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Featured The Day of the Lord is at Hand for all the Nations

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by keras, Aug 2, 2020.

  1. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    Obadiah 1:15-21 The Day of the Lord is at hand for all the nations, they will be treated as they have treated others and their wrong actions will recoil upon themselves. My people will drink the wine of God’s wrath, then all the nations in turn will drink of it and be devastated by it. But in Jerusalem there will be a holy remnant, the Lord’s people will be like a flame while the House of Esau will be burnt up with no survivors. My [Christian] people will possess all of the holy Land that was given to Abraham and those in Jerusalem who lead My people will control the lands of the Edomites, but the Kingdom belongs to the Lord.

    Isaiah 28:21-22 The Lord will arise as He did at Mt Perazim and in the valley of Gibeon, and storm with rage to do what He must do, to perform His task – a strange and alien deed. But now, have done with all arrogance and pride or the Lord will increase His punishment, for destruction is decreed over the whole Land. Jeremiah 10:18

    Isaiah 26:10-11 Lord: Your hand is lifted high and Your enemies can’t see Your good will toward Your people. [Let them see and be ashamed.] Let the fire reserved for Your enemies consume them. The wicked are destroyed, they have never learnt justice, they are corrupt and blinded to Your Majesty and power.

    Micah 4:11-12 Now, many nations are massed against Israel, they say: Let Zion suffer outrage, we will gloat over their demise. They are unaware of the Lord’s plans, for His purpose is to gather them like sheaves to the threshing floor.

    Nahum 1:5 The earth quakes before the Lord, the world and all who live in it are in tumult. Who can stand before His wrath? Who can resist the fury of His anger, poured out as fire?


    The Lord will arise and storm with rage, as He did in ancient times’. Jeremiah 30:23-24

    His task, strange and alien’. We know God as a God of love, but also of justice and it is just to punish those who do not obey Him and who attack His Land. Isaiah 34:5

    destruction is decreed’. The entire Middle East will be burnt and devastated. Ezekiel 30:3-5, Isaiah 17:1, Amos 1:3-15

    ‘fire reserved for the Lord’s enemies will consume them, His anger poured out as fire’. A massive sunstrike CME will fulfill all these prophesied effects. Deut. 32:22, Isaiah 66:15-16, Malachi 4:1

    ‘My people will drink the wine of God’s wrath’. This will be the third ‘swing of the sword’ Ezekiel 21:14, the final judgement/punishment of the Jewish people. Jeremiah 2:9, Eze.24:14

    ‘now, many nations are massed against Israel’. This perfectly describes the situation today and they want to ‘gloat over her demise’. Psalm 83:1-18

    ‘The House of Esau, burnt up – no survivors’. Those attacking Israel will be totally wiped out. Isaiah 63:1-6, Zephaniah 2:4-5

    ‘those who lead My people’. Another proof that all this will happen before the Return of Jesus. Jeremiah 30:21, Hosea 1:11

     
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  2. Lost4words

    Lost4words Jesus I Trust In You Supporter

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    All, your own, unique, interpretation of what the scripture means, to 'you'. ;)
     
  3. Timtofly

    Timtofly Well-Known Member

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    The church will be restored into the temple of God prepared for Adam and his descendants. 1 Corinthians 15:51

    51 Look, I will tell you a secret — not all of us will die! But we will all be changed!

    1 Thessalonians 4:16-17
    16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a rousing cry, with a call from one of the ruling angels, and with God’s shofar; those who died united with the Messiah will be the first to rise;
    17 then we who are left still alive will be caught up with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air; and thus we will always be with the Lord.

    Titus 2:11-15
    11 For God’s grace, which brings deliverance, has appeared to all people.
    12 It teaches us to renounce godlessness and worldly pleasures, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives now, in this age;
    13 while continuing to expect the blessed fulfillment of our certain hope, which is the appearing of the Sh’khinah of our great God and the appearing of our Deliverer, Yeshua the Messiah.
    14 He gave himself up on our behalf in order to free us from all violation of Torah and purify for himself a people who would be his own, eager to do good.
    15 These are the things you should say. Encourage and rebuke with full authority; don’t let anyone look down on you.

    Revelation 6:12-17
    12 Then I watched as he broke the sixth seal, and there was a great earthquake, the sun turned black as sackcloth worn in mourning, and the full moon became blood-red.
    13 The stars fell from heaven to earth just as a fig tree drops its figs when shaken by a strong wind.
    14 The sky receded like a scroll being rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved from its place.
    15 Then the earth’s kings, the rulers, the generals, the rich and the mighty — indeed, everyone, slave and free — hid himself in caves and among the rocks in the mountains,
    16 and said to the mountains and rocks,Fall on us, and hide us from the face of the One sitting on the throne and from the fury of the Lamb!
    17 For the Great Day of their fury has come, and who can stand?

    It is the end of the age. The Hope of God's glory and the Redeemer is at hand. The Lamb slain from before the foundation of the world. Come to gather the Redeemed who are alive to present before the alter in the temple of God a complete church and bride. The nations rage and the house of Jacob ask who is this Lamb of Glory?

    Psalm 24:7-10
    7 Lift up your heads, you gates!
    Lift them up, everlasting doors,
    so that the glorious king can enter!
    8 Who is he, this glorious king?
    Adonai, strong and mighty,
    Adonai, mighty in battle.

    9 Lift up your heads, you gates!
    Lift them up, everlasting doors,
    so that the glorious king can enter!
    10 Who is he, this glorious king?
    Adonai-Tzva’ot —
    he is the glorious king. (Selah)

    Psalm 90
    "Sing a new song to Adonai,
    because he has done wonders.
    His right hand, his holy arm
    have won him victory.
    2 Adonai has made known his victory;
    revealed his vindication in full view of the nations,
    3 remembered his grace and faithfulness
    to the house of Isra’el.
    All the ends of the earth have seen
    the victory of our God.
    4 Shout for joy to Adonai, all the earth!
    Break forth, sing for joy, sing praises!
    5 Sing praises to Adonai with the lyre,
    with the lyre and melodious music!
    6 With trumpets and the sound of the shofar,
    shout for joy before the king, Adonai!

    7 Let the sea roar, and everything in it;
    the world, and those living in it.
    8 Let the floods clap their hands;
    let the mountains sing together for joy
    9 before Adonai, for he has come to judge the earth; he will judge the world rightly and the peoples fairly."


    This is the end of the church and the end of Adam's punishment. The Psalmist does not say the Redeemed are protected. This is the victory of overcoming the world. The church is completed. The world is harvested fairly. Not receiving any unjust punishment. Yet Satan will still demand his own justice against Adam's descendants. To claim that any go through Satan's 3.5 years is turning God into an unjust God. That Satan gets power over any humanity is a travesty. But even the worst of humanity can save themselves by getting their head cut off. However the Lord of the harvest is here to end flesh and blood once and for all eternity. The last 1000 years will be a resurrection of life from the fires of the final harvest at the battle of Armageddon. That is the only way to end and complete Adam's punishment.

    The church is already judged on the Cross. The Redeemer already paid the Atonement. The church can only be taken out first. Then the end of sin and death. After the reign of the Millennium it is true that Christ will hand a completed kingdom and the defeat of Death. One cannot put the beginning of the Lord's Day at the end. The beginning of the Lord's Day completes two ages. The end of the Lord's Day will be the final completion of all things.
     
  4. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    It is obvious to anyone without another agenda to promote, that 1 Corinthians 15:50-56 is a prophecy about the Great White Throne Judgment; AFTER the Millennium. Only then is Death no more.
    You post lengthy scriptures, but your take on what they mean, is a confused mish-mash.
    No; L4W, I use 15 other scriptures to help explain the Prophesies.
    Other people here discuss issues and make useful comments. You?
     
  5. Timtofly

    Timtofly Well-Known Member

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    Since I trust your study of the Bible, my thoughts are mish-mash next to yours. You are about the only one with that much thought put in, who will be prepared. The Millennium will be a new heavens and earth. But not the Revelation 21 type. It will be an Isaiah 65 type. My guess is it will be the same heaven and earth as was pre-Flood. The OT only knew the Torah, and they prophecied accordingly. I have read a great deal and researched much, but not the same as any here, because all have unique experiences. I definitely have no pre-conceived agenda, thus the mish-mash. All I know is I am a witness and the 4th seal is about to be opened when we least expect it. Thus, the 5th and 6th seals will be a surprise as much as the 4th seal will be. Whoever disagrees and claims the first 3 seals have not been opened this year, I cannot refute them. I am just here to witness them. Every one seems to have their minds made up, and likely will not change them. Thus all will still be surprised even if they are prepared.
     
  6. eclipsenow

    eclipsenow God cares about his creation as well as us.

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    In our other discussion you asserted that the Day of the Lord would occur in our lifetimes.

    If this is all you've got, colour me utterly disappointed and sceptical! A bunch of OT exile prophesies ripped out of context does not a timetable make!

    One of the main things happening here is you don't know how to do your Biblical Theology in how the Old Testament prophesies of doom to Israel were actually fulfilled.

    Another thing that often happens is futurists don't know how the Day of the Lord is presented in the OT as one event that then splits into two in the New Testament - which is why the Jews and especially the disciples were so expectant that they were going to kick out the Romans and usher in a Davidic kingdom again.

    But the worst thing? I know how you read Hosea 6 and Luke 13 to just totally randomly assert end-times-tables that just are not in the text. I'm not excited by this - not at all. I so prefer a good exegetical sermon on the OT prophets by a Reformed Covenant Theologian like Peter or Phillip Jensen, or Dr Andrew Shead. This random collection of verses above could have been put together by throwing darts at a wall-map of bible books and chapters!
     
  7. Jonathan Walkerin

    Jonathan Walkerin Well-Known Member

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    Adding to that personal bias and daily morning news from Fox seems to be the preferred method for many.
     
  8. Lost4words

    Lost4words Jesus I Trust In You Supporter

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    I see it for what it is. ;)
     
  9. eclipsenow

    eclipsenow God cares about his creation as well as us.

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    To all futurists that think Revelation is not a gospel sermon to encourage John's generation about to be persecuted by the Romans, but think that his letter is mainly about us.

    1. Why do you cut Chapter 1 out of Revelation where John says it is SOON, the time is NEAR, he shares in THEIR TRIBULATION (as in the stuff he's about to describe!), and he wants THEM to hear and obey his message?
    2. How do you hear and obey a message about something thousands of years in the future?
    EG: "The Mechs will fight the Organoids on Mars in the year 4000 - and the warfare will throw terrible energies around. Now obey this message!"
    3. John seems to care about his generation. Why do you think he would sneer at them? "So I share in your tribulation but stop snivelling - wait till you see what's coming in 2000 years!"

    I just can't see how you insert 2000 years between Chapter 1 and the rest - and how you read all this great sermon to the people of 2000 years ago as some kind of dry, boring, IRRELEVANT end times table. Why is it irrelevant? Because ... unless you're narcissistic to think we're in the middle of it (because everything's always about US, right? :oldthumbsup:) - it's probably another 1000 years in the future or something.
     
  10. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    I have not changed my belief about this.
    The main proof for this belief, is the exact 2000 year periods as given in the Bible and in actual historical facts.
    There was 2000 years from Adam until Abraham migrated to Canaan. Then 2000 years from Abraham until Jesus, now 1990 years since Jesus commenced His Ministry.

    The two prophesies of Hosea 6:2 and Luke 13:32 confirm this final 2000 year period; until Jesus Returns to reign over the earth for the final 1000 years, making a total of 7000 years = Gods decreed time for mankind.
    Well, none of Revelation happened to John's generation. Or during the past 1990 years. Excluding the first five Seals. We have had the wars, incl the Roman conquest of 66-135 AD, the famines and the plagues all thru this age. Plus the millions of Christian martyrs.

    The Sixth Seal is next, as the OP of this thread says. All of Revelation from Rev 6:12 until the end, awaits fulfilment. It will be, or our Bibles are valueless.
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2020
  11. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    The Sixth Seal is the event that the Lord intends to use in order to punish the nations, who at present conspire to annihilate Israel. Their attack and its consequences are prophesied in Psalms 83 and Micah 4:11-12.
    Prophecies that parallel the Sixth Seal are; Isaiah 34:4the sky rolled up like a scroll’, Isaiah 2:21hide in caves, etc’, Zeph.1:14 ‘The Day of the Lords wrath, a Day of doom and disaster’, then in Amos 1 – it says how the Lord will send fire to destroy the Ishmaelite peoples [those mentioned in Psalm 83] for all their crimes.
    There are over 70 verses in the Bible that speak of a forthcoming fire judgement and most of them state clearly that it is the Lord Himself who instigates this fire. Joel 1:15 & 19 ‘The Day of the Lord comes, a mighty destruction from the Almighty and fire has consumed the trees and pastures.

    Habakkuk 3:12 Furiously, You traverse the earth, in anger, You trample on the nations.

    Isaiah 66:15-16 The Lord will judge with fire....He will test all mankind, many will be slain.

    How He will do this, is told to us in Isaiah 30:26-30 where it is undeniably written about ‘a devouring fire, from the Lord Himself’, that is caused by ‘the sun shining seven times stronger’. This can only be a Coronal Mass Ejection; something that the earth has experienced in the past and is expected to happen again, that can have worldwide devastating consequences - a seemingly natural occurrence that will maintain the hidden-ness of the Lord.
    With this scenario in mind, many other prophecies make sense, passages like Ezekiel 20:47-48, about a fire in the Land, kindled by the Lord, and 2 Peter 3:7 & 10, where Peter says: ‘The Day of the Lord will come like a thief, the Day the heavens disappear and flames bring all the earth to judgement’. Psalms 18:7-15
     
  12. eclipsenow

    eclipsenow God cares about his creation as well as us.

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    1. We don't know that to be a fact as 'son of' in the genealogies can mean 'descendant of'.
    2. Much of early Genesis is creative narrative - it's literal not literary.
    3. So what if it was 2000 years?
    4. It wasn't.


    So what?

    Yes - the Lord has been patient with his creation, hasn't he?


    (Yawns...) As we have already discussed: neither of these passages have any INKLING of Last Days time-tables in them.

    HOSEA 6:
    It's a Hebrew counting pattern. Counting can form an impression of quickness in Hebrew poetic forms: See Amos 1:2-15.

    “Thus says the Lord:
    For three transgressions of Damascus, and for four, I will not revoke the punishment, because they have threshed Gilead”.​

    This counting theme is repeated through the next few chapters of Amos, showing God’s judgement.

    But in Hosea the message is that if Israel repents (“admits” in verse 15), then God will not delay his forgiveness. It will come quickly and surely. It's just part of the message of God's forgiveness to Israel if Israel repents. It's part of the overall message of Hosea to his generation - that if they repent, the Lord will forgive with haste.
    “Come, let us return to the Lord; for he has torn us, that he may heal us; he has struck us down, and he will bind us up. 2 After two days he will revive us; on the third day he will raise us up, that we may live before him. 3 Let us know; let us press on to know the Lord; his going out is sure as the dawn; he will come to us as the showers, as the spring rains that water the earth.”
    Your argument is not even an argument – it’s special pleading from the total silence of the passage on anything to do with the last days at all. There's nothing eschatological here. The verse is meaningful in its context - but utterly devoid of end-times tables or millennial forms. It's just a counting phrase - almost like "One two buckle my shoe" but with the promise of God's forgiveness instead of menial tasks!

    LUKE 13

    31 At that time some Pharisees came to Jesus and said to him, “Leave this place and go somewhere else. Herod wants to kill you. 32 He replied, “Go tell that fox, ‘I will keep on driving out demons and healing people today and tomorrow, and on the third day I will reach my goal.’ 33 In any case, I must press on today and tomorrow and the next day—for surely no prophet can die outside Jerusalem!​

    Herod Antipas was in charge of Galilee, and Pharisees warned Jesus to flee. Antipas gets some mention in the gospels as the king who killed John the baptist and was therefore terrified of Jesus as John resurrected: Luke9:7, Matthew 14, Mark 6:4. It sounds like Herod was finally coming for Jesus. Jesus response? Well, of course - start talking about Revelation's End Times tables - in code no less! Oh, wait, he didn't. He was in the middle of a preaching series about God's love - not God's judgement. No one asked him about the end times. In response to the threat of Herod Jesus just explains he is not afraid of Herod! He's going to continue teaching in his own time thank you very much. But he does tell them to go back and report that - in effect - Herod shouldn't worry about Jesus because Jesus will be leaving Herod's province of Galilee. He's going onto another jurisdiction. To die. In his own timing (on the third day - which wasn't literal because he was going to teach and do other stuff for a while yet - it was literary and gospel focussed - as his death tends to be! - with the third day invoking Jonah in the whale). As the "Evangelical Commentary of the Bible" with Walter A Elwell as Editor says:

    "Nevertheless, Jesus will be leaving Herod's realm and will arrive in Jerusalem, not because he is afraid of Herod, bt because as a prophet he must "reach [his] goal" and die in Jerusalem (vv. 32-33). The temporal references in verses 32-33 should not be taken literally; they are simply a way of describing a period of time before the end (the end is "the third day")."

    The commentary then goes on to discuss Jesus grief over Jerusalem and her judgement. The main question these verses ask is does Herod threaten Jesus? The answer is no - Jesus is going to continue his ministry, leave Galilee when he is good and ready, and then discusses his travel plans. He's going to Jerusalem. Overwriting this trip with some kind of eschatological timetable is just plain absurd! It's not even on the radar of what the text is about! If there is a timetable here, it's of 3 days, not 2! "Today, tomorrow, and the next day." But there's no timetable - it's a Hebrew counting game much like the English phrase "In the fullness of time."

    So you assert - but none of the verses you claim for this say anything like what you're forcing them to say.
    Wrong![​IMG] As Bishop Paul Barnett explains, the 1000 years we are in (long period of time between Jesus resurrection and return) have the following cycles described all in parallel - along side each other - not to be read sequentially like some sort of future timeline.

    HUMAN HISTORY: THE 1000 YEARS:-
    Seven seals depicting TYRANNY (then back to the beginning to describe)...
    Seven trumpets depicting CHAOS in nature (then back to the beginning to describe)...
    Seven signs depicting PERSECUTION (then back to the beginning to describe)...
    Seven plagues depicting DESTRUCTION.
    These episodes are concurrent, not consecutive.

    Wouldn't it be ironic if we were looking for how the Corona Virus pandemic fit into some future timeline and missed it entirely because we were looking for a timeline prediction rather than a thematic description? What if we missed the entire point of Revelation, and missed biblical warnings and encouragements about our lives now - and the last 2000 years - because we were trying to read it with the wrong glasses on?
    https://www.amazon.com/Apocalypse-Now-Then-Revelation-Commentaries/dp/1875861416

    Bottom line - it describes natural disasters, tyrants persecuting the church, 'beast-states', the temptations of trusting in materialism and luxury and even state security, and all manner of other things the human race have experienced over the last 2000 years and into the next. Revelation was a book John wrote about impending Roman persecution, but also other themes. Some images (like the beast) describe Roman stuff, other things are more generic. Not everything has to be fulfilled in the first century because it was a general description of life and the various temptations we'll face.

    To put it plainly, while Rev 13 describes Rome's persecution of the Christians in Asia Minor, it also tells us general principles about our beast states. Hitler was one beast state, Stalin another, North Korea yet another. There are many examples - and Amil Christians that live under these look to Revelation as a book of comfort. They laugh at the idea that John would have told his generation of suffering Christians "You think you've got it bad, wait till you see what happens in 2000 years!"
     
  13. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    Actually that was exactly what Jesus did prophecy:

    Luke 23:27-31 A great number of people followed Jesus on His way to execution, among them many women who mourned and lamented over Him. Jesus turned to them and said: Daughters of Jerusalem, do not weep for Me, weep for yourselves and your children. For the days are coming when people will say: Happy are those who don’t have children to worry about. Because then all will call to the mountains “fall on us” and to the hills “hide us”.

    For if these things are done when the wood is green, what will happen when the wood is dry? Reference: REB, NIV.


    weep for yourselves’, For those in Jerusalem at that time, this warned them about the coming conquest and destruction by the Romans. But it is also a dual prophecy, as then the Christians were told to ‘take to the hills’ and they escaped to Pella, in the Northern Jordan valley. Luke 20:24


    For if these things are done when the wood is green, what will happen when the wood is dry?’ A Jewish proverb. An English equivalent: ‘You ain’t seen nuthin yet!’ Green wood doesn’t burn well, dry wood does, so Jesus is saying: you can expect a lot worse carnage and violence to come in a later event. Ezekiel 20:47-48

    fall on us and hide us’, This is paralleled by Revelation 6:15-17 and Isaiah 2:21, both in passages that vividly describe the Lord’s Day of vengeance and wrath. As Jesus quoted Isaiah 61:1-2a at the commencement of His ministry, what follows in verse 2b is the Day when He will destroy His enemies: those who attack Israel and all the ungodly peoples. Deuteronomy 32:34-35, Psalms 83, Isaiah 2:12-21, Isaiah 5:25, Isaiah 33:10-12, Isaiah 63:1-6, Isaiah 66:15-16, Ezekiel 21:1-7, Joel 1:15, Psalms 97:3-5, Malachi 4:1, Hebrews 10:27
    You are rejecting Bible information, given to us by God.
    I have a list, using 47 Bible verses that prove the 3 exact 2000 year periods.
    To say 'so what', means that you have little regard for what the Bible says. What else do you reject?
    Will Jesus Return and will He find anyone with faith on earth?
     
  14. Lost4words

    Lost4words Jesus I Trust In You Supporter

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    70AD is what it pointed to. Nothing more. You are 'adding' your very own individual ideas / beliefs to scripture my friend.
     
  15. Timtofly

    Timtofly Well-Known Member

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    Then why have a NT at all if it was over? The NT canon was not even finalized for another 100 years. The tribulation was over by then, according to this theology. There is no comfort for the next 2000 years. At least be consistent with the absurdity of only pertaining to the 1st century. If the claim is that nothing in the NT was future. Then the last 1890 years have nothing whatsoever to do with God's Word. We get your false theology. It has nothing to do with the last 1890 years. That will only change in the next million years, if God is up to any change.
     
  16. Lost4words

    Lost4words Jesus I Trust In You Supporter

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    Interpretation my friend, interpretation ;)
     
  17. eclipsenow

    eclipsenow God cares about his creation as well as us.

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    Jesus prophecy was about judgement day - and I've never claimed that wasn't coming. But an Amil understanding of eschatology is that it could be in 5 seconds or 50,000 years - we just don't know - as Jesus himself says we will not know, because he is going to return like a thief in the night.

    Note that he didn't say "And the Apostle John will write a letter that's 90% applicable and understandable only by people in 2000 years." So again, Christians that have experienced real suffering laugh at the futurist reading of Revelation.

    If you're saying what I think you're saying - I don't have a problem with that.


    None of this proves anything about Revelation or anything about Jesus return being predictable rather than a thief in the night.

    I don't have time to check all those verses but for the sake of our debate I'll just assume you haven't taken stuff out of context and are looking at verses that actually discuss the judgement day. I have never said I don't believe in judgement day. So what's your point? You don't really know how to prove your point do you? This is all a diversion.

    :doh:


    You have basic comprehension problems!
    Verses saying that the Lord will return do not prove when he'll return.
    :doh::doh::doh:

    You'd better come up with something good - because pointing this basic comprehension stuff out time and again is getting tiring.
     
  18. Timtofly

    Timtofly Well-Known Member

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    Seriously, you want me to take your post literally or interpret them out of context?

    I posted exactly what amil theistic evolutionists declare to be fact.
     
  19. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    There is to come two Judgments; first the Judgment and punishment of the nations, the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster, that will commence the end times and lead up to the glorious Return. Habakkuk 3:12, Psalms 2:7-9
    Then; after Jesus has reigned as King for the Millennium, there will be the Great White Throne Judgment of every person who has ever lived. Revelation 20:11-15, Daniel 7:9-10

    It is the Sixth Seal that will come unexpectedly; as a thief. The Return will not be unexpected, as that will occur exactly 1260 days after the leader of the One World Govt sits in the Temple. 2 Thess 2:4, Revelation 13:5
    The suffering of the martyrs, bears no relation to what is described for the end times in Revelation. No one believes that
    In fact, those who were and still are persecuted and killed for their faith, can read Revelation and be happy that they didn't experience those dramatic and testing events.
    But it just may be that we alive today, will see it all.
    Difficult to discuss things with someone who doesn't bother to check my references.
    What I am saying there is how the Lord intends to destroy all the ungodly peoples in all of the holy Land. This will enable His faithful, righteous people to go and live there. Isaiah 35, Ezekiel 34:11-16, Romans 9:24-26 John sees them there in Revelation 7:9.

    This is the end times scenario that most simply do not see, with all the weird and unbiblical theories like being raptured to heaven and that we are in the Millennium now, despite Jesus not having Returned yet.
    7000 years from the Creation to the Completion of Mankind:

    Genesis 1:27 Adam was created in 3970.5 BC subtracted back from 586 BCE, from:

    Gen 5:3 Seth +130, Gen 5:6 Enoch +105, Gen 5:9 Kenan +90, Gen 5:12 Mahalalel +70, Gen 5:15 Jared +65, Gen 5:18 Enoch +162, Gen 5:21 Methuselah +65, Gen 5:25 Lamech +187, Gen 5:28 Noah+182, Gen 7:6 The Flood came when Noah was +600, Gen 11:10 Our year 2314.5 BC

    Arpachshad +2 - born to Shem after the flood. Gen 11:12 Selah +35, Gen 11:14 Heber +30, Gen 11:16 Peleg +34, Gen 11:18 Reu +30, Gen 11:20 Serug +32, Gen 11:22 Nahor +30 , Gen 11:24 Terah +29, Gen 11:26 Abram +70, Abram was +52 when God called him and they left Ur. Our year 1970.5 BCE He lived in Haran for 23 years, then went to Canaan at age 75. Genesis 12:4 Total years so far = 2000

    Gen 17:1, Abraham was 99 when the Covenant was made with God. +47 Genesis 17:1-8

    Galatians 3:17 Paul states that the Law was given +430 after the Covenant. Total years elapsed until the Exodus – 2477, in our year 1493.5 BC.

    [Many ancient records say Comet Typhon passed close the earth at that time. It was the cause of many of the disasters in Egypt.]

    1 Kings 6:1 The Temple construction starts, in the 4th year of King Solomon +480 since the Torah was given at the Exodus.. 1 Kings 11:42 Solomon 40 minus 4 = +36, 1 Kings 14:21 Rehoboam +17, 1 Kings 15:2 Abijah +3, 2 Chron 16:13 Asa +41, 1 Kings 22:42 Jehoshaphat +25, 2 Kings 8:17 Jehoram +8, 2 Kings 8:26 Ahaziah +1, 2 Kings 11:1-3 Athaliah +6, 2 Kings 12:1 Joash +40, 2 Kings 14:2 Amaziah +29, 2 Kings 15:1-2 Azariah +52, 2 Kings 15:33 Jotham +16, 2 Kings 16:2 Ahaz +16, 2 Kings 18:1-2 Hezekiah +29, 2 Kings 21:1 Manasseh +55, 2 Kings 21:19 Amon +2, 2 Kings 22:1 Josiah +31, 2 Kings 23:31 Jehoahaz +3mths, 2 Kings 23:36 Jehoiakim +11, 2 Kings 24:8 Jehoichin +3mths, 2 Kings 24:18-20 Zedekiah +11, who ruled until the Babylonian captivity in our year of 586 BC.

    Total elapsed years to the first exile of Judah = 3386.5

    586 BC + 613.5 years + 2 comes to 29.5 AD, the date of Jesus’ baptism. Luke 3:1 Plus 2 to include the total number of elapsed years, as our calendar system counts years from their commencement.
    3386.5 + 613.5 = 4000 years from Adam to Jesus.


    January 2020 AD - 29.5 AD = 1990.5 years since the commencement of Jesus’ Ministry.

    1990.5 + 4000 = 5990.5 years, is where we are now. 5990.5 + 9.5 = 6000 years

    2020 AD + 9.5 = 2029.5 AD

    Exactly 2000 years for the present Church age, until Jesus Returns.
    4000 since Abraham, 6000 since Adam. Next comes the 1000 year reign of Jesus.

    7000 years is God’s decreed time for mankind.

    Those who have been found worthy will go into Eternity with God. Revelation 22:1-5
     
  20. eclipsenow

    eclipsenow God cares about his creation as well as us.

    +955
    Australia
    Anglican
    Married
    Ah, see what you're doing there?
    Reading it from your futurist perspective to justify your futurist perspective.
    Can you get more circular?

    That's not what Jesus says.

    Except that John said he shared in his generation's tribulations and troubles.
    I believe that - St Augustine believed something like that - and the Reformers believed something like that.

    I'm not sure this sentence even makes sense?

    Ah - so now you're equating Romans 9 with OT prophesies about God's people living in the new heavens and new earth? Dude - read Romans 9 again. Romans 9 is why I - an Australian - can be a Christian. Romans 9 is the mystery revealed to the ages that God would call in Gentiles as well. It's what we see in Acts as the gospel goes out to all the nations. It's why God gave us the Holy Spirit in Acts 1:8 to empower the gathering of the nations in. It's not future eschatological but gospel-focused eschatology.

    I rebuke your futurist reading of Romans 9 as basically calling me not a Christian because I'm not Jewish!
     
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