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Tax-cut Boom -- Trump & GOP were right, Democrats and media flat wrong

Discussion in 'American Politics' started by Mountainmanbob, Dec 24, 2019.

  1. cow451

    cow451 The Most Interesting Poster in the Forum Supporter

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    Trump spent Christmas at his Florida property.
     
  2. TLK Valentine

    TLK Valentine You will be who you will be. We are our choices.

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    Sounds like you've been paid well for your support.
     
  3. Mountainmanbob

    Mountainmanbob Goat Whisperer Supporter

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    It's actually called.
    32 years spent working for a medium wage with great retirement package.
    Hard work pays off.
    M-Bob
     
  4. TLK Valentine

    TLK Valentine You will be who you will be. We are our choices.

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    Imagine how much you'd pay if you stopped supporting Donald for any reason?
     
  5. whatbogsends

    whatbogsends Senior Veteran

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    I don't think Trump actually suggested that his economic growth would make up for tax cuts. His supporters have certainly made that claim, but i'm unaware that Trump said that (although he did make the absurd claim that gains in the stock market made up for increased debt).

    I'm fairly certain that Trump(the self-proclaimed "King of Debt")'s plan is for the US to declare bankruptcy and welch on it's financial obligations. That tactic has worked extremely well for him throughout his career. He made a killing in his bankruptcies, converting investors money into his money, leaving his businesses in tons of debt, and then declaring bankruptcy leaving his investors holding the bag. That's why US banks stopped loaning to him long ago, and i'd wager it's his grand plan to get the US out of debt.
     
  6. jayem

    jayem Naturalist

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    Donald Trump gets 10% of the credit for the thriving economy. Which he inherited from Pres. Obama. Who (along with Congress) get 40% of the credit for the stimulus measures passed in 2008-2009. Back when bipartisanship was still possible. But 50% of the credit belongs to Ben Bernanke, Janet Yellen, and the Fed, for keeping interest rates vanishingly low.

    BTW, Trump has hinted that the Fed should consider negative interest rates. Which means that instead of the bank paying you interest on money you’ve deposited, you pay interest to the bank. It would be sort of a fee for holding your money. The thinking is that this is an incentive to spend money, rather than save. Which acts as a further economic stimulus. (Especially when you spend your money at Trump resorts and casinos. :oldthumbsup:) Anyone really this is a sound financial measure?

    Edited to add: Forgot to post a link.

    Trump tweets support for negative interest rates - MarketWatch
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2019
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  7. TLK Valentine

    TLK Valentine You will be who you will be. We are our choices.

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    No need to think about the future -- just spend, spend, spend.... like a good little consumer.
     
  8. The_Barmecide

    The_Barmecide Well-Known Member

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    Guessing from your avatar that you are a geologist. There is no reason why a geologist should make that little. There is something seriously wrong with our nation when we pay geologists that little. This is NOT the America I signed up for! #geofairness
     
  9. The_Barmecide

    The_Barmecide Well-Known Member

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    The REPUBLICANS have ALWAYS overseen massive spending increases, even going back to Ronald Reagan! The game is to TALK a big game over fiscal responsibility and then do the exact opposite. Kind of like excoriating people for poor morals and then voting lock-step for a man with the worst morals.
     
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  10. The_Barmecide

    The_Barmecide Well-Known Member

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    Not everyone is able to afford a "good tax man". I know we didn't get one until we got into a significantly higher tax bracket. They ain't cheap. Even for simple taxes.
     
  11. jayem

    jayem Naturalist

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    What especially complicates a tax return is receiving income from multiple sources—like a side business, interest, dividends, and capital gains. Being retired, my wife and I get a fair amount from the last three. So I have to file a schedule B reporting interest, and a schedule D for capital gains along with several 8949 forms which specify long and short term gains and losses. In the old days, I also filed schedule A for itemized deductions (with a few more forms to support them.) Trumptax did simplify that. But it did so by eliminating about half of what I was able to deduct. Resulting in about a 40% higher tax liability for me. So I’m looking forward to 2021 when the new President and Congress will revise the tax code again.
     
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  12. rjs330

    rjs330 Well-Known Member

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    No the Dems are the ones who traditionally want large spending. Going back into the 20s. Republicans have undoubtedly jumped on the spending band wagon. The point isn't who started it or who has been the big spenders I. The past. It's who's doing it now that matters. And both sides are as guilty of it. You are right that the Republicans seem to talk a big game, but when the rubber meets the road they spend like the Democrats. No difference. When we see actual cuts in spending then I will be impressed. Then I will take talk about the concern for the deficit seriously.
     
  13. RocksInMyHead

    RocksInMyHead God is innocent; Noah built on a floodplain!

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    I have a degree in geology, but don't actually work in the field.
     
  14. RocksInMyHead

    RocksInMyHead God is innocent; Noah built on a floodplain!

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    I don't think that you can point to one party or the other as "traditionally wanting large spending". While you can point to Woodrow Wilson (a Democrat) as the first president to run a serious deficit, that was in response to WWI. The entirety of his deficit was accrued from 1917-1919 - the other years he broke even or ran a surplus, including his final two years in office. Harding and Coolidge (both Republicans) ran surpluses, but Hoover (also a Republican) ran a deficit as he dealt with the Great Depression.

    Roosevelt is probably the most famous Democratic deficit spender, but much like Wilson, the bulk of his deficit spending was related to WWII. He did run deficits from 1934-1941 (aside from 1938, when he broke even) as he dealt with the Great Depression and its aftermath, as well as supporting our European allies at the beginning of the war, but they were comparable to the deficits run by Hoover (again, a Republican) at the end of his administration. It wasn't until 1942 that the annual deficit ballooned from 5 billion to over 20 billion, then about 50 billion for the remainder of the war.

    Truman (also a Democrat) ran surpluses for about half his presidency for a very modest overall increase in the deficit. Eisenhower (Republican) was about the same. Kennedy (Democrat) ran a deficit every year, but not a large one. Johnson (Democrat) ran similar or lower deficits to Kennedy aside from 1968 (Tet Offensive) and even managed a surplus in 1969.

    Nixon (Republican) ran a larger deficit than Johnson pretty much every year as the US ramped up involvement in Vietnam. Ford (Republican) ran huge (for the time) deficits of ~50 billion - similar to Roosevelt's spending during WWII. Carter (Democrat) followed the same trend, with a slight increase, but then Reagan (Republican) turned it up again, more than doubling - nearly tripling, even - Carter's highest annual spending most years. Bush Sr. (Republican) ran even higher deficits than Reagan, but Clinton (Democrat) was the first President since Coolidge to run an overall budget surplus over the length of his time in office.

    Bush Jr. (Republican) promptly turned that around and returned spending to the same level as his father, and even higher, with the invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq. Obama (Democrat) blew up the budget even more with his response to the Great Recession, but was starting to bring it back under control towards the end of his second term. Trump (Republican) has returned spending to levels near what Obama's were at the beginning of his first term.

    Overall, presidents of both parties have grown the deficit. However, from this data, what I see is that (aside from Carter) every Democratic president who has significantly increased the deficit compared to his predecessor has done so in response to a new war or a recession/depression - or both. On the Republican side, Reagan, Bush Sr., and Trump have all presided over significant deficit increases without impetus from war or recession (I don't count the '91 Iraq invasion as a war, since that only lasted a couple days).

    Which President Rang Up the Highest Budget Deficit?
     
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  15. KCfromNC

    KCfromNC Regular Member

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    The three largest percentage increases in the deficit were caused by WWI, WWII and Ronald Reagan. Bush II was 4th.

    The data doesn't seem to support your assertion here.
     
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  16. The_Barmecide

    The_Barmecide Well-Known Member

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    You mean there are OTHER degrees than geology?
     
  17. The_Barmecide

    The_Barmecide Well-Known Member

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    Correction: the dems are the ones who speak about it openly. The GOP just says they are for limited spending then they pull the wheels off the bus and go insane with spending. Look at history. In fact look at Trump himself! He started a trade war with China and then had to pump out a ton of money to US farmers to help them survive his own tradewar! AND he gutted revenues with his tax cut and CREATED A NEW MILITARY BRANCH!
     
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  18. rjs330

    rjs330 Well-Known Member

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    You guys know better than that. You know presidents don't determine spending. Congress does. And since the 30s (I didn't look further back) the Democrats ran the spending and spent more and more. It wasn't until The Republicans got control of Congress during Clinton's term that spending slowed. Then when Bush jr got into office and the economy collapsed and we went to war, the Republicans went on a massive spendi spree. Which continued with the Democratic Congress with Obama and continued more with the Republican Congress with Trump.
     
  19. wing2000

    wing2000 E pluribus unum Supporter

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    It takes a President and Congress working together....both defense and welfare spending were cut during Bill Clinton's tenure.
     
  20. KCfromNC

    KCfromNC Regular Member

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    If you don't stop confusing this thread with facts, Donald will be very upset with you.
     
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