The Great Replacement

[TLK Valentine]

Have you considered adopting policies that people want to vote for?

That would make them Democrats.

 

[TLK Valentine]

I was with you, but the end stuck in my craw...

If all Democrats were moderates, Ron DeSantis wouldn't be as popular as he is. He only seems reasonable because people on the other side are advocating for things that are blatantly crazy.

That makes it sound like its the Dems' fault that conservativism is going off the deep end, and it's the same rationale that a domestic abuser uses on his victim: Look what you made me do! You think I want to be like this? If only you behaved yourself, I wouldn't have to be so rough on you...

 

[Eight Foot Manchild]

That would make them Democrats.

Not nececelery. There are popular policies that neither party is really platforming. If they wanted to, they could find a positive spin on prison reform, for example, that would appeal to their base.

That would take time and effort, though. Apparently, they’d rather just stick to the same garbage policies while relying on voter suppression, gerrymandering, and Republican affirmative action - AKA, the electoral college - for success.

 

[Mark Quayle]

That would make them Democrats.

Just because they make the most noise doesn't make them the majority.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Just because they make the most noise doesn't make them the majority.

True... the fact that they control the House, the Senate, and the Presidency makes them the majority...

...of course, soon that won't be the case anymore, and won't that be a shame... but soon after that, it will be again -- and the world keeps spinning.

 

[Danthemailman]

Donny Deutsch: Democrats losing on economy, so we need to 'scare' voters against ‘racist’ GOP

Donny Deutsch: Democrats losing on economy, so we need to 'scare' voters against ‘racist’ GOP

 

[RocksInMyHead]

Just because they make the most noise doesn't make them the majority.

True. The fact that they make up the largest subset of registered voters does give them a plurality though. There are over 49 million registered Democrats in the US. 36 million are registered as Republicans and 38 million are registered as Independent or a third party.

Partisan affiliations of registered voters - Ballotpedia

 

[ThatRobGuy]

That makes it sound like its the Dems' fault that conservativism is going off the deep end, and it's the same rationale that a domestic abuser uses on his victim: Look what you made me do! You think I want to be like this? If only you behaved yourself, I wouldn't have to be so rough on you...

It's not their fault the some GOP members are going off the deep end, but it is partially their fault that people are seeing them as the less reasonable option when compared to that.

That's why Spanberger and Clyburn have made similar critiques about some of the rhetoric and messaging coming out of their own party.

 

[variant]

If all Democrats were moderates, Ron DeSantis wouldn't be as popular as he is. He only seems reasonable because people on the other side are advocating for things that are blatantly crazy.

Ron DeSantis is popular because conservatives are increasingly blatantly crazy, which would be true no matter their opposition.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Ron DeSantis is popular because conservatives are increasingly blatantly crazy, which would be true no matter their opposition.

Actually, their opposition does matter...

Would DeSantis even have half the talking points and been able to score cheap points with his base with PR-stunt style bills if the Democratic party of today resembled the Democratic party of 2004 or 2008?

 

[PloverWing]

if the Democratic party of today resembled the Democratic party of 2004 or 2008?

What changes do you have in mind?

 

[ThatRobGuy]

What changes do you have in mind?

I would lean towards James Clyburn's recommendations as a starter

James Clyburn: 'Defund the police' cost Democrats seats, hurt BLM

Clyburn's comments also come alongside a broader Democratic reckoning about why the party underperformed expectations in races across the country.

The anger among House Democrats came to a boil during a private caucus call on Thursday where some members insisted that calls to "defund the police" and attacks tying Democrats to "socialism" cost several members their seats in Congress.

"I don't want us to allow sloganeering to hijack this movement & cause people of goodwill to resist making the changes we need to make," Clyburn said on MSNBC in June.

Abigail Spanberger had similar sentiments, stating that some of the messaging from the more progressive wing of the party almost cost her her own seat, and that it caused democrats to lose house races they should've won.


James Carville put it much more bluntly:
James Carville knows *exactly* why Democrats lost on Tuesday - CNNPolitics

James Carville knows exactly why his party lost so badly on Tuesday: “Stupid wokeness.”

That’s the blunt diagnosis of the man who famously guided Bill Clinton to the White House in the early 1990s.

“Don’t just look at Virginia and New Jersey,” Carville told PBS’ Judy Woodruff. “Look at Long Island, look at Buffalo, look at Minneapolis, even look at Seattle, Washington. I mean, this ‘defund the police’ lunacy, this take Abraham Lincoln’s name off of schools. I mean that — people see that.”

This is not a new view for Carville.

Back in July, in an interview with CNN’s Chris Cuomo, Carville said the party’s emphasis on “woke” issues was endangering its ability to keep its House and Senate majorities.

“We’re letting a noisy wing of our party define the rest of us. And my point is we can’t do that,” Carville told Cuomo. “I think these people are all kind of nice people. I think they’re very naive, and they’re all into language and identity. And that’s all right. They’re not storming the Capitol. But they’re not winning elections.”

 

[Belk]

Ron DeSantis is popular because conservatives are increasingly blatantly crazy, which would be true no matter their opposition.

But they are not. Certainly the crazy portion has gained prominence but to simply dismiss them as "crazy" is to summon the same defeat from the jaws of victory Democrats are so good at. I have a lot of conservatives for neighbors and they are decent hard working people of good will. The problem is Democrats keep coming off as authoritarian schmucks who are talking down to conservatives and ignoring them when they bring up valid issues.

We can't act like know it all do gooders and expect conservatives to simply fall in line.

 

[mark46]

Actually, their opposition does matter...

Would DeSantis even have half the talking points and been able to score cheap points with his base with PR-stunt style bills if the Democratic party of today resembled the Democratic party of 2004 or 2008?

DeSantis vs Harris in 2024 seems most likely, with a large Republican win.

I don't think that the Democrats will listen to Carville and Clyburn and continue with its liberal roots. It seems time for leftists to take over and fail yet again.

The left wing will control the party and self destruct as they have so many times before, starting in 1972 with McGovern. This is a center-right country, and center-right Democrats can have easy victories against the TRP. Of course, anyone not named Trump would have any easy time against a Sanders-type leftist.

A RACE TO WATCH
There is a House race today in Texas, with the moderate incumbent Democrat likely being ousted by a Sanders/Warren "progressive". In 2020, Biden took the district by 5, the incumbent by 20. The incumbent might win. The progressive would lose by at least 10%.

 

[TLK Valentine]

DeSantis vs Harris in 2024 seems most likely, with a large Republican win.

I would think Pence vs Harris... Desantis is branding himself as Donald II, and anyone interested in that would vote for Donald I.

Even with my players, I agree that it would be a large Republican win.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

I would think Pence vs Harris... Desantis is branding himself as Donald II, and anyone interested in that would vote for Donald I.

Even with my players, I agree that it would be a large Republican win.

Until Donny starts spouting off about how much better he is than Ronny, comes up with one of his nicknames like "Dirty DeSantis" and their egos collide and sub-factions form.

Trump was already making those kinds of remarks back in October.
“If I faced him, I’d beat him like I would beat everyone else,” Trump said during an interview with Yahoo Finance Live, set to be released on Monday.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Until Donny starts spouting off about how much better he is than Ronny, comes up with one of his nicknames like "Dirty DeSantis" and their egos collide and sub-factions form.

Trump was already making those kinds of remarks back in October.
“If I faced him, I’d beat him like I would beat everyone else,” Trump said during an interview with Yahoo Finance Live, set to be released on Monday.

My point exactly -- those interested in Donaldesque antics will be splitting their vote between either Donald or any of his wannabes.

I don't know if sanity is a majority opinion in the GOP anymore, but at least the vote won't be diluted.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

My point exactly -- those interested in Donaldesque antics will be splitting their vote between either Donald or any of his wannabes.

I don't know if sanity is a majority opinion in the GOP anymore, but at least the vote won't be diluted.

Maybe there's still hope that the GOP will get on board with someone like this:
Libertarian VP nominee Bill Weld: full interview - CNN Video

Bill Weld ran as VP on the libertarian ticket, but his history as governor was that of being someone who was very popular (on the GOP ticket) even among democratic voters.

 

[mark46]

I would think Pence vs Harris... Desantis is branding himself as Donald II, and anyone interested in that would vote for Donald I.

Even with my players, I agree that it would be a large Republican win.

Pence would be a huge step forward for the Republican Party. To be clear, I am NOT talking about policy. Pence is as conservative as they come, and has been on the wrong side of all the social and safety net issues. That being said, he is someone who accepts the 2020 election. the rule of law, and who wants to look forward.

Curiously, Pence and the GA republicans have led the effort to accept the results of elections. IMO, a bi-partisan election bill limiting the intervention by state legislatures in the certification of elections will pass the Senate, even if the Republicans control that body. Kemp and Raffensperger have been profiles in courage, risking their lives and careers to oppose Trump and certify the GA elections, and now to run against Trump candidates.

 

[mark46]

I don't know if sanity is a majority opinion in the GOP anymore, but at least the vote won't be diluted.[/QUOTE]

not a majority opinion, certainly not among the rank and file

However, in GA sanity may in fact be a majority opinion, as it was in 2020 and 2021.