The Law is external; the Spirit is internal

[pescador]

I have read many discussions about the Law vs the Spirit but most of them ignore a given fact...

The Law is external to the person. It is a set of written (and sometimes oral) requirements that governs a person's behavior from outside of them. We are told to do and what not to do according to a set of commands/rules that are not from within us.

The Spirit is internal to a person. Jesus sent us the Holy Spirit to guide us internally to do what God wants us to do. The Spirit is our guide and counselor; He is God living within us.

I have read post after post after post in which Christians are still thinking that they have to obey something external to us, whether it be the written Law or the teaching of some external hierarchy of priests and/or pastors, or some other external source. This is a denial of the New Covenant; if you're not governed by the part of the Godhead that lives within us, you're living under the Old Covenant, which has passed away.

 

[Josheb]

I have read many discussions about the Law vs the Spirit but most of them ignore a given fact...

The Law is external to the person. It is a set of written (and sometimes oral) requirements that governs a person's behavior from outside of them....

Except the laws of God are written on the human heart and written again in Christ. All humanity is moral. Sinful humans acting immorally is a testimony, evidence of that fact.

Jeremiah 31:33
"But this is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the LORD. I will put My law in their minds and inscribe it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they will be My people." (see also Heb. 10:16)​

In Deuteronomy God told the Jews,

Deuteronomy 6:4-9
" 4'Hear, O Israel! The LORD is our God, the LORD is one! 5You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might. 6These words, which I am commanding you today, shall be on your heart. 7You shall teach them diligently to your sons and shall talk of them when you sit in your house and when you walk by the way and when you lie down and when you rise up. 8You shall bind them as a sign on your hand and they shall be as frontals on your forehead. 9You shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates.'"​

And the religious leaders in Jesus' day took that literally but God did not want them literally to bind signs on their hands and heads. This was figurative language directing them to make His Law part of who and what they are: a holy and righteous people set apart by God, not their fleshly practice thereof.


The Law, properly understood, is not external. Sin has corrupted our understanding of the law to imagine it as an external but that is not the case.

 

[expos4ever]

I agree. The odd thing about this discussion is that those who insist the Law is still in force have the very odd challenge of explaining why this effectively relegates the Holy Spirit to the sidelines. And yet here is the job description of the Holy Spirit:

But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth

If someone claims that we need to look to the Law for guidance on how to live, that seems to encroach on a big chunk of "all truth".

 

[OldWiseGuy]

The law is a guard rail that keeps up from going over the cliff, and is very handy for those who wish to live on the edge. But, Christians shouldn't be anywhere near the edge of the cliff.

 

[pescador]

Except the laws of God are written on the human heart and written again in Christ. All humanity is moral. Sinful humans acting immorally is a testimony, evidence of that fact.

Jeremiah 31:33
"But this is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the LORD. I will put My law in their minds and inscribe it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they will be My people." (see also Heb. 10:16)​

In Deuteronomy God told the Jews,

Deuteronomy 6:4-9
" 4'Hear, O Israel! The LORD is our God, the LORD is one! 5You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might. 6These words, which I am commanding you today, shall be on your heart. 7You shall teach them diligently to your sons and shall talk of them when you sit in your house and when you walk by the way and when you lie down and when you rise up. 8You shall bind them as a sign on your hand and they shall be as frontals on your forehead. 9You shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates.'"​

And the religious leaders in Jesus' day took that literally but God did not want them literally to bind signs on their hands and heads. This was figurative language directing them to make His Law part of who and what they are: a holy and righteous people set apart by God, not their fleshly practice thereof.


The Law, properly understood, is not external. Sin has corrupted our understanding of the law to imagine it as an external but that is not the case.

Unfortunately you are wrong. The Law is external, whether it is the Ten Commandments or any other of the OT laws. They were written on parchment, etc., not on our hearts. Jesus gave us the Holy Spirit who guides us into all truth. Paul, a dedicated Jew, had this to say about the Law and the Spirit: "He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant--not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. 2 Corinthians 3:6 You might also want to read Romans, where this is developed more fully.

 

[Tolworth John]

As Christians we are not bound by, or required to obey the law in order that we are saved.

As Christians we are saved by Jesus's death and resurrection, however Jesus did say,

" If you Love me you will obey my Commands."

Jesus commands are to love as he loved us, which is the fulfillment of the the whole of the law.

To love God with all one's being and to love others as one loves oneself.

Who here is not going to obey Jesus and keep his commands because they Love Jesus.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Who here is not going to obey Jesus and keep his commands because they Love Jesus.

Each will obey Christ's commands as we understand them and as they apply to our lives. We are to "work out our own salvation..."

 

[Josheb]

Unfortunately you are wrong.

Scripture proves otherwise. I provided scripture explcitly stating the law is written on the human heart. In return I received a lack of parity and personal opinion.

The Law is external, whether it is the Ten Commandments or any other of the OT laws.

Scripture says otherwise.

They were written on parchment, etc., not on our hearts.

Writing the Law on parchment does not preclude it also being written on the human heart. A false dichotomy is being argued.

Jesus gave us the Holy Spirit who guides us into all truth.

Yes, he did and nothing I have posted should be construed to say otherwise.

Paul, a dedicated Jew, had this to say about the Law and the Spirit: "He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant--not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. 2 Corinthians 3:6 You might also want to read Romans, where this is developed more fully.

The letter killing does not preclude the law from being written on the human heart. A second false dichotomy is being argued!

I have already showed scripture declaring the law can be internal and is written on the human heart.

Jeremiah 31:31-33
"'Behold, days are coming,' declares the LORD, 'when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah, not like the covenant which I made with their fathers in the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband to them,' declares the LORD. 'But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days,' declares the LORD, 'I will put My law within them and on their heart I will write it; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people."​

How did Cain and Abel know to make offerings and how to make them correctly? How did Enoch know what to do to live blamelessly? How did Abraham know of sin? Sin reigned from the time of Adam until Moses (Romans 5). How then did any of them know if the moral design of creation was not ensconced in their being?

You must think of morality like gravity or the magnetic field. These are constituent elements of the entire creation, design features sown into its nature. Humans are moral creatures. So too are angels. For the latter no salvation is available. For us that is available. We can go back as in time as is possible and see that every human culture, no matter where in the world it is found, no matter how advanced or primitive, has codified conduct. Man is moral. He does not need an externally-written law to know somethings are wrong and somethings are not.

Romans 2:12-16
"For all who have sinned without the Law will also perish without the Law, and all who have sinned under the Law will be judged by the Law; for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified. For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus."​

Even the pagans who do not have the Law of Moses show the works of the law written on their hearts. Straight out of Romans.





Pay attention: The entire OP is built on an implicit dichotomy that is false.

The Law is external to the person.
The Spirit is internal to a person.​

That is what is stated. What is being argued is...

The Law is only external to the person and never internal to the person.
The Spirit is only internal within a person and never external to a person.​

Scripture tells us the oral/written law can and is both within and without. Likewise, scripture tells us the Spirit is also both within and without. The Spirit within me is the same Spirit within you but clearly there is a distinction otherwise we'd be in complete agreement. This can be seen more positively in the fact the New Testament was written by several different men, all under the inspiration of the Same Holy Spirit but each in different ways for diverse (sub-)purposes. We see this also in the fact there are seven billion people on the planet and every single one of them is made in the image of God but no two bear God's image identically; not even identical twins. None of the regenerate bear God's image in the way the regenerate bear God's image in Christ.


I don't know from where the teaching "The Law is external," arose but you should have been as critical of that teaching as you are of my posts. There isn't a single verse in the entire Bible explicitly stating "The Law is external." That is an inferential position based on an interpretation of scripture that ignores or neglects the scriptures I have provided that tell us the laws of God can be and are written on the human heart and written such that no human is without excuse. You have only inferences but I can and have pointed to scriptures that tell us the law is written on the human heart and known even by those who do not know God.

Romans 1:18-25
"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse. ....they exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator..."​

Furthermore, I am glad there was mention made of the oral law because before it was written it was spoken and the oral law necessarily means it was remembered. If it was remembered then it was recorded in the memory cells of the brain and that makes it internal.​

 

[pescador]

Except the laws of God are written on the human heart and written again in Christ. All humanity is moral. Sinful humans acting immorally is a testimony, evidence of that fact.

Jeremiah 31:33
"But this is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the LORD. I will put My law in their minds and inscribe it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they will be My people." (see also Heb. 10:16)​

In Deuteronomy God told the Jews,

Deuteronomy 6:4-9
" 4'Hear, O Israel! The LORD is our God, the LORD is one! 5You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might. 6These words, which I am commanding you today, shall be on your heart. 7You shall teach them diligently to your sons and shall talk of them when you sit in your house and when you walk by the way and when you lie down and when you rise up. 8You shall bind them as a sign on your hand and they shall be as frontals on your forehead. 9You shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates.'"​

And the religious leaders in Jesus' day took that literally but God did not want them literally to bind signs on their hands and heads. This was figurative language directing them to make His Law part of who and what they are: a holy and righteous people set apart by God, not their fleshly practice thereof.


The Law, properly understood, is not external. Sin has corrupted our understanding of the law to imagine it as an external but that is not the case.

Sorry, but the Old Testament law is external. It doesn't live within us or there would have been no need for Jesus to send us the Holy Spirit. "He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant--not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life." 2 Corinthians 3:6 and elsewhere.

 

[pescador]

Scripture proves otherwise. I provided scripture explcitly stating the law is written on the human heart. In return I received a lack of parity and personal opinion.

Scripture says otherwise.

Writing the Law on parchment does not preclude it also being written on the human heart. A false dichotomy is being argued.

Yes, he did and nothing I have posted should be construed to say otherwise.

The letter killing does not preclude the law from being written on the human heart. A second false dichotomy is being argued!

I have already showed scripture declaring the law can be internal and is written on the human heart.

Jeremiah 31:31-33
"'Behold, days are coming,' declares the LORD, 'when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah, not like the covenant which I made with their fathers in the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband to them,' declares the LORD. 'But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days,' declares the LORD, 'I will put My law within them and on their heart I will write it; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people."​

How did Cain and Abel know to make offerings and how to make them correctly? How did Enoch know what to do to live blamelessly? How did Abraham know of sin? Sin reigned from the time of Adam until Moses (Romans 5). How then did any of them know if the moral design of creation was not ensconced in their being?

You must think of morality like gravity or the magnetic field. These are constituent elements of the entire creation, design features sown into its nature. Humans are moral creatures. So too are angels. For the latter no salvation is available. For us that is available. We can go back as in time as is possible and see that every human culture, no matter where in the world it is found, no matter how advanced or primitive, has codified conduct. Man is moral. He does not need an externally-written law to know somethings are wrong and somethings are not.

Romans 2:12-16
"For all who have sinned without the Law will also perish without the Law, and all who have sinned under the Law will be judged by the Law; for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified. For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus."​

Even the pagans who do not have the Law of Moses show the works of the law written on their hearts. Straight out of Romans.





Pay attention: The entire OP is built on an implicit dichotomy that is false.

The Law is external to the person.
The Spirit is internal to a person.[/indent]

That is what is stated. What is being argued is...

The Law is only external to the person and never internal to the person.
The Spirit is only internal within a person and never external to a person.​

Scripture tells us the oral/written law can and is both within and without. Likewise, scripture tells us the Spirit is also both within and without. The Spirit within me is the same Spirit within you but clearly there is a distinction otherwise we'd be in complete agreement. This can be seen more positively in the fact the New Testament was written by several different men, all under the inspiration of the Same Holy Spirit but each in different ways for diverse (sub-)purposes. We see this also in the fact there are seven billion people on the planet and every single one of them is made in the image of God but no two bear God's image identically; not even identical twins. None of the regenerate bear God's image in the way the regenerate bear God's image in Christ.


I don't know from where the teaching "The Law is external," arose but you should have been as critical of that teaching as you are of my posts. There isn't a single verse in the entire Bible explicitly stating "The Law is external." That is an inferential position based on an interpretation of scripture that ignores or neglects the scriptures I have provided that tell us the laws of God can be and are written on the human heart and written such that no human is without excuse. You have only inferences but I can and have pointed to scriptures that tell us the law is written on the human heart and known even by those who do not know God.

Romans 1:18-25
"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse. ....they exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator..."​

Furthermore, I am glad there was mention made of the oral law because before it was written it was spoken and the oral law necessarily means it was remembered. If it was remembered then it was recorded in the memory cells of the brain and that makes it internal.
​

You might want to re-read Romans 7 with an open mind. Here is an excerpt: " So, my brothers and sisters, you also died to the law through the body of Christ, that you might belong to another, to him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit for God. For when we were in the realm of the flesh, the sinful passions aroused by the law were at work in us, so that we bore fruit for death. But now, by dying to what once bound us, we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code ... Once I was alive apart from the law; but when the commandment came, sin sprang to life and I died. I found that the very commandment that was intended to bring life actually brought death."

 

[Josheb]

Sorry, but the Old Testament law is external.

Argumentum ad nauseam

And you're not sorry.

You might want to re-read Romans 7 with an open mind. Here is an excerpt: " So, my brothers and sisters, you also died to the law through the body of Christ, that you might belong to another, to him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit for God.

Another pair of false dichotomies. The Old and New function cohesively as a single progressive revelation from God. Our having died to the law does not preclude the law from having been internal.

Your own arguments refute your position. You've repeatedly appealed to Romans 7, apparently in neglect of something bluntly stated therein,

Romans 7:5-6, 21-23
"For when we lived according to the flesh, the sinful passions aroused by the law were at work in our bodies, bearing fruit for death. But now, having died to what bound us, we have been released from the law, so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code...... So this is the principle I have discovered: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me, For in my inner being I delight in God’s law. But I see another law at work in my body, warring against the law of my mind and holding me captive to the law of sin that dwells within me.​

That would be the Law internal.

Big, big, big screw up. If the laws of God did not dwell within we would not struggle with sin; we would either be oblivious to sin or take delight in its temporary pleasures without a piqued conscience.

2 Timothy 3:16-17
"ALL Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work."​

"All" means all. The Law is part of scripture and as such it is profitable. It is no good as a means of attaining justification or righteousness but it remains veracious and efficacious for teaching, reproof, correction, training and equipping.

Colossians 3:12-17
"So, as those who have been chosen of God, holy and beloved, put on a heart of compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience; bearing with one another, and forgiving each other, whoever has a complaint against anyone; just as the Lord forgave you, so also should you. Beyond all these things put on love, which is the perfect bond of unity. Let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, to which indeed you were called in one body; and be thankful. Let the word of Christ richly dwell within you, with all wisdom teaching and admonishing one another with psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with thankfulness in your hearts to God. Whatever you do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks through Him to God the Father."​

John 5:37-38
"And the Father who sent Me, He has testified of Me. You have neither heard His voice at any time nor seen His form. You do not have His word abiding in you, for you do not believe Him whom He sent."​

Once again: I can point to verses explicitly stating the law, the commandments, the words are internal but I have yet to receive a single bit of parity. Everything I have received is entirely inferential and ignores what is stated. We've traded posts three times now. That is three opportunities to respond to the specifics posted without doing so.

I've been patient and kind so far but it is time to face the facts: this op does not correctly represent God's word. I'm going to stop debating the issue with you because each of your posts contains more and more eisegesis and logical fallacy. The posts already contain four or five false dichotomies, at least two straw men, highly interpretive views of scripture that ignore context (Romans 7 occurs within the already established contexts of the previous chapters), and you're ignoring what has been posted. Learn how to engage what has been posted with something other than "Nunh unh" and fallacy.

pescador, some of this topic is currently being vigorously debated in another recent op HERE. Read through the arguments to better understand the the nature of the Law. I also encourage and exhort you to pick up a copy of the Counterpoint Series book, "Four Views on Law and Gospel" edited by Stanley Gundry. The topic is much debated, even by some of the most knowledgeable and experienced among us but there is no excuse for not engaging the scriptures I have posted.

I'll see you in the next op.

 

[Tolworth John]

Each will obey Christ's commands as we understand them and as they apply to our lives. We are to "work out our own salvation..."

If you mean work out how we serve and follow Jesus I agree.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

If you mean work out how we serve and follow Jesus I agree.

We serve God by serving others.

 

[pescador]

Argumentum ad nauseam

And you're not sorry.

Another pair of false dichotomies. The Old and New function cohesively as a single progressive revelation from God. Our having died to the law does not preclude the law from having been internal.

Your own arguments refute your position. You've repeatedly appealed to Romans 7, apparently in neglect of something bluntly stated therein,

Romans 7:5-6, 21-23
"For when we lived according to the flesh, the sinful passions aroused by the law were at work in our bodies, bearing fruit for death. But now, having died to what bound us, we have been released from the law, so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code...... So this is the principle I have discovered: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me, For in my inner being I delight in God’s law. But I see another law at work in my body, warring against the law of my mind and holding me captive to the law of sin that dwells within me.​

That would be the Law internal.

Big, big, big screw up. If the laws of God did not dwell within we would not struggle with sin; we would either be oblivious to sin or take delight in its temporary pleasures without a piqued conscience.

2 Timothy 3:16-17
"ALL Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work."​

"All" means all. The Law is part of scripture and as such it is profitable. It is no good as a means of attaining justification or righteousness but it remains veracious and efficacious for teaching, reproof, correction, training and equipping.

Colossians 3:12-17
"So, as those who have been chosen of God, holy and beloved, put on a heart of compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience; bearing with one another, and forgiving each other, whoever has a complaint against anyone; just as the Lord forgave you, so also should you. Beyond all these things put on love, which is the perfect bond of unity. Let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, to which indeed you were called in one body; and be thankful. Let the word of Christ richly dwell within you, with all wisdom teaching and admonishing one another with psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with thankfulness in your hearts to God. Whatever you do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks through Him to God the Father."​

John 5:37-38
"And the Father who sent Me, He has testified of Me. You have neither heard His voice at any time nor seen His form. You do not have His word abiding in you, for you do not believe Him whom He sent."​

Once again: I can point to verses explicitly stating the law, the commandments, the words are internal but I have yet to receive a single bit of parity. Everything I have received is entirely inferential and ignores what is stated. We've traded posts three times now. That is three opportunities to respond to the specifics posted without doing so.

I've been patient and kind so far but it is time to face the facts: this op does not correctly represent God's word. I'm going to stop debating the issue with you because each of your posts contains more and more eisegesis and logical fallacy. The posts already contain four or five false dichotomies, at least two straw men, highly interpretive views of scripture that ignore context (Romans 7 occurs within the already established contexts of the previous chapters), and you're ignoring what has been posted. Learn how to engage what has been posted with something other than "Nunh unh" and fallacy.

pescador, some of this topic is currently being vigorously debated in another recent op HERE. Read through the arguments to better understand the the nature of the Law. I also encourage and exhort you to pick up a copy of the Counterpoint Series book, "Four Views on Law and Gospel" edited by Stanley Gundry. The topic is much debated, even by some of the most knowledgeable and experienced among us but there is no excuse for not engaging the scriptures I have posted.

I'll see you in the next op.

I'm going to stop debating the issue with you because each of your posts contains more and more eisegesis and logical fallacy.

Argumentum ad nauseam.

Bye. I won't see you there.

 

[Behold]

The Law, properly understood, is not external.

The power of sin is the Law. Romans 6
This is why Jesus came to "redeem us from the CURSE of the Law".
we are "Not under the law, but under GRACE" if we are born again.

 

[Josheb]

The power of sin is the Law. Romans 6
This is why Jesus came to "redeem us from the CURSE of the Law". We are "Not under the law, but under GRACE" if we are born again.

Yep. Nothing I have posted should be construed to say otherwise.

What does that have to do with whether the law is external or internal?

For what does the Romans say we are not under the law? Please be specific (the Romans 6 text is quite clear on this matter).

 

[Behold]

Yep. Nothing I have posted should be construed to say otherwise.

What does that have to do with whether the law is external or internal?

For what does the Romans say we are not under the law? Please be specific (the Romans 6 text is quite clear on this matter).

paul teaches that there are 2 "minds".. the mind of the Spirit, and the mind of the flesh.
Grace, is a dominion, and the Law is a dominion.
When a believer is as paul states...."that which i would do i dont do, and that which i should not do , that i do"......he is explaining that they are not walking "under Grace" but are instead walking in their "flesh" by trying to "be good", = self effort
When you do this, you are going to fail, repent, confess, fall, repent, confess, and always be sin conscious, as this is because "the POWER of SIN, is the Law".
So, as paul continues to teach, once he started walking in the right "mind", ..under the dominion of GRACE, then he had no more issues with sin, and always had the "Victory".

"you are not under the law, but UNDER GRACE".

If you don't live there, you will be a Christian failure.

 

[Josheb]

paul teaches that there are 2 "minds".. the mind of the Spirit, and the mind of the flesh.
Grace, is a dominion, and the Law is a dominion.
When a believer is as paul states...."that which i would do i dont do, and that which i should not do , that i do"......he is explaining that they are not walking "under Grace" but are instead walking in their "flesh" by trying to "be good", = self effort
When you do this, you are going to fail, repent, confess, fall, repent, confess, and always be sin conscious, as this is because "the POWER of SIN, is the Law".
So, as paul continues to teach, once he started walking in the right "mind", ..under the dominion of GRACE, then he had no more issues with sin, and always had the "Victory".

"you are not under the law, but UNDER GRACE".

If you don't live there, you will be a Christian failure.

The question asked was not answered.


The question asked was, "What does that have to do with whether the law is external or internal?"


You just quoted me asking you a question.
You just quoted me asking you a very specific question.
You just quoted me explicitly asking you a very specific question.
You just quoted me explicitly asking you a specific question and it was ignored!

Furthermore, 1) the content of that post has already been addressed AND 2) the content of that post proves the law is internal. because the "2 'minds'" are BOTH internal. When I am shown an externally-existing mind then I will reconsider but by asserting two minds what I have stated in all the posts above is confirmed.

The self is within us, not external to us. The laws of grace, the laws of mercy, the law of the Spirit, etc. all work within us. That entire post confirms everything I have stated so all that needed to be said was.....


"Yep, Josh, I completely agree. Well done."


And you need to post that content to the op because the op misguidedly believes the law is external when it is in fact internal. It is at work in our flesh. The laws of God are written on the human heart whether saved or unsaved and written anew thereon in Christ. The op has argued a false dichotomy believing the law being written on stone or parchment precludes it from also being written within.


So again I am going to ask you a single, plain, op-relevant, specific question:




What does post #15 have to do with whether the law is external or internal?

 

[Behold]

The question asked was not answered.


The question asked was, "What does that have to do with whether the law is external or internal?"

Its both.
It's written and its eternal.
You have what is listed, written in the Torah, and you have as Paul states.."i see a law"., that is internal.
There is also the dominion OF the law that is related to what is written and how it affects as an authority OVER an unbeliever.
When we are born again, we are "no longer UNDER the law, but UNDER Grace"

 

[Josheb]

Its both. It's written and its eternal.

EXternal.

This discussion is not about the law be eternal. This discussion is about the law being EXternal. Please read more carefully.

You have what is listed, written in the Torah, and you have as Paul states.."i see a law"., that is internal.

Tell it to the op; thatis where the assertion "the law is external" resides. It is right there in the title of the op.

There is also the dominion OF the law that is related to what is written and how it affects as an authority OVER an unbeliever.

Preaching to the choir.

When we are born again, we are "no longer UNDER the law, but UNDER Grace"

What does that have to do with whether the law is external or internal?


What does Paul explicitly state is the context for our no longer being under the law? How have I answered that question? Did I use scripture correctly to do so or not?