The Abrahamic Covenant and the crossroads of 3 great religions

[John 1720]

Abraham is revered by the 3 great monotheist religions. These three religions are at odds with each other so much, yet we can talk about Abraham all day long and honor him as the father of faith and obedience to God. Why do you think that is?​

​

 

[John 1720]

The Abrahamic Covenant from a Christian Perspective

The Bible is huge and I know there's much backdrop and history within it. Jews, Christians and even Muslims can focus in on a myriad of lessons in the Bible and derive spiritual truths from it.
I've had some of those conversations from time to time and at times found common ground.

However, I see the Bible as both a canvas and a masterpiece of art and beauty. I see the canvas as the backdrop the creation, the fall, the flood, etc. However, as a Christian I see the story of redemptive history as God's masterpiece. Instead of seeing the Bible as a disparate collection of stories to attach to my own personal relevance, whilst I simmer in the stew of my own experiences, whether inside or outside my control, it is far better to read the Bible with the key to understanding it. I believe it is the promise of God that ties in all other interconnecting threads, including how that promise unfolds itself in the course of history.

I happen to believe God ties it all together starting with the Abrahamic covenant and I'm far from alone in this opinion. It is in this promise of God to bless the nations through this father of faith and obedience that interrelates Moses and the prophets as well as the promised Messiah. If you read it with an eye towards how God unpacks this blessing starting with Abraham, who was to be a blessing in order that the nations of the entire earth would be blessed through him and his progeny, then I believe you will find the heart of God for the all peoples within its covers. With that small key in our possession we begin to unlock the rest of the story including prophesy and God's Divine purpose for humankind. ​

• 
  
• Genesis 12 Promises to Abram (also in Acts 7:2–5 )

• Genesis 12:1-3 Now the LORD had said to Abram: “Get out of your country, from your family and from your father’s house, to a land that I will show you. 2 I will make you a great nation; I will bless you and make your name great; and you shall be a blessing. 3 I will bless those who bless you, and I will curse him who curses you; and in you all the families of the earth shall be blessed.”
• Gen 18:18 “since Abraham shall surely become a great and mighty nation, and all the nations of the earth shall be blessed in him?
• Gen 22:18 “In your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed, because you have obeyed My voice.”
• Gen 26:4 “And I will make your descendants multiply as the stars of heaven; I will give to your descendants all these lands; and in your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed;
• Gen 28:14 “Also your descendants shall be as the dust of the earth; you shall spread abroad to the west and the east, to the north and the south; and in you and in your seed all the families of the earth shall be blessed.
• Psa 72:17 His name shall endure forever; His name shall continue as long as the sun. And men shall be blessed in Him; All nations shall call Him blessed.
• Act 3:25 “You are sons of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying to Abraham, ‘And in your seed all the families of the earth shall be blessed.’
  Gal 3:8 And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.”
• Gal 3:16 Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, “And to seeds,” as of many, but as of one, “And to your Seed,” who is Christ.
• Rev 7:9 After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands

How do you view the Abrahamic Covenant as a Jew, Muslim or Christian?
Thanks, Patrick
​

 

[cloudyday2]

Because claiming Abraham as the father of your religion is simply an advertising ploy similar to labeling something "natural" while the list of ingredients seems to be anything but "natural". Or another analogy would be when rival US political factions all claim to be the truer and more patriotic faction that upholds the ideals of the founding fathers.

 

[cloudyday2]

(duplicate post)

 

[com7fy8]

One thing I get is how God guaranteed that Abraham will be a blessing. A Christian has a natural heart desire to be God's blessing to other people. So, this is a very special promise to our love and caring for other people. God is saying we love people, and He will make sure we are His blessing to people. Our care is not in vain!

"Therefore, my beloved brethren, be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that your labor is not in vain in the Lord." (1 Corinthians 15:58)

 

[John 1720]

Because claiming Abraham as the father of your religion is simply an advertising ploy similar to labeling something "natural" while the list of ingredients seems to be anything but "natural".

Okay, I appreciate your response. It differs greatly from my own cloudyday2 but it is informative to hear what is out there. Can I ask how did you arrive at your conclusion? Can you unpack it from just a suppositional format in order for us to better understand how you derived your opinion?
Much appreciated
Thanks, Patrick

 

[cloudyday2]

Okay, I appreciate your response. It differs greatly from my own cloudyday2 but it is informative to hear what is out there. Can I ask how did you arrive at your conclusion? Can you unpack it from just a suppositional format in order for us to better understand how you derived your opinion?
Much appreciated
Thanks, Patrick

First of all, many or most secular scholars don't think the patriarchs are actual people. Almost no scholar would think the stories about the lives of the patriarchs are historical, so there is no way to know what their religion might have been even if they did exist.

So "Abrahamic" is about as meaningful as "low fat".

 

[John 1720]

1. First of all, many or most secular scholars don't think the patriarchs are actual people.
2. Almost no scholar would think the stories about the lives of the patriarchs are historical,
3. so there is no way to know what their religion might have been even if they did exist.

So "Abrahamic" is about as meaningful as "low fat".

Okay, thanks cloudy day2. So would I be correct in assessing that the reason you believe, or rather disbelieve, what you do is because you have put your faith in some modern academics as your source of truth?

 

[cloudyday2]

Okay, thanks cloudy day2. So would I be correct in assessing that the reason you believe, or rather disbelieve, what you do is because you have put your faith in some modern academics as your source of truth?

Yep pretty much

 

[LoAmmi]

One thing I get is how God guaranteed that Abraham will be a blessing. A Christian has a natural heart desire to be God's blessing to other people. So, this is a very special promise to our love and caring for other people. God is saying we love people, and He will make sure we are His blessing to people. Our care is not in vain!

"Therefore, my beloved brethren, be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that your labor is not in vain in the Lord." (1 Corinthians 15:58)

Do you believe that Jews also have the same thing? A lot of our faith deals with our obligation to help others.

 

[com7fy8]

One thing I get is how God guaranteed that Abraham will be a blessing. A Christian has a natural heart desire to be God's blessing to other people. So, this is a very special promise to our love and caring for other people. God is saying we love people, and He will make sure we are His blessing to people. Our care is not in vain!

"Therefore, my beloved brethren, be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that your labor is not in vain in the Lord." (1 Corinthians 15:58)

Do you believe that Jews also have the same thing? A lot of our faith deals with our obligation to help others.

Abraham is for all people > when he offered up his son Isaac, obeying God, the LORD told him >

"'In your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed, because you have obeyed My voice.'" (Genesis 22:18)

So, "all nations" includes the Jews. But what do we all do with this? Ones of us do not do what is not benefiting from the blessing of Abraham.

Yes, we all need to help others. But the most benefit is with how the LORD has us helping others. Genesis 37-50 > Joseph's brothers who sold him into slavery might have been at times helping their father, Jacob, but at the same time they were letting their father feel that his so loved son, Joseph, was dead. So, any sort of helping was not really what the LORD wanted, in such a case.

And there are many people who help others, but they do not uphold Jesus to be now alive as our Messiah. So, they can in truth be helping people to miss out, by acting like they are doing so great but at the same time saying they don't need Jesus!

So, it depends on what each Jew is doing.

 

[com7fy8]

One thing I get is how God guaranteed that Abraham will be a blessing. A Christian has a natural heart desire to be God's blessing to other people. So, this is a very special promise to our love and caring for other people. God is saying we love people, and He will make sure we are His blessing to people. Our care is not in vain!

"Therefore, my beloved brethren, be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that your labor is not in vain in the Lord." (1 Corinthians 15:58)

Do you believe that Jews also have the same thing? A lot of our faith deals with our obligation to help others.

Abraham is for all people > when he offered up his son Isaac, obeying God, the LORD told him >

"'In your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed, because you have obeyed My voice.'" (Genesis 22:18)

So, "all nations" includes the Jews. But what do we all do with this? Ones of us do not do what is not benefiting from the blessing of Abraham.

Yes, we all need to help others. But the most benefit is with how the LORD has us helping others. Genesis 37-50 > Joseph's brothers who sold him into slavery might have been at times helping their father, Jacob, but at the same time they were letting their father feel that his so loved son, Joseph, was dead. So, any sort of helping was not really what the LORD wanted, in such a case.

And there are many people who help others, but they do not uphold Jesus to be now alive as our Messiah. So, they can in truth be helping people to miss out, by acting like they are doing so great but at the same time saying they don't need Jesus!

So, it depends on what each Jew is doing.

 

[LoAmmi]

And there are many people who help others, but they do not uphold Jesus to be now alive as our Messiah. So, they can in truth be helping people to miss out, by acting like they are doing so great but at the same time saying they don't need Jesus!

Well... we don't need him.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Well... we don't need him.

 

[com7fy8]

Well... we don't need him.

Jesus says,

"'Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.'" (Matthew 11:28-30)

I think we do need rest for our souls.

 

[LoAmmi]

Jesus says,

"'Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.'" (Matthew 11:28-30)

I think we do need rest for our souls.

I don't recognize that as an authoritative source for anything.

 

[Starcomet]

Do you believe that Jews also have the same thing? A lot of our faith deals with our obligation to help others.

The obligation to help others to the best of our abilities is commanded to all people by God. Of course people are free to ignore this obligation.

 

[ananda]

Abraham is revered by the 3 great monotheist religions. These three religions are at odds with each other so much, yet we can talk about Abraham all day long and honor him as the father of faith and obedience to God. Why do you think that is?
​

Perhaps add Hinduism to the mix too. Some have suggested Abraham = Brahma, and his wife Sarah = Brahma's consort, Saraswati.

 

[ananda]

Jesus says,

"'Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.'" (Matthew 11:28-30)

I think we do need rest for our souls.

How does taking a yoke lead to "rest for the soul"?

The Buddha says,

"Joined with the yoke of sensuality & the yoke of becoming, joined with the yoke of views, surrounded by ignorance, beings go to the wandering-on, heading to birth & death. But those who comprehend sensuality & the yoke of becoming — entirely — who have thrown off the yoke of views and are dispassionate toward ignorance, disjoined from all yokes: they — their yokes overcome — are sages indeed." (Yoga Sutta AN 4.10) "those who take on the yoke of sacrifice, impassioned with the passion for becoming, have not crossed over birth & aging." (Sn 5.3) cf. "reach the unexcelled rest from the yoke" (Thag 2.26)

 

[Starcomet]

How does taking a yoke lead to "rest for the soul"?

The Buddha says,

"Joined with the yoke of sensuality & the yoke of becoming, joined with the yoke of views, surrounded by ignorance, beings go to the wandering-on, heading to birth & death. But those who comprehend sensuality & the yoke of becoming — entirely — who have thrown off the yoke of views and are dispassionate toward ignorance, disjoined from all yokes: they — their yokes overcome — are sages indeed." (Yoga Sutta AN 4.10) "those who take on the yoke of sacrifice, impassioned with the passion for becoming, have not crossed over birth & aging." (Sn 5.3) cf. "reach the unexcelled rest from the yoke" (Thag 2.26)

This passage may be of the few later insertions by the author of the later needs of Christianity. But from interpreting the passage in context, Jesus is referring to the yoke that is spiritual and not worldly. The Buddha refers to worldly yokes and yokes constrained by worldly opinions and views.