Ten Contradictions That Christians Can't Stop Making.

[Ron Gurley]

S10"..."1.a..."Claiming membership in one of thousands of sects of religion as authority for telling
...1.b...non-believers why our (A-theists'??) "interpretation of religion" is wrong.

A10: Differing denominations of true Christ-followers will vary slightly in their doctrines and dogma.
E>G> The Nicene/Apostles CREEDS are "common ground" as is the Model Prayer, the Beatitudes, the Golden rule, ETC.!
The doctrinal statements...the "We believes.."...are very similar.
ABSOLUTE SPIRITUAL TRUTHS can be spiritually discerned from the Bible despite Differing Denominations who reach out to A-theists and AG-nostics and "non-believers" worldwide.

Matthew 24:14(NASB)...Jesus'prophecy of "the end of the ages"
This "gospel of the kingdom" (Jesus the Divine Messiah has come down from heaven to save Man)
shall be preached in the whole "world" (kozmos)
as a testimony to all the NATIONS (ethnos = societies), and then the end (Of TRIBULATIONS) will come.

 

[Ron Gurley]

That was FUN. Using LOGIC + SCRIPTURE to defeat 10 different untrue "strawmen".

 

[Foxfyre]

Sometimes it is because we hope to find people who were like we once were. Someone who, if they hear an alternate opinion to their own, will start to think for themselves if pressed.

And sometimes we do it in order to pursue our own opinions more fully. It helps me to figure out my own views and opinions when I am in a setting that challenges me to better articulate my positions to those who will be critical of it by default.

To the point of the OP: contradictions such as these pushed me to start my own questioning of my religious beliefs. It took a few years but that eventually led me to realize I was an atheist.

And again, while admitting my error in assuming the writer of the OP was a non Christian, I do very much appreciate your response. Honest. Heartfelt. Sincere. Nonjudgmental. Civil.

I have also dealt with those same contradictions all my life and awhile back I too questioned my faith. I went on a two-decades journey to explore every aspect of it--seminary courses, intense Bible study, deep theology, and immersed myself in all the world's great religions. In fact I pretty well prepared myself to write and teach pretty much any common subject related to comparative religions and/or the history and development of the Christian doctrines, practices, beliefs, and faith.

The process allowed me to strip away every facet of religion and religious trappings that did not have to be in the equation. And ultimately I was left with the truth of a relationship with the living God that I could neither dismiss nor deny. I am absolutely and without question or doubt a Christian. I am certainly an imperfect person and an imperfect Christian, I am yet a sinner, but I can't deny that I am Christian. One loved by God and assured of eternal life.

And this despite full acknowledge that the contradictions within Christian teachings and expressions of belief/faith are very much still there.

So our respective spiritual journeys led us to different conclusions. But I think the fact that you are here suggests a mind more open than closed on the subject. An open mind continues to lead us into new truths. Sometimes those truths are troubling or disappointing, and sometimes they are marvelous revelation.

I hope your truths will be absolutely great.

 

[quatona]

It always seems a contradiction to me, i.e. inconsistent elements are present, when professed non believers spend so much time and effort participating in matters of belief.

Where exactly do you see the contradiction?

For instance, if I start a thread on the paranormal or extraterrestrial sightings or some such, I may not necessarily be a believer, but neither am I an non believer. I approach such topics with an open mind for all possibilities. I am not about to categorically state such things are purely a human invention. I am seriously curious and interested in such things and whether they exist and/or what they actually are.

Well, if you are seriously curious, you´d have to spend quite some time on it.

If I was an unbeliever, I can't imagine spending much, if any, time or effort on such topics. So the contradiction is a professed nonbeliever having so much interest in the topic.

I´m not sure I understand the logic in "I would do it differently, so there is a contradiction in it.".

 

[TBDude65]

And again, while admitting my error in assuming the writer of the OP was a non Christian, I do very much appreciate your response. Honest. Heartfelt. Sincere. Nonjudgmental. Civil.

I have also dealt with those same contradictions all my life and awhile back I too questioned my faith. I went on a two-decades journey to explore every aspect of it--seminary courses, intense Bible study, deep theology, and immersed myself in all the world's great religions. In fact I pretty well prepared myself to write and teach pretty much any common subject related to comparative religions and/or the history and development of the Christian doctrines, practices, beliefs, and faith.

The process allowed me to strip away every facet of religion and religious trappings that did not have to be in the equation. And ultimately I was left with the truth of a relationship with the living God that I could neither dismiss nor deny. I am absolutely and without question or doubt a Christian. I am certainly an imperfect person and an imperfect Christian, I am yet a sinner, but I can't deny that I am Christian. One loved by God and assured of eternal life.

And this despite full acknowledge that the contradictions within Christian teachings and expressions of belief/faith are very much still there.

So our respective spiritual journeys led us to different conclusions. But I think the fact that you are here suggests a mind more open than closed on the subject. An open mind continues to lead us into new truths. Sometimes those truths are troubling or disappointing, and sometimes they are marvelous revelation.

I hope your truths will be absolutely great.

We all obviously end up finding different paths to follow and often find ourselves reaching different conclusions for a variety of reasons. My journey to learn more about my own religion was (and still is) one of extreme discomfort. I had to put myself in uncomfortable territory in order to ensure that I was pushing myself to learn. I didn't expect to see my religious beliefs dissipate, but that's what happens sometimes. A lot of other beliefs I held for similar reasons faded away too as a result (like ghosts, alien visitations, etc)

 

[Foxfyre]

Where exactly do you see the contradiction?


Well, if you are seriously curious, you´d have to spend quite some time on it.


I´m not sure I understand the logic in "I would do it differently, so there is a contradiction in it.".

When you break up a post like that you destroy the context and miss the answer to the question you asked.

 

[Soyeong]

I've seen that once. Literally once. An atheist made a video about how someone was killed because he mispronounced a word. Left out the fact that his pronunciation revealed that he was from an enemy land.

But the guy had a thick European accent, so it's possible he misread something.

Generally, we don't need to take the Bible out of context to make it look bad because it handles that for us all on its own. You can't go 5 straight verses in Deuteronomy without stumbling across a major human rights violation.

I've seen it happen frequently, such as with people cherry-picking out verses from Deuteronomy without taking the time to understand what was happening.

 

[Foxfyre]

We all obviously end up finding different paths to follow and often find ourselves reaching different conclusions for a variety of reasons. My journey to learn more about my own religion was (and still is) one of extreme discomfort. I had to put myself in uncomfortable territory in order to ensure that I was pushing myself to learn. I didn't expect to see my religious beliefs dissipate, but that's what happens sometimes. A lot of other beliefs I held for similar reasons faded away too as a result (like ghosts, alien visitations, etc)

I understand. Especially about the uncomfortable territory part. And most especially in the 'when bad things happen to good people' department when it is so very difficult to reconcile terrible suffering with a loving God.

I hope this won't be offensive to you, but I feel led to say it, so I'll take the chance. :

My impression of you is that you are intelligent, insightful, and have strength of character and your own convictions. And I suspect that even though you don't believe in Him, if you give God permission to make Himself known to you, and do that with an open mind and heart and--this is important--with no preconceived notion of when or how He is to to do that--you might come into some new truths yourself. At least it won't do any harm.

 

[TBDude65]

I understand. Especially about the uncomfortable territory part. And most especially in the 'when bad things happen to good people' department when it is so very difficult to reconcile terrible suffering with a loving God.

I hope this won't be offensive to you, but I feel led to say it, so I'll take the chance. :

My impression of you is that you are intelligent, insightful, and have strength of character and your own convictions. And I suspect that even though you don't believe in Him, if you give God permission to make Himself known to you, and do that with an open mind and heart and--this is important--with no preconceived notion of when or how He is to to do that--you might come into some new truths yourself. At least it won't do any harm.

And most especially in the 'when bad things happen to good people' department when it is so very difficult to reconcile terrible suffering with a loving God.

Actually what I meant by "uncomfortable territory" involved trying to seriously consider the arguments of those who believed I was wrong in some way shape or form. Not just responding to it or accepting that they believe I am wrong, but trying to understand from their perspective how I was wrong under the assumption I was (or possibly was).

"...And I suspect that even though you don't believe in Him, if you give God permission to make Himself known to you, and do that with an open mind and heart and--this is important--with no preconceived notion of when or how He is to to do that--you might come into some new truths yourself. At least it won't do any harm."

I am a former Christian and I certainly asked/prayed to god(s) for said revelation. I just found myself talking to myself.

 

[Steve Petersen]

I am a former Christian and I certainly asked/prayed to god(s) for said revelation. I just found myself talking to myself.

 

[TBDude65]

View attachment 201211

Lol! Yeah, pretty much

 

[Foxfyre]

And most especially in the 'when bad things happen to good people' department when it is so very difficult to reconcile terrible suffering with a loving God.

Actually what I meant by "uncomfortable territory" involved trying to seriously consider the arguments of those who believed I was wrong in some way shape or form. Not just responding to it or accepting that they believe I am wrong, but trying to understand from their perspective how I was wrong under the assumption I was (or possibly was).

"...And I suspect that even though you don't believe in Him, if you give God permission to make Himself known to you, and do that with an open mind and heart and--this is important--with no preconceived notion of when or how He is to to do that--you might come into some new truths yourself. At least it won't do any harm."

I am a former Christian and I certainly asked/prayed to god(s) for said revelation. I just found myself talking to myself.

Well I do believe the Holy Spirit communicates to me through others at times so I don't dismiss what others say out of hand, but I don't automatically buy what they think I should believe either. I am pretty sure most of the folks who participate on this site would consider me a pretty bad heretic on at least a point or two if not on many or even pretty much most/all? of my personal beliefs. Certainly some have tried to convert me or instruct me or chastise me.

These don't bother me. I respect their convictions, don't--okay try not to--let the annoying ones provoke me, and rejoice in all who love the Lord however they choose to express that so long as they are not harming themselves or others.

And the experiment to let God in if He exists, to make Himself known to you, can't come with any strings. He is God after all and we are not privileged to order Him around. All things in their own time and all that. Again it has to include a mind open enough not to put constraints of how, where, or when he will do that.

 

[TBDude65]

Well I do believe the Holy Spirit communicates to me through others at times so I don't dismiss what others say out of hand, but I don't automatically buy what they think I should believe either. I am pretty sure most of the folks who participate on this site would consider me a pretty bad heretic on at least a point or two if not on many or even pretty much most/all? of my personal beliefs. Certainly some have tried to convert me or instruct me or chastise me.

These don't bother me. I respect their convictions, don't--okay try not to--let the annoying ones provoke me, and rejoice in all who love the Lord however they choose to express that so long as they are not harming themselves or others.

And the experiment to let God in if He exists, to make Himself known to you, can't come with any strings. He is God after all and we are not privileged to order Him around. All things in their own time and all that. Again it has to include a mind open enough not to put constraints of how, where, or when he will do that.

And the experiment to let God in if He exists, to make Himself known to you, can't come with any strings. He is God after all and we are not privileged to order Him around. All things in their own time and all that. Again it has to include a mind open enough not to put constraints of how, where, or when he will do that.

Like I said, I am a former Christian. There were no strings attached. Either god doesn't exist or god won't communicate with me. I find the former far more likely considering I have never seen any evidence to demonstrate a god is even possible.

 

[Steve Petersen]

Well I do believe the Holy Spirit communicates to me through others at times so I don't dismiss what others say out of hand, but I don't automatically buy what they think I should believe either.

Is there any possibility the HS is NOT communicating through you? Why is everyone else wrong but you are not?

 

[Nihilist Virus]

I've seen it happen frequently, such as with people cherry-picking out verses from Deuteronomy without taking the time to understand what was happening.

Examples? Or are you seriously suggesting there is a context in which rape or slavery is permissible?

 

[Soyeong]

Examples? Or are you seriously suggesting there is a context in which rape or slavery is permissible?

Such as trying to say that rape is permissible in the Bible.

 

[Nihilist Virus]

Such as trying to say that rape is permissible in the Bible.

Deuteronomy 22. Won't tell you which verses lest you accuse me of taking it out of context.

Also you seem to be perfectly fine with the slavery part...?

 

[Foxfyre]

Is there any possibility the HS is NOT communicating through you? Why is everyone else wrong but you are not?

Since I didn't say the Holy Spirit communicates through me, I don't know the purpose of your question. I certainly didn't say I was never wrong, much less that everybody else is and I am not. Where did you get that?

 

[Foxfyre]

And the experiment to let God in if He exists, to make Himself known to you, can't come with any strings. He is God after all and we are not privileged to order Him around. All things in their own time and all that. Again it has to include a mind open enough not to put constraints of how, where, or when he will do that.

Like I said, I am a former Christian. There were no strings attached. Either god doesn't exist or god won't communicate with me. I find the former far more likely considering I have never seen any evidence to demonstrate a god is even possible.

But don't you see? When you say God doesn't exist or won't communicate with you because he didn't respond when you thought he should, you have established an artificial time. He didn't do it on your schedule, therefore you conclude he won't do it or he doesn't exist.

Remember my recipe was an open mind which means you don't place any how, where, how, or WHEN on it.

 

[Soyeong]

Deuteronomy 22. Won't tell you which verses lest you accuse me of taking it out of context.

Deuteronomy 22 prescribes the death penalty for rapists, so it is by no means permissible.

Also you seem to be perfectly fine with the slavery part...?

In the ANE, someone who couldn't pay their debts had the option to beg, to starve, or to sell their future labor, and if they were able-bodied, then begging wasn't an option, so it was a choice between starvation and selling themselves into slavery. So slavery in the Bible was an economic advantage for people that allowed them to be sheltered while they paid off their debts much like indentured servitude.