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The “Five Solas” of denominationalism. Are They Scriptural?

CObondservant

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Not a sour statement at all, just a statement of historic fact.

As I pointed out, we get a good clue of what was taught from reading what their disciples wrote - indeed what the early fathers handed down as the faith. I suggested ignatius of Antioch to Smyrneans because writings such as his and polycarp were written by the first generations taught by the apostles: in that case John.

And in that particular case, I use the example of the eucharist, to show that tradition hands down the meaning of what is found in scripture. There are all sorts of mutually exclusive beliefs on the eucharist post reformation, precisely because many seem to think they are entitled to hold any interpretation they think does not contradict the scriptural text.

But there is only one truth: in this case the real presence truly the "flesh of Jesus" - a eucharist valid only if performed by a bishop or his appointee, in a liturgical, sacramental church, which was what the church believed for millenia till those that splintered away at the reformation went of at tangents.

The other interpretations of eucharist take "memorialism" are heretical, and were made only possible by the false doctrine of sola scriptura, ignoring authority and tradition.

The problem all have is if they ignore authority, they have no new testament , or creed, because the canon and creed were inspired decisions of councils where the church is empowered to act as authority, the "pillar and foundation of truth" using the power to "bind and loose" on matters of doctrine and heresy.

And as we see, when you lose that anchor all drift ever further apart.

Ok, since the apostles only gave us a start on doctrine, name one tradition that is essential to know to be saved that you can prove the apostles taught, but is nowhere mentioned in scripture.
 
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OrthodoxyUSA

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When reading the title it struck me as funny that there were five "solas".

I have not read any of the other posts. In Orthodox Christianity there is nothing "alone" about salvation.

Forgive me...
 
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OrthodoxyUSA

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"Jesus didn't give us a book". That's kind of a sour statement. How do we know what the apostles taught except by reading what they wrote? Just curious.
May I answer this one?

Forgive me...
 
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FenderTL5

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When reading the title it struck me as funny that there were five "solas".

I have not read any of the other posts. In Orthodox Christianity there is nothing "alone" about salvation.

Forgive me...
Ha! you're right.
It's as if one were to adapt the scene from the classic Steve Martin film:
All I need is the Bible, scripture alone...
and faith.. that's all I need.
Scripture, Faith.. oh, and Christ.
Christ alone and scripture and faith and Grace.. I need that...
 
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Monk Brendan

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Catholicism had ZERO to do with the writing of the bible. Had you mentioned catholic, nun, pope, etc, in the 1st century, you wouldve gotten a blank stare. Nobody knew any of that till HUNDREDS years after the apostles died. Why not consider the PRE-denominational Acts 2 church in the bible?

Please pay attention: I said PRODUCED not wrote. And had I said catholic in the latter half of the first century, they would have replied "universal what?"

And I BELONG to the pre-denominational church that was born on the Day of Pentecost, when the Holy Spirit fell upon the 120 or so people in the upper room. The Catholic Communion of Churches, along with Orthodox Churches ARE that same first century Acts 2 Church! Now, you may not like it, but it's true. Besides, your Church has only been around since 1993, making you a Johnnie-Come-Lately to the Christian scene. There MAY have been others that had similar views, but NONE of them even go back to the Reformation, so you CANNOT BE the Universal, International Bride of Christ that you tout yourself to be.

You may all be fine, upstanding Christians, but the International Church of Christ is not, nor will it ever be, the first, only, and unadulterated Christian Church you sound like you want it to be.
 
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Mountainmike

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You really Do need to study history:

Your first statement is demonstrably false in all its parts,( Take the charism of celibacy , charity , poverty and prayer, study the Essenes! - You said " nun")

and your favourite question shows little except a misunderstanding of tradition - so answer your own question? What doctrine do you think is non apostolic and none scriptural?



Catholicism had ZERO to do with the writing of the bible. Had you mentioned catholic, nun, pope, etc, in the 1st century, you wouldve gotten a blank stare. Nobody knew any of that till HUNDREDS years after the apostles died. Why not consider the PRE-denominational Acts 2 church in the bible?

Also, still waiting for an answer to my question: Please name one tradition that is essential to know to be saved that you can prove the apostles taught, but is nowhere mentioned in scripture please. Thank you!!
 
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Monk Brendan

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That's a Catholic claim, but not a Protestant one, usually.

Just to let you know, that is the truth of ALL of the Pre-Reformation Churches--The Catholic Communion of Churches (23), Plus Eastern and Oriental Orthodoxy, plus a few others, Copts, for instance, that ALL believe that WE date back to the Apostles, and can, in most cases, trace them to a particular Apostles.
 
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Monk Brendan

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Essentially, it's a new Catholic Church, or an attempt at one. I would rather live without that way of thinking, frankly

I would say that this is really an anti-Catholic statement. Please do not continue your bigotry on these fora.
 
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Monk Brendan

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It's kind of strange to say but, generally speaking, your basic soteriology is actually rather "Romish".

Please! Don't even begin to confuse this person's claim with the Catholic Church. We don't have to pretend. This guy is against ALL churches unless it is the ICoC, whereas the Catholic Communion of Churches says that ANYONE who does God's will, and lives in His love can be saved.
 
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Monk Brendan

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The ICoC took all that...and went one step further in creating a sort of pyramid-style discipleship in which each member had to be subject to a "discipler". The abuses that sprung out of that led to some relaxing of this idea in recent years, to my understanding. That said, if there are any ICoC folk out there who can clarify on this or correct any misstatements, I leave it open to you.

So it's either a multi-level marketing scam, some kinky sex pyramid, or a cult, right?
 
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Monk Brendan

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---- Crypto, how do you feel about reforming something that was broken when it was created in AD 350?

Pray tell, what church was created in 350 A.D? The Pre-Reformation Churches, which all have apostolic origin, are well before that.
 
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Monk Brendan

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A century later, in 410ad the city of Rome was sacked, and the empire fell in 476.

Actually, that was only the WESTERN part of the Roman Empire.

Constantine also founded a branch of the Roman Empire in the city of Byzantium, which he renamed as Constantinople.

On May 29, 1453, after an Ottoman army stormed Constantinople, Mehmed triumphantly entered the Hagia Sophia, which would become the city's leading mosque. Emperor Constantine XI died in battle that day, and the decline and fall of the Byzantine Empire was complete.
 
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Monk Brendan

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The bible claims all authority, not some. Creeds were never part of the original acts 2 church.

Oh, but they were. Have you ever heard of the Apostles' Creed? Based on what the Apostles themselves believed?
 
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Monk Brendan

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Im not familiar w/the prot veiws you have posted. They all say we're saved by faith alone. When God says immersion in water washes away sins when one has been taught correctly, believes, confesses, repents - this is salvation. There are no other examples

First of all, I believe in Baptism by immersion. However, you have taken that particular point and expanded it to such a point that it cannot stand on its own. As @Soyeong said:

No amount of dunking in water will ever save someone...
 
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Monk Brendan

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First, let's begin with a little bit of REAL as opposed to ICoC history. Acclaimed as emperor by the army at Eboracum (modern-day York) after his father's death in 306 AD, Constantine emerged victorious in a series of civil wars against the emperors Maxentius and Licinius to become sole ruler of both west and east by 324 AD.Constantine played an influential role in the proclamation of the Edict of Milan in 313, which declared religious tolerance for Christianity in the Roman empire. He called the First Council of Nicaea in 325, at which the Nicene Creed was adopted by Christians. But he did not call himself a Christian until he was baptized, almost on his death bed.

Now, we come to statements you have made.

There's no hope in Protestantism, nor Catholicism. The Lord only built one church

This statement is against the CF rules. PLEASE retract it forthwith or I will report this. Stating or implying that another Christian member, or group of members, are not Christian is not allowed.

Right, but a giant denom was. And it wasnt even in it's current form till the 700's. And even after that it continues to change its belief systems.

Again, this is an anti-Catholic statement, and will be reported.
 
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actionsub

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So it's either a multi-level marketing scam, some kinky sex pyramid, or a cult, right?

A mixture of "multi-level" and "cult" is how it worked out in practice.
 
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Soyeong

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First of all, I believe in Baptism by immersion. However, you have taken that particular point and expanded it to such a point that it cannot stand on its own. As @Soyeong said:

I also believe in baptism by immersion. Apart from faith, baptism accomplishes nothing more than getting wet. It only through faith that we are saved and it is only through the same faith that we are therefore required to become baptized, but the baptism itself does not save us.
 
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