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The Assumption of the Blessed Virgin Mary

Discussion in 'The Lord's Table - Liberal Catholics' started by Colin, Aug 15, 2017.

  1. Colin

    Colin Senior Veteran

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    August 15th
    The Assumption of the Blessed Virgin Mary

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    This feast is the memorial of Our Lady's death, burial, rising to life - her Passover and glorious assumption into heaven.

    In ancient times the churches of the west and in many eastern churches still today, begin the feast with an all-night vigil mourning the death of the Mother of Christ. Then at dawn a great Mass celebrated her resurrection and assumption.

    In pre-Reformation England, this was the most popular summer festival. It inspired all kinds of village fairs, parties and dances. King Alfred the Great made the feast of Our Lady's Assumption a 'bank holiday' in his kingdom.

    Russian and Greek Orthodox Christians call this feast the Dormition, or the Falling Asleep of Our Lady.

    In both the East and West, Mary is the most important of saints
     
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  2. Anhelyna

    Anhelyna Handmaid of God Supporter CF Senior Ambassador

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    In giving Birth you retained your virginity, in falling asleep you did not abandon the world, O Mother of God. You passed into life, for you are the Mother of Life, and by your prayers you deliver our souls from death.

    The tomb and death could not hold the Mother of God, unceasing in her intercession and unfailing hope of patronage, for, as the Mother of Life, she was transferred to life by Him Who had dwelt in her ever – virgin womb.
     
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  3. Anand Prabhu Antony

    Anand Prabhu Antony Member

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    Till now, No resurrected person has ascended into heaven except the Lord Jesus Christ (John 3:13). The apostle John, who took care of Mary -mother of the Lord, did not say anything about her ascension.

    Jesus said: "If I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and take you to Myself, that where I am, there you may be also(John 14:3). Still, He did not come back, how one can say Mary went to heaven without Him?. Everyone has to wait for His second coming, untill then nobody can go there.

    1Corinthians 15:20-23
    Christ has indeed been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep.
    For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man.
    For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive.
    But each in his own turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him.
     
  4. Colin

    Colin Senior Veteran

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    Tradition though does speak of Mary's Assumption , which took place before the Bible was written .
     
  5. Anand Prabhu Antony

    Anand Prabhu Antony Member

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    2 Thessalonians 2:15 Revised Standard Version Catholic Edition (RSVCE)
    “So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter”.

    Tradition by written Letters or by mouth is same according to St. Paul. So, where comes the concept of new tradition of the catholic church, which does not bind with written tradition(Apostle Letters). St. Paul says hold to the tradition, the tradition which is in the New Testament letters. I meant, that Sacred tradition is already given in the scripture, so no need a tradition that comes away from the Scripture.

    Now we don’t have the oral tradition from the mouth of Apostles, but we have the written letters. So, we can follow the apostolic tradition from their letters itself.

    The supporting words of St.Paul that’s says about Apostolic tradition is mentioned in 1Corinthians 11:2; 2Thessalonians 3:6. Also Paul warns about man made traditions in Colossians 2:8.

    1 Corinthians 4:6 Revised Standard Version Catholic Edition (RSVCE)
    “…..learn by us not to go beyond what is written, that none of you may be puffed up in favor of one against another”.

    St. Paul asking those people not to go beyond what they received in written letters , so that they won’t go against another in fight regarding their beliefs.

    New Testament was written in 1AD, those time people followed the Apostles from their letters. The Holy Spirit has combined the New testament in-order today's people around the globe shall not go away from the Scripture. Even the Holy Spirit testifies that Nobody has ascended into heaven except the Lord Jesus Christ.
     
  6. AvilaSurfer

    AvilaSurfer Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Sounds like debating to me. Also a couple of false statements.
     
  7. Colin

    Colin Senior Veteran

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    Please provide evidence that the New Testament was written in 1AD , and that in those times people followed the Apostles from their letters .
     
  8. tadoflamb

    tadoflamb no identificado

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    Another sola scripturist with reading comprehension problems. Go figure.
     
  9. Anand Prabhu Antony

    Anand Prabhu Antony Member

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    Sorry, Typo error. I meant 1st century. Sorry for my english. Please excuse.
     
  10. Anand Prabhu Antony

    Anand Prabhu Antony Member

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    Colossians 4:16
    When this letter has been read among you(Colossian's people), cause it to be read also in the assembly of the Laodiceans, and that you also read the letter from Laodicea.

    1 Thessalonians 5:27
    "I solemnly command you by the Lord that this letter be read to all the holy brothers".

    2 Peter 3:15
    St. Peter says, "Regard the patience of our Lord as salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also, according to the wisdom given to him, wrote to you".

    We can see the method of spreading the Apostolic Epistles; in the direction to interchange Epistles with the Laodicean Church, we trace the way in which these Epistles became more widely circulated, and recognised as authoritative in the Church at large. St. Peter says about St. Paul letters.

    Tradition beyond the Scripture must be subjected to Apostolic tradition, which is their letters.
     
  11. Colin

    Colin Senior Veteran

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  12. Colin

    Colin Senior Veteran

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    Who are " all the holy brothers " ?

    Are females included ?

    Are they all the holy brothers in just the Church in Thessalonika or are they all the holy brothers in the whole of the Catholic Church at the time of writing ?
     
  13. Anand Prabhu Antony

    Anand Prabhu Antony Member

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    I gave three references, just standing at one verse and want to prove something?.

    Now I quote from the catholic edition.
    1 Thessalonians 5:27 (RSVCE)
    I adjure you by the Lord that this letter be read to all the brethren.
     
  14. Colin

    Colin Senior Veteran

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    "Σας διατάζω επίσημα από τον Κύριο να διαβαστεί αυτή η επιστολή σε όλους τους ιερούς αδελφούς"
     
  15. Anand Prabhu Antony

    Anand Prabhu Antony Member

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    In a whollistic sense St. Paul says for all the members of the Church.
     
  16. Anand Prabhu Antony

    Anand Prabhu Antony Member

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    John 3:13 and John 14:3 clearly explains that nobody has entered heaven with the resurrected body. More than 500 people were witness for Jesus resurrection. And Apostles saw Jesus, when he taken up to heaven.

    No evidence is there for assumption of Mary to heaven. Apostle John, who took care of Mary, did not say about Her ascension. It was not a matter of thought to bring such a belief among 1st century christians.
     
  17. Colin

    Colin Senior Veteran

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    Who are " all the holy brethren " ?

    Are females included ?

    Are they all the holy brethren in just the Church in Thessalonika or are they all the holy brethren in the whole of the Catholic Church at the time of writing 1 Thessalonians ?
     
  18. Colin

    Colin Senior Veteran

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    Where does it say that in the Bible , or is it just part of your Tradition ?
     
  19. Anand Prabhu Antony

    Anand Prabhu Antony Member

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    Colossians 4:16
    When this letter has been read among you(Colossian's people), cause it to be read also in the assembly of the Laodiceans, and that you also read the letter from Laodicea.

    1 Thessalonians 5:27
    "I solemnly command you by the Lord that this letter be read to all the holy brothers".

    2 Peter 3:15
    St. Peter says, "Regard the patience of our Lord as salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also, according to the wisdom given to him, wrote to you".

    We can see the method of spreading the Apostolic Epistles; in the direction to interchange Epistles with the Laodicean Church, we trace the way in which these Epistles became more widely circulated, and recognised as authoritative in the Church at large. St. Peter says about St. Paul letters.

    Tradition beyond the Scripture must be subjected to Apostolic tradition, which is their letters.
     
  20. Colin

    Colin Senior Veteran

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    You keep dodging the questions I ask .

    Since you are not dialoguing I choose to make no further responses to your posts .

    I leave you with one thought , a thought which is the verse following on from the one you quoted from 2 Peter ......" His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures . "
     
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