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The Last Hundred Years, or so...

Discussion in 'Baptists' started by Avid, Feb 5, 2015.

  1. Avid

    Avid A Pilgrim and a Sojourner...

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    In a recent eMail, a friend quoted info from one of his contacts that showed something that was said about concerns for the dawning of the 20th Century. These have been issues of concern for me, and I have discussed these on Christan websites for many years.

    What are your thoughts about the concerns of this prominent Missionary Leader who died over a hundred years ago? He was asked a question, that was asked of others as well, at the dawn of the 20th Century, and his comments are still relevant today.

    -------

    "What in your opinion is the chief danger, social or political, that confronts the coming century?"
    General William Booth, of the Salvation Army, replied to that question.


    I consider that the chief dangers which confront the coming century will be:

    1. Religion without the Holy Spirit
    2. Christianity without Christ
    3. Forgiveness without repentance
    4. Salvation without regeneration
    5. Politics without God
    6. Heaven without Hell

    Each point could have a thread on its own, and that may be next, depending on responses...
     
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  2. 98cwitr

    98cwitr Lord forgive me Staff Member Red Team - Moderator Supporter

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    Well he pretty much described every liberal Protestant church I've ever been to.

    During the "Words of Reassurance" at one Baptist church the pastor said

    "You are loved. You are forgiven. Thanks be to God."

    I can only question: Who is he talking to? If it's the entire congregation, how can this man see all 300 persons' fruits without knowing them? And if he doesn't, he just lied to everyone...especially the unregenerate sinners sitting in the pew.
     
  3. MWood

    MWood Newbie

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    When he said "you are loved" Its the truth. God loves everyone.

    When he said "you are forgiven" Its the truth. The blood on the Cross gives them that.

    Two very generic, benign terms. They apply to everyone, and makes everyone feel good.
     
  4. Avid

    Avid A Pilgrim and a Sojourner...

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    How does it give them that?
     
  5. 98cwitr

    98cwitr Lord forgive me Staff Member Red Team - Moderator Supporter

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    Everyone "feeling good" leads them straight to hell, when sinners are feeling good there is zero need for them to repent or believe anything.

    God doesn't love everyone, He can't based on The existence of Hell and reconciling that with 1 Cor 13 "Love always protects" and 1 John 5:18 "keeps them safe"

    God wouldn't and doesn't let those He loves wind up in Hell.

    If we are all forgiven then I have no reason to repent. Your post is preaching univeralism. Universalism is heresy.
     
  6. MWood

    MWood Newbie

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    You will find it written in Hebrews, "There is no forgiving of sins without the shedding of blood." Jesus did just that. He shed His blood for the sins of the world.
     
  7. 98cwitr

    98cwitr Lord forgive me Staff Member Red Team - Moderator Supporter

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    You will also find in Hebrews:

    26 If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, 27 but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God.
     
  8. MWood

    MWood Newbie

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    Feeling good doesn't lead anyone to hell. Everyone feels good at sometime in our lives. Unbelief will send a person to hell, and nothing else. We all sin. As long as we have fleshly bodies we will sin, and can't stop it.

    God loves everyone, and He wants everyone to be saved. But He knows that a majority of all of the peoples of the earth will not believe, so He has a hell waiting for them.

    Your sins are forgiven whether you accept it or not. If you don't repent then you are not in Jesus and He is not in you.

    I know nothing about universalism.
     
  9. 98cwitr

    98cwitr Lord forgive me Staff Member Red Team - Moderator Supporter

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    "feeling good" in the context of our convo is the "warm fuzzy" sermons that tell everyone that they are justified before God....falsely.

    If an unbeliever's sins are forgiven what then sends them to hell? Isn't unbelief a sin?

    Universalism is the doctrine that states that everyone eventually goes to heaven...everyone. I sure would like to see Scriptural support for your claim that God loves the damned.
     
  10. MWood

    MWood Newbie

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    That is right. Jesus is the last sacrifice. He will die no more.
     
  11. 98cwitr

    98cwitr Lord forgive me Staff Member Red Team - Moderator Supporter

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    That statement has nothing to do with the scripture posted.
     
  12. MWood

    MWood Newbie

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    As far as I know, unbelief is unbelief. I know not whether it is a sin.

    Then I am surely not a Universalist. Straight and narrow is the way and few will find it.
     
  13. MWood

    MWood Newbie

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    It has everything to do with "there will be no more sacrifice for sin."
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2015
  14. 98cwitr

    98cwitr Lord forgive me Staff Member Red Team - Moderator Supporter

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    So how do you reconcile God loving the unbeliever when faith comes from God? If He loved everyone, wouldnt He give faith to everyone?
     
  15. MWood

    MWood Newbie

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    I can't reconcile God in anything. God is God. Who am I to counsel God?

    God doesn't give you faith, He gives you salvation. Everyone has faith. Even little children have faith. God give you salvation because of your faith in Jesus being the Son of God, and your belief in His death, burial, and resurrection. Salvation is the gift of God, not faith.
     
  16. JLR1300

    JLR1300 Newbie

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  17. Avid

    Avid A Pilgrim and a Sojourner...

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    Thank you for professing the truth here.
    You shall have them boast of their Faith and Hope in God's Mercy, when they lie upon their death-bed; yea, you shall have them speak as confidently of their salvation, as if they had served God all their days: when the truth is, the bottom of this their boasting is, because they have no bands in their death.
    John Bunyan (1628−1688)
    [​IMG]

    A FEW Sighs From Hell,


    OR,
    THE GROANS OF The Damned Soul
    By That Poor and Contemptible
    Servant of JESUS CHRIST,

    JOHN BUNYAN. 1658.


    http://achristianspirit.com/Groans.html
     
  18. Avid

    Avid A Pilgrim and a Sojourner...

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    3. Forgiveness without repentance
     
  19. JLR1300

    JLR1300 Newbie

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    How can God love those who He doesn't give faith to? He says to hate our father and mother. That really means to love them less than Christ. So God doesn't really Hate the non-elect he really just loves them less.

    Now here is an illustration. Suppose there are 10 men who work in an office building. Suppose one of them is my son. Suppose I see a tornado heading straight for that building. So I go to the office building and yell, "Please everyone go to the basement right now. Let's say that none of them will listen. All refuse. Now I like all of those 10 men. I really don't want them to die. But I love my son more. In fact I love him so much that I go and drag him down to the basement. Even though I have some concern for the other men I do not go as far to try to save them. I just warn them but don't drag them. Now that is what God does.

    He has a type of concern for all men that we might call love. But He loves His elect more. In fact, although He warns all men about damnation and tells them to believe in Christ none will do so. So He allows them to be unbelieving... that is what they want. But in the case of the elect He gives them faith. Jesus said it like this, "No one can come to me unless the Father who sent Me draws him". The Greek word for draw here is "drag". It is the word used when Jesus talked to the woman at the well about drawing water. To draw water means to take hold of it and drag it to the top. We do not woo water. Here water, water, come to the top! When I draw a gun and shoot it I pull it by force. When I draw a sword I pull it by force. Peter used that word when He said that rich people were dragging Christians to court.

    You see, sinners are unbelieving and their sinfulness causes them to refuse to believe. But God elects some unconditionally and Opens their minds to see and know the truth. Therefore they believe. If I show you the truth about something you have to believe it. If you believe that the earth is flat and I take you up in a rocket and show you that it is round you cannot help after that but believe it is round because now you know it is. In the same way when the Spirit of God reveals the truth about Jesus to the elect sinner the sinner cannot help but believe it.

    When Paul preached to the gentiles in Acts 13:48 we read "and as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed." How many believed? As many as had been appointed.
     
  20. Avid

    Avid A Pilgrim and a Sojourner...

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    Scriptural backing for your opinions has already been requested, so this is at least the SECOND person and the SECOND request. Please provide something from the scriptures that shows how you arrive at this doctrine.
     
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