Spiritual Israel

[IamNazarene]

Joshua was a gentile and washed clean by his faith in God.

We are not grafted in to Israel we are grafted onto the VINE and Jesus is the Vine, he is the BRANCH.

Zechariah 3:8 Hear now, O Joshua the high priest, thou, and thy fellows that sit before thee: for they are men wondered at: for, behold, I will bring forth my servant the Branch.

The scrip[tures say who ever rejects Jesus is damned for Hell.

Those ones you call Israel are headed for Hell.
Sorry there is no second chance after.

It is important to preach the gospel to them now.

Sabath is not Sunday and did you know the Israelites had an eight day?

The point is, Jesus is LORD of the Sabbath.
The disciples did gather on the first dasy of the week to praise God. It is written in acts.

Read the old testament what does it mean to you when the prophets constantly Rebuked Israel for their whoredom?

They warned over and over again.

God said I will pass by them no more.

Amos 7:8 And the Lord said unto me, Amos, what seest thou? And I said, A plumbline. Then said the Lord, Behold, I will set a plumbline in the midst of my people Israel: I will not again pass by them any more:

The prophets constantly said Israel will be regathered from the ends of the earth.

This means Jesus will regather them...

Christians did not replace Jews. The covenant was merely continued in Christ.

 

[Dave-W]

Joshua was a gentile and washed clean by his faith in God.

How did Joshua get to be a high priest if he was a gentile?

Explain it from the rules for the high priest from Leviticus.

 

[Dave-W]

We are not grafted in to Israel we are grafted onto the VINE and Jesus is the Vine, he is the BRANCH.

Romans 11 is where it talks about the inclusion of gentiles. Where is the "vine" in that chapter? The vine you are referring to is in John 15 and was spoken exclusively to JEWS who believed in Him. But if you include us He is not the branch, he is the vine proper:

John 15:5 I am the vine, you are the branches; he who abides in Me and I in him, he bears much fruit, for apart from Me you can do nothing.

 

[Dave-W]

Sabath is not Sunday and did you know the Israelites had an eight day?

Saturday is the 7th day. There are other sabbaths beside Saturday but that is the main one.

The "eighth day" was only for one feast: Sukkot or feast of tabernacles. It is called Shimini Atzeret. In John 7 it is called "the last day, the great day of the feast."

 

[Dave-W]

The prophets constantly said Israel will be regathered from the ends of the earth.

This means Jesus will regather them...

Already happening. Jews are coming to the gospel in incredible numbers in the former Soviet Union countries, South America and even in Israel.

 

[Steve Petersen]

Already happening. Jews are coming to the gospel in incredible numbers in the former Soviet Union countries, South America and even in Israel.

Have been hearing stories like this for decades. I think most of it is apocryphal.
Could you provide some reliable NEWS sources for this?

 

[Dave-W]

Have been hearing stories like this for decades. I think most of it is apocryphal.
Could you provide some reliable NEWS sources for this?

Suggest you go to the websites of Jonathan Bernis and David C. Rudolph. Those are 2 of the front line workers.

Jewish Voice Ministries International
Home - GBCY


You can also go to the IAMCS (International Alliance of Messianic Congregations and Synagogues) to see how many more congregations there are in Israel now as compared to 15 years ago.

From what stats I have seen say that in 2013 there were 150 congregations with about 20,000 Jewish believers in the state of Israel. In 2009 the number was estimated at half that - 10,000 by the US State Dept.

In 1999 those same estimators put the number of believers at 5000 in 80 congregations. A decade earlier the numbers were basicly zero and zero.

Statistics - Jewish Israel

 

[Steve Petersen]

Suggest you go to the websites of Jonathan Bernis and David C. Rudolph. Those are 2 of the front line workers.

Jewish Voice Ministries International
Home - GBCY

I capitalized NEWS sources for a reason. These are not neutral sources, but missionary ones.

 

[Dave-W]

Why would a news source be interested at all? They pretty much ignore us.

the statistics site I referenced had some US State dept estimates; but again that is NOT a news source.

 

[Steve Petersen]

Hardly 'incredible numbers.' That is something like 0.17% of the world Jewish population. 1 in 600.

This is why I don't trust missionary sources or people on one side of the issue or the other. They have a tendency to exaggerate. There is also the problem of confirmation bias.

 

[fozzy]

How did Joshua get to be a high priest if he was a gentile?

Explain it from the rules for the high priest from Leviticus.

How did Jesus get to be a high priest seeing he is from the tribe of Judah?

Leviticus does not allow anyone except for Levi to ascend to the priesthood.

Maybe that's why the writer of Hebrews said that a change in the priesthood means a change in the law!

You may claim to be under the new but your words are from the old.

 

[fozzy]

Romans 11 is where it talks about the inclusion of gentiles. Where is the "vine" in that chapter? The vine you are referring to is in John 15 and was spoken exclusively to JEWS who believed in Him. But if you include us He is not the branch, he is the vine proper:

John 15:5 I am the vine, you are the branches; he who abides in Me and I in him, he bears much fruit, for apart from Me you can do nothing.

If we want to talk of what Jesus said 'exclusively to the Jews' you are not going to like what he said like when he said you (Jews) are of your father the devil and the lusts of your father you will do (John 8) or speaking of the Roman centurion where he said I have not found so great a faith no not in Israel (Matt. 8) or the kingdom of God will be taken from you (Jews) and given to a nation (Gentiles) bringing forth the fruits thereof (Matt. 21). Sounds like replacement theology to me.

 

[fozzy]

Already happening. Jews are coming to the gospel in incredible numbers in the former Soviet Union countries, South America and even in Israel.

This would be nice if it were true but I have yet to hear you speak of grace, love or faith and you claim to believe the gospel. It's just this law and that law and some laws over here. You remind me of SDA. They love laws too.

 

[IamNazarene]

How did Joshua get to be a high priest if he was a gentile?

Explain it from the rules for the high priest from Leviticus.

That story of Joshua.
Everyone is born in Sin ok. It does not matter who you are, you born in dirt and ready for Hell.
Unless we make the choice at around age 1 or something.

Joshua was old enough to make his choice.

Now that chapter strongly depicts Joshua being robed.

Revelation 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb

Now Joshua has become a Saint.
If ou read the entire old testament there were plenty of high preists that were not believers, why did Jesus say to them you are of your father the Devil?

Not every one is a Jew who calls them self a Jew.

The covenant simply continued in Christ. Not a human high preist.

Jesus is now the high preist, GOd himself took the ob on beause the Jews failed.

Miserably.

So there is no replacement theology.

God simply came to earth and became the high preist who has much power.
Forgiveness of Sin.

No man can do that but God..

 

[IamNazarene]

This would be nice if it were true but I have yet to hear you speak of grace, love or faith and you claim to believe the gospel. It's just this law and that law and some laws over here. You remind me of SDA. They love laws too.

Do not worry Foz, our words fall on dead ears..

Gpd bless, just pray for these people

 

[IamNazarene]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TpzOuQEkjE

 

[fozzy]

That story of Joshua.
Everyone is born in Sin ok. It does not matter who you are, you born in dirt and ready for Hell.
Unless we make the choice at around age 1 or something.

Joshua was old enough to make his choice.

Now that chapter strongly depicts Joshua being robed.

Revelation 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb

Now Joshua has become a Saint.
If ou read the entire old testament there were plenty of high preists that were not believers, why did Jesus say to them you are of your father the Devil?

Not every one is a Jew who calls them self a Jew.

The covenant simply continued in Christ. Not a human high preist.

Jesus is now the high preist, GOd himself took the ob on beause the Jews failed.

Miserably.

So there is no replacement theology.

God simply came to earth and became the high preist who has much power.
Forgiveness of Sin.

No man can do that but God..

Great analogy! Everyone thinks that you have to be born from the right family to be part of Israel and it's partly true. You just have to be born again into the right family or the family of God. The new birth is a new spiritual birth into the house of God.

 

[IamNazarene]

That is right FOz, the same thing would happen to Joseph.

That is why it is written the father draws them.

No one can choose to be Israel, we need to be dawn by the father and Jesus.

 

[joeb32]

OK, now I'm confused. Where does Paul say he isn't a Jew?
I'm sure you know he was a Jew, and was circumcised.


Would you kindly reference a Biblical passage that equates circumcision with being born again.

I haven't read this entire thread so I don't know if someone else answered your question, but I'll give it a shot and see if this does it for you.

Deuteronomy 10:16

Deuteronomy 30:6

Jeremiah 4:4

Ezekiel 44:7,9

Acts 7:51

These texts clearly link circumcision of the heart and the flesh together, and circumcision of the heart is clearly nothing more than the surrender of self to God, or in other words, being born again.

 

[Dave-W]

How did Joshua get to be a high priest if he was a gentile?
Explain it from the rules for the high priest from Leviticus.

How did Jesus get to be a high priest seeing he is from the tribe of Judah?
Leviticus does not allow anyone except for Levi to ascend to the priesthood.
Maybe that's why the writer of Hebrews said that a change in the priesthood means a change in the law!
You may claim to be under the new but your words are from the old.

Yeshua/Jesus was from a different NON-LEVI priesthood of Melchizedek. That order pre-existed Levi and Aaron.

BTW - that does NOT answer the question.