The false charismatic unification to the apostate Nicolaiton assemblies.

[Alithis]

This one may bite ..
_____________
Sometimes we see things in a bigger picture but ,though bigger ,the picture is still complex.and the attempt to articulate the picture is not always easy.
So where it will step on the toes of some it may smash the feet of others.
.__________
The false charismatic unification to the apostate Nicolaiton assemblies.


“The name “Nicolaitans” is derived from the Greek word nikolaos, a mixing of the words nikos and laos. The word nikos is the Greek word which means to conquer or subdue. While the word laos is the Greek word for the people. And is also where we get the word laity. When these two words are formed into one, they form the name Nicolas, which literally means one who conquers and subdues the people. It seems the Nicolaitans were somehow conquering and subduing the people.

Since In this case those being subdued were some of “the congragation of believers. “ we see that there was a forming of hierachy ..a spiritual elitism between Jesus and his body... Effectively a spiritual strangulation between the head (Jesus) and his body by those usurping power .
This The doctrine\ teaching of the nicolatain mindset.
Then we have “their deeds.”

Jesus likened thier deeds to those of Baal worship...
Discouraging holiness in utter separation from worldliness and Encouraging ,sexual immorality and a mixing of pure and holy religious practice with pagan practice and idolatry.

Ie -religious organisations ruled by an elite class over a lay class
Who claim to worship both God and mingle that with images statues and pagan renamed godesses. Comitting spiritual Unfaithfulness and adultery against God.

These days almost all denominations have taken up some measure of this doctrine or practice or both.. Of the nicolatains...
Which thing Jesus said “HE HATES” .

To maintain such a state of control over the laity it became the norm to create a sense of dependency upon the elite class in what' ever form the elite class clothes itself.
In rcc scenario this is very obvious ..clothing itself in a priesthood.
As with the older protestant movements who drew away a little but still clung hard to that system to this day.
Even in the translating of the king James bible we see the blatant use of the word church imposed where the Greek word for church isn't there .in order to maintain a strong measure of control.

Today though we see in the Spirit filled denominations that this same hateful doctrine is equally as stubbornly rooted.

Having created a false heirachy in yet different clothing again. Calling it “being under the umbrella of your local congregation pastor and elder etc.
And being under the “leadership” Of apostles prophets teachers evangelists etc where such mostly self claimed giftings are used to maintain perceived “leadership” and the following of these leaders is imposed by a form of social peer pressure making those who don't conform to feel a sense of isolation.

This dependency on These heirachy based figure heads give rise to further error . with people clammering to be prophesied over by these perceived elite.having not learned to seek God themselves.

And so the grip of control is tightened and the money rolls in .
And in the greater picture what is the fruit of it all...?

A unifying of the denominations that are all being dominated by this doctrine and those who seek to grasp power over the fathers vinyard.
Adherence to the honouring of a godess.
A mass of professing believers actioning faith in a false elite spiritual class but none in Christ The head.
The hyper grace movement where the continuance of sin is no longer condemned.
Sexual immorality.
Outright idolatry.
Leaders prostrating themselves at the feet of other men
A what's in it for me religion utterly drenched in covetousness.
A faithless religion who think Faith is only what you have and have forgotten that without the actioning of it ,it is utterly dead.
Congregations gathering to be entertained by music and dance. some lurid enough to not even pretend to pretend any more.
Sunday morning clubbers that have more passion for their favorite sports team and would not dream of shouting triumphantly in praise to God with even a small measure of the degree they praise and give worhip to their team. Sodomite ministers.
Clergy who have given up the nateral order of the use of the body to seek after perversion
.congregations that sing songs and pray in tongues then go home and watch tv popular content much of which amounts to inappropriate content with a little clothing on.
An unrepentant people living an unrepentant and unholy life..under a leadership that has usurped that position of leader.
Seeking a sign and basing a belief upon an experience of carnal feeling. Instead of in the word of God.And thinking, “God is pleased with me because my hands tingeld.”

Apostle prophets teachers etc...are the “foundation” of a building. not its roof. When you walk across the floor you walk freely over the foundations laid beneath, Being led of the holy spirit to.learn and Do whatever he,Being the one that only says what the father is saying,tells you to.
Not being dictated to by an elite class while being spiritually dependent upon them .because they have not taught you to hear the masters voice and you have not cared to listen for his voice, preferring instead to hear things pleasing to the ears .

Welcome to the doctrine of the nicolatains.
Welcome to the system so many
Readily refer to as “Church”.!

All the while in revelations we have the warning- that the Lord Jesus HATES this doctrine.
-We have the warning that he stands outside that system ..knocking .HE is not in it.
-We have the warning that the first works (the great commission of the gospel) are neglected...
-We have the warning that this mingled mix of hot and cold making everything noncommitedly putridly luke warm ..will be Spewed out of his mouth..

Welcome to the reunifying of the apostate church. Judgment begins in the house of God.
This projected forced unity is in unity only with itself.
Not with the Lord Jesus.
Come out of her or perish with her.

It's a house built upon the Sand.
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[stuart lawrence]

Well I was raised in an evangelical/ charismatic church, and I can assure you it wasn't a church where: anything goes, as it were, including sexual immorality.
Strange, I was chatting to a catholic on another website a while back, and he was describing his Christian walk to me. Seeking to live a pure life without sin/ repentance when he failed. I was literally stunned. He perfectly described my experience in the evangelical church of my youth( apart from going to a priest for confession)

 

[Blade]

Yes... judgment begins with the house of GOD.. that is whats written. Yet not by us... just who is US? Pffft.. we read about some Churches Jesus was taking to. Reminds me of "sheep and goats". So many just love to paste that on some group.

With Christ...its not about THEM...its about YOU/ME. That He cares about. So easy to look out side and KNOW who is and who is not of GOD preaching wrong walking wrong blah blah blah. We look at what? See the heart do we? See Christ was not talking to the works of flesh. The out side sometimes does not match whats on the inside. So... WE just might be talking to the wrong people..we need to let HIM see the heart.

Is it not written.. who so ever believes shall not perish but have every lasting life. Who so ever calls on the name of the lord shall be saved. There is none righteous no not one. If we say we have no sin..we deceive our selfs and the truth is not in us. Its never them...its us..its me 1st. Change me 1st.. judge me 1st.

 

[Alithis]

Is it not written.. who so ever believes shall not perish but have every lasting life. Who so ever calls on the name of the lord shall be saved.

That is written ..but it is not a stand alone statement.
It must align with everting else a rupture says.
Is if you believe..you obey
If you love him you keep his word.
To keep his word you must obey the Gospel
To obey the Gospel you must repent and forsake works of Sin.
In order to do works of righteousness.

 

[LinkH]

I think your hermeneutical approach is flawed. You use a folk etymology approach, trying to figure out what Nicolaitan means from its component parts. Phineas means 'snake mouth.' Paul means short. What if someone tried to interpret a text through the esoteric lens of saying that Paul was 'short' on something.

There is a word 'likewise' there showing the Nicolaitans were similar to Balaam that taught the people to commit fornication and to eat meat offerred to idols. There is a church tradition recorded by Eusebius that the Nicolaitans were a libertine group that taught the people it was okay to do these things, and that it was named after Nicholas, one of the seven, based on a misinterpretation of something he taught, though he was not a part of the group.

The use of 'Niconaitan' to refer to clergy was popular with the Plymouth Brethren. Watchman Nee, it could be argued, as a part of that movement, too. He was certainly influenced by it at least. Their group teaches the idea that Nicolaitan has to do with the clergy system.

If I remember right, the Christodelphian book Eureka argues for this idea, and that might be the first reference I have foudn to the idea that Nicolaitans refers to the clergy caste or system. The Eureka argument may make the most persuasive case for it I've seen. But I still consider it ot be a flased hermeneutical approach.

The actual passage there shows us that they had some similarity to Balaam that enticed the people to fornicate and to eat meat offered to idols.

 

[LinkH]

I think your hermeneutical approach is flawed. You use a folk etymology approach, trying to figure out what Nicolaitan means from its component parts. Phineas means 'snake mouth.' Paul means short. What if someone tried to interpret a text through the esoteric lens of saying that Paul was 'short' on something.

There is a word 'likewise' there showing the Nicolaitans were similar to Balaam that taught the people to commit fornication and to eat meat offerred to idols. There is a church tradition recorded by Eusebius that the Nicolaitans were a libertine group that taught the people it was okay to do these things, and that it was named after Nicholas, one of the seven, based on a misinterpretation of something he taught, though he was not a part of the group.

The use of 'Niconaitan' to refer to clergy was popular with the Plymouth Brethren. Watchman Nee, it could be argued, as a part of that movement, too. He was certainly influenced by it at least. Their group teaches the idea that Nicolaitan has to do with the clergy system.

If I remember right, the Christodelphian book Eureka argues for this idea, and that might be the first reference I have foudn to the idea that Nicolaitans refers to the clergy caste or system. The Eureka argument may make the most persuasive case for it I've seen. But I still consider it ot be a flased hermeneutical approach.

The actual passage there shows us that they had some similarity to Balaam that enticed the people to fornicate and to eat meat offered to idols.

 

[Susan Swanger Zipf]

According to most learned scholars, no one really knows what the Nicolatians did or who they were. Your guess could be right - or could be wrong.

But to dismiss an entire section of the body of Christ because you THINK you've figured out what centuries of scholars couldn't, is possibly not the best option. Perhaps had your theory been written as a "what do you think of this idea" article it would receive more positive attention.

The Pentecostal church I go to has maybe 25 members, and 4 ordained ministers. We all take turns with preaching and teaching, with the Head pastor preaching most of the time. He never "lords" it over anyone, and is always very humble. Your assumption about the Charismatic Pentecostal churches is not only unfair, it's untrue.