Study of "End Times"

[Gentlemantech48]

After 40 years of being a child of God I still don't know for sure what I think about "End Times Teachings". I absolutely do agree with Hank Hanegraaff on what he says about Matthew 24. When Jesus says "this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened" Jesus is not talking about the end times but about the Romans coming in, destroying the Temple, and persecuting the Jews. What I'm not sure about is whether or not Jesus is also painting a picture of the "End Times". In general I have many doubts about the modern teaching of Eschatology. As I understand it, modern Eschatology began in the mid 1800's and was not taught before that time. That makes me VERY suspicious of the the modern teaching. Ultimately I have come to the conclusion that it really doesn't effect our faith and I can simply put it on the shelf and wait to see what happens (or see what happens from Heaven). 24 Jesus left the temple and was walking away when his disciples came up to him to call his attention to its buildings. 2 “Do you see all these things?” he asked. “Truly I tell you, not one stone here will be left on another; every one will be thrown down.”
3 As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?”
4 Jesus answered: “Watch out that no one deceives you. 5 For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Messiah,’ and will deceive many. 6 You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come. 7 Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. 8 All these are the beginning of birth pains.
9 “Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. 10 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, 11 and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. 12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, 13 but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved. 14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.
15 “So when you see standing in the holy place ‘the abomination that causes desolation,’[a] spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand— 16 then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. 17 Let no one on the housetop go down to take anything out of the house. 18 Let no one in the field go back to get their cloak. 19 How dreadful it will be in those days for pregnant women and nursing mothers! 20 Pray that your flight will not take place in winter or on the Sabbath. 21 For then there will be great distress, unequaled from the beginning of the world until now—and never to be equaled again.
22 “If those days had not been cut short, no one would survive, but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened. 23 At that time if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Messiah!’ or, ‘There he is!’ do not believe it. 24 For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you ahead of time.
26 “So if anyone tells you, ‘There he is, out in the wilderness,’ do not go out; or, ‘Here he is, in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. 27 For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. 28 Wherever there is a carcass, there the vultures will gather.
29 “Immediately after the distress of those days
“‘the sun will be darkened,
and the moon will not give its light;
the stars will fall from the sky,
and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.’[b]

30 “Then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. And then all the peoples of the earth[c] will mourn when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory.[d] 31 And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.
32 “Now learn this lesson from the fig tree: As soon as its twigs get tender and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. 33 Even so, when you see all these things, you know that it[e] is near, right at the door. 34 Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. 35 Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.

 

[desmalia]

I totally understand your feelings about eschatology. If you're like me, you were raised believing in the premil pretrib dispensational view and didn't know there was anything else at first. That's how it was for me. Then I read the Left Behind series and noticed so many inconsistencies with Scripture that it got me wondering... It was actually through discussions with people on CF that I finally began to get a concept of the other doctrinal stands on the issue (postmil, amil, preterist, etc.) and started investigating them. I still have a long way to go, but am glad for the journey. It can be overwhelming at times, but the Lord gave us teachings in Scripture (Revelation, Daniel, Matthew, etc.) for a reason, and it is very much for our edification to examine the Scriptures in this area. I encourage you to take your time and study when you can. It has taken me years to come to the view that I now hold, and I still have SO much to learn. But it's so important because eschatology is not a doctrine that is separated from all other doctrine. It is very intimately connected.

 

[miamited]

Hi GT,

Well, certainly when you label an understanding as 'modern eschatology' one would surely consider that it is a fairly new concept.

Could you define what you mean by 'modern eschatology'.

Do you mean that there will be no end? What is the ideology that you understand as 'modern eschatology' and what does it attempt to teach us about the truths of God's word?

God bless you,
In Christ, Ted

 

[MrJim]

I'm a partial preterist/amillenial sort but sure wouldn't be disappointed if I'm wrong; after about 25 years as a believer I'm still a kindergartner on this particular area..like Des I too was discipled to believe the pre-trib/pre-mil teaching but later rejected it.

 

[Gentlemantech48]

Hi GT,

Well, certainly when you label an understanding as 'modern eschatology' one would surely consider that it is a fairly new concept.

Could you define what you mean by 'modern eschatology'.

Do you mean that there will be no end? What is the ideology that you understand as 'modern eschatology' and what does it attempt to teach us about the truths of God's word?

God bless you,
In Christ, Ted

There are a number of teachers who talk about the problem with modern eschatology which came about in the 1800's. Also the confusion of having 4 different theories about when Jesus will return should tell us that there is a problem with modern teaching.
Dispensationalism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
New Testament Eschatology: Why Modern End-Times Teaching Is Misguided
Do Christians realize there is no rapture? - Yahoo! Answers
The Apocalypse Code (Audio Book) | CRI

 

[notreligus]

I was a hard-line Dispenational for 40 years. I suppose if I had to label myself today I would be amillennial futurist.

Differing beliefs about Israel are at the root of the different beliefs about end-times. Differing beliefs about Covenants are also contributors to the differing end-times beliefs.

 

[thecolorsblend]

Time was I bought into the premillenial line (although I was never pre-trib; talk about contradictory wishful-thinking) but these days I lean toward the amillenial view -- specifically partial Preterism. It just fits.

 

[miamited]

In general I have many doubts about the modern teaching of Eschatology. As I understand it, modern Eschatology began in the mid 1800's and was not taught before that time. That makes me VERY suspicious of the the modern teaching. Ultimately I have come to the conclusion that it really doesn't effect our faith and I can simply put it on the shelf and wait to see what happens (or see what happens from Heaven).

Hi GT,

I would agree that a believer can set the study of prophecies that are future to our day on the back shelf, but...

Daniel came to understand when the end of the Babylonian captivity would be over based on the prophecy of 'punishment' that Jeremiah wrote about. So, he did at least study some of the more near prophecies. Jesus rebuked the Jews for not knowing the time of their visitation and everything written about him and his visitation would have been future to the Jews before his arrival. My understanding is that it was the very specific prophecy of Daniel that led Jesus to think that the Jews should have known the time of their visitation. So, it would seem obvious that Jesus did expect the Jews to have studied and understood the prophecies about himself. Finally, I'm not sure that the study of prophecy itself has not always been a part of those of the 'church'. Paul does write about those who were believing that the rapture was coming before several key signs had been fulfilled.

Also, it's rather redundant to say that 'modern' eschatology is recent. Wouldn't anything that is 'modern' be assumed to be 'recent'. So, I'm going to assume that what you really meant was just that eschatological study is something recent in the 'church'. On that, I think there is certainly some evidence, as given above, that it isn't true.

God bless you.
In Christ, Ted

 

[Gentlemantech48]

Ultimately I'm waiting for the time when I have "the mind of Christ" and will understand why God left this thing so difficult to understand. Why did The Lord "seem" to write these things in riddles? Why didn't He make the signs of Christ's coming clear and concise and explain exactly how it will occur? Didn't He know that when we read His Word in our modern language that we would be confused about certain issues? For instance: Matthew 24:40-41 says "That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 40 Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. 41 Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left." From these verses we have "assumed" that there is something called the "rapture" though no such word exists in the Bible. Some scholars have clearly stated that this is NOT what it means and that there is no such thing as the rapture. And we don't know who to believe because the Word does not explain it clearly to us in our language.

I sometimes get frustrated by the wording of God's Word because it is not concise and leaves doubt. Obviously the really important part is very concise and leaves no doubt. Any legitimate Bible scholar does not argue the point that we receive salvation NOT through works but by repenting of our sins and trusting in Jesus Christ to save us from our sins. That is concise, it is straight forward, it says the same thing in any language. As you can see I have learned not to just follow the crowd and accept a teaching unless I can see it for myself. Eschatology is one of those areas where I have to just wait for the right answer because when there are multiple answers we know that only one answer is right.

 

[thecolorsblend]

I sometimes get frustrated by the wording of God's Word because it is not concise and leaves doubt. Obviously the really important part is very concise and leaves no doubt. Any legitimate Bible scholar does not argue the point that we receive salvation NOT through works but by repenting of our sins and trusting in Jesus Christ to save us from our sins. That is concise, it is straight forward, it says the same thing in any language. As you can see I have learned not to just follow the crowd and accept a teaching unless I can see it for myself. Eschatology is one of those areas where I have to just wait for the right answer because when there are multiple answers we know that only one answer is right.

This type of thing (if not specifically End Timey stuff) is why I don't believe in Sola Scriptura anymore.

 

[miamited]

Ultimately I'm waiting for the time when I have "the mind of Christ" and will understand why God left this thing so difficult to understand. Why did The Lord "seem" to write these things in riddles? Why didn't He make the signs of Christ's coming clear and concise and explain exactly how it will occur? Didn't He know that when we read His Word in our modern language that we would be confused about certain issues? For instance: Matthew 24:40-41 says "That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 40 Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. 41 Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left." From these verses we have "assumed" that there is something called the "rapture" though no such word exists in the Bible. Some scholars have clearly stated that this is NOT what it means and that there is no such thing as the rapture. And we don't know who to believe because the Word does not explain it clearly to us in our language.

Hi GT,

Yes, well don't get caught up in the actual word that is written. Learn to understand meaning. You are correct that the word 'rapture' is a new term we use to refer to the 'catching up in the clouds'. One must also always keep in mind that when Jesus spoke he often moved from one time to another within the very same discussion. In this statement here he says to them, "This is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man." When is that? According to the Revelation the 'coming of one who looks like the Son of Man is explained in what we have numbered as chapter 14. In that chapter we are told that first the 'son of man' will come and 'harvest from the earth' (rapture) all that are his and then the second angel will come behind him and take what is left and throw into the winepress of God's wrath. So, one who studies the Scriptures should be able to gain from these two passages that when Jesus returns (the coming of the son of man) there will be some people removed from the earth just as everyone goes about doing their daily activities. Now, you can call this the call of the ice cream man if you'd like, but believers have made a word for that day and it is 'rapture'.

So, again, don't get hung up on the word so much as the meaning of the text for which the word refers. There are several evidences within the Scriptures that the believers will be taken away from the earth prior to God unleashing His great wrath stored up against all the wicked and unbelieving of the earth. The word that modern writers have adopted to signify that day is 'rapture'.

I sometimes get frustrated by the wording of God's Word because it is not concise and leaves doubt. Obviously the really important part is very concise and leaves no doubt. Any legitimate Bible scholar does not argue the point that we receive salvation NOT through works but by repenting of our sins and trusting in Jesus Christ to save us from our sins. That is concise, it is straight forward, it says the same thing in any language. As you can see I have learned not to just follow the crowd and accept a teaching unless I can see it for myself. Eschatology is one of those areas where I have to just wait for the right answer because when there are multiple answers we know that only one answer is right.

Yes, but Jesus also said that the Holy Spirit would guide us into all truth.

I can understand your frustration, but I encourage you to keep studying all the truths of God's word. From Genesis 1:1 to Revelation 22:21. Trust God that He has a reason for all of it being written. We should understand why and how we got here based on the beginning as explained in Genesis and also understand the end of all things in this realm based on the writings of the Revelation of Jesus. God didn't send this vision to John just because John happened to be bored on the Isle of Patmos and He wanted to keep him busy doing something.

God bless you.
In Christ, Ted

 

[notreligus]

Ultimately I'm waiting for the time when I have "the mind of Christ" and will understand why God left this thing so difficult to understand. Why did The Lord "seem" to write these things in riddles? Why didn't He make the signs of Christ's coming clear and concise and explain exactly how it will occur? Didn't He know that when we read His Word in our modern language that we would be confused about certain issues? For instance: Matthew 24:40-41 says "That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 40 Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. 41 Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left." From these verses we have "assumed" that there is something called the "rapture" though no such word exists in the Bible. Some scholars have clearly stated that this is NOT what it means and that there is no such thing as the rapture. And we don't know who to believe because the Word does not explain it clearly to us in our language.

I sometimes get frustrated by the wording of God's Word because it is not concise and leaves doubt. Obviously the really important part is very concise and leaves no doubt. Any legitimate Bible scholar does not argue the point that we receive salvation NOT through works but by repenting of our sins and trusting in Jesus Christ to save us from our sins. That is concise, it is straight forward, it says the same thing in any language. As you can see I have learned not to just follow the crowd and accept a teaching unless I can see it for myself. Eschatology is one of those areas where I have to just wait for the right answer because when there are multiple answers we know that only one answer is right.

If we Christians would interpret the Old Testament by the New Testament and see how Christ has fulfilled the promise to Abraham we would not keep looking for future fulfillment in a people, Israel. Our salvation is in a Person, Christ Jesus.

Gal 3:13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us--for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree"--
Gal 3:14 so that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we might receive the promised Spirit through faith.
Gal 3:15 To give a human example, brothers: even with a man-made covenant, no one annuls it or adds to it once it has been ratified.
Gal 3:16 Now the promises were made to Abraham and to his offspring. It does not say, "And to offsprings," referring to many, but referring to one, "And to your offspring," who is Christ.

 

[1watchman]

Here is an interesting paper I find helpful.

"GLORY TO GOD IN THE HIGHEST"
CONSIDERING THE COMING OF CHRIST ​

It was a glorious thing when the Lord Jesus, the Christ, came from heaven to this world as a man, and faithful men have rejoiced in that hope. The angels praised God at His birth, saying: "Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace, good will toward men". All men ought to rejoice and be glad for the gift of God (Rom.6:23), but alas He was rejected and today He is mostly ignored.
- By R. L. DeWitt, '00; rev. 11/05

Today our thoughts ought to also turn to the soon coming AGAIN of the Lord. Some Christians are confused about the return of the Lord Jesus, and choose to believe that the church (the bride of Christ) will endure the wrath of God along with all men, in judgment against this world during the tribulation period foretold. That is not what the Word of God shows, but that the bride will come with Christ. Let us see here what the Word teaches.

In the Holy Scriptures we find the "day of Christ" (1 Cor.1:8; 1 Cor.15:51-52; Phil.1: 6,10; Phil. 2:16; 1 Thess.4:13-18), which speaks of the translation (often called "rapture") of the church; and there is also the "day of the Lord" (1 Thess.5:1-5; 2 Pet.3: 10; Jude 14-15), which tells of the second appearing of Christ to vanquish His enemies and reign; and there is the "day of God" (2 Pet.3:12), which shows God's final judgment after the millenial reign of Christ. One ought to see the different aspects of the return of the Lord Jesus, the Christ of God, and see how it affects mankind.
If one is clear about these things they will be able to see that the Lord is not going to pour out judgment on His Bride, as some suggest; rather, He will take her out before His wrath falls. When the Lord returns visibly to the world, His bride will be with Him (Matt.24:30-31).

The following commentary from the Concise Bible Dictionary should help in giving one a good picture:

- The Second Advent -​

"The second coming of the Lord Jesus Christ to this earth, naturally implies that He has already been here once. 'Now once in the end of the world hath He appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself...and unto them that look for Him shall He appear the second time without sin (or apart from sin) unto salvation' (Heb.9:26-28). The 'second advent' therefore is clearly a scriptural expression. Scripture speaks of many momentous and solemn events connected with the second coming of Christ which will be found under the different headings connected with this subject.

"There are two aspects of the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ which should never be confounded, namely, His coming FOR His saints, and His coming WITH His saints. These events may be thus illustrated. Suppose a large town or province revolted from allegiance to its sovereign, and refused to acknowledge his authority. After many warnings the sovereign raises an army to punish the rebels; but he knows that in that city there are many true subjects who loyally acknowledge his title and claims. When approaching the city he secretly calls out all those loyal ones, who gladly go out to meet him. He storms the city, and entering with those that have already joined him, he punishes the rebellious, and rewards those that had been faithful. Now, as the coming of the sovereign would be a day of joyful deliverance to one class, so it would be followed by judgment on the others. We find both these aspects of the coming of the Lord Jesus plainly revealed in the Scripture. 1 Thess. 4:15-18 speaks of Christ coming for His saints to their everlasting joy; and Jude 14, 15 speaks of Christ coming to execute judgment on His enemies.

"Another distinction to be noticed is that when Christ comes for His saints, including both the living and the dead, He will not actually come to the earth for them. The above passage in 1 Thessalonians says that the saints will be caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. This is often called the "rapture". It will be a meeting far too sacred for the eyes of the wicked to behold...it will be in the clouds. No separation will ever take place: those that are thus caught up will be for ever with the Lord. But the important aspect of the resurrection and rapture of the saints is, that it is God's answer in those that believe to the all-glorious worth of His own Son.

"This is the bright hope of the Christian. There is no event revealed in scripture that must take place before the rapture of the saints. They should, therefore, be expecting the return of the Lord at any moment to fetch all His saints away together (John 14:1-3; 1 Thess.1:9-10).

"In other scriptures it is revealed that there will be an interval between the rapture (the catching away of the saints), and the Lord's coming to the earth. For instance, in 2 Thess.2 we learn that the day of the Lord cannot come 'til the antichrist is revealed, because the Lord is going to destroy that wicked one when He comes. Then in Rev.13 we find that the antichrist will co-operate with another 'beast', the head of the future Roman empire; and in Dan.9 that this latter power will make a covenant with Israel and will break the covenent in the midst of the week; all which intimates that this apparent triumph of wickedness will spread over at least seven years, otherwise spoken of as the last week of the seventy weeks of Daniel.
"That the Lord Jesus will actually come to the earth is plainly revealed in Acts 1:11: 'This same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen Him go into heaven'. 'His feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east' (Zech.14:4). 'The Lord, whom ye seek shall suddenly come to His temple....but who may abide the day of His coming?' (Mal.3:1-2)."

- The Appearing Of Christ -​

"This is to be distinguished from Christ coming FOR His saints, though intimately connected with it, for He will bring them with Him. 'When Christ, who is our life, shall appear (to the world), then shall ye also appear with Him in glory" (Col.3:4). Here it is the manifestation of Christ WITH His own, to be followed by the setting up of His kingdom and the apportionment of rewards to His saints (2 Cor.5:10). The Lord's servant is exhorted by His appearing and His kingdom to preach the Word (2 Tim.4:1-2). The saints will be associated with Christ in His judgments at His appearing (Jude 14-15). Christ will execute judgment on the beast and the false prophet and the western powers; also on the Assyrian and eastern powers that will oppress the Jews. The Jews and the ten tribes will be restored to their land in blessing, ushering in the millenium."

The "millennium" is that promised time of one thousand years of the reign of the Lord in righteousness, before the eternal state begins, and it will be a great time of rejoicing for all who love the Christ of God. - RLD.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------​

 

[Faulty]

After 40 years of being a child of God I still don't know for sure what I think about "End Times Teachings". I absolutely do agree with Hank Hanegraaff on what he says about Matthew 24. When Jesus says "this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened" Jesus is not talking about the end times but about the Romans coming in, destroying the Temple, and persecuting the Jews.

I just wanted to make sure you were aware that the word translated as "the same" (verse 13) just a few sentences before the "this generation", verse 24, is the exact same word in verse 24 some translate as "this". To be consistent, it should be reading "the same generation".

Same word, same context, same usage, same meaning:

Verse 13: "But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved."

Verse 34: "Verily I say unto you, This ("the same") generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled."

​

 

[KNOWLEDGE BOMB]

Couple things to keep in mind...

Matt 24. Mark 13 and Luke 21 where they start with wars famines and pestilences - this is the start of Rev 6 - we see Jesus comes After this.


Rev 14:14-20 IS the gathering together of 2thess 1:7. 1:10. 2:1-3
it is also Daniel 12:1-2. Notice at end of 14:20 the blood-this is from armageddon.... Now look at Daniel 11:42-45 - you see some of GOGs armies (from Ez38) (Libya ethiopia) chase after the Antichrist from Egypt because the chinese from the east and Russia from north are heading towards him and in v.45 he parks his tents right at Armageddon field for the battle mentioned in Rev 14:20.....


(dan 11:21 AC comes to power (king of north) - the other king called king of the south - this is Gog)(the fight for both is Jerusalem) stumbling block to the world). They fight all the way through 11:43 which leads to rapture (gathering)

We see that Matt mark and luke have Jesus coming After the abomanation of desolation - this happens after the agreement of Daniel 9::27 when the armies surround Jerusalem - 2 thes 2:3 tells us NOT to be fooled into thinking Jesus comes Before the man of sin is revealed - that's right after jerusalem is taking and shows Jesus coming after mid trib.....

The Antichrist comes peaceably (dan 11:24) he does not come through war! Sorry Islamic antichrist believers.... That's why the rider on the white horse is crowned before he starts to conquer.... Also the "bow" is a shash like those worn by politicans and Not bow/arrows.

The bad times do not start at mid trib when the agreements broke - it starts right after the deal is signed. Through war famine etc - this is the saying peace peace when there is no peace and sudden destruction comes upon you -this is the 7 yr deal signed and broken when the armies surround Jerusalem.


For the pre trib rapture teaching - look to both the 10 virgins and lukes good faithful servant and both of these either stay the course or fall away when? When pre trib Jesus doesn't show up and their faced with a tribulation period their not ready for.... This is why 1st Peter 3:3-4 says that in the Last Days (last 7 yrs - daniels 70th and final week) that the first thing will be scoffers saying: where's the promise of His coming - we all know that's the pre trib promise...... And some virgins fall away....


Not here to debate but look for yourself - also keep in mind revelation isn't start to Finnish as read..... The rapture can also be found at..... Rememeber where Jesus says the next time we see him is at right hand of father - that happens at 6:12 and all the waythrough to a great multitute in heaven at 7:9 and then Gods wrath after that at 8:7 - after the bride is gone. Notice the 144,000 are sealed at same event for same reason to be spared gods wrath...


There are NOT 2 raptures this first one is what happens on earth and 14:14 shows the events from Gods side.... Same thing!

 

[KNOWLEDGE BOMB]

I sometimes get frustrated by the wording of God's Word because it is not concise and leaves doubt. Obviously the really important part is very concise and leaves no doubt. Any legitimate Bible scholar does not argue the point that we receive salvation NOT through works but by repenting of our sins and trusting in Jesus Christ to save us from our sins. That is concise, it is straight forward, it says the same thing in any language. As you can see I have learned not to just follow the crowd and accept a teaching unless I can see it for myself. Eschatology is one of those areas where I have to just wait for the right answer because when there are multiple answers we know that only one answer is right.

well really salvation does Not include repenting.... It's by faith or believing on His name..... We repent (turn towards him and away from sin) as result but it is not part of grace through faith and we are saved.

 

[Soothfish]

If God is merciful then the end of this world will come quickly. It is better to die young than to linger here much longer.

 

[TargetPractice]

The Bible is clear that Jesus' second coming will be a dark day, that no one will want to experience. From my understanding, the flood came after Methuselah died, which means that Noah was the last righteous man on earth at that time.

Although I'm eager for his return, I would not wish to experience the trouble of those times.

So hopefully He'll take me before that day.

 

[coventrytrey]

I find the end times scriptures fascinating

 

[godenver1]

So there are two judgements of Christ? First is the believers who are saved-rewarded or good works in Jesus name or 'storing treasures in Heaven' that pass through the refiner's fire , and the second (great white throne judgement) where unbelievers are judged by their works. Is this correct?