The answer in the book of Job

[Mark Dohle]

The answer in the book of Job
(Written November 2015)​

I was talking to one of our retreatants not too long ago. He was an intelligent man, a lawyer, and 55 years old. Like many, for most of us, on the outside, he looked good, had a good job, and was successful and respected. Yet he was alone and isolated at the same time. His life had been rough and he was struggling with all that had happened to him.

As we talked he mentioned (which others do too) the book of Job and thought it was a bunch of crap, that there can be no balancing out the suffering we go through in life with some sort of afterlife of supreme happiness. He reminded me of ‘Ivan” in the book “The Brothers Karamazov” when he brought up the suffering of an innocent child. He was my favorite character in the book. For suffering is an issue that will not go away for most people who seek answers to life’s problems.

I have learned that each of us has to find a way through this minefield of important theological and philosophical questions. I asked the man if he read the book straight through, and he said no. So we talked a little about this great piece of literature. I am just going to give some of my thoughts on my reflection of ‘Job”. I am sure none of them are original, nor do I expect everyone to agree with me.

It involves the injustice and suffering of a very godly man. In one day he lost all of his wealth, his children and was afflicted with a very painful disease. So why he asked himself, me being a just man, why am I being subjected to all of this tragedy? He had three well-meaning friends, who like him were probably God-fearing men. They spoke each, in turn, seeking to convince Job to accept the popular understanding of why bad things happen to people. It is because God is punishing them. So it goes back and forth. Now Job did not accept their arguments and his friends became even more adamant in their argumentation. The youngest was last and of all the men to speak and the most outspoken of all three, as young people often are.

The man I was talking to was a man of faith. He was trying to understand and like Job, his prayer was at times one of anger. His image of God was torn from him and he was now seeking to find something to cling to. Evil and suffering can rip away all sentimental and simple human notions of God. It can bring us to the place wherein any notion of God is absurd. This is when faith dies for some and is deepened for others. Perhaps the path of unbelief is just as important as those who go deeper into their faith.

One day I was talking to an atheist friend who stated how I could believe in some deity that was invisible, everywhere, and was love, in the midst of a world that was filled with suffering, disease, and yes the moral evil of human beings. So I thought about it and said: “Yes, at times it seems so, yet to think of their being no intelligence behind the Universe that is fact intelligible, is even more absurd”. We are all caught in a place of ‘unknowing’, simply being forced to step out and embrace a worldview. For me, science is not helpful in seeking to answer questions that are the most important for me.

In the book of Job, in the end, I do not believe any answer is given that brings any kind of consolation. Nor does Job’s situation really improve after he is healed. For even though his sheep are returned, his wealth and I guess his friends, how can the children he lost be replaced even if he got the same number back? So no, his life was still one of suffering and loss. I like the book because it will not allow a simplistic solution to this problem of suffering. I think atheism can be embraced too soon, and others may seek to hide behind some sort of pious cliché that may have some truth to it, but does little to help. I suppose we are here to seek, to have faith in the darkness, and to learn that we live our lives in mystery. I believe the saying that “life is a mystery to be lived and not a problem to be solved” is a true one.

One man who studies scripture told me that in some manner the whole bible is an autobiography of each of us. Perhaps many of us have to live in Gethsemane for a long time. When I speak to people who are suffering the way this man was, all I can do is listen and encourage them to stay on his pathless path, for that is what the desert experience is.

I wish I had it figured out. Even Jesus who suffered in all ways that we did, asked for some light but got none, yet he did not allow failure to consume him and kill him……but imagine what happened. He rose. Not a consolation when in the midst of darkness and suffering; yes God’s ways are really frustrating to us, to me. For in suffering all seems dark, in hope we move slowly forward and from the experience of millions, the light returns, and we are different in our faith and understanding in ways that we would not think possible until experienced.-BrMD

 

[Mark Quayle]

View attachment 308145


The answer in the book of Job
(Written November 2015)​

I was talking to one of our retreatants not too long ago. He was an intelligent man, a lawyer, and 55 years old. Like many, for most of us, on the outside, he looked good, had a good job, and was successful and respected. Yet he was alone and isolated at the same time. His life had been rough and he was struggling with all that had happened to him.

As we talked he mentioned (which others do too) the book of Job and thought it was a bunch of crap, that there can be no balancing out the suffering we go through in life with some sort of afterlife of supreme happiness. He reminded me of ‘Ivan” in the book “The Brothers Karamazov” when he brought up the suffering of an innocent child. He was my favorite character in the book. For suffering is an issue that will not go away for most people who seek answers to life’s problems.

I have learned that each of us has to find a way through this minefield of important theological and philosophical questions. I asked the man if he read the book straight through, and he said no. So we talked a little about this great piece of literature. I am just going to give some of my thoughts on my reflection of ‘Job”. I am sure none of them are original, nor do I expect everyone to agree with me.

It involves the injustice and suffering of a very godly man. In one day he lost all of his wealth, his children and was afflicted with a very painful disease. So why he asked himself, me being a just man, why am I being subjected to all of this tragedy? He had three well-meaning friends, who like him were probably God-fearing men. They spoke each, in turn, seeking to convince Job to accept the popular understanding of why bad things happen to people. It is because God is punishing them. So it goes back and forth. Now Job did not accept their arguments and his friends became even more adamant in their argumentation. The youngest was last and of all the men to speak and the most outspoken of all three, as young people often are.

The man I was talking to was a man of faith. He was trying to understand and like Job, his prayer was at times one of anger. His image of God was torn from him and he was now seeking to find something to cling to. Evil and suffering can rip away all sentimental and simple human notions of God. It can bring us to the place wherein any notion of God is absurd. This is when faith dies for some and is deepened for others. Perhaps the path of unbelief is just as important as those who go deeper into their faith.

One day I was talking to an atheist friend who stated how I could believe in some deity that was invisible, everywhere, and was love, in the midst of a world that was filled with suffering, disease, and yes the moral evil of human beings. So I thought about it and said: “Yes, at times it seems so, yet to think of their being no intelligence behind the Universe that is fact intelligible, is even more absurd”. We are all caught in a place of ‘unknowing’, simply being forced to step out and embrace a worldview. For me, science is not helpful in seeking to answer questions that are the most important for me.

In the book of Job, in the end, I do not believe any answer is given that brings any kind of consolation. Nor does Job’s situation really improve after he is healed. For even though his sheep are returned, his wealth and I guess his friends, how can the children he lost be replaced even if he got the same number back? So no, his life was still one of suffering and loss. I like the book because it will not allow a simplistic solution to this problem of suffering. I think atheism can be embraced too soon, and others may seek to hide behind some sort of pious cliché that may have some truth to it, but does little to help. I suppose we are here to seek, to have faith in the darkness, and to learn that we live our lives in mystery. I believe the saying that “life is a mystery to be lived and not a problem to be solved” is a true one.

One man who studies scripture told me that in some manner the whole bible is an autobiography of each of us. Perhaps many of us have to live in Gethsemane for a long time. When I speak to people who are suffering the way this man was, all I can do is listen and encourage them to stay on his pathless path, for that is what the desert experience is.

I wish I had it figured out. Even Jesus who suffered in all ways that we did, asked for some light but got none, yet he did not allow failure to consume him and kill him……but imagine what happened. He rose. Not a consolation when in the midst of darkness and suffering; yes God’s ways are really frustrating to us, to me. For in suffering all seems dark, in hope we move slowly forward and from the experience of millions, the light returns, and we are different in our faith and understanding in ways that we would not think possible until experienced.-BrMD

Notice what God says in 42:7, "...you have not spoken of me what is right, as my servant Job has." Job was not just saying that he was not being punished, but that God was doing as God pleased, and even so, Job knew, after all was said and done,
"I know that my redeemer lives,
and that in the end he will stand on the earth.
And after my skin has been destroyed,
yet in my flesh I will see God;
I myself will see him
with my own eyes—I, and not another.
How my heart yearns within me!"
Job 19

Nothing measures as important as God. Apparently, Job knew this life was not for this life.

 

[Mark Dohle]

Good point. Though at the time, not sure the thought of an afterlife was that developed. What come out was Job's love of God, no matter what happened, his trust, and yes hope. He was also very childlike in his prayer towards the Lord.

Some scholars believe that the book of Job was not Jewish, but placed in the Canon because of its
content, which is truly deep, and beautifully said.

Peace
mark