The Fascinating World of Eastern Orthodox Old Calendarists

[The Liturgist]

Someone changed the times, but I didn't start the fire. type deal then.

Eh?

(no pun intended)

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Eh?

(no pun intended)

good one.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

King Solomon is a Saint and a Holy Prophet. Did he sin? Yes, like all men. But he repented. And he wrote Proverbs, the Song of Solomon, Ecclesiastes, Psalms 72 and 127, and at least some of the sayings collected in the Book of Wisdom (Ecclesiasticus), making him one of the most important writers of the Old Testament, along with the Prophets St. Jeremiah, St. Moses and the other contributors to the Pentateuch and Joshua.*

So how would Nero compare to Solomon? The difference between Nero and Solomon is like the difference between the devil and St. Michael the Archangel. Both are the same sort of being: Nero and St. Solomon are men, and the devil and St. Michael are angels; all four are rulers, but the devil is a fallen angel and Nero was a selfish genocidal anti-Christian monster, both of whom are beasts, while St. Michael is a ruling angel and King Solomon is a King of Israel, both of whom are Saints; King Solomon and St. Michael defend the righteous, whereas Nero and the devil falsely accuse the innocent, and finally, King Solomon built the first Temple in which the true God, who we know as the Blessed Trinity was worshipped by Israel and a choir of Angels, while Nero built a temple to himself, a luxury palace where Nero, falsely claiming divinity like his predecessors, was worshipped by sycophants and mocked by a band of demons.

At a minimum, someone wrote the ending of Deuteronomy, and ai suspect Joshua was written by someone involved in the Torah due to a known stylistic similarity which causes some scholars to speak of a Hexateuch (and even a Heptateuch, including Judges, since this and Joshua comprise together with the Torah the Deureronomistic History; there is also the Octateuch, which includes Ruth, but this is simply because in the Septuagint and the Ethiopian Ge’ez Bible, which was translated from partially lost Hebrew sources (some of which were recovered in the Qumran Caves), and it is used in the Ethiopian Orthodox Church (and probably among tne Ethiopian Jews, the Beta Israel) as a liturgical construct in ordering of services, the Orit).

** There is evidence the ancient Hebrews knew of the Trinity at one time, but had by the time of Christ due to the pernicious false dichotomy of Phariseeism and Sadduceanism effectively forgotten this truth, but the existence of the concepts of the Memre (Logos) and Ruach-ha-kodesh, which the early Church was able to use to explain the Trinity with great ease to the Jews, converting most of the Jews in Greece, Italy, Egypt, Ethiopia, Syria, the Nineveh Plains and Assyria more generally, Persia and Mesopotamia, and India, and a large number in Judaea and Galilee, who thrived in places like Caesarea even after the Bar Kochba Revolt, I estimate as many as half of the Jewish population converted, including about 15-20% of those in Judaea, many of whose descendants are in the Syriac, Ethiopian, Eritrean, Coptic, Indian, Antiochian, Assyrian, Chaldean and Maronite churches, including where applicable Orthodox, Catholic and Protestant branches (for example, in the churches of the Mar Thoma Christians of Malankara), and among the membership of the Greek Orthodox Patriarchates of Jerusalem, Alexandria and Constantinople, and the Churches of Greece and Cyprus. I would also note the Shewbread and Libations at the Temple in Jerusalem anticipated the Eucharist, consisting, like Holy Communion, of bread and wine, however, it must be stressed that they were an anticipation or a prophecy of the means by which we partake of the one all sufficient sacrifice of Christ in the divine liturgy of Holy Communion. We also see such anticipation in the sacrifice of bread and wine to Melchizedek.

*** Roman Emperors were pronounced divine in what was called Apotheosis, which is not to be confused in the Patristic belief in salvation through Theosis, which John Wesley called Entire Sanctification. There is an allegorical painting on the interior of the dome of the US Capitol called The Apotheosis of George Washington, which, while beautiful, I believe would infuriate President Washington, who was an Anglican, and extremely humble, rejecting a proposed stlye which I recall was something like “His Excellency, the Honorable President of the United States and Defender of our Liberties” in favor of “The President of the United States” and introducing the convention of serving two terms only, which was violated only by FDR before being added to the Constiution. I also believe it violates the First Amendment. Therefore because of my admiration for President Washington and my desire to protect the rights of Christians, at some point I intend to start a movement seeking to have the current fresco removed and installed in a replica of the dome in the Smithsonian, due to its historical value, and instead have the interior of the dome gilded using some of the considerable quantity of bullion the US government has in reserve. Indeed since the all gold in Fort Knox is of little political value compared to even one nuclear warhead, I believe that at least half of it should be used to gild the domes and roofs of public buildings and also leased to private buildings including religious buildings on an equal access basis, for use only as architectural material (with requirements for security and the government reserving the right to reclaim the gold, using a deposit the private parties would pay upfront, if the building changed owners, was not properly secured or was set to be demolished or undergo major construction) in order to beautify the landscape. I believe this initiative would be supporter by President Washington.

As should be evident, aside from publicly defending the Christian faith and morality and the human right to life, I only have political positions on issues no one cares about, like mass transit, power distribution infrastructure, the architecture of government buildings, uniforms for the military and first responders, and aviation policy.

Thanks for sharing that detailed explanation, it makes sense. For some reason my eyes have been calibrated to see different things in world leaders.

The mention of the word "nuclear" (and this topic) reminds me of another idea I've had on calling down fire in plain sight of men, that being a nuke bomb or cruise missile.

 

[chevyontheriver]

So interestingly enough, the Gregorian Calendar’s innovation is only temporary, in that the Earth’s rotation is slowing and over the course of a few hundred thousand years, give or take an order of magnitude or two (I haven’t done the math and I didn’t sleep last night, but someone here can do the math and work it out) the Julian Calendar will correct itself. Now, given this is very nearly a geological timescale, you might scoff at it, but I am extremely tired of people saying we are in the end times, when Jesus Christ said “No one knows the day or the hour except our Father in Heaven.” He also said, and the apostles said, that very soon we would be with him, or he would be coming, but I interpret this as a Memento Mori, in that Jesus Christ has saved us and will save us through His choirs of angels after we die.*

So, since we don’t know when Christ Pantocrator will return in glory to judge the quick and the dead, we should consider the possibility of our existence in the far future. I liked the introduction of the Feast of Christ the King in the 1920s by several churches, and the division of Tempus per Annum into a Post Pentecost season and a Kingdomtide season at several churches, for example the Methodist Episcopal Church, with the theme being the Christianization of the world, which I think is vital. Unfortunately the United Methodist Church and the other mainline churches apparently wavered on this concept; Kingdomtide as a liturgical season was dropped in the 1989 Book of Worship. But I wish it would be restored. I am opposed to Ordinary Time in liturgical calendars.

Also, the Revised Julian Calendar is slightly more accurate than the Gregorian, given the current speed of the Earth’s rotation, which means in a few centuries it will drift apart, meaning that the Orthodox fixed feasts will slip out of alignment with the Gregorian; indeed I think the days of the week could become misaligned. Which is one more reason why I favor an Gregorian or Julian approach.

*I don’t interpret the Patristic doctrine sometimes referred to as “aerial tollhouses” literally like the monks at Elder Ephrem’s monastery in Florence, Arisona, may his memory be eternal, who I once met, by accident, although perhaps I should because he is the only human I have personally encountered who I think had the gift of tongues, insofar as he communicated with me a wealth of emotions, ideas and concepts without us speaking at all; it was not telepathy, but certain very subtle gestures and facial expressions, and I already venerate him as Blessed and intend to commission an icon of him at some point. The extremely literal interpretation promoted by the monks seems possible but unlikely.

However, I do like the doctrine interpreted in an Alexandrian way, in the manner suggested by Fr. Seraphim Rose, memory eternal, who I also regard as blessed, and indeed I hope he is glorified; he successfully overcame his homosexuality and the corrupt decadence of the notorious North Beach of San Francisco in the 1950s, which was like a cross between Nashville and West Hollywood, the home of the Beatniks, whose Nihilistic doctrine and music developed into the horrible counterculture of the 1960s.**

Repudiating that life, he became a monk, and a priest, and finally the founder of of St. Herman of Alaska Monastery in Platina, California, north of Redding and Red Bluff, in the mountains separating what I wish I could still call the Golden State with a straight face from Oregon; this is the most austere Orthodox monastery in the Lower 48, possibly in the entire country, a monastery with no air conditioning and only wood stoves, and no electricity in most of the complex. Basically, its amenities are equivalent to those at St. Catharine’s Monastery in Sinai, or on Mount Athos, or at some of the more austere Roman Catholic monasteries in Europe. And he wrote three brilliant books: a denunciation of Nihilist philosophy, Orthodoxy and the Religion of the Future, which predicted the problems with New Age cults, and The Soul After Death, which outlines the Patristic doctrine but advocates a non-literal interpretation of what is often rather crudely termed “Aerial Toll Houses,” which is still a terrifying doctrine under most interpretations, but then again, so is our own mortality. Indeed, I believe purgatory became popular as an alternative doctrine because it was less frightening.

Interpreted in a certain way however, the idea that after we die our faith in Christ results in angels delivering us from demons who accuse us of sins we committed and slander us, so we cannot offer a defense because we are guilty of enough so that the distorted version could not be disproven without implicating ourselves in something else. Our only hope is our faith in Christ, which involves good works, as St. James said; if we have an nominal faith in Christ but neglect our neighbor, our faith is dead. But we will be saved if we have faith, which requires us to practice the virtues as best we can, and to seek to be baptized to wash away our sins and any demons (Orthodox baptism contains an exorcism and I assume so too does Roman Catholic), and to receive both Chrismation (confirmation) to provide the seal of the Holy Spirit, and Holy Communion, the medicine of immortality, for the remission of sins and life everlasting, which we must prepare for with Confession, which in some cases should be auricular, and also if needed Holy Unction, Holy Matrimony and Holy Orders, available for the healing of infirmities, the sanctification of marriage (I believe marriages between one man and one woman performed by the Christian Church are uniquely blessed and holy, to the extent that while people married outside the church are in wedlock, they are not in Holy Matrimony; sacramental marriage belongs to the Church and can only happen with her blessing), and the consecration of vocations for ecclesiastical service.

That faith allows the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, enabling us to do good works, and causing us to be counted among the lambs; we receive a Guardian Angel, and when we die, our angel and many others will protect us from the slander of the minions of the Accuser. So that is my interpretation of Patristic soteriology. Of course, Purgatory is a possibility; I personally consider it much more likely than soul sleep, but less likely than the Patristic doctrine.

**This counterculture also is a major reason why I reject rock music as completely unsuitable for worship; I believe electric guitars, regular guitars and drum kits should be removed from every church in every theologically traditional denomination, for example, the Roman Catholic and Maronite Catholic churches, the Presbyterian Church of America, the Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod, the Anglican Church of North America, and the Southern Baptist Convention, just to name a few.

Only music instruments traditional to the rite should be allowed, and if unavailable, a cappella singing should be the standby, and everyone who attends church who can sing should be encouraged to learn Plainsong, Gregorian Chant, Anglican Chant, Byzantine Chant, Coptic Tasbeha, West Syriac Chant, Kievan Chant, Slavonic “Greek” Chant, or whatever the most basic traditional form of chant used in their church is. For Southern Baptists this would be a cappella square note singing using the famous Southern Harmony hymnal, for example, and for Congregationalists this would probably be using the Bay Psalter. But I digress.

The calendar we are all following in daily use is Gregorian BUT now with the addition of leap seconds. As such it is a perpetual calendar that precisely maps the actual year and day. Gregory’s formula has been improved upon to match actual observed data.

We could use a common liturgical calendar but I don’t see much chance of it. But we can dream.

 

[The Liturgist]

The calendar we are all following in daily use is Gregorian BUT now with the addition of leap seconds. As such it is a perpetual calendar that precisely maps the actual year and day. Gregory’s formula has been improved upon to match actual observed data.

We could use a common liturgical calendar but I don’t see much chance of it. But we can dream.

My understanding is that these leap seconds are actually in a sense now being applied to the Julian, in that the Julian calendar is increasingly defined as a fixed offset from the Gregorian to prevent problems like Sunday drifting to Monday.

I need to look into this.

 

[Leaf473]

We could use a common liturgical calendar but I don’t see much chance of it. But we can dream.

This came to my mind from John 17
"...that they may all be one."

Lord, hear our prayer.

 

[chevyontheriver]

My understanding is that these leap seconds are actually in a sense now being applied to the Julian, in that the Julian calendar is increasingly defined as a fixed offset from the Gregorian to prevent problems like Sunday drifting to Monday.

I need to look into this.

Interesting.

If we had 24:00:00:00 days then Sunday wouldn't drift into Monday. But our days are actually a little bit variable. And so are our years. So leap seconds make a good deal of sense to keep things aligned long term. Keep days and years days and years no matter how fast the earth spins or orbits the sun. The week is fine as it is as long as a (Cesium clock) day is a (physical) day.

I wouldn't care which of the two calendars as long as Spring is in Spring. But just as the Muslim (strict lunar) calendar drifts (a lot), a fixed calendar will always drift at least a bit. The Muslim calendar drift means that sometimes Ramadan is in planting season (and planters are too weak to plant) or in harvest season (and harvesters are too weak to harvest). That's their preference. The preference of pope Gregory was to have Easter in Spring, rather than to have it drift around the physical seasons. He more or less fixed that, and with leap seconds it is actually fixed. So now it would be good for us all to have a common calendar, and also to have a calendar where Easter was in Spring. If leap seconds have fixed the calendar(s) then all we need is one big fat ecumenical agreement. Ha! Sorry.

 

[Leaf473]

The Muslim calendar drift means that sometimes Ramadan is in planting season (and planters are too weak to plant) or in harvest season (and harvesters are too weak to harvest).

Fascinating! How fast does it drift? As in, how many years to move from Spring to Fall?

 

[chevyontheriver]

Fascinating! How fast does it drift? As in, how many years to move from Spring to Fall?

The Muslim month is 28 days. So it drifts 2.5 days per month or 30 days a year. So every three years it is in a different season. But they seem to think it's fine. Jewish and Christian sentiment is to have the calendar aligned with the seasons. So there has long been a correction, even in Jewish lunar month calendars.

 

[The Liturgist]

Interesting.

If we had 24:00:00:00 days then Sunday wouldn't drift into Monday. But our days are actually a little bit variable. And so are our years. So leap seconds make a good deal of sense to keep things aligned long term. Keep days and years days and years no matter how fast the earth spins or orbits the sun. The week is fine as it is as long as a (Cesium clock) day is a (physical) day.

I wouldn't care which of the two calendars as long as Spring is in Spring. But just as the Muslim (strict lunar) calendar drifts (a lot), a fixed calendar will always drift at least a bit. The Muslim calendar drift means that sometimes Ramadan is in planting season (and planters are too weak to plant) or in harvest season (and harvesters are too weak to harvest). That's their preference. The preference of pope Gregory was to have Easter in Spring, rather than to have it drift around the physical seasons. He more or less fixed that, and with leap seconds it is actually fixed. So now it would be good for us all to have a common calendar, and also to have a calendar where Easter was in Spring. If leap seconds have fixed the calendar(s) then all we need is one big fat ecumenical agreement. Ha! Sorry.

The problem is threefold: firstly, there is no way for a new council to be addressed to fix the issue, and some proposals, such as the idea floated by Pope Francis, Justin Welby and, allegedly, Pope Tawadros II, of celebrating Pascha on the Second Sunday of April caused a lot of disquiet, and if attempted, would cause a massive schism. Frankly, I see no way that the Orthodox, most Catholics, most Anglicans and most liturgical Christians, nor the Messianic Jews who have revived Quartodecimianism, would go for that. Some mainline churches might, but if they did they would likely see a further decline in membership.

Secondly, Pope Gregory XV overcompensated, which results in the ancient canons mandating Pascha happen after the Jewish passover being transgressed. And due to certain miracles not happening in the Holy Land, for example, the Holy Fire, when an attempt to use the Gregorian Calendar was made around 1920, all of the Eastern churches in Jerusalem reverted to the Julian Calendar.

Thirdly, and perhaps most importantly, the Church already had a “big fat Ecumenical agreement,” the Holy First Ecumenical Council of Nicaea, where 318 pious Fathers anathematized Arianism, enacted 20 canons, the first of which prohibited men who voluntarily castrate themselves or have themselves castrated without a medical justification (for example, cancer of the prostate or the male genitals) from being ordained to any office, even that of a doorkeeper, canons VI and VII which establish the autocephaly of the church of Jerusalem and acknowledge officially, lest there be no further confusion as happened under Archbishop Victor of Rome, that the churches of Alexandria and Antioch were autocephalous and had the same rights and privileges as Rome, and these were granted to Jerusalem, which was being rebuilt thanks to St. Helena, the Christian mother of Emperor Constantine, who had recently rediscovered the True Cross, which was used to miraculously resurrect a recently deceased man, and also Canon XX, which peohibits kneeling or prostration during Eastertide (the days until Pentecost) and on all Sundays throughout the year, which Rome and several other churches are violating. Note the Eastern Orthodox kneeling vespers after the Divine Liturgy on Pentecost Sunday is not a violation, since being a Vespers, it causes the liturgical day to advance to Monday. However, I have been told, albeit by one deacon who may have been mistaken, but who does have an MDiv and will probably be a priest, that the Syriac Orthodox service which looks identical to Kneeling Vespers, is not a Vespers, and unless there exists a rubric which one might call an “antihesperinos” (meaning in place of Vespers, basically, a rubric or liturgical device that would advance the liturgical day to Monday without celebrating Vespers, for example, by making the kneeling service a substitute for Vespers), then that would be a violation of Canon XX.

Of course, since we are talking about an Eastern church, the bishops could also theoretically grant their parishes oikonomia to celebrate the kneeling service without celebrating Ramsho (Syriac Orthodox Vespers) beforehand.

By the way, much of the complexity in the Eastern liturgical calendars, especially the Byzantine, involves the fact that Vespers, like in the Roman calendar, represents the start of a new liturgical day; whereaw things get strange is with Vesperal Divine Liturgies and the Presanctified Liturgy, because the these advance the liturgical day at their completion, (allowing a Vesperal Divine Liturgy on Christmas Eve, or the Paschal Matins and Divine Liturgy to start late on Holy Saturday, because the Vesperal Divine Liturgy served on the morning of Holy Saturday, which used to be the practice in the Roman Rite (the two services, the Vigils Mass on the morning of Easter Even and the Vesperal Divine Liturgy were extremely similiar, in that the former has twelve, and the latter fourteen, Old Testament lessons, read while people were being baptized, with more added if need be; in the Byzantine Rite a Vesperal Divine Liturgy has a Synaxis, or Liturgy of the Word, which is basically Vespers, as does the Presanctified Liturgy of St. Gregory, which again, Rome used to celebrate on Good Friday, until Pope Pius XII changed all of it in 1952-1955, something which the New Liturgical Movement and other traditional mass groups within the Roman church, but curiously, not the SSPX, are trying to revert). Consequently, when there is a Vesperal Divine Liturgy, usually the Typikon also calls for a Typika service (the Synaxis or Liturgy of the Word, with no Eucharist, equivalent to the Roman Missa Sicca and Missa Venatoris, and the Anglican Ante-Communion) in the morning, at the time when the liturgy would usually be served, except on Holy Thursday and Holy Saturday, when the Vesperal Divine Liturgy is served in the morning. This means the Twelve Gospels Service on the evening of Maundy Thursday, which closely resembles the Western Tenebrae service and uses candelabras with 12 candles, which closely resemble the Tenebrae Hearse, is actually Matins for Great and Holy Friday.

Now, aside from enacting the canons that led to all of that gloriously ornate liturgical sequencing, the Council of Nicaea did two other important things concerning the liturgy: firstly, they adopted the Nicene Creed, which would be further revised at Constantinople in 381, which would eventually be tead or sung at all services in the Eastern Churches, and at the Sunday and Festal Eucharist except on Trinity Sunday in the West, when Quincunque Vult was used, a creed also traditionally read or sung at Prime, and the Apostles Creed at weekday masses, and in Anglicanism, at the Divine Office, except on Trinity Sunday, except in the Episcopal Church, which from its foundation never accepted Quincunque Vult, also known as the Athanasian Creed despite St. Athanasius almost certainly not writing it (I mean, why would he, when he spent his lifetime defending the Nicene Creed and Nicene Christianity from the Arians? Unless it was a different St. Athanasius that no one remembers who just happens to have really been into Christology, Triadology and Dogmatic Theology, and who was good at it). I presume this is due to the clauses that state rejecting that creed will prevent salvation. This gets sticky when we consider there is an Eastern Orthodox version, which was translated into English by the monks at Holy Trinity Jordanville, which lacks the filioque. As to which one is older, who knows? (Unlike in the case of the Nicene Creed, where we know the Spanish church added the Filioque in an ill-advised move due to a severe outbreak of the Adoptionist heresy, and Charlemagne thought it was a good idea and actually pressured the Roman church into accepting it, which eventually happened, leading to the Photian Schism which was ended by what some Orthodox called the Eighth Ecumenical Council, wherein the Roman church agreed to drop the filioque, only to have another synod a few decades later where they decided to reinstate it, but this did not cause the Great Schism. I suspect had things happened differently in the eleventh century, there would still be one Chalcedonian Church, maybe two, if the Maronites remained independent, assuming they were Chalcedonian, unlike the Syriac Orthodox they separated from (many believe this was because the Maronites embraced Monothelitism; given this doctrine was pushed by Pope Honorius I, this may explain their argument that they had always regarded themselves as being an ally of the Roman Catholic Church subject to the Pope, which I prefer to believe over the cynical explanation favored by some historians who say the Maronites joined the Catholic Church to benefit from the political power of the Crusading Armies).

The other important liturgical decision made at Nicaea was to standardize the Paschalion, or Computus, used to calculate the date of Pascha, ending Quartodecimianism and the use of the Hebrew Calendar in favor of the Julian calendar. Rome and several other churches had been using the computus since the second century, so for most Christians except those in Asia Minor and a few other locales, this was not a major change.

Part of the Old Calendarist argument is that because this issue was settled by the Council of Nicaea, it would either take another ecumenical council to change it, or it cannot be changed, since any council presuming to change the decisions of the Seven Ecumenical Councils would automatically become a Latrocinium. Many Eastern Orthodox Christians who are members of the canonical churches, or the “World Orthodox” as Old Calendarists call them, also feel this way, which is why either the Julian or the Revised Julian Calendar is in use.

Frankly, I would use the Julian Calendar if I could get away with it, but various factors including the heat in the desert, my congregations being at present entirely Western, and wanting to celebrate Christmas at the usual date, and the commercialization being less offensive and more tasteful in the regions of the small towns around Las Vegas and the Mojave Desert, which have a conservative population dominated by Christians and Mormons, unlike, for instance, Los Angeles, make it unsuitable in terms of pastoral care.

 

[The Liturgist]

Fascinating! How fast does it drift? As in, how many years to move from Spring to Fall?

Remarkably fast. I remember in the late 90s (98 or 99 I think) Hilary Clinton extending positive wishes or blessings to Christians, Jews and Muslims celebrating Christmas, Chanukah, and Ramadan, with Ramadan being in early December that year. She may also have wished well or blessed the African Americans celebrating Kwanzaa, which was extremely popular in the 90s; frankly I can’t remember.

 

[Not David]

The thread should have been posted in the Orthodox forum, not enough non-Orthodox care about Old Calendarists, and not enough Orthodox care about leaving TAW.

 

[The Liturgist]

The thread should have been posted in the Orthodox forum, not enough non-Orthodox care about Old Calendarists, and not enough Orthodox care about leaving TAW.

Forgive me, but the whole point of this thread was to talk about Orthodox Old Calendarists with people of multiple ecumenical backgrounds, most of whom I assumed would never have heard of them.

 

[chevyontheriver]

The thread should have been posted in the Orthodox forum, not enough non-Orthodox care about Old Calendarists, and not enough Orthodox care about leaving TAW.

This thread ran to 31 posts outside of TAW, which is not a bad run. It has allowed people who might not post in or read something in TAW the opportunity to read or post here. You could always start a parallel post in TAW but this seems fine where it has been.

 

[prodromos]

I had no idea this thread existed until now.

 

[prodromos]

Rejection of the Gregorian calendar is a matter of rejecting the pope, which is often a far more powerful negative motivator than following the science as a positive motivator. I think it boils down to nothing other than that.

I don't know if you will believe it, but the papacy wasn't even on the radar of reasons for not accepting the Gregorian calendar. It still isn't.

 

[chevyontheriver]

I don't know if you will believe it, but the papacy wasn't even on the radar of reasons for not accepting the Gregorian calendar. It still isn't.

So was it simply that no change is possible?

 

[prodromos]

So was it simply that no change is possible?

Many annually occurring miracles occur on the feast days according to the Julian calendar. I don't believe that would change unless there was another Council led by the Holy Spirit as was Nicaea, which unanimously decided to adjust the calendar.

 

[prodromos]

I personally would prefer the Church remained on the Julian calendar as it would seperate completely the christian celebration of the feast days from the secular celebration of the same. It means I would have to take annual leave on those days as the public holidays would not correspond, but it is a sacrifice I would willingly make.

 

[chevyontheriver]

Many annually occurring miracles occur on the feast days according to the Julian calendar. I don't believe that would change unless there was another Council led by the Holy Spirit as was Nicaea, which unanimously decided to adjust the calendar.

I wish there could be such a Council but hold out little hope that it could happen. Would the Old Calendrists come to such a council?

I personally would prefer the Church remained on the Julian calendar as it would seperate completely the christian celebration of the feast days from the secular celebration of the same. It means I would have to take annual leave on those days as the public holidays would not correspond, but it is a sacrifice I would willingly make.

That makes some real sense.

I do think the Gregorian calendar solved seasonal drift and the addition of leap seconds keeps days, and thus weeks properly defined.

Nicea intended for us all to be on the same page. And now we’re not.