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The Eye of Zeus

Discussion in 'Physical & Life Sciences' started by Agonaces of Susa, Apr 21, 2011.

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  1. Agonaces of Susa

    Agonaces of Susa Evolution is not science: legalize creationism.

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    Two = two.

    Deimos and Phobos.

    I already provided book and line number.

    In the real world, the planet existed, was named, deified, and worshipped before Latin existed as a language.

    Do you claim outerspace is not under the world? Then what is?

    The planets faught a battle in outerspace -- theomachy -- when they deviated from their orbits and when other catastrophic events occured in heaven.

    The solar system was not discovered in 1877.

    Uranus was named by the Greeks.

    Jonathan Swift didn't invent the two moons of Mars. They are real.

    So you claim. Astrolatry: look it up.

    Pluto is the Roman name for the planet Hades.

    Quote please.
     
  2. Snow Phoenix

    Snow Phoenix Member

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    A comic book character...

    But I wouldn't put it past you to take that, chew it up, spit it out, chew it up again, light it on fire, stomp it out, flush it down the toilet, then claim he actually meant that he evolved from a bat.
     
  3. Nostromo

    Nostromo Brian Blessed can take a hike

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    Could somebody summarise the point of this thread, I can't for the life of me work it out.
     
  4. Delphiki

    Delphiki Well-Known Member

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    The OP is saying the ancient Greek gods were named after all the planets and moons we know about in the solar system today and the red spot on Jupiter is Zeus's eye, despite the OP allegedly being a Christian...



    ...I think
     
  5. Upisoft

    Upisoft CEO of a waterfal

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  6. Nostromo

    Nostromo Brian Blessed can take a hike

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    Gotcha
     
  7. pgp_protector

    pgp_protector Noted strange person

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    [​IMG]
     
  8. Agonaces of Susa

    Agonaces of Susa Evolution is not science: legalize creationism.

    +45
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  9. Agonaces of Susa

    Agonaces of Susa Evolution is not science: legalize creationism.

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    That is mostly correct.

    However, it is not the ancient Greeks only that practiced astrolatry but every civilization in recorded world history that practiced astrolatry.

    "And lest thou lift up thine eyes unto heaven, and when thou seest the sun, and the moon, and the stars, even all the host of heaven, shouldest be driven to worship them, and serve them, which the LORD thy God hath divided under the whole heaven." -- Deuteronomy 4:19

    "And they shall spread them before the sun, and the moon, and all the host of heaven, whom they have loved, and whom they have served, and after whom they have walked, and whom they have sought, and whom they have worshipped: they shall not be gathered, nor be buried; they shall be for dung upon the face of the earth." -- Jeremiah 8:2

    "God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods." -- Psalm 82:1

    "For the LORD is great, and greatly to be praised; he is to be feared above all gods." -- Psalm 96:4

    "For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,) But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things and we in him." -- 1 Corinthians 8:5-6
     
  10. Snow Phoenix

    Snow Phoenix Member

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    Don't forget the hundreds of quote mines from long-dead philosophers!
     
  11. ReverendDG

    ReverendDG Defeater of Dad and AV1611VET

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    nothing in those quotes are the greek creation myth, what i linked was, your refusal to admit it is telling.
    it tells me that you have no argument and the best you can do is repeat yourself and hope to your alien jesus that i get bored or your stupid quotemines and you can claim some imaginary victory.

    i linked the myth, i've read books with the same basic story in it, NONE OF THEM HAVE ANY OF YOUR QUOTES IN THEM,
    so your quotes ARE NOT THE CREATION MYTH.

    so your quotes are irrelevant because they are not the myth they are some random quotemines.
     
  12. ReverendDG

    ReverendDG Defeater of Dad and AV1611VET

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    HOW DOES THAT REFUTE WHAT I SAID?
    you said wikipedia was an unreliable source, i said EB says it is, funny that i find no contradiction from the EB now, and the best you can do is cite crap from over 100 years ago as your source, no matter what, i've found that stuff from over 100 years ago is often wrong.

    funny too is the only stuff i find saying that the greeks had telescopes is the garbage you spew on the internet.
    also go read wiki's page on pepi II neferkare, they talk about your claims, the very fact that they do and they have sources just refutes what you claim.
    you are wrong, wikipedia is a reliable source and in fact better than EB because you can get up to date info. eb is going to be out of date within a year, wiki gets updated everyday.

    handwaving away a source just because someone could post wrong information or anyone can edit, is a genetic fallacy. wiki is fairly good at fixing things and they have bloody sources for the things they post, unlike you.
     
  13. Agonaces of Susa

    Agonaces of Susa Evolution is not science: legalize creationism.

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    This makes no sense whatsoever.

    I just quoted you the creation myths as given by the ancient Greeks themselves, namely Anaxagoras, Plato, and Aristotle.

    You didn't quote any Greek. You linked to a 20th century American website with no citations.

    You linked a 20th century American website with no citations. I gave direct quotes from Anaxagoras, Plato, and Aristotle.
     
  14. Agonaces of Susa

    Agonaces of Susa Evolution is not science: legalize creationism.

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    No I didn't. I say it IS an unreliable source (present tense not past tense)...:thumbsup:

    "... sight is made precise by the compass, rule, and telescope." -- Iamblichus, philosopher, Life of Pythagoras, 3rd century

    "[Roger Bacon] did perfectly understand all kinds of optic glasses, and knew likewise the method of combining them so as to compose some such instrument as our telescope." -- William Molyneux, natural philosopher, Dioptrica Nova, 1692

    "... strange as it may seem to us ... the Babylonians possessed optical instruments of the nature of telescopes, since it is impossible, even in the clear and vapor-less sky of Chaldaea, to discern the faint moons of that distant planet [Saturn] without lenses. A lens, it must be remembered, with a fair magnifying power, has been discovered amongst the Mesopotamian ruins." --George Rawlinson, historian, The Seven Great Monarchies of the Eastern World, Volume 4: Babylon, 1862-67

    "... to the ancients belong the honor of the invention of the telescope.'" -- Helena P. Blavatsky, theosophist, Isis Unveiled, 1877

    "The credit of the discovery of the telescope has been a fruitful subject of discussion. Thus, because Democritus announced that the Milky Way is composed of vast multitudes of stars, it has been maintained that he could only have been led to form such an opinion from actual examination of the heavens with a telescope. Other passages from the Greek and Latin authors have similarly been cited to prove that the telescope was known to the ancients." -- Encyclopaedia Britannica 1888, 1893, & 1911

    "The Chaldeans must have understood the manufacture of the telescope, for [Austen H.] Layard reported the discovery of a lens of power in the ruins of Babylon. Nero the emperor of Rome had optical glasses from the east." -- Drusilla D. Houston, historian, Wonderful Ethiopians of the Ancient Cu[bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]e Empire, Chapter XIII: The Civilization of Babylonia, 1926

    "Galileo always insisted that the ancients had telescopes." -- Ivan Van Sertima, historian, Blacks In Science: Ancient and Modern, The Lost Sciences of Africa: An Overview, 1983

    "It is a short and simple step to place one lens in front of another to make a basic telescope, and the chances are it could have happened and many times. Galileo himself noted that the 'ancients' were aware of telescopes. The question is just how good these telescopes were and how much knowledge the astronomer/priests of these early civilizations were able to obtain from them. Yet Brecher and Sagan give no consideration to this at all! Their narrow vision cannot alter the facts, but their writings do cast light on the root of their problem...." -- Hunter H. Adams III, archaeoastronomer, African Observers of the Universe: The Sirius Question, 1983

    "A recent find in the Idaean Cave in Crete of two rock crystal lenses of unusually good optical quality led to this investigation of other lenses from antiquity. The evidence indicates that the use of lenses was widespread throughout the Middle East and the Mediterranean basin over several millennia. The quality of some of these lenses was sufficient to permit their use as magnifying glasses. The use of lenses as burning glasses in Classical Greece is noted, as is the need for magnifying lenses to authenticate seal impressions. The probability that magnifying lenses were used by gem carvers and seal engravers is discussed. The fine detail of Roman gold-glass portrait medallions and the discovery of a lens in the house of an engraver in Pompeii and another in the house of an artist in Tanis are presented as evidence for the use of the lenses for magnifying purposes. Methods of producing optical quality lenses by simple procedures are also presented." -- Sines, G., and Sakellarakis, Y.A., archaeologists, Lenses in Antiquity, American Journal of Archaeology, Volume 91, Number 2, Pages 191-196, Apr 1987

    "If one Italian scientist is correct then the telescope was not invented sometime in the 16th century by Dutch spectacle makers, but by ancient Assyrian astronomers nearly three thousand years earlier." -- World's Oldest Telescope?, BBC, Jul 1999

    "I call it consensus blindness. People agree not to see what they are convinced cannot exist. 'Everyone knows' that there was no optical technology in antiquity, so consequently when you come across it, staring you in the face, you go blind. End of conflict." -- Robert G. K. Temple, author, Forbidden Technology, 2009

    "The ancients apparently used the telescope long before Pythagoras's time." -- Larry B. Radka, historian, Telescopes and the Ancients, 2010

    Read it and weep.
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2011
  15. Agonaces of Susa

    Agonaces of Susa Evolution is not science: legalize creationism.

    +45
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    Thank God.

    No. I only consider original sources to be reliable.

    FYI a surveying instrument is a telescope: http://www.abc.net.au/rn/science/ss/stories/s148930.htm

    Mistranslate this:

    "[Roger Bacon] did perfectly understand all kinds of optic glasses, and knew likewise the method of combining them so as to compose some such instrument as our telescope." -- William Molyneux, natural philosopher, Dioptrica Nova, 1692

    "... strange as it may seem to us ... the Babylonians possessed optical instruments of the nature of telescopes, since it is impossible, even in the clear and vapor-less sky of Chaldaea, to discern the faint moons of that distant planet [Saturn] without lenses. A lens, it must be remembered, with a fair magnifying power, has been discovered amongst the Mesopotamian ruins." --George Rawlinson, historian, The Seven Great Monarchies of the Eastern World, Volume 4: Babylon, 1862-67

    "... to the ancients belong the honor of the invention of the telescope.'" -- Helena P. Blavatsky, theosophist, Isis Unveiled, 1877

    "The credit of the discovery of the telescope has been a fruitful subject of discussion. Thus, because Democritus announced that the Milky Way is composed of vast multitudes of stars, it has been maintained that he could only have been led to form such an opinion from actual examination of the heavens with a telescope. Other passages from the Greek and Latin authors have similarly been cited to prove that the telescope was known to the ancients." -- Encyclopaedia Britannica 1888, 1893, & 1911

    "The Chaldeans must have understood the manufacture of the telescope, for [Austen H.] Layard reported the discovery of a lens of power in the ruins of Babylon. Nero the emperor of Rome had optical glasses from the east." -- Drusilla D. Houston, historian, Wonderful Ethiopians of the Ancient Cu[bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]e Empire, Chapter XIII: The Civilization of Babylonia, 1926

    "Galileo always insisted that the ancients had telescopes." -- Ivan Van Sertima, historian, Blacks In Science: Ancient and Modern, The Lost Sciences of Africa: An Overview, 1983

    "It is a short and simple step to place one lens in front of another to make a basic telescope, and the chances are it could have happened and many times. Galileo himself noted that the 'ancients' were aware of telescopes. The question is just how good these telescopes were and how much knowledge the astronomer/priests of these early civilizations were able to obtain from them. Yet Brecher and Sagan give no consideration to this at all! Their narrow vision cannot alter the facts, but their writings do cast light on the root of their problem...." -- Hunter H. Adams III, archaeoastronomer, African Observers of the Universe: The Sirius Question, 1983

    "A recent find in the Idaean Cave in Crete of two rock crystal lenses of unusually good optical quality led to this investigation of other lenses from antiquity. The evidence indicates that the use of lenses was widespread throughout the Middle East and the Mediterranean basin over several millennia. The quality of some of these lenses was sufficient to permit their use as magnifying glasses. The use of lenses as burning glasses in Classical Greece is noted, as is the need for magnifying lenses to authenticate seal impressions. The probability that magnifying lenses were used by gem carvers and seal engravers is discussed. The fine detail of Roman gold-glass portrait medallions and the discovery of a lens in the house of an engraver in Pompeii and another in the house of an artist in Tanis are presented as evidence for the use of the lenses for magnifying purposes. Methods of producing optical quality lenses by simple procedures are also presented." -- Sines, G., and Sakellarakis, Y.A., archaeologists, Lenses in Antiquity, American Journal of Archaeology, Volume 91, Number 2, Pages 191-196, Apr 1987

    "If one Italian scientist is correct then the telescope was not invented sometime in the 16th century by Dutch spectacle makers, but by ancient Assyrian astronomers nearly three thousand years earlier." -- World's Oldest Telescope?, BBC, Jul 1999

    "I call it consensus blindness. People agree not to see what they are convinced cannot exist. 'Everyone knows' that there was no optical technology in antiquity, so consequently when you come across it, staring you in the face, you go blind. End of conflict." -- Robert G. K. Temple, author, Forbidden Technology, 2009

    "The ancients apparently used the telescope long before Pythagoras's time." -- Larry B. Radka, historian, Telescopes and the Ancients, 2010
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2011
  16. Ar Cosc

    Ar Cosc I only exist on the internet

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    "Debating creationists ... is rather like trying to play chess with a pigeon — it knocks the pieces over, craps on the board, and flies back to its flock to claim victory."

    Scott D. Weitzenhoffer.

    Seems particularly appropriate for this discussion!
     
  17. AV1611VET

    AV1611VET IN GOD WE TRUST Supporter

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    Is this true, Agonances?
     
  18. Delphiki

    Delphiki Well-Known Member

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    Dude. Read the thread.
     
  19. Snow Phoenix

    Snow Phoenix Member

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    Read the thread from the start... it might surprise you :)



    Edit: Looks like you don't actually have to read any of this thread, he buried himself in quotemines, all by himself.
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2011
  20. Agonaces of Susa

    Agonaces of Susa Evolution is not science: legalize creationism.

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    This is correct.

    The Greek creation myth is identical to the Hebrew creation myth.

    "All things were mixed up together, then Mind came and arranged them all in distinct order." -- Anaxagoras, philosopher, 5th century B.C.

    "Then I heard someone who had a book of Anaxagoras, as he said, out of which he read that mind was the disposer and cause of all, and I was quite delighted at the notion of this, which appeared admirable, and I said to myself; If mind is the disposer, mind will dispose all for the best, and put each particular in the best place ...." -- Plato, philosopher, Phaedo, 360 B.C.

    "... Anaxagoras, who says that all things were together and at rest for an infinite period of time, and that then Mind introduced motion and separated them...." -- Aristotle, Physics, Book VIII, 350 B.C.

    "He [Anaxagoras] said that the beginning of the universe was mind and matter, mind being the creator and matter that which came into being. For that when all things were together, mind came and arranged them." -- Hippolytus, priest, 2nd century

    Because they are.

    "I suspect that the sun, moon, earth, stars, and heaven, which are still the Gods of many barbarians, were the only Gods known to the aboriginal Hellenes. Seeing that they were always moving and running, from their running nature they were called Gods or runners (Theous, Theontas)" -- Plato, philosopher, Cratylus, 360 B.C.

    "Another of his [Pythagoras's] theories was ... that the sun, and the moon, and the stars, were all Gods...." -- Diogenes Laertius, historian, Life of Pythagoras, 3rd century

    "He [Thales] held the sun and the planets for Gods. And in the same sense Pythagoras, on account of its immense force of attraction, said that the Sun was a prison of Zeus, that is, a body possessed of the greatest circuits." -- Isaac Newton, mathematician, 1690

    Read the Bible.

    "And lest thou lift up thine eyes unto heaven, and when thou seest the sun, and the moon, and the stars, even all the host of heaven, shouldest be driven to worship them, and serve them, which the LORD thy God hath divided under the whole heaven." -- Deuteronomy 4:19

    "And they shall spread them before the sun, and the moon, and all the host of heaven, whom they have loved, and whom they have served, and after whom they have walked, and whom they have sought, and whom they have worshipped: they shall not be gathered, nor be buried; they shall be for dung upon the face of the earth." -- Jeremiah 8:2
     
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2011
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