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The Evils of Slavery and Its Consequences Have Been Taught Through the Years

Discussion in 'News & Current Events (Articles Required)' started by Hvizsgyak, Jun 12, 2021.

  1. Hvizsgyak

    Hvizsgyak Member

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    Amber Ruffin schools white America about critical race theory (msn.com)

    The Failure of American Schools - The Atlantic

    Archived: A Nation At Risk

    A student's point of view: Kids don't want to learn – Schools of Thought - CNN.com Blogs

    I grew up in a small town in western Pennsylvania where people "cling tight to their Bibles in one hand and their shotgun in the other" so the saying goes. Not exactly a time or place where one would have discussions about the treatment of African Americans in American society over the past 200 years. So one would think. But believe it or not our high school history teachers did not white wash the tragic history of Americas biggest and worst sin - slavery. We were taught about the disgusting treatments and abuses on African slaves by their Southern owners. We were taught about how even after the Civil War almost all slaves were still victimized by Southern white people AND even some Northern white people. We were taught about how segregation between the races was everywhere. We were taught about how land that the freed slaves acquired was taken away from them. Its been 45 years since I was in high school and I don't recall everything taught in detail but this was being taught in rural Pennsylvania. I would have to say it was taught to more extent in the cities. It wasn't exactly the history being taught through Critical Race Theory but it sure wasn't glossed over to make the US sound great.

    I offer another reason why alot of students are not learning about the sickening treatment of our African American brothers and sisters throughout the last two and a half centuries and its probably the same reason why students aren't learning a second language and why they are not learning the sciences and they are not learning how to write their names or tie their shoes or cook and that's because they don't want to learn. My wife is a teacher who puts alot of hours into her classroom prep so the students learn, stay interested and enjoy her course. She along with many of her colleagues say there are usually only a handful of students who really want to learn. All of the other students just memorize the material for the test and then it's forgotten. And then there are some who don't even study at all. They just don't care but then they expect a passing grade so they can be eligible for sports at a college. That's there big ticket to life.

    I personally think we as parents have given our children way too much freedom in their decision making and its time to clamp down on them and make them productive citizens again.
     
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  2. pescador

    pescador Newbie Supporter

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    Oh My! Really??

    You're going from "a handful of students who really want to learn" to "students [who] just memorize the material for the test and then it's forgotten" to "they expect a passing grade so they can be eligible for sports at a college. That's there big ticket to life" to "its time to clamp down on them and make them productive citizens again". That's some progression! (BTW, "That's there [sic] big ticket to life" is poor English.) "F" grade!

    Listen, show me a single student who, at least some of the time, didn't just memorize the material for the test and then it's forgotten. It's part of passing courses that you really have no interest in. I have a Master's degree and am in the top 1% of intelligence and I did plenty of that. Also, when I taught I didn't expect my students to do much beyond pay attention, take notes, pass the exams, then move on. I didn't judge their character, nor should you or your wife. (Most of them turned out to be very successful adults.)

    Then you generalize with this advice: "I personally think we as parents have given our children way too much freedom in their decision making and its time to clamp down on them and make them productive citizens again." Perhaps that's the way you raised your children, but that's not how I raised mine. My son is a Boeing 777 pilot who flies all over the world; my daughter is an PhD. osteopath. I gave my children the freedom to become successful, productive adults, and guess what -- it worked! BTW, my grandchildren are wonderful, loving kids who, I am certain, will be happy, productive adults.

    Perhaps you feel that failed with your kids, but that's no reason to condemn today's kids in general.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2021
  3. public hermit

    public hermit social troglodyte Supporter

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    So, they didn't teach about the "Lost Cause" in Pennsylvania? I guess that makes sense. Sometimes the things we learn and embrace are not what is said in the classroom, but what is said in the street, the cafe, in the home, in church and the so on. I don't know if we can pin all our issues with racism on the classroom and a bunch of lazy kids. I certainly think it's possible to both teach the evils of slavery in the classroom and effectively encourage prejudice in our every day conversations and attitudes. It's one of the ironies of our current situation. Everyone will admit that slavery, prejudice, and racism are wrong. Still racism, prejudice, and hatred continue.
     
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  4. Hvizsgyak

    Hvizsgyak Member

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    Lets see if I understand this, I produced three documents (and there were more) (one being a government paper on the failure of our students not getting the proper education to be productive citizens) showing our students aren't learning properly. I even threw in the eyewitness accounts of teachers I personally know and your counter-argument was - I'm smart, my kids have very good jobs and my grandchildren are heading in the right direction to be productive citizens. Yeah, you are probably in the top 1% of intelligence - and disconnected from the world and their problems.

    I will say, it is very nice to hear that your kids and your grandkids are doing well. God the Father continue to bless your family with peace, good health and happiness:amen:.
     
  5. Pommer

    Pommer Autodidact polymath Supporter

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    Yeah but to go from “the schools aren’t working” to “clamp down on the kids” misses a rather large point.
     
  6. TravisD

    TravisD Happy Child

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    I think some of the folks have missed the point you are trying to make. I'm 42 years old and I have 4 children. I remember being taught the atrocities of slavery in school and at home when I was a kid. My high school English teacher was the granddaughter of holocaust survivors. I learned more in that class about the holocaust than any other history class I ever had.

    There is a HUGE difference in what kids are taught today vs. what I learned growing up. My parents could slack when I was a kid and I would still get a proper education in public schools. This is what has changed. Our children are now indoctrinated with ideologies. Parents have to step it up a few notches to counteract the garbage fed to our children.

    So I think I understand what you are trying to say about giving our children too much freedom in their decision making.

    I think as Christian parents, we want our children to be free thinkers, but we need to ground them in the biblical truths so they don't get led astray by all the wolves out there. It is a wicked world we live in.
     
  7. pescador

    pescador Newbie Supporter

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    You're half right... Yeah, I am definitely in the top 1% of intelligence - and also connected from the world and their problems.

    I agree with Pommer, who wrote "Yeah but to go from “the schools aren’t working” to “clamp down on the kids” misses a rather large point." You go from stating a generality about schools to accusing young people. I wonder why you're so critical of our youth in general.
     
  8. pescador

    pescador Newbie Supporter

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    You wrote, "Parents have to step it up a few notches to counteract the garbage fed to our children." Such as..?

    My grandchildren have received and are receiving a very good education. As far as I'm concerned, it's people outside the education system that are feeding kids (and adults) garbage.
     
  9. TravisD

    TravisD Happy Child

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    You are absolutely correct that our kids are fed with plenty of garbage outside the education system. No argument there.

    There are certain ideologies I disagree with that I have apparently insensitively labeled garbage. I do not mean to offend anyone here, but here are a few examples of said "garbage" that I was referring to:

    1) The ideology of evolution
    2) The ideology of more than just male and female
    3) The ideology of CRT under the guise of equity

    Now I do not intend to debate or even discuss any of the above items in this thread. That would detract from the OP. I stated these items only as examples since you asked. This is partly a generalization because not all school systems adopt the second and third example, whereas the first has been well accepted as a curriculum in most school systems for decades.

    My point is that when a school system strays from standard education and infuses ideology into its curriculum, we as parents/grandparents have to step it up a few notches to counteract the state-funded indoctrination if we disagree.
     
  10. pescador

    pescador Newbie Supporter

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    Schools have always infused ideology into their curricula. Ranging from the subjective "history" that is taught (as opposed to objective facts) to the reading material chosen for English courses, it's all ideology-based. Even the issue of slavery has been sanitized to make it seem acceptable instead of objective accounting of the real truths.

    If you disagree then make your voice heard, but expect others to do the same.
     
  11. TravisD

    TravisD Happy Child

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    I'm not sure I disagree. I can say in my experiences as a child growing up and bouncing from school to school, I remember being taught slavery was bad and that all of us are equal under the US constitution. Whether or not history was sanitized I do not remember, but I don't doubt it one bit.

    I am a little confused by your previous statement. You said, "My grandchildren have received and are receiving a very good education". But now you point out the issue of slavery has been sanitized to make it seem acceptable.

    Either way, I think many of us can agree that we just want a good education for our children taught in our schools rather than biased ideologies that we are seeing more of today.
     
  12. Ana the Ist

    Ana the Ist Aggressively serene!

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    My experience was similar. I certainly wouldn't call my education a "whitewash" of history. There seems to be an association between the amount of guilt or shame one feels for being white or American or male or perhaps even Christian....and how well you were taught history.

    It's not as if everything in history can be taught or needs to be taught either. Is it enough to say black people were lynched? Do we need to go over the details of specific lynchings? Should we also teach that white people were lynched? Should we also teach that lynching ended with the widespread integration of telephones and police?

    I've no problem with people questioning or debating these topics....particularly if they want to change the curriculum.

    The backlash we've seen many states is that generally speaking, it appears as if a major shift in curriculum has been made without any discussion about why it has occurred, let alone discussion of if it should occur at all.

    Parents are rightly upset....lawmakers are right to put a stop to it until that discussion occurs

    The irony is that left wing media sources would say that CRT has nothing to do with history....and yet laws that ban teaching it's core concepts are guilty of "whitewashing history".

    I'd argue it has to do with the finite amount of time inherent in teaching. The Tulsa Race Riot might be interesting in Tulsa...but not teaching it doesn1 constitute some deliberate attempt to mislead students.

    I learned only briefly about the history and abuse of children and child labor in school. I would find it bizzare if people were saying that the reason was oppressive adults are still exploiting children today and they want to hide the history of child labor and continue their abuse.

    If people genuinely believe that history has been whitewashed to hide, or deceive students.....that's a moral accusation. Those people should at least have the guts to point out which historians and textbooks they are judging guilty.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2021
  13. Ana the Ist

    Ana the Ist Aggressively serene!

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    If that's the case....what ideology do you think has been generally taught in history and English literature for the past 50 years?

    Acceptable in what way?

    Morally? Or from the viewpoint of Western civilization at the time? Or from the viewpoint of human history in general?

    Hard to disagree without knowing what the claim is....

    Point out these ideologies.
     
  14. Ana the Ist

    Ana the Ist Aggressively serene!

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    I agree...the clamping down should be on teachers and administrators if they are trying to make sweeping curriculum changes without any input from parents.

    If, for example, teachers have decided to try and make students more politically active instead of imparting critical thinking skills or practical knowledge without any input or consultation with the parents....

    They're gravely in violation of many ethical or professional standards that are inherent to teaching.
     
  15. Ana the Ist

    Ana the Ist Aggressively serene!

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    I think if you're teaching "white privilege" in the classroom as an explanatory fact of society and not just the opinion of some people with arguably racist views....

    Then we can say to a certainty that you're teaching prejudice in the classroom....and we should stop it there before we worry about whatever children are hypothetically learning outside the classroom.
     
  16. public hermit

    public hermit social troglodyte Supporter

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    Look. Just don't be racist, discriminatory, and hateful. It's easy. The rest is subterfuge.
     
  17. Ana the Ist

    Ana the Ist Aggressively serene!

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    I agree that's easy.

    I don't understand why people can't seem to do it.
     
  18. Hvizsgyak

    Hvizsgyak Member

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    The reason I said you are unconnected with the average person is because you were fortunate enough to have children and grandchildren who applied themselves to their study and please don't get me wrong, I truly truly admire that but I have seen and heard from many people through schools where I know the teachers, through social media, and the local news shows (and maybe this is just a Florida phenomenon but I have family in Pennsylvania and they have seen it with kids from the local high schools too) alot of kids aren't even trying to learn. They expect good grades for half decent work and tests.

    I personally believe and many other people agree with me is the students are very distracted by social media and sports. They are just not memorizing the material for classes they don't like the not memorizing any of their classes. These kids are this countries future and some of them don't even know the months of the year in order and they are in middle school. I think its a shame the kids are not learning. generations of kids who will pursue low paying jobs only.

    These kids have been so distracted (not all because a few are strong enough to overcome the peer pressure). I truly feel sorry for them; hopefully when they get older and realize they can't make a living off of these low wage jobs, they will beable to go back to school and get skills for a better career in life.
     
  19. Pommer

    Pommer Autodidact polymath Supporter

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    You’re just getting old.
    These “complaints” have been the same for 100 years.
    (I remember a machinist-uncle I had, complaining about how “they don’t even TEACH fractions anymore!”, (as the mid-seventies push to get onto the Metric system (along with the rest of the world) began under Ford.)

    The World will continue to move-on.
    Most everything will be okay.
     
  20. Ana the Ist

    Ana the Ist Aggressively serene!

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    Undoubtedly we all are.

    There's always complaints about the young from the old...and complaints about the old from the young.

    That doesn't make any of the complaints valid or invalid.


    I don't see the connection between your uncle's complaint and the rest of the statement.

    Biden wants to spend trillions fixing infrastructure and frankly , that's a good thing. It requires a lot of engineers and tech sector specialists. We have far less students pursuing these degrees in favor of garbage like visual communication and intersectional feminism.

    The idea that the degrees have value is dubious at best. They tend to either self perpetuate in academia or result in an activist who has no solutions.

    The point being that we don't need to be concerned about an entire generation not knowing or understanding math is "going to be ok" is silly. Fixing this nation's infrastructure is not a project that can be done in 2 terms. At some point this younger generation has to solve problems....not just complain about them.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2021
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