The Exodus: 2450 B.C.?

dana b

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Joshua must have got very tired if he was fighting for a thousand years


The "light of one day" is 500 years added to history.

A full day which in God's time equals 1000 years consists of half of it being the night-time, and half of it being day-light. The verse says the "light" of one day. Thus in his time it signifies 500 years. So therefore we can see that the tribes of Israel left Egypt about 500 years earlier than the dates set by conventional scholars, and crossed into the promised land at about 2000BC.
 
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dana b

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The 480th year after the Children of Israel had come out of Egypt was the 4th year of Solomon's reign, so just how can you justify 500 years for Joshua?

Chris


From that very year and day, that God stopped the Sun for the "light of one day," there was a 500 year period of time added to history. During this time the 12 tribes of Israel lived in their promised land of Canaan. Modern Archeological history may not record this time. But it existed and made up 500 of the full one thousand years during which the Old Testament Covanant people were living in thier promised millennium. The Bible referrs to this period as "giving rest unto Israel." Josh.23;1 Heb.4;4-10

God also set back time by "10 degrees" in another part of the Old Testament. This too added it's proportioned historical time of "36 years" onto the Old Testament period. In actuality the Christian calendar was set by the diciples to begin counting it's years from Jesus's crucifixion and resurrection. But today modern acheological history tells us that the Christian Calendar begins at Christ's birth.
 
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dana b

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ChapterSeven%20(19).jpg
 
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miamited

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hi phydeaux,

The exodus can be reasonably determined by the geneological evidences of the Scriptures.

From Adam to Noah = 1056 years.
Noah to the flood = 600 years.
Arpachshad born 2 years after the flood.
Arpachshad to Abraham = 290 years.
Abraham to Isaac = 100 years.
Isaac to Jacob = 60 years.
Jacob to Egypt = 130 years.
From Egypt to the exodus - 430 years.

So, from the creation to the exodus was, according to the geneologies of the Scriptures, 2668 years.

The exodus can be worked back through the kings and judges of Israel, but it is a bit more involved. It works out to about 1446 BC that the Hebrews crossed the Red Sea. This would make the years from the creation to the Christ to be 4114 years. We now stand approximately 2012 years from the birth of our Lord (give or take 5-10 years). Which makes the existence of this realm of God's creation about 6,100 years.

One reasonably close verification for these estimates is the Jewish calander itself. The year 2012 AD corresponds to the Jewish calander years of 5772-5773. So, it is understood that there is some small margin of error, but 1000 years is a bit much. If, these calculations are reasonably correct, then the error would be no more than 3-4 hundred years.

Now, it is understood that these numbers (as regards the beginning of the creation of this realm), to be only agreed among young earth creationists so all arguments of millions or billions of years for the creation are expected.

God bless you.
IN Christ, Ted
 
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Martyrs44

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hi phydeaux,

The exodus can be reasonably determined by the geneological evidences of the Scriptures.

From Adam to Noah = 1056 years.
Noah to the flood = 600 years.
Arpachshad born 2 years after the flood.
Arpachshad to Abraham = 290 years.
Abraham to Isaac = 100 years.
Isaac to Jacob = 60 years.
Jacob to Egypt = 130 years.
From Egypt to the exodus - 430 years.

So, from the creation to the exodus was, according to the geneologies of the Scriptures, 2668 years.

The exodus can be worked back through the kings and judges of Israel, but it is a bit more involved. It works out to about 1446 BC that the Hebrews crossed the Red Sea. This would make the years from the creation to the Christ to be 4114 years. We now stand approximately 2012 years from the birth of our Lord (give or take 5-10 years). Which makes the existence of this realm of God's creation about 6,100 years.

One reasonably close verification for these estimates is the Jewish calander itself. The year 2012 AD corresponds to the Jewish calander years of 5772-5773. So, it is understood that there is some small margin of error, but 1000 years is a bit much. If, these calculations are reasonably correct, then the error would be no more than 3-4 hundred years.

Now, it is understood that these numbers (as regards the beginning of the creation of this realm), to be only agreed among young earth creationists so all arguments of millions or billions of years for the creation are expected.

God bless you.
IN Christ, Ted

That is well worth consideration.
 
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gideon123

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I realize that some Christians desire to fit the Bible into a neat chronicled order of events, but I will go with the opinion that things are NOT that easy. Not by a long shot. For this reason, ASKING QUESTIONS makes a lot of sense.

THANKS to the people who suggested that Exodus was around 2200BC, or somewhere close to those dates. I will take a look at the theories. We need CONSISTENCY between the Biblical narrative and the records of Egytpian history. The two should square off.

Those people who say ... "well the Bible says 480 years, or I counted this many generations" are NOT doing anyone a favor. Least of all God!! You need to allow time for the truth to be determined. The search for the truth is painstaking ... it's not like baking cookies in the kitchen. You can't get it done in 15 minutes.

A MORE careful review needs to be made of the periods of time in the Egyptian records, in order to really understand Exodus!!
 
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gideon123

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By the way .. if we shift our time reference, and consider the possibility that Exodus happened sometimes around 2200-2400 BC, this does NOT mean that Joshua "lived for 1000 years". It is not necessary to jump to an impossible conclusion.

The change in the time of Exodus would certainly create a time gap of roughly 1000 years in the Biblical narrative. BUT we would not know when exactly this occurred. We would have to start looking at various possibilities. NONE of these alternate approaches requires the assumption that a man lived for 1,000 years.

For example, it is possible that Moses died in the Sinai and did not enter Israel. Exactly as stated by the Bible. But the Israelites lived for 1,000 years in the northern Sinai AFTER the death of Moses, before they entered Israel. In other words, there is a gap of 1,000 years between the death of Moses and the leadership of Joshua. YES, I understand that this creates a contradiction with a very small part of the Bible, but it's not a major discrepancy. A time gap could have existed.

Another possibility is that the Israelites actually spend a MUCH longer tine in the Sinai during their travels in the wilderness. Not 40 years, but 1,000 years. They were FREE from the Egyptians after the crossing of the Red Sea. But their subsequent journeys and trials lasted much longer. And much of that story was lost and not recorded - except for the highlights. If such a version is true, then the "Moses" who led the people out of Egypt is not the same "Moses" who finishes the journey at the northern end of the Sinai. They are two quite separate people. Perhaps even people with the same name, but not identical. Again, we don't know.

I am not saying that any of these versions are true. I am simply saying that the search for the truth requires much patience and an OPEN mind.
 
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Daniel Gregg

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Sharuhen is mentioned in the Book of Joshua: Joshua 19:6
And Bethlebaoth, and Sharuhen; thirteen cities and their villages:​
Sharuhen was destroyed by Pharaoh Ahmose I whose reign (the beginning of the New Kingdom) has been radiocarbon dated to 1570 and 1544 B.C.

Ramsey, et al., Radiocarbon-Based Chronology for Dynastic Egypt, Science, Volume 328, Number 5985, Pages 1554-1557, Jul 2010
Our radiocarbon data indicate that the New Kingdom started between 1570 and 1544 B.C.E.​
Therefore the Exodus must have preceded the reign of Ahmose I, and therefore also preceded the traditional Exodus date of 1450 B.C.

"Now the sojourning of the children of Israel, who dwelt in Egypt, was four hundred and thirty years." -- Exodus 12:40

The Sharuhen note is valid. I have the city destroyed in 1557 or 1556 BC in the 22nd year of Ahmose I, 1st year of Amenhotep I. A date of 1632 BC actually fits the data for the Biblical Exodus, chronology_canons.

Exodus 12:40 is a typical biblical cipher. The sojourn dates from UR. There were only four generations in Egypt lasting 210 years. Jacob, Levi, Jochebed, Moses. See Genesis 15:16.
 
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gideon123

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However, 1632 BC puts the Exodus into the part of Egyptian history called the 15'th Dynasty. It is a period of time where relatively little is known about some of the Pharoahs.

BUT for example. Pharoah Sirtis (around 1650 BC) is very unlikely to be the correct Pharoah for the Exodus. Why? Because Sirtis was very scared of an invasion from the east. Therefore he stationed an army of 250,000 Egyptian warriors on the eastern flank of Egypt. Therefore if Moses had fled east after the uprising, he would have walked right into certain death.

The bottom line is this ... you can't "prove" your point by only working off the Biblical records. Your answer should be consistent with Egyptian history as well. That's no easy task, and there is no guarantee that you will ever get perfect consistency. But it requires a lot more work. These words are not intended to be a criticism ... think of it as being a personal challenge.

I admit that I have not spent much time on Egyptology. I did notice that the period of time around 2200-2600 BC sounded a lot more like the "flavor of Egypt" that seems to be mentioned in the Bible in Exodus. But I completely agree, it's pretty hard to explain why 1,000 years is missing in the Biblical records, if you postulate that the Exodus was around 2450 BC.

More research needed!!!
 
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tooldtocare

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.,.,.,.,.I realize a lot of people don't think the Exodus happened at all, but perhaps there is some historical bases to it, however distorted this story has become..,.,.,.,.,

Do you agree and/or not agree-?

(Gen 41:44 KJV) And Pharaoh said unto Joseph, I am Pharaoh, and without thee shall no man lift up his hand or foot in all the land of Egypt.

(Gen 41:46 KJV) And Joseph was thirty years old when he stood before Pharaoh king of Egypt. And Joseph went out from the presence of Pharaoh, and went throughout all the land of Egypt.

(Gen 41:57 KJV) And all countries came into Egypt to Joseph for to buy corn; because that the famine was so sore in all lands.

(Gen 42:1 KJV) Now when Jacob saw that there was corn in Egypt, Jacob said unto his sons, Why do ye look one upon another?

(Gen 42:2 KJV) And he said, Behold, I have heard that there is corn in Egypt: get you down thither, and buy for us from thence;

(Gen 42:3 KJV) And Joseph's ten brethren went down to buy corn in Egypt.

(Gen 42:5 KJV) And the sons of Israel came to buy corn among those that came: for the famine was in the land of Canaan.

(Gen 42:6 KJV) And Joseph was the governor over the land, and he it was that sold to all the people of the land:

(Gen 42:25 KJV) Then Joseph commanded to fill their sacks with corn, and to restore every man's money into his sack, and to give them provision for the way:

(Gen 45:20 KJV) Also regard not your stuff; for the good of all the land of Egypt is yours.

(Gen 45:21 KJV) And the children of Israel did so: and Joseph gave them wagons, according to the commandment of Pharaoh, and gave them provision for the way.

(Gen 47:1 KJV) Then Joseph came and told Pharaoh, and said, My father [ISRAEL] and my brethren, and their flocks, and their herds, and all that they have, are come out of the land of Canaan; and, behold, they are in the land of Goshen.

(Gen 47:3 KJV) And Pharaoh said unto his brethren, What is your occupation? And they said unto Pharaoh, Thy servants are shepherds, both we, and also our fathers.

(Gen 47:4 KJV) They said moreover unto Pharaoh, For to sojourn in the land are we come; for thy servants have no pasture for their flocks; for the famine is sore in the land of Canaan: now therefore, we pray thee, let thy servants dwell in the land of Goshen.

(Gen 47:5 KJV) And Pharaoh spake unto Joseph, saying, Thy father [ISRAEL] and thy brethren are come unto thee:

(Gen 47:6 KJV) The land of Egypt is before thee; in the best of the land make thy father and brethren to dwell; in the land of Goshen let them dwell: and if thou knowest any men of activity among them, then make them rulers over my cattle.

(Gen 47:11 KJV) And Joseph placed his father [ISRAEL] and his brethren, and gave them a possession in the land of Egypt, in the best of the land, in the land of Rameses, as Pharaoh had commanded.

And it came to pass in those days, when Moses was grown, that he went out to his brothers, and looked on their burdens: and he spied an Egyptian smiting an Hebrew, one of his brothers. And he looked this way and that way, and when he saw that there was no man, he slew the Egyptian, and hid him in the sand. And when he went out the second day, behold, two men of the Hebrews strove together: and he said to him that did the wrong, Why smite you your fellow?

Now when Pharaoh heard this thing, he sought to slay Moses. But Moses fled from the face of Pharaoh, and dwelled in the land of Midian: and he sat down by a well.

This marks the great EXIDIOUS


In my view; how do you see it-?


Just asking :)-
 
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Protos

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I know this was a dead thread but... well, I've read through it entirely and here are my thoughts:

-The 2400 BC Exodus is very unlikely - most of the towns mentioned didn't even exist at that time. Chariots could've existed here and there back then, but Pharaoh wouldn't have had 600 of them (Ex. 14:9) - this was a 16th century BC invention on such a massive scale. The political situation in Genesis 14 is a very big clue regarding chronology. Kenneth Kitchen points out that an Elamite overlord (Chedorlaomer = Kudurlagamar) with Larsa (Ellasar) being a major power was possible only in 2000-1750 BC. The names Moses (Manasseh), Joshua, etc are all Egyptian names from the mid 2nd millenium BC. So is Abraham (c.2000-1000 BC).

-The Egyptian parallels to Joseph's narrative are very lately and are probably forgeries/legends (possibly based from the Bible). This includes the supposed 7 years of famine during the days of Imhotep ("Joseph"). The dream of Djozer (similar to the story of Potiphar's Wife), and you do not need a Pharaoh who lived decades (80+ years for Moses - where does the OP get this from?) - Exodus 2:23 says the Pharaoh who wanted to kill Moses died. The Pharaoh who instituted the genocidal order in Exodus 1 could've easily passed away while Moses was growing up too - there's no reason to necessitate it was the same Pharaoh.

-The years of the Judges add up to ~553+x; but at least c.600 years is the actual value. Some of these overlap (Samson is judge during the entire Philistine servitude; Deborah was already judge during Jabin's oppression). This site has a very detailed and organized table, with which I mostly agree (I don't think we can know the exact years as he proposes, but roughly the decade). A 16th century BC Exodus makes sense of Jericho - destroyed by Joshua ~1500 BC. Hazor as well, making the 13th century BC one be due to Deborah. The 480 are easily a rounded, symbolic value, just like how the Greek historian Thucydides rounds some 39 years of "peace" to 50 - Pentakontaetia. Similarly, Daniel and Jeremiah round the 50-60 years of the Exile to the symbolic 70.

-The Pharaoh of the Exodus could've easily been a Hyksos, who got expelled by the Egyptians, taking on his weakness - grouping the victorious Israelites as if a group of retreating Asiatics back into Palestine. Or it could've been one of the early Egyptian pharaohs. The possibilities are many.

-The 1day=1000 years theory above I saw is just plain silly. It's clearly inserting a metaphor where the text speaks plainly of the Sun being held in its place a little longer, and the same for Hezekiah's day. I don't know why you even need that for this recalculation or why Joshua lived 1000 years himself or after Moses (not likely given the evidence from the names).
 
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tooldtocare

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Exodus 2:23 says the Pharaoh who wanted to kill Moses died. The Pharaoh who instituted the genocidal order in Exodus 1 could've easily passed away while Moses was growing up too -

Concerning the Bible, you are far more knowledgeable than I am. Having said that Moses was the leader of the Israelite people during this time, he did kill a man and for this the Pharaoh wanted to punish him. As a result Moses fled and I must assume he took his followers with him. Am I at least correct in this regard
 
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