OF MEN, that turn from the truth. [15] Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled. [16] THEY PROFESS THAT THEY KNOW GOD; BUT IN WORKS THEY DENY HIM, being abominable, AND DISOBEDIENT, and unto every good work reprobate.

In Titus you will find people that profess they know God (they say they believe) but in works they deny Him. They do not know God. So according to scripture it is just not enough to simply say you believe. Theres a lot more to it.

JEREMIAH [6] Thine habitation is in the midst of deceit; through deceit THEY REFUSE TO KNOW ME, saith the LORD.[7] Therefore thus saith the LORD of hosts, Behold, I will melt them, and try them; for how shall I do for the daughter of my people?[8] Their tongue is as an arrow shot out; it speaketh deceit: one speaketh peaceably to his neighbour with his mouth, but in heart he layeth his wait.[9] Shall I not visit them for these things? saith the LORD: shall not my soul be avenged on such a nation as this?[10] For the mountains will I take up a weeping and wailing, and for the habitations of the wilderness a lamentation, because they are burned up, so that none can pass through them; neither can men hear the voice of the cattle; both the fowl of the heavens and the beast are fled; they are gone.[11] And I will make Jerusalem heaps, and a den of dragons; and I will make the cities of Judah desolate, without an inhabitant.[12] Who is the wise man, that may understand this? and who is he to whom the mouth of the LORD hath spoken, that he may declare it, for what the land perisheth and is burned up like a wilderness, that none passeth through?[13] And the LORD saith, BECAUSE THEY HAVE FORSAKEN MY LAW which I set before them, and have not obeyed my voice, neither walked therein;

EVERYONE DOES NOT KNOW THE LORD!

 

[WailingWall]

Yes, it has.

Matthew 26
26 As they were eating, Yeshua took bread, gave thanks for it, and broke it. He gave to the talmidim, and said, "Take, eat; this is my body."
27 He took the cup, gave thanks, and gave to them, saying, "Drink all of it,
28 for this is my blood of the new covenant, which is poured out for many for the remission of sins.​

He spoke in present tense. This IS my blood of the NEW covenant.

Well ofcourse Shimshon. Christ brought in the new blood covenant. The new covenant is all about the blood of Christ. Not changing the law....but fulfilling the law

ZECH.9 [9] Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion; shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: behold, THY KING COMETH UNTO THEE: HE IS JUST, AND HAVING SALVATION; lowly, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an ass.[10] And I will cut off the chariot from Ephraim, and the horse from Jerusalem, and the battle bow shall be cut off: and he shall speak peace unto the heathen: and his dominion shall be from sea even to sea, and from river even to the ends of the earth.[11] As for thee also, BY THE BLOOD OF THY COVENANT I have sent forth thy prisoners out of the pit wherein is no water

Verse 9 definately prophecies of the coming Jesus. Verse 11, Jesus is called the blood of thy covenant

HEBREWS 12 [23] To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,[24] And to Jesus THE MEDIATOR OF THE NEW COVENANT, AND TO THE BLOOD of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

New covenant...blood

LUKE 22 [19] And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me. [20] Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, THIS CUP IS THE NEW TESTAMENT IN MY BLOOD, which is shed for you.

New testament...blood

HEBREWS 9 [1] Then verily THE FIRST COVENANT HAD ALSO ORDINANCES of divine service, and a worldly sanctuary. [9] Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;[10] WHICH STOOD ONLY IN MEATS AND DRINKS, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.[12] NEITHER BY THE BLOOD OF GOATS AND CALVES, BUT BY HIS OWN BLOOD he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

old covenant...blood of goats.....The meat and drink offerings

HEBREWS [4] FOR IT IS NOT POSSIBLE THAT THE BLOOD OF BULLS AND OF GOATS SHOULD TAKE AWAY SINS.[5] Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:[6] In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure.[7] Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.[8] Above when he said, sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein; which are offered by the law;[9] Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. HE TAKETH AWAY THE FIRST, THAT HE MAY ESTABLISH THE SECOND.

He taketh away the first {covenant}, that he may establish the second.

JOHN 6 [53] [54] Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day. [55] For MY FLESH IS MEAT INDEED, and MY BLOOD IS DRINK INDEED.

And theres the 2nd

But theres no mention of the blood in Jer.31. Its a whole different covenant

 

[WailingWall]

Hey Shimshon.... does the leader of north korea know the Lord?

 

[Shimshon]

You have misunderstood what I communicated, probably because you did not read past my initial statement. Let me try to clarify my intent.

[10] For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I WILL PUT MY LAWS INTO THEIR MIND, AND WRITE THEM IN THEIR HEARTS: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: [11] And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. [12] For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

In the context of knowing the Lord we were also discussing when God's laws are written on the heart and minds, as well as when we will be a people to God.

As John said we are now children of God, because of the Spirit that was sent to dwell within our hearts and minds, to teach us at a moments notice of all things, and remind us of ALL the Words of Messiah.

As prophesied and proved out in the above verses. In the new covenant made with Israel the Spirit is given to each 'believer'. This is how Messiah ministers the new covenant. His Spirit is upon our hearts and minds and we are Now God's people. We have no need to teach each other to 'know the Lord' because from the greatest to the least of us we have a living relationship with the God of the universe through the Spirit. We have entered the heavenly holy of holies. Where Messiah is ministering. In the Temple, our bodies.

You are not teaching nor proclaiming this message, that was given from the beginning. Your message misuses the law. Placing it in places God never placed it. Using it in ways it was not intended. This is the main issue with sects of Christianity that focus on 'the law' over Messiah and his Words. In this very conversation you questioned the fact that the law is being written upon the hearts of believers at this present time, the fact that as believers we are under and engaged within the new covenant spoken of in Jeremiah 31, and continually misrepresent the texts which indicate 'commandments' as if they all refer to the ministry of the old covenant. I'm accustom to debating these things with the self-defined Torah observant crowd. But I'll admit I've not spent much time trying to discuss the Gospel, the Torah of Messiah with the SDA. Who seem to have much stranger twist on 'the law' than I care to engage with at this time.

I pray you enjoy the rest of your Shabbat,

Shalom

 

[WailingWall]

I'm accustom to debating these things with the self-defined Torah observant crowd. But I'll admit I've not spent much time trying to discuss the Gospel, the Torah of Messiah with the SDA. Who seem to have much stranger twist on 'the law' than I care to engage with at this time.

I pray you enjoy the rest of your Shabbat,

Shalom

Good. Lets then debate. Im not SDA

 

[WailingWall]

In the new covenant made with Israel the Spirit is given to each 'believer'.

HEBREWS 3 [12]Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you AN EVIL HEART OF UNBELIEF, in departing from the living God. [13] But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. [14] For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end; [15] WHILE IT IS SAID, TO DAY IF YE WILL HEAR HIS VOICE, HARDEN NOT YOUR HEARTS, AS IN THE PROVOCATION. [16] For some, when they had heard, did provoke: howbeit not all that came OUT OF EGYPT by Moses. [17] But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, WHOSE CARCASES FELL IN THE WILDERNESS? [18] And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not? [19] So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief

Scripture above (out of Egypt - into the wilderness - those that believed not - destroyed them)

Scripture below (out of Egypt - into the wilderness - polluted HIS SABBATHS - destroyed them)

EZEK.20 [10] Wherefore I caused them to go forth OUT OF THE LAND OF EGYPT, and brought them INTO THE WILDERNESS. [11] And I gave them my statutes, and shewed them my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them.[12] Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the LORD that sanctify them.[13] But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness: they walked not in my statutes, and they despised my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; and MY SABBATHS THEY GREATLY POLLUTED: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them IN THE WILDERNESS, TO CONSUME THEM.

There it is. They were destroyed in the wilderness because they were not keeping Gods sabbath day. Dont walk with an evil heart of unbelief {Hebrews3v12}. Keep Gods sabbath day. Today hear His voice!

 

[Shimshon]

Good. Lets then debate. Im not SDA

Not my calling anymore. I've been shown that it is much more valuable to encourage and defend the little ones than to march off to war against every perceived false prophet. I believe in the teaching that one can not see unless it has been given them to be seen by God. I'm done trying to rip off the blinder of the Torah observant. But I'm more than willing to lay down my life for the Torah of Messiah. God will knock the bows out of every person who uses them against another. I know, my bow has been removed. Now I fight by the Spirit given me. Not by my own might. I have no need to teach you, because there is someone else who is supposed to be teaching you. Likewise, you have no need to teach me, because I already know the One who is the teacher. And if our faith was similar you would be acting in a similar way. Instead of by the impulses of the flesh, which leads to death.

I am Shimshon, and I'm done trying to rip off the blinders of the Torah observant. For which I was made blind. Now my only prayer is to strengthen me one more time with God's power so that I may proclaim the Torah of Messiah, even if it brings my flesh or reputation down to ruin. May Yeshua be glorified in all things. May I decrease and my he increase till my temple falls down around me. Because I know he will raise me in the last day. Not because of any work of the old covenant I did. I am and will be raised to newness of life. Because I ate the bread of faith. And walked it out in acts of kindness and love by the power of the Holy Spirit.

Shalom