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Ten Reasons I'm a Sabbatarian

Discussion in 'Denomination Specific Theology' started by Icyspark, Oct 9, 2020.

  1. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member Supporter

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    An accusation without any support is not as compelling as it may seem at first.

    I beg to differ. I quote the NT almost non-stop so also does the Adventist 28 Fundamental Beliefs.

    So for example on "this thread" --



    Albion - Some sort of 'fact' needs to get into your post when making those accusations.

    True statement
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2021
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  2. SabbathBlessings

    SabbathBlessings Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Which context ? The ones where the disciples teach us to keep the commandments of God as well as Jesus our Creator? Romans 3:20, Romans 7:7, James 2:10-12, 1 Cor 7:19, 1 John 5:3, John 14:15, John 15:10, Revelations 14:15, Revelations 12:17, Revelations 22:14 and both the disciples and Jesus keeping the Sabbath commandment Acts 18:4, Luke 4:16-22, and the Sabbath is still a commandment after Jesus ascended back to heaven Luke 23:56, Matthew 24:20 Seems like we are not the ones who are disregarding contents and since you seem to only provide commentary over scripture the disciples even tell us we ought to obey God over man.

    God bless
     
  3. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member Supporter

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    For the lost - the Law serves to convict them that they are lost - Rom 3:19-20 makes that case perfectly.

    For the born-again the New Covenant writes that Law on the heart - the law known to Jeremiah and his readers (Jer 31:31-34 Heb 8:6-12, Rom 3:31)
     
  4. Albion

    Albion Factchecker

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    At some point in ALL these identical debates on this same topic, the "big question" has to be asked. And answered.

    That's why I focused on it in these last few messages.

    If it gets answered, that would be great. If it never is, but the evasions and the dancing around the issue continue on, then at least it can be said that it wasn't because of anyone's inability to understand what's at issue.
     
  5. HIM

    HIM Friend Supporter

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    I am not a SDA and we are done with you.
    Rev 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

    Matt 23:38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.
     
  6. Albion

    Albion Factchecker

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    I can imagine. ;)

    But you realize that doing so just says you cannot or will not explain why you both affirm and deny the New Testament at almost the same time.
     
  7. SabbathBlessings

    SabbathBlessings Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Please do share these scriptures you keep claiming changes God’s Sabbath day of worship. God’s Word should shine, not be hidden.

    We are told the Sabbath will continue to be God’s chosen day of worship for eternity Isaiah 66:23 as God promised Exodus 31:16-17 so if you can’t find scripture that tells us these scriptures are wrong, which they are not, I would consider worshipping Jesus in Truth and Spirit, because that is what Jesus wants from us. John 4:24


    Happy Sabbath all! I am off for now.

    God bless!
     
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  8. HIM

    HIM Friend Supporter

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    Happy Sabbath to you and everyone also. May the Lord our God continue to bless us all in all His Way; Jesus Christ.
     
  9. Albion

    Albion Factchecker

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    I'm waiting for a reply from the person I was addressing there.

    And, no, I am not going to name the same verses for you yet another time, as though you don't know them. By chapter and verse, you have discounted them and denied their meaning already. This, and the familiar routine that would follow, were addressed earlier in the thread.
     
  10. Freth

    Freth Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The word of God is the answer to the problem—both Old and New Testaments. There is only one truth. Why I believe in the seventh-day Sabbath? I can't find one verse to support Sunday sacredness, or Sunday observance as a worship day, but I can find a commandment spoken by God and written with His own hand.

    What does Jesus say about the broad way?

    Matthew 7:13-14 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
    If this one verse were the only evidence of a wrong path in scripture, one could easily dismiss it and say, "Oh, well, it's the non-believers who are following the broad way. Christians are the narrow way." There's a problem with that line of thinking. The Old and New Testaments prophesy apostasy, which is a problem originating within the church, directly concerning blasphemy, the changing of times and laws of God, persecution of the saints, and more.

    On top of the prophesied apostasy, you find statements like this in the New Testament:

    "Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus." (Revelation 14:12)
    One has to put their fingers in their ears and make loud noises to ignore such statements (and there are so many), which point directly to the Ten Commandments. The commandments of God do not tell us to worship on Sunday. Jesus did not declare Sunday as a new day of worship.

    There are numerous threads on this forum where SDA (and others; not to leave them out) quote the Old and New Testaments alike, on the daily, on a wide variety of subjects (not just the Sabbath). The vast majority of these posts are expositional, and contextually sound. Whether you agree or not with the cases presented is your prerogative.

    Closing statement regarding the seventh-day Sabbath vs Sunday debate: I have yet to see a compelling argument that trumps the voice of God and His own handwriting. Or the Revelation of Jesus Christ, as given to John, telling us the saints keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2021
  11. Albion

    Albion Factchecker

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    Any search engine can solve that problem for you.
     
  12. SabbathBlessings

    SabbathBlessings Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Why search the Internet when we can read God’s Word directly from scripture.

    People didn’t believe Jesus either and it reminds me of this passage I am reading. John 8:37-47
     
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  13. Albion

    Albion Factchecker

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    I suppose that's clever as a retort, but if we want to treat this issue as serious, we will acknowledge that there is no problem in locating the relevant Scriptures because a search engine will direct you to those Bible verses.
     
  14. Freth

    Freth Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Referring someone to a search engine isn't a compelling argument.
     
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  15. Albion

    Albion Factchecker

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    It is not an argument. It was the answer to the question about where to look.

    It's actually remarkably simple and easy to put your question into a search engine and find all sorts of websites that give listings of applicable verses. Of course, not all of them are equally informative, but if "which verses" was what was sought, coming up with them is not as tough as that seems to lots of people initially. And if something else about the content or meaning of those verses is wanted, that's different and could of course be asked here.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2021
  16. Albion

    Albion Factchecker

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    duplicate.
     
  17. Icyspark

    Icyspark Member

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    Hi Albion,

    How about this. Since you seem hesitant to supply the texts yourself, why don't you supply a link to the search engine result you find that most aligns with your mindset? That way if I respond to something I can know that I'm not responding to a belief you don't hold.

    God bless.

    But for the grace of God go I,cyspark
     
  18. Icyspark

    Icyspark Member

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    Hi prodromos,

    I look to the Bible for evidence because I believe that "All Scripture is inspired by God and is profitable for teaching, for rebuking, for correcting, for training in righteousness."

    By historical evidence I'm surmising you mean tradition? If so, Jesus doesn't speak fondly of tradition, especially when it directly contradicted His inspired word as recorded in Scripture.

    Matthew 15:1-9
    Then some Pharisees and teachers of the law came to Jesus from Jerusalem and asked, “Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? They don’t wash their hands before they eat!

    Jesus replied, “And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition? For God said, ‘Honor your father and mother’ and ‘Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.’ But you say that if anyone declares that what might have been used to help their father or mother is ‘devoted to God,’ they are not to ‘honor their father or mother’ with it. Thus you nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition. You hypocrites! Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you:

    “‘These people honor me with their lips,
    but their hearts are far from me.
    They worship me in vain;
    their teachings are merely human rules.

    If one exchanges the word of God for "historical evidence" then one is bound to go off the straight and narrow path which leads to life. The "historical evidence" of the Jews was to reject God and to set their "hearts on evil things."

    1 Corinthians 10:1-13
    For I do not want you to be ignorant of the fact, brothers and sisters, that our ancestors were all under the cloud and that they all passed through the sea. 2 They were all baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea. 3 They all ate the same spiritual food 4 and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from the spiritual rock that accompanied them, and that rock was Christ.5 Nevertheless, God was not pleased with most of them; their bodies were scattered in the wilderness.

    6 Now these things occurred as examples to keep us from setting our hearts on evil things as they did. 7 Do not be idolaters, as some of them were; as it is written: “The people sat down to eat and drink and got up to indulge in revelry.” 8 We should not commit sexual immorality, as some of them did—and in one day twenty-three thousand of them died. 9 We should not test Christ, as some of them did—and were killed by snakes. 10 And do not grumble, as some of them did—and were killed by the destroying angel.

    11 These things happened to them as examples and were written down as warnings for us, on whom the culmination of the ages has come. 12 So, if you think you are standing firm, be careful that you don’t fall! 13 No temptation has overtaken you except what is common to mankind. And God is faithful; he will not let you be tempted beyond what you can bear. But when you are tempted, he will also provide a way out so that you can endure it.

    The historical evidence of the Jews was recorded in Scripture as examples and warnings for us.

    I pray this helps.

    But for the grace of God go I,cyspark
     
  19. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Thanks good post and I enjoyed reading it. Did you write this? If you did it is well put together. Welcome to CF Icyspark and nice to meet you. HAPPY SABBATH! :)
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2021
  20. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Hi @True Counterphobia, nice to meet you. I think this is a good and fair question as this teaching is taught in most of the Christian world but is it true? For me I can't see anywhere in the scriptures where it says that Jesus is the true Sabbath or that the "seventh day" creation Sabbath is a "shadow law" of anything. The reason for this is that according to the scriptures alone the only definition of the creation Sabbath of God's 4th commandment is written in Exodus 20:10 where it says "...the "seventh day" is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God. There is no scripture anywhere that says Jesus is a Sabbath.

    If you look at the context of Hebrews 4:1-5 it defining two rest's. One is the rest of believing and following the gospel (Gods Word) and the second as God's rest which is defined in these scriptures as the "seventh day" Sabbath created from the foundation of the world. Now if you think about when the Sabbath was made on the "seventh day" of the creation week as shown in Genesis 2:1-3 that God made for all mankind (Mark 2:27) you will see that it is impossible for the Sabbath of God's 4th commandment to be a "shadow law" of anything. Why do I say this? Well firstly the "creation Sabbath" was created on the "seventh day" of the creation week making of the seventh day of the week which is every seventh day of the week.

    If you read God's 4th commandment in Exodus 20:8-11 it points "backwards" not "forwards" to things to come. "Remember" the Sabbath day... So according to God's 4th commandment it is a memorial of creation pointing backwards to the finished work of creation and a celebration of God as the creator of heaven and earth.

    In fact I believe according to the bible it is impossible for the creation Sabbath to be a shadow law of anything. Why do I say thin? Well the Sabbath was created "before" the fall (sin) of mankind when mankind were in perfect harmony with their creator. When the Sabbath was made for mankind (Genesis 2:1-3; Mark 2:27) there was no sin, no Moses, no Israel, no plan of salvation was given because there was nothing to be saved from. Therefore there were no shadow laws pointing to God's plan of salvation for mankind. There was only Adam and Eve created in God's image walking and talking with God in the garden of Eden.

    That said there were many different kinds of other ceremonial shadow sabbaths in the old testament. These however were not the same as God's 4th commandment that is one of God's 10 commandments. These Feast sabbaths attached to the annual Feast days could fall on any day of the seek depending on the yearly cycle and were not attached to specific set times but were linked directly into the annual Feasts of Leviticus 23.

    Anyhow I have spent some time prayerfully studying the above in a lot of detail from the bible. If you would like to discuss what the scriptures teach in detail here your welcome to PM me as to not take the OP off topic too much. Nice to meet you and good question.

    God bless.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2021
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