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The Atheist could be wrong for many good reasons

Discussion in 'Philosophy' started by SamuelTP1977, Nov 22, 2015.

  1. SamuelTP1977

    SamuelTP1977 Member

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    Dear Fellow Posters,

    I feel Christ could have come back from the dead. I know we don't know this, but we weren't there, we don't know what the people saw 2000 years ago in Palestine. I definitely hope it did happen and Christ has our back in the after life.

    Some evidence for a creator is atheists like Richard Dawkins admit we can't rule Him, Her or It out. I feel if you consider the kind of odds that would have to play out from the big bang to present time to make DNA just by natural processes is really too hard for it to happen like that. There is probably a creator and we are not made to know if there is a Heaven or a Hell, but I definitely hope there is justice in the end for all humans.

    So what are your thoughts on this?
     
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  2. Crowns&Laurels

    Crowns&Laurels Well-Known Member

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    The coming of Christ is the most controversial event in human history. Atheists dismiss him in favor of things which are irrelevant. Dawkins is irrelevant, Hawking is irrelevant, science is irrelevant- it's all only serves as a distraction and a blindfold.
     
  3. Ana the Ist

    Ana the Ist Aggressively serene!

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    When you consider the "odds" for anything to happen across a long enough timeline...literally just about every event becomes extraordinarily unlikely.

    Consider the odds of you writing this exact thread using those exact words just an hour ago...

    If we go back as far as today and all that had to happen exactly as it did for you to create this thread....we can see the "odds" are stacked pretty heavily against it.

    If we go back a week...the odds become far far worse, heading towards the highly improbable.

    If we go back a year....now we're reaching near impossibility.

    If we go back to before your birth...we're looking at an event you would probably say needed divine intervention to happen.

    Can you see now how looking at the "odds" of something happening...against all other possibilities from the beginning of the universe makes anything seem ridiculously unlikely?

    Is it because such a thing was really unlikely? Or could it be that the realm of possibility is so large that anything can look improbable compared to it?
     
  4. Ana the Ist

    Ana the Ist Aggressively serene!

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    Lol good to see you're being objective as possible about this.
     
  5. Crowns&Laurels

    Crowns&Laurels Well-Known Member

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    If God created the laws of the universe, then how does one dismiss God on account of nature :doh:
    It is being objective- I'm just not romanticizing science and skepticism, which is what atheists always want the religious to do and not the other way around.
     
  6. Davian

    Davian fallible

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    How could a human being be alive after all this time?
    Wishful thinking, then.
    The undefined, unfalsifiable, and untestable is hard to rule out completely. Can you rule out the fairies in the garden that make the plants grow?
    What are those odds?
    What do you mean by justice? From what I gather, anything goes, as long as you believe.
    Atheism is not a truth statement. It is only "I am not convinced of your religious opinion."

    What are these "good reasons" that you allude to?
     
  7. Davian

    Davian fallible

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    On what do you base this? In real life, I do not encounter religion at all. I have to come here to explore this topic.
    How are gods relevant, in some measurable way?
    I love the "blindfold" analogy, as if you can see something that others can't.
     
  8. Crowns&Laurels

    Crowns&Laurels Well-Known Member

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    Christianity is the one religion atheists aim at. It is what other religions aim at. It is the history of the society you live in. Christ changed the world.

    But nice job trying to downplay it to your ordinary, day to day life. You came here to be against Christianity, I don't labor under any delusion that all of you came here out of some interest in Christianity.
     
  9. Davian

    Davian fallible

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    Right. You are persecuted, therefore you are right. Or something like that.

    lol.
    Religions changed the world, to be clear.
    Mind reading fail. Did you not get fresh batteries for that thing?

    While I encounter virtually no religion in my day-to-day life, there are religionists that have access to our government, our school systems, and my children. It behooves me to inform myself about all manners of less-than-skeptical thinking, from pseudoscience to religions. To learn about Christians, I come here. Can you fault that reasoning?
     
  10. AHH who-stole-my-name

    AHH who-stole-my-name in accordance with Christ

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    Have any of you who think everything other than your own interpretation of events you have not witnessed is so superior to those who were equally not there ever thought that The big Bang was actually the mechanics that God used to create the universe and everything in it?

    I really get tired of people who dismiss the idea of exploring ideas that might lead us to a further understanding of ourselves and our world, simply because there are those within this exploration community called science who disagree with you on it's creator.

    If you think science is irrelevant than go back to the horse and buggy and go to your precher when a lump forms in your body and begins to grow.
     
  11. Crowns&Laurels

    Crowns&Laurels Well-Known Member

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    I didn't say we were persecuted, I said we're who you all aim at.

    Christ is the most relevant figure in history. Mohammad borrowed from his coming, and created the second largest religion in the world. All other religions became obsolete in 0 AD.
    That is also to say, even how you date history is based on Jesus' birth. But downplay it all you want.
     
  12. Davian

    Davian fallible

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    Like the chart shows, it is the biggest target, and exerts the biggest pressure on our government and school systems.
    He never came up in any history class I attended.
    Are we to put reality up for a vote?
    The rest shortly after. ^_^
    Where I live (Canada) we use the BCE/CE notation. No downplaying necessary.

    When I first started looking into all of this religious stuff, I was really worried, based on the stories told of school systems in the USA, but it turned out not to be a big deal. I review my children's curriculums, and read their text books, and I am happy with how secular everything is.
     
  13. Ana the Ist

    Ana the Ist Aggressively serene!

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    By starting with the assumption that "god created the laws of this universe"...you're demonstrating bias. Therefore any claims of objectivity go right out the window. There's a lot of steps that you have to skip right over to even get to the conclusion that "god created the laws of this universe".

    What is it exactly that you think atheists "romanticize" about science and scepticism? You certainly don't have to answer with every example you can think of...but it would be nice to have one or two so we can understand what you're talking about.

    I've certainly seen people romanticize science to a degree...though the guy wasn't an atheist (to my knowledge). He seemed to have some unfounded belief that mankind's greatest problems were currently underway for being solved by science. I think he's putting faith into something that doesn't have a track record for deserving it. Science has definitely given us a lot of solutions to modern problems...but I don't see it as saving us from any number of global problems like water shortages, peak oil, and global warming for example.

    This is my idea for a romanticized view of science though. So what exactly do you mean when you say atheists romanticize it and what's an example?
     
  14. AHH who-stole-my-name

    AHH who-stole-my-name in accordance with Christ

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    Christianity is like all religions and we have fought more against each other than against any other religion on the planet and still do. That's evident in many of the posts we have here.

    Being that America was saturated by Christianity as the different sects ran to our shores to escape the very intolerance we showed every other sect that came with us, as well as the indigenous inhabitants of the country we invaded speaks volumes of how benevolent we are and how much we deserve the scrutiny of others.

    I want that scrutiny and I think we all should think our lucky stars that there are some people out there that give us the feedback we need to honesty evaluates ourselves and our actions. Without that we would run around in a self righteous haze thinking ourselves deserving Gods love instead of diligently working towards being Christian

    As far as being a victim. Those in America have no idea what that is. As of today all we've been is irritated that we don't hold the social/political power we once held and some refuse to try and understand why that is. They just throw words like EVIL and DEPRAVITY at everything and sneer at the very people who might be open to speak with us If we weren't so dismissive of them and the world they live in.
     
  15. Crowns&Laurels

    Crowns&Laurels Well-Known Member

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    You didn't sue that Muslim bakery that denied homosexual couples though. Why is that? You don't go running up to Muslim gatherings complaining that you have no space to exert your beliefs. Why is that? Every move that atheists make, it is not against religion, it is against Christianity under the guise that it is about religion. When an atheist complains, it's not about that Muslim who went and shot up some people, it's about that guy saying a prayer to his football team.

    The chart shows what it shows, and that is it. Not the twist you are putting on it.

    Everyone in that book were Christians, driven by a principle and worldview thereof, in countries that were newly founded on Christianity.
    And I'm sure if Christ were in any history book, you'd throw him out just like with any other thing.

    I'm sure that has everything to with political correctness. If anything, it just proves my point. It's not apples and oranges anyway, 'before common era' vs 'before Christ'. Same thing, 0AD. Jesus.

    You were 'worried' about the effects of a belief that has been central and prominent in society for the past 1700 years.
    Yeah, you're making a believer out of me let me tell you..
     
  16. Ana the Ist

    Ana the Ist Aggressively serene!

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    Lol that's a touch tactless....but you have a point. It's hard to take a science detractor seriously when they're explaining their views to you from across the internet and a computer that together have changed mankind so significantly they get compared to the industrial and agricultural revolutions historically.

    The Amish and Ted Kaczinsky (the unabomber, however you spell his name) are people who you know actually live their opinions about science and technology.
     
  17. Ana the Ist

    Ana the Ist Aggressively serene!

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    The story of Christ certainly changed the world...though whether that change is more significant than Buddhism or Islam is certainly debatable.

    We are on a christian forum though...so the rest of this post is just odd. I go to the forums of other religions when I want to discuss them (and that's actually something I've done...I'm not just explaining what I'd do hypothetically).
     
  18. Crowns&Laurels

    Crowns&Laurels Well-Known Member

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    Being that Jesus is straight up called the Jewish Messiah in the Quran and deemed the co-prophet of Mohammad, Buddhism is dwarfed. There are even Buddhist-Christian syncretists, at that.

    There's something about Christ that drives men.
     
  19. AHH who-stole-my-name

    AHH who-stole-my-name in accordance with Christ

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    I use tact where I think it is of use. I've ran into too many brick walls trying to sugar coat my words and have been dismissed for not being, quote/unquote Christian enough for some people who seem to think they have a monopoly on the concept.
     
  20. Ana the Ist

    Ana the Ist Aggressively serene!

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    Try to remember that in many Muslim nations they still execute people for apostasy. If you go back only a couple hundred years...christians were still burning people at the stake for non-christian beliefs. It's only once you remove the fear of death...not to mention the destruction of someone's reputation/career/credibility...that you get to find out what people actually think.

    So it's a relatively new phenomenon here in the U.S. People can be atheists and not worry so much about their lives being ruined if someone finds out. You're lucky enough to live in this time...so to you it looks like christianity is being "attacked" from all sides. The reality is that you're just able to find out what people really believe because of where and when you live in history.

    For the vast majority of its existence...I'd say about 1500 of it's 2000 years, christians have been the ones persecuting and wiping out every other belief system. When you do those sorts of things as a religion, and everyone who disagrees must hold their silence or risk death, you can get away with doing things like changing the way years are counted by starting them on the hypothetical birth year of your supposed savior.
     
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