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Supreme Court rules manditory vaccination constitutional

Discussion in 'American Politics' started by keith99, May 14, 2021.

  1. keith99

    keith99 sola dosis facit venenum

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    It seems some think otherwise, but the court has been clear on the issue, not once but at least twice.

    Jacobson v. Massachusetts - Wikipedia
    Zucht v. King - Wikipedia

    I think it is worth noting that Jacobson makes a far stronger case for the vaccination in question presented a real burden than any I have seen related to Covid.

    These are far from recent decisions. No one involved in either decision is still alive.
     
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  2. 2BeholdHisGlory

    2BeholdHisGlory Still on vacation!

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    I would rather be quaratined for a year, or longer.

    However, I do think people should be given the choice between taking the vaccine or being put to death, I think thats a fair option.
     
  3. com7fy8

    com7fy8 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Oh, so you are saying the courts making these rulings were before our present Supreme Court justices were sitting. Right now, if I understand correctly, there are justices who were put in by Donald Trump, giving a conservative majority. But these did not make the rulings mandating vaccinations. I am curious how they might rule, if not effected by previous rulings. Would they tend to think like Donald who seems to have not been in favor of masks and vaccines . . . not much, anyway? But they can think for themselves, so they might feel more strongly for or against vaccines.

    I personally think it can be constitutional to mandate vaccinations. But, of course, it needs to be proven well that the vaccines can be helpful. Ones might say, what about individual choice and rights? But already we have various things which are law for the overall social good, and individuals do not have their own choice, except with limits.

    speed limits

    taxes

    And I think of what I think is called "eminent domain" . . . meaning how an individual's property may be taken for the greater good of people, for example taking a house so a superhighway can be built through an area. Like this, I think it can be ruled for the greater good, that certain health regulations and requirements may override individual rights.

    But right now may be the vaccines have not been officially and legally approved by the FDA. And so, maybe "of course", it would not be legal to require the general public to use what has not been officially approved by the FDA.
     
  4. HannahT

    HannahT Newbie Supporter

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    That's a strange case to be sure.

    Although we seem to be more sensitive today about ugly reactions to vaccines.

    The story quoted he already had vaccine inhis home county, and had a severe reaction to it. So he refused to get vaccines again or get fined $5.

    I can't say that I blame there. If vaccine almost kills you? I'd be fighting a second too.
     
  5. sesquiterpene

    sesquiterpene Well-Known Member

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    This is another flat out falsehood. Here's a link for the Moderna trials:
    https://www.fda.gov/media/144434/download
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2021
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  6. Fantine

    Fantine Dona Quixote Supporter

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    I hope when the FDA gives final approval that there will be mandates, and since governors like DeSantis won't protect the common good the federal government will.
     
  7. mark46

    mark46 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Biden will not take the power from the states. The stated policy of the CDC will cause lots and lots of COVID cases unless states encourage businesses to require vaccination proof. Biden has abdicated the federal responsibility by not encourage a national tax card, that of course could be also be used for voter ID.

    Biden has also failed by not giving credit to Trump for the rapid development of the vaccine. We could have waiting many years. Allowing such credit to Trump would help get millions of Trumpers vaccinated.
     
  8. Fantine

    Fantine Dona Quixote Supporter

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    How about "to save many thousands of lives?"

    Good reason.

    So you think Republicans don't want vaccination cards because they could be used as voter ID's? Interesting.

    The worst governors are refusing to let businesses require proof of vaccination.

    Trump's vaccine record is mixed. He had the chance to buy 100 million doses in October and didn't.
     
  9. Ana the Ist

    Ana the Ist Aggressively serene!

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    The SCOTUS ruling is vague.

    It doesn't specify what threshold must be reached for your individual liberties to be stripped from you.
     
  10. Ana the Ist

    Ana the Ist Aggressively serene!

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    I'd like to point out its almost certainly vague because the courts can't pin down a threshold.

    The flu kills many thousands yearly....yet flu vaccines aren't mandated.
     
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  11. Larnievc

    Larnievc Well-Known Member

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    Evidence please. That sounds like rubbish. Which study has shown that?
     
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  12. 2BeholdHisGlory

    2BeholdHisGlory Still on vacation!

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    [Staff Edited Quote]

    I'm just saying, that I personally would RATHER be quaratined for a year if it comes to being forced to vaccinate. If one must be forced into every experimental vaccination while they feel just fine (to save others from the smallest chances of possible death) then honestly, there should be an option to chose death over the other. Maybe I should have put it that way since I am speaking personal preference.

    Vaccinate (for some small probability of someone else possibly dying) or self quarentine for a year or just plain die yourself. Who wants to live this way anyway?

    I should have said I was speaking for myself though.

    I am not afraid of the sligtest chances of dying from it and I get it others are, so if I must needs get a vaccine (for them to be unafraid because of their phobias) they can at extend me the same courteousy to chose death (over their option for me) since I fear death less than I fear the vaccine. Why are their fears catered to and mine are not taken into consideration?

    They could actually serve both our fears by a simple choice, vaccinate or death (if it must be) therefore those who are afraid dont have to deal with me (and they can get vaccinated and be happy) and I dont have to deal with getting vaccinated and can still save lives by my own death.

    Works for me.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 15, 2021
  13. Fantine

    Fantine Dona Quixote Supporter

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    God loves you. God has a purpose for your life.

    Depression is a very real side effect in this pandemic, one shared by many people.

    One of the best non-medical cures for depression is helping others. It's a great way to find God's purpose and gain perspective.

    Praying for everyone who has lost joy of living in these times.
     
  14. HARK!

    HARK! Well-Known Member Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter

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    MOD HAT ON


    THIS THREAD WAS CLEANED OF OFF TOPIC POSTS; AND IT WAS ALSO CLEANED POSTS THAT WERE DIRECTED TOWARD THE POSTER, INSTEAD OF THE CONTENT.


    MOD HAT OFF
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2021
  15. mark46

    mark46 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    What SHOULD government policy be if we knew that there was a population of folks who were unvaccinated against polio? or mumps? or German measles? Let us say that we knew that 5% of this population was positive for the disease.

    Should we be able to exclude these folks from our schools? from our restaurants?

    What needs to happen for us to understand that we SHOULD have a right to go to school or to a restaurant and not risk serious illness or death for us or for our children. FL says that anyone, with any probability of disease, has a right to go into large gatherings and potentially spread disease. Other states spend tremendous resources trying to prevent biological crises like the weddings and churches last year where the virus was spread to so many.
    ==================
    SITUATION 1
    Everybody in a restaurant or concert (workers and customers) is required to be vaccinated and have proof.

    SITUATION 2
    Business can choose to require their employees and customers to show proof of vaccination. They are free to advertise this requirement.

    SITUATION 3
    No facility is allowed to check for vaccination status, and no business can force their employees to vaccinate.

    Which situation do you prefer?

    I wouldn't take kids or grandkids to an indoor restaurant where folks could be unvaccinated. It is simply too risky. The same goes for Walmart and the grocery store (to a lesser extent).
     
  16. TLK Valentine

    TLK Valentine You will be who you will be. We are our choices.

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    Indeed -- these were the same judges that Donald and his legal team expected to overturn the election and hand him the presidency on a golden platter (Donald doesn't settle for silver).

    You'll notice that they didn't give him the desired outcome.
     
  17. Vylo

    Vylo Stick with the King!

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    It has been proven that they are helpful, and not just a little bit, the pfizer/moderna vaccines are incredibly effective.

    The EUA instead of full approval is only due to the requirement of being able to determine the duration of effect. The first people vaccinated still have their immunity, so we don't know how long that is besides "8+ months". The vaccines were not used until they were shown to be safe in studies. Bear in mind this:

    No vaccine in our history has been tested/used at scale for more than 6 weeks before any statistically significant severe adverse effects showed up. These vaccines were not used outside of trials before that amount of time had passed. We are now pass the 8 month mark and still no significant severe effects. nearly half the nation has gotten the vaccine, and the only effect has been plummeting case, hospitalization, and death rates from covid, even as we reduce and eliminate restrictions.

    If we want to get back to normal, people need to get vaccinated. If we give the virus too much time it could go for a round 2.
     
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