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Featured The end of "magic"

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by mcarans, Mar 20, 2019.

  1. mcarans

    mcarans Member

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    Where did the magic go in the intervening time?
     
  2. Kaon

    Kaon Well-Known Member

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    It didn't go anywhere. Vessels that are capable of practicing it are in various degrees of secrecy. Most people don't realize they are practitioners themselves - where the magic they wield is OUTWARD, and for some other entity.
     
  3. Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

    Jude1:3Contendforthefaith I'm Currently An Eastern Orthodox Catechumen Supporter

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    Saints Cyprian and Justina would disagree. (304 A.D.)

    Saint Cyprian was a Sorcerer and attacked Saint Justina with black magic before his conversion to Christianity. The Lord was more powerful then the demons Cyprian worked with so God delivered her from Cyprian's attacks:

    This is an example of the struggles and Secret Persecutions The Church has endured while also having to endure the physical and out in open ones.

    These things still happen to Us today and we should be aware of what is happening. God Is Greater than the wicked who attack us in secret:


    The Lives of Sts. Cyprian and Justina

    Cyprian and Justina - Wikipedia








    Jesus Christ Conquers

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    • The Divine Liturgy of St. John Chrysostom:

    O Lord, Save Your people,
    and bless your inheritance!
    Grant Victory To The Orthodox Christians
    Over Their Adversaries,
    and by virtue of your cross,
    preserve your habitation.


    https://orthodoxwiki.org/Troparion


    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  4. Handmaid for Jesus

    Handmaid for Jesus You can't steal my joy Supporter

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    When Spirit filled children of God realize that the God of the universe resides within them, they will become bold channels for the Holy Spirit.
     
  5. Kaon

    Kaon Well-Known Member

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    Correct. However, some people are still supremely enticed by the gain of magic(k). It is intoxicating.

    The "magic" from the Most High God is Clean. You won't have residue on your spirit from wielding it. I just wish people weren't so ignorant to magic, then they could see how it is used on them every day.
     
  6. wonderkins

    wonderkins Member

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    Miracles were not a regular occurrence in the Bible. It is not page after page of miracles. You basically have three periods where miracles were happening, along with a few separate miracles.

    1. Moses and Joshua
    2. Elijah and Elisha
    3. Jesus and the apostles
     
  7. Kaon

    Kaon Well-Known Member

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    These are definitely periods of recorded miracles...
     
  8. Tone

    Tone Star Fish Radiant Supporter

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    Magic does not come from the Creator and is not condoned by Him.

    He is the Creator so what He does is natural to Him. We call it supernatural when we don't understand how He does it. And when we understand some things about it, we call it science and technology.

    He is the author of any laws of physics or what have you, and naturally, He may manipulate them in ways that we cannot comprehend. But, how is this "magical"?

    Magic Definition and Meaning - Bible Dictionary
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2019
  9. Handmaid for Jesus

    Handmaid for Jesus You can't steal my joy Supporter

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    What is written is not all there was. The Apostle John writes:
    John 21:25 And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

    Also the Maccabees experience the miracle of the lights, but that miracle is not in the cannon.
     
  10. Handmaid for Jesus

    Handmaid for Jesus You can't steal my joy Supporter

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    Yes, but He is NOT natural. He is Supernatural and His acts are Supernatural.
     
  11. Tone

    Tone Star Fish Radiant Supporter

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    Yeah, I didn't say He was natural. When He created the heaven and the earth, it was supernatural right? And within that creation, all is natural...or supernatural?
     
  12. wonderkins

    wonderkins Member

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    OK, but the point of this thread is that miracles have ceased, correct? Although I don't agree with relating miracles from God to the wicked magic of men. Even with the miracles that are recorded in scripture, it's not a high frequency when compared the 1500 or so years covered in the Bible. So to say miracles happened so often in the Bible, but now it's nothing would be inaccurate.

    Miracles had a purpose. They confirmed what God said. They were not just random everyday happenings.
     
  13. Handmaid for Jesus

    Handmaid for Jesus You can't steal my joy Supporter

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    I agree God created all of the natural laws of physics that govern the universe. But He also created the spiritual laws which are supernatural.
     
  14. Handmaid for Jesus

    Handmaid for Jesus You can't steal my joy Supporter

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    I agree somewhat with what your quote. It is error that has been crippling the Church in these last days. And Miracles from God are greater than the magics that evil ones perform. However today people are blind to the supernatural and rely primarily on the natural.There is more faith in technology today than faith in God.
     
  15. Bruce Leiter

    Bruce Leiter Member

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    It's not the end of "magic" in the New Testament era. The large-scale miracles continue. At the beginning of every era, God acts with miracles to confirm his existence and authority as the Creator and Rescuer.

    That series of large-scale miracles happened in the gospels through Jesus and in Acts through the apostles. The miracles continue in the lives of true believers in the form of the new birth and spiritual progress. How many true Christians have existed since Jesus died and rose again? That number is the large-scale miracle. It's through Christians that God wants to spread the good news so that others can experience his miracles.

    I don't like the word "magic" for anything that God does. He is NOT the divine Magician.

    About the relationship between the Old and New Testaments, my studies as a pastor have shown me that there are both continuity and discontinuity between them. The Old Testament and its laws were for the nation of Israel. The outward forms of the laws have disappeared through Jesus' death (Colossians 2:9-23). Therefore, when God replaced Israel with the international church, he did away, for example, with the forms of unclean and clean foods, animal sacrifices, physical descent from Abraham, the priesthood, and holy and unholy objects (read Hebrews). However, the inner intents of the laws like our needing to overcome spiritual uncleanness, trust in Jesus' sacrificial death, consider ourselves spiritual children of Abraham, our priesthood as believers, and our need to grow in holiness still apply in the New Testament era.

    Furthermore, the covenant given to Abraham also continues into the New Testament era in a new form, as Jesus said when he instituted the Lord's Supper in Luke 22:20, "This cup is the blood of the new covenant, which is poured out for you." That covenant is not brand-new, because he uses the word kainos, which means "new and improved." Neos is the Greek word for brand-new, as in a baby.
     
  16. Handmaid for Jesus

    Handmaid for Jesus You can't steal my joy Supporter

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    Man was created in God's image but man lost that in the fall. Lord Jesus came to fix (restore) man's image and to reconcile man to our Father in Heaven. We are born again of the Spirit and once again called sons of God.Lord Jesus demonstrated how we should operate as sons of God. He told us that the things He did, we would do and greater things would we do. But how many of us even understand this?
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2019
  17. Kaon

    Kaon Well-Known Member

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    That definition is highly lacking, simply because the institutions that define magic so not know what magic actually is. And, it isn't the fault of the institution, as academia cannot take magic as something that is a natural phenomenon.

    What the dictionary actually denotes as magic is the colloquial definition.


    The truth is there is no such thing as magic: there is

    1) using natural laws to work in harmony with nature, and

    2) using natural laws for ones own personal will.

    What we call miracles are nature to the Most High God. What we call magic is a sophisticated knowledge of this plane of existence.
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2019
  18. nonaeroterraqueous

    nonaeroterraqueous Nonexistent Member

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    Magic is merely the act of making nature do what nature would not do. Being part of the natural course of events, ourselves, we are not prone to magic. Everything that we are is caused by something natural, and everything that we do is a product of that nature. God, being outside of his created universe, being the cause of all and not being caused by anything, is inherently magical. When he acts, it is always magic (supernatural), whether it is something obvious, like the healing of a lame man, or something more subtle, like the healing of a lame attitude.

    Other causes of magic can be other things that lie outside of the natural order (supernatural beings, by definition). As long as there are angels and demons in this world, there will be magic. Many people don't like the term, because it sounds so much like sorcery. Such people usually prefer to refer to Godly magic as "miracles." A miracle is just magic from God, really.

    A case could certainly be made that demonic magic has been suppressed since the coming of Christ. Jumping from that to claim that miracles from God have likewise been suppressed, almost as a matter of fairness to the demons, is a much harder position to take, and it might even be a foolish one. I don't think it would be reasonable to think that either miracles or demonism have been entirely stopped.
     
  19. Tone

    Tone Star Fish Radiant Supporter

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    What I have in mind also is the fact that nature isn't natural, post fall, it is unnatural...so bringing someone from the dead is restoring something unnatural back to natural--how it was originally created...apart from death.
     
  20. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    The paragraph has replies, and from those, no one had ever heard of it.
    Satan can only corrupt what is created as good.
     
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